"Dad, I'm Dying" -israeli pigs use boy to practice shooting

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its comments like this, which show we still have many blind people who are blind from the inside,

well can i see authentic news sources sayin that hamas is firin rockets? because i dont believe in the bbc/cnn/sky/
Say Israel is firing rockets on its citizens... Why do you think they'd keep the death toll at 3 when the whole world is accusing them of disproportionality?
 
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Israel has done many mistakes,

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You are right; they last mistake was attack to Gaza. They maybe were thinking to destroy Hamas power but they made it more powerfull and popular. So: Thanks to idiot zionists!

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However Israel itself is a great example how history can be forgotten for the greater good. 60 years ago, over 6 million of its people died in its concentration camps yet today Germany and Israel are great allies and even friends.
 
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Now zionists are doing what Hitler didn´t to the bitter end, massacre and genozide others like nazists did before.
 
Can't find 'Trumble's' comment -- not sure if I am on the wrong thread, nonetheless I received it my email, and here is my response to the this is war, and it is fair game

Will keep that in mind indeed, the next time you expect some sort of condemnation for an alleged 'Muslim terrorist Act' -- hey.. this is war!
 
I agree completely.
How will a blindfolded Palestinian boy who's lost his entire family in an air strike ever want to have peace with Israel?

:sl:

Blindfolded Palestinian boys whose have lost all they family by zionists/USA air strikes proposed ceasefire for one year. Lets see what zionists say about idea.

:-[

They don´t like to make peace with Palestinians, let me say.
 
Can't find 'Trumble's' comment -- not sure if I am on the wrong thread, nonetheless I received it my email, and here is my response to the this is war, and it is fair game

Will keep that in mind indeed, the next time you expect some sort of condemnation for an alleged 'Muslim terrorist Act' -- hey.. this is war!

Wrong thread. However, I am baffled that someone of your undoubted intelligence continues to have difficulty understanding something so simple. I an NOT dismissing or excusing anything happening in Gaza in the way you imply. NOWHERE have I said anything is 'fair game' or implied same. NOWHERE. At least give me the courtesy of actually reading my posts before attempting to reply.

Nothing in war is ever 'fair game'; that's your ridiculous fantasy, not mine. I am merely pointing out that what has happened in Gaza happens in every war because it is in the nature of war, and therefore the only way to avoid the pain and suffering we have seen is to avoid fighting any wars by whatever means necessary. To illustrate that simple argument, I have given examples of other conflicts where similar atrocities - and worse - have occurred asking you and another to explain why you believe them to be different if, in fact, you do.

It really isn't difficult.
 
Wrong thread. However, I am baffled that someone of your undoubted intelligence continues to have difficulty understanding something so simple. I an NOT dismissing or excusing anything happening in Gaza in the way you imply. NOWHERE have I said anything is 'fair game' or implied same. NOWHERE. At least give me the courtesy of actually reading my posts before attempting to reply.

Nothing in war is ever 'fair game'; that's your ridiculous fantasy, not mine. I am merely pointing out that what has happened in Gaza happens in every war because it is in the nature of war, and therefore the only way to avoid the pain and suffering we have seen is to avoid fighting any wars by whatever means necessary. To illustrate that simple argument, I have given examples of other conflicts where similar atrocities - and worse - have occurred asking you and another to explain why you believe them to be different if, in fact, you do.

It really isn't difficult.

It isn't quite as simple as that for us as Muslims. When one part of the Ummah (worldwide Muslim community) is suffering, we all suffer inside.
 
Wrong thread. However, I am baffled that someone of your undoubted intelligence continues to have difficulty understanding something so simple. I an NOT dismissing or excusing anything happening in Gaza in the way you imply. NOWHERE have I said anything is 'fair game' or implied same. NOWHERE. At least give me the courtesy of actually reading my posts before attempting to reply.

Nothing in war is ever 'fair game'; that's your ridiculous fantasy, not mine. I am merely pointing out that what has happened in Gaza happens in every war because it is in the nature of war, and therefore the only way to avoid the pain and suffering we have seen is to avoid fighting any wars by whatever means necessary. To illustrate that simple argument, I have given examples of other conflicts where similar atrocities - and worse - have occurred asking you and another to explain why you believe them to be different if, in fact, you do.

