Cicumsission question

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Tony

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Mods I tried to put this in brothers section but wouldnt let me do it, not sure why.
Can someone shed some light on the subject of circumsision. I have two boys 3 and 4, my wife is constantly telling me we need to cicumsize them, it is causing problems for us and we argue. My wife is welcome to have her own way with everything, she bore my children and it it the least I can do. But I cannot back down over this, my reasons are as follows.
1) I cannot get past the belief that we would be mutilating our children.
2) We are not perfect in our imaan so how can we then subject our children to a procedure that is part of religion, I strongly think that untill we are right in the eyes of Allah we cannot expect our children to go through this to benefit our own beliefs
3) How is it right to mutilate the body when it is Allahs perfection, we do not adorn our bodies with tattoos, peircings etc, I do not understand this point as circumsission seems to go against Allah, We may as well cut of our noses !
4) They are my world and to take something from them seems wrong.

Apologies if offending anyone, this is the least I am trying to do. Please can someone knowledgeable help me here. It may be cultural thing but its becoming a big problem. My wife is Turkish and to go live in Turkey she says we must do it. Please help a dad in distress. Peace
 
:sl:

do you believe in Allah's book?

do you believe muhammad (saws) didnt speak from his own desires but that his words and actions are also sources of guidance from Allah to us?

if so how can you question what has been commanded?

did ibrahim (as) ask for the reasons for circumcision or did he just hear and obey even though he was in his 80's at the time?

:sl:
 
Male circumcision is among the rites of Islam and is part of the fitrah, or the natural character and instinct of the human creation.

Prophet Muhammad (salalahu aleyhi wasalaam) said, "Five are the acts quite akin to fitrah:Circumcision, clipping or shaving the pubes, cutting the nails, plucking or shaving the hair under the armpits and clipping (or shaving) the moustache." (Reported in Bukhari & Muslim)

:w:
 
It is best to circumcise children when they are born -- however now you can do it under general anesthesia so they won't have a memory of it!

:w:
 
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I don't know what else there is to say besides the fact circumcision is obligatory, this isn't something that scholars differ upon, they are unanimous. Like brother dawud said, Islam is a package deal, you've got to take it all as it is, there's no picking and choosing.
Plus, it's supposedly much easier when you're little than when you get older, so if you don't do it now, when your kids get older and decide to do it themselves, they may resent you for not having taken care of this when they were younger.
 
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Thanks for responses, not sure why people being so short tho, these are my children not some objects that I can give up or do without, its easy to qyestion my belief in the Qur'an or Muhammads (pbuh) teachings, I am genuinely stuck if it was as easy as saying it is my duty then I would not have neede to post at all. Please I need help not just flippant remarks that require little or no thought. It maybe easy to throw up details of Abrahams sacrifices, I am not Abraham and to some extent this is my point. I am prepared to take the suffering and punishment if nescessarry, I just want someone to explain the points I raised. If you have no children please do not bother to post a reply
 
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I reread our posts, and couldn't find any short or flippant remarks at all, they're all respectful. If you found my post rude somehow, I apologize, it wasn't meant to be. :)

I'm unsure what it is you're stuck on, it's a clear command from Allah; circumcise your children. Some people may not see the logic in hijab, or praying 5 times a day, or growing a beard, but Islam is submission, it is submitting ourselves to the will of Allah whether we understand it or not.

Perhaps this is the problem; you said "It may be cultural thing but its becoming a big problem.". Maybe you are perceiving it as a cultural thing; whereas in reality, it's a part of Islam through and through.
 
Assalamoalaikum Brother,

I have kids too and my husband seemed to have thought like you but when I told him about the sunnah he did it immediately, although he is not religious at all

he couldnt bear to be with him during the operation time or didnt even see the ring of the smaller one but he did get it done.. Alhamdolillah

removing the skin is just like cutting nails, or hair when they grow or clearing/shaving off pubic hair ( which hurts a lot if one is waxing... EVERY TIME) but it is part of cleaning oneself.

Are you even aware of all the diseases that they can catch if you dont remove it for them? And what if they become religious when they are grown men, they would have to show their aura to strangers to get it cut. AND in addition to this they will even hurt muc more than they would right now.

When theya re young they dont feel pain, my older one delayed until he was almost 2 because of living in france where we couldnt arrange it, i remember I ws going to cry when he would try and pass urine and it would urt but even then it only hurt for around 10 hours and by 24 hours he was up and running an perfectly normal and his size had increased alot as well hehehe

When they grow older the older they grow the more pain they will feel, I suggest get it done soon. the loose skin is very sensitive to STDs, and there are many other problems that are caused due to it, e.g occasionally it swells up and sometimes it dries and itches and sometimes it gets hard around the head etc etc.

There are only and only benefits for removing the skin and only diadvantages for keeping it. Even lots of non muslims have the foreskin removed due to health benefits.
If you love your sons you will get them circumcised because a few hours pain would cause them many eayrs of pleasure and closeness to Allah in addition to it.

These explainations would only be needed by someone who .. requires wordly explainations, yet nevertheless sometimes we all do..

