Define shirk to me please?

[MustafaMc]

How can anyone dispute what Sister Insaanah has written? Shirk is the unforgiveable sin if one dies in that state that we should be most attentive to guard against. To adhere to misguidance when the Truth has been made clear is not in one's best eternal interest.

 

[IslamicRevival]

I guess every Scholar who opposes your views are misguided and deviant. You cannot post a Hadith and interprete the way you see fit, it needs to be deciphered and broken down by a learned Scholar (As does every Hadith), everyone will have their own views and maybe you should try accepting mine (Agree to disagree) instead of saying I need to open my eyes to reality and implying im on the wrong path, maybe its you that needs to wake up to reality?

You know, one thing i cannot stand is Muslims who shove their views down other Muslims throats, shouting and screaming Shirk, Bidah at everything and anything. You might think its ok to insult Scholars who have spent their whole life studying Islam but i dont. This' im right, your wrong' attitude really is a disease.

are you Sunni?

Everyone claims to be a Sunni these days, i am but i prefer to be labelled as a Muslim

 

[Insaanah]

I guess every Scholar who opposes your views are misguided and deviant.

I will repeat for the third time, this is not my view. This is what the Qur'an clearly says, what the hadeeth says, what Allah has commanded, what his Prophet said, what the sahaabah practised. This is their view, and this is what I follow, and this is what Muslims are supposed to follow.

You cannot post a Hadith and interprete the way you see fit,

I have made no interpretation. The Prophet said du'a is worship. If I have interpreted that in any other way, please let me know. On the other hand, Tahir ul Qadri has done what you have just claimed you don't like, i.e. taken a hadeeth about a person asking the prophet for du'a while the Prophet was alive, and has erroneously applied that and interpreted it to mean that you can ask from the dead, though the hadeeth says no such thing.

Who is interpreting in a way that they see fit here?

maybe you should try accepting mine (Agree to disagree) instead of saying I need to open my eyes to reality and implying im on the wrong path, maybe its you that needs to wake up to reality?

I cannot accept falsehood, I cannot accept what is clear as day to be shirk, I cannot accept what is against Qur'an and sunnah. I will however, try to warn people against it, as that is our duty.

You know, one thing i cannot stand is Muslims who shove their views down other Muslims throats, shouting and screaming Shirk, Bidah at everything and anything.

Again, it is not my view, but Allah's and the Prophet's . I do not recall shouting or screaming or shoving things down anyone's throat, merely providing evidence from the Qur'an and authentic ahadeeth for what is unacceptable in Islam, in a clear and firm way.

This' im right, your wrong' attitude really is a disease.

Allah says:

They believe in Allah and the Last Day, and they enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong and hasten to good deeds. And those are among the righteous. (3:114)

We have been told in the Qur'an to enjoin what is right and forbid what is wrong. I am saddened if you think that acting on this verse is a disease.

To adhere to misguidance when the Truth has been made clear is not in one's best eternal interest.

I agree, and I hope the brother will come to this realisation.

 

[MustafaMc]

Quran 9:31 They take their priests and their monks to be their lords in derogation of Allah, and (they take as their Lord) Christ the son of Mary; yet they were commanded to worship but One Allah. There is no god but He. Praise and glory to Him: (Far is He) from having the partners they associate (with Him).

 

[Ramadhan]

You might think its ok to insult Scholars who have spent their whole life studying Islam but i dont.

Brother, I see that no one in this thread has insulted any scholar.

You cannot post a Hadith and interprete the way you see fit, it needs to be deciphered and broken down by a learned Scholar (As does every Hadith), everyone will have their own views and maybe you should try accepting mine (Agree to disagree)

Can you please post authentic narrations (Qur'an and shahih hadith) where we are allowed to ask from prophet Muhammad (saw) who already passed away?

 

[Predator]

Does a lack of self confidence = shirk or kufr ?

For example if a person believe he is not competant enough to beat other in a contest

 

[IslamicRevival]

Brother, I see that no one in this thread has insulted any scholar

Calling a Sheikh who has spent his entire life studying Islam a deviant is an insult in my book.

Can you please post authentic narrations (Qur'an and shahih hadith) where we are allowed to ask from prophet Muhammad (saw) who already passed away?

Video posted on page 1, Sheikh mentions Hadith clearly and explains the meaning behind it.. You can interpret it in any which way you want.

Anyway, im done with this thread. I have no authority to post Hadith or verses from the Quran .. Im no Scholar. I simply posted my opinion on this subject and ive said all along, each to their own views.

This short clip sums up my feelings on this matter

 

[Insaanah]

Please do not be under the illusion or the wrong impression that this is one of those small matters of disagreement among the scholars because it is not. This is huge, with very serious implications. What is being presented here is the very antithesis of what Islam stands for, and what Islam came to abolish, and to establish.