It really isn't difficult.


Peace...
Maybe it was this comment Uhkti was on about, or maybe i need a correction :X
Post #64
Re: Cease Fire Or A War Against Israel? - 6 Days Ago

Q8sobieski is, of course, quite correct regarding this "fair chance" and "manliness" nonsense. War is not a game, and if an army fights it fights to win. It aims to deny the enemy a 'fair chance' at every possible opportunity, not provide one - something just as true of Hamas or the Taliban as it is the Israeli or US military.

Peace...

 
unfortunately, ending all wars and so on are nothing but ridiculous fantasies too Trumble, the only way to stop wars is mutual deterrence, and even that fails at times.
 
It isn't quite as simple as that for us as Muslims. When one part of the Ummah (worldwide Muslim community) is suffering, we all suffer inside.

Of course. But this discussion actually originated in another thread where someone was pointing out that such concern regarding Gaza is much more than is being shown, and has been shown in the past, for muslims being persecuted and killed in other parts of the world such as Sudan, Chechnya, Afghanistan, etc. Not unreasonably, he was asking why.



Peace...
Maybe it was this comment Uhkti was on about, or maybe i need a correction :X


If it was, I think we have another misunderstanding - in which case it's probably time I gave up! Nonetheless, my comment is true.. and referred exclusively to combatants, as can be seen from the examples I gave. If a nation goes to war, it does so to win, and commanders do everything possible to deny enemy combatants a 'fair chance' because the more unfair it is, the better the chance of keeping their own men alive. As Patton said, "the object of war is not to die for your country but to make the other b****rd die for his".
 
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Wrong thread. However, I am baffled that someone of your undoubted intelligence continues to have difficulty understanding something so simple. I an NOT dismissing or excusing anything happening in Gaza in the way you imply. NOWHERE have I said anything is 'fair game' or implied same. NOWHERE. At least give me the courtesy of actually reading my posts before attempting to reply.

Nothing in war is ever 'fair game'; that's your ridiculous fantasy, not mine. I am merely pointing out that what has happened in Gaza happens in every war because it is in the nature of war, and therefore the only way to avoid the pain and suffering we have seen is to avoid fighting any wars by whatever means necessary. To illustrate that simple argument, I have given examples of other conflicts where similar atrocities - and worse - have occurred asking you and another to explain why you believe them to be different if, in fact, you do.

It really isn't difficult.


I can't find your original post from which one can only infer, 'this happens in every war' as a passive ok with it! in fact it doesn't and it shouldn't and have shown you, that this doesn't comply with Islamic jurisprudence on war ethics, and there is such a thing as 'war ethics' as agreed upon by the international community
Talking about fantasies, at least try to adhere to what I myself have written, so the rest of your comments don't get dismissed?

Your examples otherwise mean Jack.. history seems to report a different picture from your alleged interpretation of it!

Thankfully three weeks into it, the colonial settler state still hasn't achieved its goals of eliminating Hamas considering their enemy is barricaded from all sides, anymore than they did with hizbAllah... so much for their invincible army!

cheers
 
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I can't find your original post from which one can only infer, 'this happens in every war' as a passive ok with it!

I would have thought a rather more sensible inference was simply that you were looking in the wrong place, but there you go. It's HERE

No, not 'unparalled'. That's war.. it's always like that, a fact few here seem to understand. That's why the only sane thing to do is avoid war, whatever your 'cause' or however angry you may be or justified you think you may be.

in fact it doesn't and it shouldn't and have shown you, that this doesn't comply with Islamic jurisprudence on war ethics, and there is such a thing as 'war ethics' as agreed upon by the international community

What's your point? My claim is not that there have been no breaches of convention, treaty, morality, 'war ethics' or whatever label you want to attach to it in Gaza. My claim is that the same or similar breaches have occurred in most wars, and all historically significant ones.

Your examples otherwise mean Jack.. history seems to report a different picture from your alleged interpretation of it!

