dead babies go to heaven without baptism?

MustafaMc said:
How will babies enter Heaven if they haven't accepted the free gift of Jesus' cleansing blood or been cleansed of the sin of Adam?
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I myself have asked that question in the board during which time Nicola was around. The only answer I get was about sacrificing goat blood or something.
 
- Brok3n - said:
:salamext:

^not a story, according to christianity, tis a fact.


Source

Quite silly if u ask me :ooh:
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Not exactly.

Augustine, an early Christian Philosopher and one of the two biggest human influences in Western Christian thought(the other being Thomas Aquinas) really hammerd home the doctrin of Origional Sin, like a heriditary sin every human is born into. The Christians of this time also ramped up the doctrin of extra ecclesiam nulla salus(Outside the Church[Roman Catholic] there is no salvation), this led to the necessary problem.

If we are all born in origional sin, seperated from God, and only Baptism can bring one into Christs' Church and hence salvation, then what of unborn Children, unbaptised babies, and rightous pagans(read non-Christians) etc.

Well, The Western Church is fairly axiomatic, like a great deductive system, as their axiomatic basis said these people could not possible be in the presence of God, in heaven, they must be somewhere else, yet God is All Mercyful, how could a just and mercyful God **** Children to hell fire for something utterly beyond their control?

The medeval Scholastics postulated "Limbo" to answer this. It is not exactly heaven, but a part of hell(hell is simply the absence of God, so this dosen't mean fire and brimstone necessairly), this part of hell is indeed seperate from God, but not torture, rather it is a place of "perfect natural happiness".

Now things are changing of course, as seen with Benedict XVI's big announcement.

It's really a doctrin of Traditional Catholics, it's never been infalible doctrin, but "in the mind of the Church", some "High" Protestans observe it as well.

This might help

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/11312a.htm
 
Jazzy said:
^^Yes I get it...which is why I said I don't understand the reason for original sin and I don't agree with it. But then again, it's so closely fit together with your other beliefs. So to leave one means to leave others.
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It's changeing, remember Augustine was a gnostic for a long time, Karl Rahner(important Jesuit Theologian) began describing it as a social reality rather than biological, hereditary "stain"

they seem to be slowely nutering it/phasing it out.:-[

The Catholic Church is sneaky like that:omg:

I don't know to what extent they have infalibly defined Origional Sin actually
 
Yea and then it falls back to the deal with the "correct" religion. The real one wouldnt need cut and paste....but that's a separate topic all together.
 
All INNOCENT souls go to heaven. Infants do not sin, therefore they are innocent souls. So, yes, they go straight to heaven.

The Ninth Scribe
 
An infant would have to commit a spiritual sin (eg: lying or stealing). Since they are not capable of such things, they are spiritually unblemished (eg: no spiritual conflict). This is a much higher state than - what's the Arabic for a sin commited out of ignorance?

"Peace be upon you: Your Lord has decreed for Himself (the rule of) mercy: truly, if any of you committed evil in ignorance, and thereafter repented, and mended his ways, he would find God Oft-forgiving and Most Merciful." (Al-An`am 6:54)
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The Ninth Scribe
 
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I was wondering why babies die in the first place, if sin is the cause of death, then unless babies sin why would they die?
 

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