Sure, Muslims sometimes disagree on certain matters where there are two valid opinions, or one of the opinions is stronger, and you agree to disagree or you follow one view while respecting the other person's right to their view and recognising that they're not wrong in what they do.

Du'a is an act of worship, and therefore to make du'a to anyone in addition to Allah, to a dead person, to use them as an intermediary, is a manifestation of associating others in the worship that belongs to Allah exclusively. Shirk is the biggest sin in Islam.

As per brother Ramadan's request, no proof as been presented that what brothers and sisters have said here in this thread, with evidence from Qur'an and ahadeeth, is wrong. The video showed no Qur'anic ayaat or hadeeth where it says one should or can make du'a to the dead.

I agree with Sheikh Hamza that we should vie with each other for virtue. May Allah give us all the tawfeeq to do that, ameen.

To conclude, Allah is my witness that I and the brothers and sisters here tried to convey the message and clarify misconceptions, and if I went about it the wrong way or erred, I hope Allah will forgive me.

 

[MustafaMc]

I'm out, here's a short clip of Sheikh Hamza Yusuf which sums up my feelings on this matter

I rather liked this short clip by Hamza Yusuf though I don't know much about him.

It seems to me that Sister Insaanah is just pointing out what she considers to be shirk and given the seriousness of this issue, I think we should respect her opinion and the validity of the quotes she has provided. If one is told that a red, glowing coal is too hot to touch, should we say, "This is not a hot coal, but rather just a rock painted red" and then go pick it up with our bare hand? If we pick up the hot coal and get burned, how can we blame the one who warned us not to touch it?

 

[MustafaMc]

Does a lack of self confidence = shirk or kufr ?

For example if a person believe he is not competant enough to beat other in a contest

Without further clarification of a specific case, I do not see how this can be ascribing partners with Allah (swt).

 

[Ramadhan]

I think there's some miscommunications in this thread.

It is absolutely clear that we cannot make du'a to the deceased, even if they are prophets (pbut), as qur'an verses presented by sister Insanaah have shown. And hence why we must not say "Ya nabi" because he (saw) has passed away. Although we must continually send salams and shalawat to him (saw).

The problem is that there are disagreements, even among ulamas/scholars, whether we can use tawasul/wasilah in our du'a.

Personally, as I am not knowledgeable, and would rather avoid anything that may weaken my eeman, when I do du'a I'd rather do this:
reciting Al fatihah (and three Quls), and then recite the beautiful attributes of Allah, and then send salams and shalawat to the prophet (saw), and then make du'a to Allah without using tawasul.

I ask my (living) mum to make du'a for me very often though.

 

[Insaanah]

I think there's some miscommunications in this thread.

I sincerely apologise if I have been unclear in any way.

It is absolutely clear that we cannot make du'a to the deceased, even if they are prophets (pbut)

This is what I was trying to get across, and following on from that, this:

If one is told that a red, glowing coal is too hot to touch, should we say, "This is not a hot coal, but rather just a rock painted red" and then go pick it up with our bare hand?

The problem is that there are disagreements, even among ulamas/scholars, whether we can use tawasul/wasilah in our du'a.

Personally, as I am not knowledgeable, and would rather avoid anything that may weaken my eeman, when I do du'a. I'd rather do this:
reciting Al fatihah (and three Quls), and then recite the beautiful attributes of Allah, and then send salams and shalawat to the prophet (saw), and then make du'a to Allah without using tawasul.

I hope it is not out of place to here, to share some excerpts from a book, on which parts of some of my previous posts have been based too:

Tawassul is one of the most important etiquettes of du'a and one of the greatest factors that increase the chance of du'a being accepted.

Unfortunately many people have an incorrect understanding of this concept, and because of it, fall into shirk and innovation.

Linguistically, tawassul means to come closer to an objective and to gain proximity to a desired goal. In Islamic terms, it signifies the act of trying to come closer to Allah through manners that have been prescribed by the Qur'an and the sunnah. In other words, it is a means of seeking nearness to Allah. This concept is referred to in the following verse:

O you who believe! Do your duty to Allah and fear Him. Seek the means of approach to Him, and strive hard in His Cause as much as you can, so that you may be successful. (5:35)

When used in the context of du'a, tawassul takes on a more specific meaning. It then refers to seeking a means of having one's du'a accepted, or increasing the chances of having one's du'a being accepted.

There are a number of ways that are prescribed in the shari'ah for tawassul. These are as follows:

1. Tawassul through Allah's names and attributes.

This is one of the most powerful means of tawassul. For example, saying, "O Allah I ask You by virtue of the fact that all praise belongs to You, that You are the Ever-Living that never dies, the Provider to all, and I ask You by all Your beautiful names that You have named Yourself with, that You.....xyz"

There are many examples of the Prophet and sahaabah (may Allah be pleased with them) doing this in the sunnah.

