Christian Trinity and Muslim's Tauwheed [monotheism] = Same God? A Clarification.

Without the Old Testament, you can't understand the New. You wouldn't understand, for instance, the importance of blood sacrifice for the remission of sins, a concept that God introduced even to Adam and Eve, as evidenced by Cain and Abel's offerings.


but the "Christians" here, tell us that there is no more law and the chief book in the Tanakh/Old Testament is the Torah/5 Books of Moses. how can you totally ignore the Torah and still rely on other parts of the Tanakh to uphold your beliefs? the Jews, btw, claim to understand the Torah. the admit that because Islam is prophesied in the Torah and Islam is based upon the 7 Noahide Laws that Muslims who follow Islam properly are going to Jannah/Heaven. with the exception of Messianic Jews, they hold no such belief about "Christians" and "Christianity!"



As I said, I'm a baby in Christ. I don't know everything. I do, however, know enough about the nature of salvation to witness about it.

so all that you know is that you have found the way, even if you have no idea what that way means?

I guess I should have made it more clear then. The only sin Adam and Eve were capable of commiting was eating from the tree of knowledge of good and evil. They were not capable of the things we are today.


There is not one verse in the New Testament where this is stated. This is a very Catholic doctrine, and I--as a born again Christian--do not put much stock in Catholicism.

right, but you see somehow "Christians" have come to the conclusion that is it OK to "associate partners with Allah[swt]" by ADDING gods to their list, such as all the praying to the Saints as well as to Jesus[pbuh] and Mary[pbuh] and other "Christians" DON'T condemn it. in fact, they say that they are just as much "Christians" as they are, BUT to "disassociate partners with Allah[swt]" by speaking the Truth that Jesus[pbuh] IS NOT god is heresy! and "Christians" who do so such as Jehovah Witness or the Philadelphia Church of God ARE NOT considered "Christians!" it seems that you can never have too many gods, but that 3 is the absolute minumum! ^o)



He does lead you into all truth. But you have to have studied the Word, mediated on it, and become grounded in it for him to begin to lead you into that truth. I did something really stupid when I first accepted Christ (basically I sinned) and I have been suffering under God's discipline ever since, so my growth has been stunted.

BUT, you claim that Jesus[pbuh] died for your sins so you have your "get out of hell free card," why would your god punish you if Jesus[pbuh] already paid the price for your sins??? i was under the impression the "Christianity" is all about your god's love for you!


And in actuality, during time spent here, sometimes he does step in and caution me against things that I have written (not with a literal voice mind you, but the Holy Spirit has his ways of communicating with you).

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

please tell, us more about "the Holy Spirit has his ways of communicating with you"

regarding Cain and Abel, the 4th Chapter of Genesis reads:
3And in process of time it came to pass that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.


4And Abel also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering;


5but unto Cain and to his offering He had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.


6And the LORD said unto Cain, "Why art thou wroth? And why is thy countenance fallen?


7If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? And if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him."

it does not say that these are sin sacrifices, just offerings!



:w:
 
I am aware of God speaking to Moses through the burning bush, but is there any verse in the OT that indicates that God lives within any human body?


>>>I am not aware of such verses, can you site one where is God spoke to Moses through the burning bush?
 
Fedos>>And of course both Adam and Eve had God living inside of them, until they sinned, and their eyes were opened, and they understood both good and evil as he withdrew his presence from them.


>>>What is wrong of sinning?

Adam and Eve sinned, and repent. It's over.

How do I know?

God later blessed them and sent them where they supposed to be, and put under thier order everything exist.

As a matter of fact, according to Islam and Jesus, when we sin and repent, we are better than the ones who never sin. When we sin, God keep his eyes on us waitnig for us to repent, and when we do, He is very please with us.

According to the Holy Bible, David sin BIG time, but when he repent, his sin, was wiped out:

Psalm 32:5 "Then I acknowledged my sin to you;
I did not cover up my guilt...
and you forgave the guilt of my sin."

Beautifull verse, I like too much:

Micah 6:8 says it best: "It has been told you, O' man, what is good, and what the LORD does require of you, only to do justice, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your GOd".

Which letter of the above verse Christians don't understand?
 
but the "Christians" here, tell us that there is no more law and the chief book in the Tanakh/Old Testament is the Torah/5 Books of Moses. how can you totally ignore the Torah and still rely on other parts of the Tanakh to uphold your beliefs?

Well, Christians do live under grace. In fact, this is a time of grace that we all live under. God is not raining fire down from the heavens like he did in the Old Testament, as an example. But you really can't divorce the Old Testament from the New, as even in the Old Testament there are prophecies, for instance, concerning the last days (the book of Daniel), and even prophecies concerning the Jewish people. Yes, we are saved by placing faith in Jesus Christ, we live under a New Covenant, but you still need to have an understanding of the Old Covenant.


the Jews, btw claim to understand the Torah. the admit that because Islam is prophesied in the Torah and Islam is based upon the 7 Noahide Laws that Muslims who follow Islam properly are going to Jannah/Heaven. with the exception of Messianic Jews, they hold no such belief about "Christians" and "Christianity!"

I'm not familiar with Jews believing that Islam is prophesied in the Old Testament. I would think that most Jews wouldn't consider Islam to be the New Covenant simply based on the fact that the Messiah was prophesied to come from the seed of David, and Muhammad did not come from the Davidic line.

Also, the Messianic Jews are the only ones who really understand the Torah, as God has placed a veil over the eyes of most Jews, until the fulness of the Gentiles or times of the Gentiles is fullfilled.

so all that you know is that you have found the way, even if you have no idea what that way means?