Rubbish. You really can't make such an utterly absurd comment without some attempt to justify it. In what way, exactly, am I supposed to be misinterpreting history? Are you seriously claiming that the war crimes and atrocities of WW2, Vietnam or Darfur, to name just a few, somehow never happened or, if they did, were somehow far less serious than those perpetrated by the IDF in Gaza? Please.. produce your evidence, it should be fascinating!
 
I would have thought a rather more sensible inference was simply that you were looking in the wrong place, but there you go. It's HERE

Thanks.. indeed that is what I am looking for.





What's your point? My claim is not that there have been no breaches of convention, treaty, morality, 'war ethics' or whatever label you want to attach to it in Gaza. My claim is that the same or similar breaches have occurred in most wars, and all historically significant ones.

and my question is-- should such things happen in wars? i.e the murder of women, children and elderly, by religious dictum?



Rubbish. You really can't make such an utterly absurd comment without some attempt to justify it. In what way, exactly, am I supposed to be misinterpreting history? Are you seriously claiming that the war crimes and atrocities of WW2, Vietnam or Darfur, to name just a few, somehow never happened or, if they did, were somehow far less serious than those perpetrated by the IDF in Gaza? Please.. produce your evidence, it should be fascinating!

What are you talking about? I have in fact justified my previous statements it with ( see below), I know it isn't the first time you have seen it, as it was the exact same I pasted in one of the other threads a reply to you, We don't have Muslim scholars condoning the murder or women/children/elderly with illegal chemicals and it is against Islamic warfare ethics. I ask and the question that has always been.. where is western/Israeli ethics? The same ethics that they expect others to comply with especially when labeling them 'terrorist organizations) yet passing religious decree to massacres! I think it is cowardice on their part (which is something patent to the naked eye)-- and lastly I am not the one who only in passing mentioned atrocities committed by Muslims and endorsed by an Islamic state without backing it up.. seems you have made a statement in passing and expected that it should hold!
Do awful things happen in war isn't so much the question as countries adhering to international laws and war ethics to which they are signatory as well if they so expect others to adhere, especially when they are constantly crying wolf over who is in breech of what!

Title
Fight Ethics Between Islam and Zionism

Question
Respected scholars, as-salamu `alaykum.

On Wednesday morning, March 3, 2008, a group of prominent rabbis issued an unprecedented fatwa allowing the Israeli occupation army to bombard the Palestinian civil gatherings. The fatwa also called upon this army to annihilate and burn the Palestinian civilians.

Is this reasonable? And what is the Islamic attitude toward killing civilians?

Jazakum Allahu khayran.

Date
12/Mar/2008

Name of Mufti

Topic
Relations during War, Jihad: Rulings & Regulations
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Answer
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Wa`alaykum as-salam wa rahmatullahi wa barakatuh.
In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.


All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.


Dear sister in Islam, thank you for the confidence you place in us, and we implore Almighty Allah to help us serve His cause and render our work for His Sake.

Islam stands against killing innocents. Even in war times, Islam does not allow killing civilians who have nothing to do with war, women, children, and worshippers in their places of worship. Also, it does not allow demolishing places of worship or destroying trees.

