Assalamu Aleykum,
The Qur'an doesnt contradict itself..whats more Allah throws in a challenge too..'that if it was from other than God it would have many discrepancies' is there any such challenge in the hadeeth literature..is not scholars who seperate the wheat from the chalf?..The one who revealed the Qur'an is Allah subhanahu wata'ala..it is He who is addressing us directly in the Qur'an and He has promised us that he will protect it from corruption..1400 years and its still the same pure text Allahu Akbar!
You still don't have seem to have answered my question sister, all you have said is that the Qu'ran does not contradict itself and that Allah put a challange in the Qu'ran, and that the text is still pure. Let me reput my question to you, please read it carefully:
"How do you know someone didn't put that in there? How do you know it has no been changed? that is like a Christian says the Bible hasnt been changed because the Bible says so."
All you have said, is that Allah has put a challange in the Qu'ran and so on, look this is as futile an explanation as the Christians, their Bible says "God's words will never perish' and "God is not the author of confusion" Let me ask you, do you believe because of what the bible says about itself that it is still the same?
So please if yuo are going to reply answer the question.
Now are you saying the pure unadulterated Qur'an is equal to the hadeeth books? in that case we have more than 1 perfect book..more than 1 holy book..astaghfirrulah..even the arabic of the Qur'an is much superior to the hadeeths..they cannot be compared at all.
I don't believe that the Qu'ran is the same, who said that, please read carefully, think about things, what have I been asking you about? The preservation through humans, in that way it is the same, you still havent answerd on how the Qu'ran has been preserved, tell me, how? How has it physically been preserved?
brother Sahih Bukhari is considered by many to be the most authentic collection of hadeeths..yet even within it you find hadeeths that contradict each other! I know this because i'vce seen it..its not something unusual..since its a purely human document and humans err
See this is where, you amaze me, because, sister, there are some people that say the Qu'ran has contradiction, why do they say this? Because they read some places, and they see that something "seems" to be contradictory, so based on their little knowledge of Qu'ran they say "it's a contradiction" but then when you show them, no look at this surah it explains this and that then they realise it is not a contradiction, similarly, with hadeeth, people like yourself, see one hadeeth then see anther and say "look itsa contradiction" because of the limited knowledge of hadeeth, but then if a scholar of hadeeth was to sit with you, he'd explain it to you becuse he has a wider knowledge of hadeeth, just as one ayah can explain another one hadeeth can explain another.
the explanation/eloboration of the deen of Allah is preserved..donot confuse hadeeth with Sunnah it isnt the same thing ..Imam Bukhari wrote his book 200 years after the demise of Prophet Muhammed pbuh..do you think before that time people didnt know how to pray..pay zakat etc?..these traditions live on in the Ummah Alhamdullilah..I am not a hadeeth rejector donot confuse me for one but then I'm against many hadeeths that seem to contradict the Qur'anic verses..and also many hadeeths that seem extremely unnecessarily and place hardships on people...e.g look to the bottom of my post.
Sister, you have proven your lack of understanding in the works of Hadeeth, Imam Bukhari didn't write hadeeth! He compiled them, as you have said, the Sunnah has been preserved, all Imam Bukhari did, was take from the people the Sunnah and then put it into a book, compilation! Did he take everything people told him? No, he left some out because some of it was lies, or mistakes .
Brother I am not against learned people..in deed Allah tells us that if we donot know a thing to ask the people who have knowledge..this is a command from Allah to be found in the Qur'an..but then again go to any muslim site or even an Islamic channel..and see for yourself what sort of knowledge muslims are recieving..
Dogs are impure and no angels will grace your home if you have a dog, your salaat will not be accepted if you pray with nail varnish (a new muslim sister was told this in the masjid..you can imagine how she felt..very offended)
Shaping of the eyebrows is haraam, muslim men should wear the thawb and any clothing they wear must be above the ankles, they must have a fist length beard otherwise they are not considered to be 'good muslims',
Your prayer cannot be accepted if you don't cut your nails for 40 days .I remember fretting for days when i had forgotten to cut my nails..thinking my salaah wouldnt be accepted ..since then i have become more knowledgable..now i don't bother to worry since Allah doesnt care about such things but I do cut my nails for cleanliness reasons since our religion encourages us to be clean.