May Allahy gie you taufeeq to do the best for your children, Ameen.
 
ok crayon, then perhaps problem is mine about percieving flippant remarks. I think that if my islam is not right there is things I need to improve before doing this to my childrfen. I am ready to change things as Allah demands but I am not questioning that cicumsission is ordained, just struggling with it as a concept. I do not understand why Allah would create us with skin and how its right to "mutilate" his perfect creation by removing it. I just want the answers is all, cannot bare the thought of harming my kids but am seeking guidance because I want to do right for Allah, this is my area where sacrifice is hard, we all have them, I would genuinley offer my right hand instead if it would be accepted. I am trying and it is an emotive subject for me, pls understand, also I was not brought up in Islam, I recognised it as truth, I think this is part of why I struggle here, I am all for children and really seek guidance on the original points
 
Hopeful, God bless you, this is exactly what I needed to hear. I cant thank you enough. may Allah bless your familly. Fete du beau reve
 
I think what you are aksing is what I asked once when I was young. If we have to cut our nails, then why did Allah amke them grow in the first place? if te apendix is removed and does not have an function anyway, then why is it placed there when it gives such an immense pain while removing it and normally it happens when one is young. When the everyone is supposed to be good then why ws evil created when Allah KNEW what shaytaan would do. When Allah knows how we are why does He expect of us things e.g prayer, fasting etc..

It is not MUTILATING the body, do not call it that, there is some surplus skin that is surgically removed. That is al there is to it brother. As I said before, they will feel pain for some hours and then they will not feel a thing.

Allah made such things to test us, Inthe quraa it says again and again that we were sent down here in duniya to be tested, how much we obey Him. When there is a sunnat or command form Alah th reward is much more when there are obstacles as Allah KNOWS how you struggled to attain that satte of submission, hence the gift of paradise, something that your imagination cannnot surpass.
 
Thanks people, I think that when it is done then the least I should do is to go first ! Just need to pray first and accept the need for real sacrifices in order to truly proove my belief. Peace
 
JazakAllah brother, May Allah give you the strength and determination to carry out your duty in the best way, ameen.
P.s I didnt see your post, so I posted again :D hehehe
 
Thanks again. just one last thing, can someone pls direct me to any passages of Qur'an relating to this
 
As Maimunah pointed it out, it is stated in an authentic Hadees:


Prophet Muhammad (salalahu aleyhi wasalaam) said, "Five are the acts quite akin to fitrah:Circumcision, clipping or shaving the pubes, cutting the nails, plucking or shaving the hair under the armpits and clipping (or shaving) the moustache." (Reported in Bukhari & Muslim)

I don't think it is in the quraan, same way as growing a beard is not in the quraan or the timings of Salat or the amounts of its rakats. As long as it is in a Hadees , authentic one then one shjould follow.

JazakAllah
 
the scholars have differed actually, since there is no evidence for it being obligatory, the only indication of it being part of our religion is what the prophet said:
" الفطرة خمس الختان والاستحداد وقص الشارب وتقليم الأظفار ونتف الآباط "

"five are from the fitrah etc"

notice he mentions cutting the nails and trimming the mustache alongside circumcision without differentiating, that means if there is any ruling to be derived then all of these actions are equal, deriving a ruling would not be accurate however, since you can not trim your mustache etc.

it is most likely sunna, and has benefits for health and so on, but I'm not a doctor.
if you really don't want to do it then don't, it was obligatory on the Jews, not us, still I'd advise you to do it, it's benefits outweigh any momentary pain etc.

http://www.mayoclinic.com/health/circumcision/PR00040
 
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TKTony said:
ok crayon, then perhaps problem is mine about percieving flippant remarks. I think that if my islam is not right there is things I need to improve before doing this to my childrfen. I am ready to change things as Allah demands but I am not questioning that cicumsission is ordained, just struggling with it as a concept. I do not understand why Allah would create us with skin and how its right to "mutilate" his perfect creation by removing it. I just want the answers is all, cannot bare the thought of harming my kids but am seeking guidance because I want to do right for Allah, this is my area where sacrifice is hard, we all have them, I would genuinley offer my right hand instead if it would be accepted. I am trying and it is an emotive subject for me, pls understand, also I was not brought up in Islam, I recognised it as truth, I think this is part of why I struggle here, I am all for children and really seek guidance on the original points
Click to expand...


:sl:

the topic has been discussed on the forum several times, perhaps that is the reason you are receiving short replies..

I need to just ask you...
Do you groom your nails and cut your hair, clean out your ear wax, wipe after using the bathroom, shower daily, use deodorants etc? Our natural state would be in animal like if we didn't take care of the above, but we are refined human beings, thus we groom, part of the grooming for males in accordance with Abrahamic faith is circumcision.
If you had appendicitis would you want excised?

Allah swt gives us many gifts and entrusts that we take care of them and/or maintain them.. Circumcision does confer some health benefits, and still people live perfectly normal lives with their foreskin -- so the final decision is yours..

:w:
 
Gossamer skye, yes I understand nails etc, and I think maybe the health benefits are good, and I think I am coming round to the idea, just meeded sounding board, however, the things listed are like a choice thing there is no choice for my lads when it comes to circumsission. Would like to think it would be done for Allahs sake but not sure that its only going to be for health reasons. May Allah forgive my doubts
 
I have a 6 year old son and I insisted that we have him circed at birth and my husband had no objections. He got circed when he was 21 when he married a Jewish woman and converted to her faith. It is better to do it around birth or wait until the 8th day, apparently on the 8th day the babys blood can clot easier and healing time is short. My stepson is not circed as my husbands 2nd wife read somewhere that the child would remember the pain and suffer mental trauman for life. When we had my son done the doctor used a local anastetic , so my son felt no pain . I would not have this done on even a baby without pain meds. It took my son only a week to heal, an older child and adult can take a while as there are more blood vessels involved than with a baby.
 
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