This clarifies that war in Islam is not meant to destroy and ruin. War in Islam should abide by morality and the ethics and regulations abided by Islam. Given this,
the difference between Zionists' destructive wars and our moral wars becomes clear.
In his response to your question, Dr. Muhammad Abdel-Latif Al-Banna, the managing editor of IslamOnline.net's (Arabic) Shari `ah Department, said,
People can see the difference between Zionists' destructive wars and our moral wars, but it is quite strange that their wars are now backed by rabbinic fatwas based on the Torah. That is why we are going to highlight and affirm the difference between their wars and our morality-based wars where women, old people, and civilians are not to be killed, and as long as the person in question is not a warrior. Adversely, in their wars children are killed, houses demolished, electricity cut, blockade imposed, and starvation spread. This clearly shows the immoral features of their wars and that they never comply with any peace pact. Even the absence of international condemnation testifies to collusion with them.
Zionists' War: Destructive
Now, it is not strange that such a fatwa be issued by Jewish rabbis, especially after destroying the infrastructures in Lebanon and killing civilians during their wars in different countries. For instance, they killed the students of Bahr Al-Baqar School in Egypt, murdered summer visitors in Palestine, and destroyed residential buildings in Beirut. They do all this under a religious cover or legitimacy. In my opinion, this legitimacy is most obviously based on the religious Hebraic state as a reference, because their Torah allows killing civilians and destroying humans and facilities.
Such is their distorted Torah on which they depended in issuing such fatwas that contradict all agreements and covenants. In spite of this, we have not heard – so far – any international jural organization blaming them, correcting their notions, or condemning what they have said.
Our Wars: Moral
They called upon their army to destroy and kill others, although this army was in no need for their fatwa. On the other hand, our Islamic Shari`ah is moral and decent in all its wars. It preserves lives, maintains honors, and never destroys people's facilities or property.
Concerning the battlefield where everybody is either killing or killed, Prophet Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) taught his Companions that the message of fair war in Islam should make it clear to all people that Muslims are heralds of peace. Therefore, if they indulge in any war, it should be undertaken through their morals, including justice with which no one is to be wronged.
It has been narrated by Abu Dawud on the authority of Khalid ibn Al-Fazar, who said, "Anas ibn Malik told me that the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) said, 'Set out in the Name of Allah, with (the help of) Allah, and according to the religion of the Messenger of Allah. Do not kill any man far advanced in years, nor a child, a baby, or a woman. And do not go into excesses. Gather your spoils of war together, do what is right, and do good; truly, Allah loves the good-doers'" (Abu Dawud, Sulayman ibn Al-Ash`ath, Sunan, the book of Jihad, hadith No. 2247, Dar Al-Hadith, Cairo).
This text clarifies that the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) specified certain categories to be exempted from killing in wars; including:
Old people, children, and women: not to be killed
Old people:
In principle, they are not to be fought because of their old age. Thus, as a sign of respecting their old age and because they do not (usually) indulge in war, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) commanded that they are not to be killed.
Yet still, we should differentiate between two kinds of old people: First, those who only seek to find their livelihood with no intention of fighting; such have nothing to do with war or fighting; second, those who set plans for war, conspire against Muslims, and dedicate all their experience in life to this goal; it is permissible to fight such people.
Sheikh MuhammadAbu Zahrah
, the well-known Muslim scholar, (may Allah have mercy upon him) said, "Old people are of two types: Those who are in charge of wars and have relevant (effective) opinions, and those who are not competent for this, nor do they have anything to do with war. The latter are not to be killed, because there are not enough reasons that obligate fighting (or killing) them. The former, however, can be legally killed, for they are warriors because of their opinions, planning, and conspiring.

In this regard, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) ordered that Durayd ibn As-Simmah be killed in the battle of Hunayn. Although he was one hundred and twenty years old (120), this man was mindful enough to give effective advice, which he had already given in that battle, so he was a warrior because of this" (Muhammad Abu Zahrah, Nazariyyat Al-Harb fi Al-Islam, p. 38).