You must not use any soap, mouthwash shampoo which has alcohol , images are haraam , guitars, pianos are haraam, your hands have be on your chest for your salaah to be 'correct..hands by the side like those following Maliki and Ja'fari schools of thoughts is wrong etc etc..the list goes on..all this is found in the hadeeth books.
I would love, I would have loved to see someone genuinly use this type of logic, for the Qu'ran. This is what people do, 'oh this part sounds wrong' lets leave it, this sounds wrong to, how can this be or this is not true. For example you say:
Dogs are impure, or that angels wont enter the house or something like that, what is harder to believe, that Dogs are impure or that ants spoke to a man?
I think you should use this logic with the Qu'ran, and any verse which anyone doesn't agree with should be thrown away, dont you agree? I mean you say, Your prayer cannot be accepted if you don't cut your nails for 40 days, I dont know if thats true, please show us the hadeeth!! but even so, do you make wudu sister? the Qu'ran does talk about it right? But I mean, that must be wrong, I mean what does Allah care if your clean or not, your only praying. Or why does Allah say dont eat the pig, that part of the Qu'ran must be wrong aswell, jee, this logic sure does make the right and wrong clear.
COme on, give me a break, you wanna say something is not right because it doesnt sound 'right' to some, did you know to some people Jesus not dyin doesn't sound right, so I assume just as those who dont like parts of hadeeth say 'it must be forged' those people can say 'that ayah was forged' and take it out lol.
You said: (a new muslim sister was told this in the masjid..you can imagine how she felt..very offended), Jee, look at how many people are upset that you cant ask Jesus for stuff, they must be offended too, does that mean its not right? Come sister.
I hope you get my point..again i apologise if i have offended any body..i am not a hadeeth rejector..there is only 1 Holy book the perfect Qur'an..the Criterion and i only accept hadeeths if they don't contradict with any Qur'anic verses keeping in mind that the only 100% fool proof way to establish the authenticity of many hadeeths is to actually go back in time which is an impossibility.
No need to apologise sister, this is just a discussion between brothers and sisters, inshaAllah.
The above is why I asked you to show me how the Qu'ran has been preserved, anyhow if you answer
how then maybe we can see how the Sunnah has been preserved.
You say you only accept hadeeth if they dont contradict Qu'ran, thats what any Muslim says, the Hadeeth SCHOLARS hold this to be a way of seeing if a hadeeth is authentic, I trust the scholars.
Who tells you if a hadeeth contradicts Qu'ran? If you tell me you do your own research and so forth, then I will tell you that alot of people reject the Qu'ran becuse they do their own research but dont have enough knowledge to understand each 'supposed' contradiction, just as I can garantee you, that neither you and i have enough knowledge to understand each 'supposed' hadeeth that contradicts Qu'ran.
just 1 last thing..if everything the Prophet did and said is to be considered divinely inspired..then doesnt that mean that Prophet Muhammed pbuh is 100% perfect and cannot make errors of judgement, proof of which is in the Qur'an itself when Prophet Muhammed pbuh forbade honey to himself and then Allah told him it was wrong of him to do so? and that it is only Allah who makes things haraam and halaal? Also what about that hadeeth where Prophet Muhammed pbuh gives a man bad agricultural advice and the man's crops become bad? and then Prophet Muhammed told the man that he is only a man who can make mistakes?
It amazes me, I don't know how many times the topic of prophets peace be upon them and mistakes has been adressed, it seems you have not raed it.
The prophet, peace be upon him, was not left in any mistake, if he did make a mistake in conveying the religion, he was immideitly corrected by Allah, but he didnt just speak randomly.
