Christianity dying out?

[Argamemnon]

In Europe, about 75% of people are christians. Not all of them go to church, not all of them agree with christian morality, but they identify themselves with this religion. There are very very few european coutries where atheists are majority. I know one, Chech republic.

Let's look at what mighty wikipedia claims;

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religion_in_Europe

The chart was not clear when I posted so I have deleted it.

 

[Fishman]

I think this has emerged with Turkey's new "European" look. They want to be seen in par with any other European country; freedom of speech, equal opportunities etc... But at the same time, they have almost lost the true essence of what it means to be an Islamic country. How it's a privilege to be an Islamic country, to be able to enforce the fair and just laws laid down for us by Rasullulah (saws). You have some of the most beautiful Islamic architecture in Turkey, yet the spirit of the history of these buildings, our own history as Musilms, is being forgotten over time.

There is one thing that Ataturk did do for Islam though: he stopped the Saudis from demolishing Masjid-ul-Nabi, allegedly. Can't find any primary sources for this unfortunately.

 

[Argamemnon]

I often hear Christians and Muslims argue about which religion is 'bigger' (in terms of numbers).

That always strikes me as pointless.
Perhaps quality (i.e. how seriously people take their faith) matters more than quantity (i.e. how many people proclaim to follow a certain religion on paper).

What do you think?

I would agree with that...

 

[Argamemnon]

You have some of the most beautiful Islamic architecture in Turkey, yet the spirit of the history of these buildings, our own history as Musilms, is being forgotten over time.

The spirit of Islam is still very strong in Turkey. There are nearly 100,000 mosques, I believe. About 24 million people attend the friday prayers at mosques, that's a huge number...

 

[Banu_Hashim]

The spirit of Islam is still very strong in Turkey. There are nearly 100,000 mosques, I believe. About 24 million people attend the friday prayers at mosques, that's a huge number...

MashAllah. I stand corrected. The extreme secular must be very much in the minority then.

 

[Argamemnon]

MashAllah. I stand corrected. The extreme secular must be very much in the minority then.

The fanatic ultra-secular are a small but very powerful minority, but there are also religious people who support the foundations of the Turkish Republic, even though they might disagree with the headscarf ban in public buildings. Turkey is a very weird country, even I get confused..

 

[Banu_Hashim]

Why did they ban headscarf's anyway? I never understood the reasoning behind it. Doesn't the president's wife wear a headscarf?

 

[Argamemnon]

^^ maybe we should create a separate thread for that

It really is a complicated matter, I couldn't answer in a few sentences. I hope you'll forgive me.

 

[Banu_Hashim]

^^Haha... fair enough. I see your point bro .

 

[Güven]

Why did they ban headscarf's anyway? I never understood the reasoning behind it. Doesn't the president's wife wear a headscarf?

:salamext:

They are afraid the shariah law will come back and they will lose their secular state ...and the woman who dont wear it are affraid that they will be pressured to wear one.


well like the brother said it is a complicated issue...and not a topic for this thread

 

[Amadeus85]

I think that we shouldnt trust those who say that Europe's predescination is atheism. Those people who lived in 80's they would never say that the evil ideology of communism will fall apart in next few years. No one can prove that an atheism is some higher level of human history. Our society nowadays isnt better, than it was 50 yearsa go, when most people were practising christians. There is more apathy in the society,more fatalism, nihilism. We can look at the muslim world. 40 years ago, muslim world seemed to be fascinated by socialism,communism,maoism. Now its totaly different. Everything can change into better.

 

[KAding]

That's the price of secularism and economic development.
It's the same in Eastern Europe, except the the most likely cause there is communism. With the exception of Poland and Croatia, most countries there have a high number of non-believers.
It's not only Christians that are affected by these factors. It's Muslims too. Countries like Albania, Bosnia, Kazakhstan etc too have a significant amount of irreligious citizens and of course, Muslims in Western Europe are secular too, a lot of them don't go to mosques or become atheists, however the family and social pressure they face is much stronger compared to Christians, so less actually leave their religion.

Yeah, I suppose at a certain moment there is a "tipping point" at which social pressure to be non-religious becomes stronger than the age old pressure to be a God-fearing citizen. At that moment the process of secularization accelerates.

On a global scale though, it is clear that believers far far outnumber unbelievers. Even in societies so similar to Europe, such as the US, religion is as strong as ever. Though like others here I do wonder what percentage of people are so-called RINO's, i.e. "Religious in name only".

 

[Argamemnon]

Even in societies so similar to Europe, such as the US, religion is as strong as ever.

Most people say this, but I seriously doubt that religion is that strong in the US. The world's biggest porn industry is there after all, that should tell us something, lol..

I would be happy if one of our American friends could clarify this issue. Are most Americans as religious as people in the rest of the world think they are? Then what's up with all this materialism, capitalism and hedonism.. how religious is that??

 

[KAding]

I think that we shouldnt trust those who say that Europe's predescination is atheism. Those people who lived in 80's they would never say that the evil ideology of communism will fall apart in next few years. No one can prove that an atheism is some higher level of human history. Our society nowadays isnt better, than it was 50 yearsa go, when most people were practising christians. There is more apathy in the society,more fatalism, nihilism. We can look at the muslim world. 40 years ago, muslim world seemed to be fascinated by socialism,communism,maoism. Now its totaly different. Everything can change into better.

True.

In Dutch the have a nice new word "ietsisme", which translates to "somethingism", a belief that there are higher powers out there. At the same time this belief distances itself from traditional religions and their understanding of God. So, from this view, there is something out there, but we just don't know what and how it actually relates to us!