2. Tawassul by mentioning Allah's favours

So for example, a person might say "O Allah! You have guided me to Islam, and placed in me a love for knowledge and its people! O Allah! Cause me to increase in this knowledge, and cause me to be amongst the righteous scholars!"

3. Tawassul by mentioning the state one is in

Here one mentions to Allah the dire circumstances one is in, and the desperate need one has for His Mercy and Blessings.

In the Qur'an, there are examples of Prophets Nuh, Zakariyya and Musa (peace be upon them all) doing this.

4. Tawassul through good deeds

One can mentions one's good deeds,so one can say "O Allah! Because of the charity that I gave to so-and-so, out of pleasing You.." or "O Allah! Because of my love for Your religion and love for You and Your prophet.." grant me my du'a.

The Quran is replete with this type of tawassul. In one verse the believers are described as: "Those that say: 'Our Lord! We have believed, so forgive us our sins, and save us from the punishment of the Fire!'" (3:16)

In the above du'a, tawassul is sought because of one's iman in Allah and His religion, and there is no doubt that the greatest good deed that a person can use is his iman in Allah.

This is a great incentive for one to do deeds purely for the sake of Allah, so that one may use them as a means of tawassul when one is in dire need of a du'a being answered.

5. Tawassul through Mentioning the Effect of the Du'a

Tawassul can also be made by attaching the response of the du'a to a good deed or benefit. So for example, a person can say "O Allah! I ask you to increase me in knowledge , so that I may teach my family and relatives" or "O Allah! Increase my wealth so that I can spend it in your way!"

Similarly, Ibrahim (peace be upon him) asked Allah to bless his family (when he left them in a barren valley) with fruits and cause a community of people to live with them, so that they could establish prayer and give thanks to Allah.

6. Tawassul by Asking a Living Person to Make Du'a

You can ask a living person to make du'a on your behalf, if you feel the person is a true and righteous person. So, it is permissible to go to a scholar and say, "O so and so, I ask you to make du'a to Allah that he cure my son from xyz illness". There are examples of this from the sahaabah.

Although it is permissible to ask others to make du'a for oneself, it is better to not do so for personal du'as (This is in contrast to du'as that are related to the benefit of the entire ummah). The book then lists it's reasons as to why.

Other types of tawassul

These types of tawassul mentioned above are the only types sanctioned by the Quran and sunnah. So if a person does tawassul by any other means, he will either fall into shirk or bid'ah.

The most common type of tawassul that is done in our times, and yet is not sanctioned by the Quran and sunnah is tawassul through the status of the prophet

Without a doubt, the Prophet is the one single person that Muslims love the most. He is the best of creation, and the most noble of mankind. He is our leader in this world, and on the Day of Judgement, and he is the most righteous of the children of Adam. All of this, however, should not make us raise him above the level Allah Himself chose for His Prophet, and that the Prophet himself was content with. One only needs to look at the Christians and the consequences that have occurred when they raised Isa ibn Maryam above the status he deserved, to see the dangers of this line of thinking.

With this in mind, tawassul through the Prophet can be divided into three categories:

1) Through one's love for the Prophet which comes under tawassul through one's good deeds, and is allowed.

2) Through the prophet's du'a while he was alive, which comes under asking a pious living person to make du'a. However, after the Prophet's death, it is not possible to use this type of tawassul any more.

3) Through the status of the Prophet eg O Allah I ask you by the status of the Prophet with you, that you grant me such and such. According to the book, this has not been mentioned in the Quran or sunnah, and there are no authentic narrations from the first three generations of Islam that show that this was practised then. No group of people loved the Prophet more than the companions, and yet none of them, even when in dire need, performed this type of tawassul, and this is an innovation. (My own note: some see no problem with this type of tawassul)

The source for the above is the book Du'a, The Weapon of the Believer: A treatise on the status and etiquette of du'a in Islam, by Abu Ammaar Yasir Qadhi. It is available to read online here as image pdf rather than text pdf. It is a very good read.

In this work, the author elaborates on the status, importance and etiquette of dua’ in Islam. In the most comprehensive work yet to be written in English on the topic, the author discusses, amongst other matters the excellence and benefits of dua; the types of dua; the pre conditions that are needed in order for a du a to be accepted; the recommended etiquette of performing dua; the timings and situations in which a dua is more likely to be answered; the various factors that aid or prevent a du’a from being accepted; the relationship of dua with the Divine Decree qadr; the wisdom behind a delayed response, and many other relevant topics.

So what is the case of making du'a directly to the Prophet who has passed away? That is not tawassul, but making du'a to and asking of, someone besides Allah, someone who has passed away, and thus in directing your du'a to them you are directing some of your worship to them.

May Allah save us all from approaching and acting on the doubtful, and from misguidance and error. Ameen.

 

[Ramadhan]

Jazakallaahu khayr for explaining different types of tawassul. So it seems I've done du'a with tawassul all the time, and hopefully only the rightful ones.