No. I can explain certain things. I have an understanding of some of the scripture. It's just that, when you begin to study the Word, meditate it on it, and become grounded in it, God begins to reveal himself to you, and you grow as a Christian.

right, but you see somehow "Christians" have come to the conclusion that is it OK to "associate partners with Allah[swt]" by ADDING gods to their list such as all the praying to the Saints as well as to Jesus[pbuh] and Mary[pbuh] and other "Christians" DON'T condemn it, in fact, they say that they are just as much "Christians" as they are, BUT to "disassociate partners with Allah[swt]" by speaking the Truth that Jesus[pbuh] IS NOT god is heresy! and "Christians" who do so such as Jehovah Witness or the Philadelphia Church of God ARE NOT considered "Christians!" it seems that you can never have too many gods, but that 3 is the absolute minumum!
.[/quote]

Well, I can only speak for what I myself do and what I personally believe to be the truth. You can look through my post history. I don't consider in any wise that the bondage of Roman Catholicism is what Christ taught. I knew there was something odd about the faith even before I accepted Christ, and after having done research on it my suspicions have been proven true.

In terms of Christians who "ascribe partners to Allah" by saying that Jesus is the Son of God, have a look at what is in the Old Testament in Psalms 110: 1.

The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool.'

Which Jesus references to the Pharisees here:

'Saying, What think ye of Christ? whose son is he? They say unto him, The son of David.

He saith unto them, How then doth David in spirit call him Lord, saying,

The Lord said unto my Lord, Sit thou at my right hand, till I make thine enemies thy footstool?

If David then call him Lord, how is he his son?

And no man was able to answer him a word, neither durst any man from that day forth ask him any more questions.' Matthew 22: 42-46.


BUT, you claim that Jesus[pbuh] died for your sins so you have your "get out of hell free card," why would your god punish you if Jesus[pbuh] already paid the price for your sins??? i was under the impression the "Christianity" is all about your god's love for you!

Well, if you sin as a Christian then almighty God is going to respond to that sin. It's called chasteneing:

'For whom the Lord loveth he chasteneth, and scourgeth every son whom he receiveth.

If ye endure chastening, God dealeth with you as with sons; for what son is he whom the father chasteneth not?

But if ye be without chastisement, whereof all are partakers, then are ye bast-ards and not sons.

Furthermore we have had fathers of our flesh which corrected us, and we gave them reverence: shall we not much rather be in subjection unto the Father of spirits, and live?

...

Now no chastening for the present seemeth to be joyous, but grievous: nevertheless afterward it yieldeth the peaceable fruit of righteousness unto them which are exercised thereby.'

Hebrews: 12: 6-9, 11.

Peace be upon those who follow the guidance,

please tell, us more about "the Holy Spirit has his ways of communicating with you"

It's really hard to explain how the Holy Spirit communicates to a Christian to one who is not initiated. I could try, but it wouldn't come off well. Just know that from what I've learned I know that it is the Holy Spirit who communicates with me, because it happens far too often to be chance.

regarding Cain and Abel, the 4th Chapter of Genesis reads:

3And in process of time it came to pass that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the LORD.


4And Abel also brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the LORD had respect unto Abel and to his offering;


5but unto Cain and to his offering He had not respect. And Cain was very wroth, and his countenance fell.


6And the LORD said unto Cain, "Why art thou wroth? And why is thy countenance fallen?


7If thou doest well, shalt thou not be accepted? And if thou doest not well, sin lieth at the door. And unto thee shall be his desire, and thou shalt rule over him."


it does not say that these are sin sacrifices, just offerings!

Read it again. It says that Abel bought a sacrifice of his flock. Taken in context with the rest of the Old Testament, yes, it was a sacrifice, or a sin offering.
 
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Fedos>>And of course both Adam and Eve had God living inside of them, until they sinned, and their eyes were opened, and they understood both good and evil as he withdrew his presence from them.


>>>What is wrong of sinning?

Adam and Eve sinned, and repent. It's over.

How do I know?

God later blessed them and sent them where they supposed to be, and put under thier order everything exist.

As a matter of fact, according to Islam and Jesus, when we sin and repent, we are better than the ones who never sin. When we sin, God keep his eyes on us waitnig for us to repent, and when we do, He is very please with us.

According to the Holy Bible, David sin BIG time, but when he repent, his sin, was wiped out:

Psalm 32:5 "Then I acknowledged my sin to you;
I did not cover up my guilt...
and you forgave the guilt of my sin."

Beautifull verse, I like too much:

Micah 6:8 says it best: "It has been told you, O' man, what is good, and what the LORD does require of you, only to do justice, to love mercy, and to walk humbly with your GOd".

Which letter of the above verse Christians don't understand?
Beyond speaking of individual acts as sin, do you believe that there is an inate tendency for humans to sin? Since all persons appear to sin at one or more times in their lives, where does this commonality for all to sin originate? Is it created in us by Allah? Is it part of our DNA? Is it that we are stained by the world? Is it people wanting to usurp God's place and be king of their own lives rather than to submit to Allah's will? Are these individual acts of sin in anyway related to each other, all having a common thread and origin deep within the person, perhaps some sort of deformity to the basic nature, or are they just each isolated, self-contained moments of violation of God's will and laws for our lives?
 
I apologize, Yusuf Noor, I did not realize that you had wrote your responses as red text. I have answered your questions in my last response.
 
I am aware of God speaking to Moses through the burning bush, but is there any verse in the OT that indicates that God lives within any human body?


>>>I am not aware of such verses, can you site one where is God spoke to Moses through the burning bush?
Exodus 3:4 And when the Lord saw that he turned aside to see, God called unto him out of the midst of the bush, and said, "Moses, Moses". And he said, "Here am I." The conversation continues through 4:23.
 

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