Women, Workers, and Children:
The Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) forbade killing these people, because they do not usually indulge in war. This is because – in principle – women do not fight and children do not carry weapons, choose (to fight), or realize (what war means). By the same token, workers are originally meant for construction, and war in Islam is not meant for destruction.
I mentioned these categories together under this title because the (relevant religious) texts have something in common concerning them, and these people themselves have a common denominator: They do not usually indulge in war. Moreover, in most cases war is imposed on them. For all these reasons, they have been tackled together under one title.
There are many texts to this effect, including a hadith narrated on the authority of Rabah ibn Rabi`, who said, "We were with the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) in a battle when he saw the people assembling around something. He ordered a man to go and see what those people were assembling for. The man came back and said they were assembling around a killed woman. He (the Prophet) said, 'This (woman) would not fight for sure.' " The narrator said, "Khalid ibn Al-Waleed was in charge of the vanguard, so he (the Prophet) sent a man to Khalid to tell him: 'Do not kill a woman or a wageworker' " (Narrated by Abu Dawud, Book of Jihad, Hadith No. 2295).
This hadith includes two important remarks: First, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) denounced that a woman be killed; and secondly, he (peace and blessings be upon him) directly ordered Khalid – as well as all Muslim leaders – not to kill a woman or a wageworker.
This clearly indicates that killing women and wageworkers is not permissible as long as they do not fight or indulge in war. If, however, they do so, it will then be permissible to kill them, because leaving them would be (a support for) killing Muslims.
The reason why workers are not to be killed is that "they do not fight, nor do they have anything to do with war. This is because such people would not fight, as war is usually connected to warriors, and because war (in Islam) is not meant for fighting nations, but for warding off the powers of evil and mischief. That is why it is to be with those who carry weapons and fight, or those who set plans and plots. Moreover, workers – who are totally busy with cultivation or handiwork – are constructors, while war in Islam is not for deconstruction; it is only for warding off corruption. It is further because such workers are (in many cases) wretched under the dominion of unjust rulers, so they should not be a fuel for a war from which they would benefit nothing but suffering" (Muhammad Abu Zahrah, Nazariyyat Al-Harb fi Al-Islam, p. 38).
Just as the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) forbade killing women and wageworkers, he also forbade killing children, because they have not done anything wrong to be killed for. It has been narrated on the authority of Qatadah who narrated from Al-Hasan that Al-Aswad ibn Sari` said that the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) sent an expedition on the Day of Hunayn. As they were fighting the polytheists, they killed (some of their) offspring (children). When they returned, the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) asked them, "Why did you kill offspring?" They replied, "O Messenger of Allah! (It is) only (because) they were children of the polytheists." He said, "Is it not that the best of you are children of polytheists?! By Him in Whose Hands Muhammad’s soul is, no person is born except on fitrah [Arabic for: natural disposition of belief in Allah] until his tongue expresses (this belief or otherwise)" (Ahmad ibn Hanbal, Musnad, The Makkans' Musnad, 15.36).
This is a form of reprimanding those who killed the polytheists' children, because those children had not yet realized (what was meant by war or polytheism), nor had they chosen that (war). Our Islamic Shari`ah requires reaching the age of puberty, sanity, and choosing (not to be under coercion) for a person to be legally responsible (for his actions). Therefore, it is not reasonable that this matter is such clear in our Shari`ah then we would act otherwise.
According to the narration of Ad-Darimi, the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) confirmed that children must not be killed. Al-Aswad ibn Sari` said, "We went out with the Messenger of Allah (peace and blessings be upon him) in some battle where he overcame the polytheists, so the people (Muslims) speeded up to kill (them) so much that they killed children. When the Prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) was told about that, he said, 'Why have some people hastened to kill (even) children? Behold! No children are to be killed!' repeating it three times" (Ad-Darimi, Sunan, the book of Siyar, Hadith No. 2354).
This denunciation – followed by forbiddance – confirms that Islam is keen on sparing the life of children in all cases. This is because "no aggression is expected from such weak children, so how should they bear the burden of others' aggression? War in Islam is not for annihilating enemies, but for preventing aggression. Therefore, it is not permissible that fighting should go beyond the motives for which it is originally stimulated" (Muhammad Abu Zahrah, Nazariyyat Al-Harb fi Al-Islam, p.38).
Contemporary Opinions on Killing Civilians
In a fatwa issued by Sheikh Faysal Mawlawi, vice president of the European Council for Fatwa and Research (ECFR), concerning killing civilians in wars especially from Jews, he said,
Originally, it is prohibited to kill civilians, women, and children, but certain cases are exempted from this:
1. When all individuals on the enemy side participate in war, as then the term "civilian" would not apply to them.
2. When civilians do things to help militants, as then what they do would be regarded as a "military action."
3. When warriors use civilians, women, and children as a shield and there is no way for Muslim warriors to reach those militants except by killing those civilians.
4. When the enemies kill Muslim civilians, for then their civilians may be treated the same.
5. When a civilian "accepts" usurping a (Muslim) land, he is considered an occupier, and is not a civilian any more.
6. When children themselves are not intended (or targeted) to be killed (deliberately) without doing anything wrong or committing any crime.
It is well known that Israelis, men and women, indulge in war against Palestinians, so they are warriors. They are also usurpers of the (Palestinian) land, because the Jews in Palestine have emigrated from various countries, and they have no right in this land. In Islam, it is obligatory to liberate any Islamic land from occupation. It should also be known that jihad against the Jews is not because they are Jews, but because they are usurpers and warriors.
The same opinion was adopted by:

Dr. Ahmad Nawfal, professor of Shari`ah in Jordan;


Dr. Sheikh Hamid Al-`Ali
, professor of Islamic culture in the faculty of Elementary Education, Kuwait;


Dr. Nizar `Abd Al-Qadir Rayyan
, participant professor of the science of Hadith, Gaza University;


Sheikh Jalal Yusuf Ash-Sharqi
, a personal status judge in Bahrain;
and many others.





 
and my question is-- should such things happen in wars? i.e the murder of women, children and elderly, by religious dictum?

Of course they shouldn't happen, I have already said that. But they do happen because it is in the nature of war that they will. It's not a case of what ethics are taught or preached, what scholars may say, or what treaties are signed. War is a brutal dehumanising experience, and it changes those involved in fighting it - sometimes for the better, and sometimes for the worse.

What are you talking about?

I think we are at pretty fundamental cross purposes; we are simply debating completely different things. Rather than spend the rest of the evening trying sort out exactly what we are disputing, it's best left there maybe?
 
:cry: Subhannallah ..

How can People be soo evil &- heartless

May Allah Grant the little boy a place in Paradise & Reward his Parents .. Ameen
 
:sl:B*******S!!!imsadimsad
GAZA CITY — "Dad, I'm dying."
The words keep echoing in Kamal Awaga's ears, sending jolts of pain into his feeble, wounded body.

These were the last words uttered by his 9-year-old son, Ibrahim, before he ended up as a practicing target for Israeli soldiers.

"They killed my son in cold blood," says the grief-stricken father, still in a state of shock.

Ibrahim joined more than 350 children killed by Israel in its three-week onslaught on the coastal enclave.

But while others fell victim to killer bullets or deadly bombs, Ibrahim's fate was even more tragic.

He became a shooting practice for a squad of Israeli soldiers.

"The Israelis did not show mercy for his innocence," said his tearful father from his bed at the Al-Shefa hospital in Gaza City.

"They had no pity for his tiny body," added the heart-broken father.

A Sunny Day

Nothing in the day prepared the Awaga family for the tragic twist of events that unfolded.

They woke up to a sunny morning after days of being locked in one small room to escape the massive Israeli bombardment.

"Mom, let's have our breakfast out in the garden. I'm tired of staying in this room," the grieved mother recalls Ibrahim's plea.

An hour later, the table was set in the garden and the family was hoping to enjoy rare moments of peace, unaware of the eyes watching them from a distance.

A first missile stole the family's job before another destroyed their house.

"Dad, I am dying," cried Ibrahim to his father who rushed frantically to his side.

"Hurry, let's go," Awaga told his wife and two other children while carrying bleeding Ibrahim.

But even before they could reach the gate, a flood of bullets showered them.

One bullet hit the mother's leg and another hit the father's waist.

Ibrahim's two frightened brothers ran for cover behind the rubbles of their bombed-out house.

Shooting Practice

As the firing died down, the family thought their misery was over. But the Israeli soldiers were not finished yet.

"When the soldiers came closer, I thought they will kill me," said Awaga who faked being dead.

"But they were aiming at my young child," he said choking at the bitter memory.

One soldier came close to Ibrahim's body, turning him by his leg and laughing while another fired his gun to the dead boy's head.

Laughs got louder as they carried the body to a higher place to start their party.

For a whole hour, the father hushed his cries of pain as he watched the Israeli soldiers compete in sniping on his dead son's body.

"They were using his bullet-ridden, bleeding body as a shooting practice.

"With each bullet, they were humming with words I could not figure out, but it sounded full of rapture. It was as if they were celebrating."

When they finally had enough "practicing," the Israelis took their guns and left the house.

Four complete days passed before emergency doctors were able to find their way to the family and rush them to hospital.

"What did my son do to deserve that?" Awaga asks, shaking his head in disbelief.

"The Israelis killed my kid, not once or twice but a thousand times."

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/...33468790&pagename=Zone-English-News/NWELayout
 

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