Many belief that is the future of religion in secular societies like Europe. I don't know, it certainly sounds like an improvement over much more political and legislative traditional religions.

 

[AntiKarateKid]

True.

In Dutch the have a nice new word "ietsisme", which translates to "somethingism", a belief that there are higher powers out there. At the same time this belief distances itself from traditional religions and their understanding of God. So, from this view, there is something out there, but we just don't know what and how it actually relates to us!

Many belief that is the future of religion in secular societies like Europe. I don't know, it certainly sounds like an improvement over much more political and legislative traditional religions.

It, quite frankly, sounds stupid. A useless mix of atheism, distorted religion, and laziness.

THey should get up off their butts and find out what that "something" out there is, religion is serious and not some childish skepticism. Their view is probably worthless in the eyes of Allah who has sent messengers.

As far as legislative religions go, why wouldnt Allah give us a complete set of moral and legal rules? It seems like the complete package but then again, the "somethingists" may disagree about what it means to be a perfect religion.

BTW "Many believe"?? That is news to the billions of Muslims, CHristians and Jews.

It is laughable that they think they could propose a better ideology than that of the Prophets of Allah.

 

[AntiKarateKid]

Most people say this, but I seriously doubt that religion is that strong in the US. The world's biggest porn industry is there after all, that should tell us something, lol..

I would be happy if one of our American friends could clarify this issue. Are most Americans as religious as people in the rest of the world think they are? Then what's up with all this materialism, capitalism and hedonism.. how religious is that??

American is a country of failed morals. It has more people who consider themselves religious but are corrupt themselves. Europe has corrupt people who acknowlege themselves as atheists.

I see America turning into a den of corrupt religious fanatics and Europe as a bunch of godless fools.

 

[czgibson]

Greetings,

From where I sit, in the UK, it has seemed for a long time now that Christianity is dying out. Statistics may point to the UK being a country with a Christian majority, but many are "Religious in name only", as KAding mentioned. Religious statistics should also never be trusted as a general rule, of course.

There are, of course, many Christians still around, and Christian charity groups such as the Salvation Army and CAFOD are still well-respected in the UK for the work they do.

For some reason, (and it might be interesting to discuss why), overt displays of religious belief seem to be less common in Britain than in other countries. Tony Blair could only openly convert to Catholicism after he'd relinquished the post of Prime Minister, for instance.

In my school, a boy started refusing to go to lessons because he wanted to pray for ten hours a day; the head brought round the school counsellor and had several psychiatrists ready to come and see him. He was an intelligent, sincere person, and he wasn't just being lazy. He was at a Christian school, and felt that was the best way to express the faith he'd been taught. You can make your own judgement, but I think the head's reaction shows something about the way "excessive" religious belief is viewed in Britain.

Abandoned churches can be found all over Britain. There simply aren't enough worshippers to fill their pews. Some have been turned into nightclubs, restaurants or theatres. Many are just left to decay because no-one can afford to maintain them. It's a sad state of affairs for anyone who cares about architecture or national heritage.

These are just a few thoughts about the state of Christianity in the UK, and I hope they are of some use in the discussion here.

In an attempt to sum up:

In Britain, there are many Christians, and there are many non-Christians; there are Christians who don't shout about it, and there are "Christians" who actually don't believe in god; it's also worth pointing out that there are also a lot of perfectly sincere Christians in many nations who know next to nothing about the contents of the Bible, and any perceived "decline" in Christianity could have something to do with that.

Peace

 

[Banu_Hashim]

Er... he prayed for 10 hours a day?!..

Christians don't have compulsory prayer do they?

 

[mkh4JC]

Most people say this, but I seriously doubt that religion is that strong in the US. The world's biggest porn industry is there after all, that should tell us something, lol..

I would be happy if one of our American friends could clarify this issue. Are most Americans as religious as people in the rest of the world think they are? Then what's up with all this materialism, capitalism and hedonism.. how religious is that??

Well, living where I live (Detroit, Michigan) and from my understanding, most people today (even in the U.S.) only say they are or they think they are Christian, when in reality they don't have an ounce of Jesus. I wouldn't hesitate at all also to say that there are whole churches throughout this nation with crooked pastors, leading people astray, as Jesus put it, 'the blind leading the blind.'

I can't tell you--for instance--the amount of times I have met someone who confessed to me that they were Christian and the next thing that comes out of their mouth is a dirty joke or a swear word. In truth, if you are truly Christian and someone comes into your life and they confess that they too are Christian, it doesn't take very long for you to confirm the truth of the matter.

Having said all that, Christianity (ie Biblical Christianity) is not going to fade away, as the Bible says that Christ's truth endureth to all generations.

 

[Aqeel Ahmed]

I'm interested in Christianity in different continents. Christianity is slowly dying out in Europe, I think we can all agree on this. But what about the US and other regions and continents of the world?

Yes I live in Canada and the places I go have around 20-30 people Christians out of 100. You can say that in Canada it has decreased about 30%.

I have lived in England 10 years and I do not know a single Christian.... All the English people I know are Atheists and the only time they mention Christianity is to make fun of it

If my brain is working and I still have my history studies , in UK they usually all live in a single area.

In Europe, about 75% of people are christians. Not all of them go to church, not all of them agree with christian morality, but they identify themselves with this religion. There are very very few european coutries where atheists are majority. I know one, Chech republic.

Yes Today is Christmas, I think it is anyway. And the renters of the down part of the house are not going to church even though they are Christians because of the snow.
Aqeel.
:wl: