‘Derision of West misguided’

[Dagless]

Go look into why people are poor and then go look into why Hitler sent Jews to concentration camps then re-read all my posts and tell me if you still think it's a 'great' example.

It's a great example.

When you say 'good for everyone' the implications are vast. I do think the system we have is good for everyone; people can practice what religion they want, people are enjoying an unparalleled growth in economy. Even the poor are well off and have lots of opportunities. This is what I cal good but your definition of good is somethign else and like I said, it's subjective and there's no point in arguing over it. You can think what you want but you'll still be living in a Western country

Then why are you arguing? I don't think where I live has anything to do with this.

You don't know what you're talking about at all.

Another great argument.

You don't know what you're talking about at all.

You can keep putting your fingers in your ears and saying it but it won't make it any more true.

Yes, I've accepted that we have different definitions of successful and good and arguing about it is pointless.

Yet you persist.

You don't know what you're talking about at all.

This is doubly funny coming from someone who routinely comments on issues he has no clue about.

 

[Lynx]

I am sure there are plenty who would trade their life with me, I am just not sure how long they can sustain it?.. some folks always want from the end without any effort.. there were days when I was sick and had insurance, there were days when I went without food, yes because I was charged to the max and didn't want my parents or family to be burdened anymore than they were...much of my sickness I treated myself until one day I had an anaphylactic shock from a left over antibiotic I was treating myself with, and you want to know what my bell came out to? meanwhile I have people come in every monday or thursday because they know exactly how to abuse the system and get a free meal.. Janitor's closet sometimes are a place to get some shut eye, try going 34 hours without and then get a beating from your preceptor's there after because they are having a bad day..and sitting for a series of four 9 hour exams, where if your grade is anything less than stellar then you get the pit of interviews at malignant hospitals, if at all. yeah, it is possible to be a doctor in the U.S and out of a job and in debt!
of course you'd close with that famous statement with 'go somewhere else' as if you were sustaining my existence and education? well I'd gladly go to an Islamic country if indeed they were Islamic and any better!

I do feel for you. If it was possible I'd wish everyone would have a decent life without many problems. I just don't think people in the West, unless they're homless, should ever be ungrateful to what they have. However, I don't want to pry into your private life...& USA health care always sucked.

no progress is made by buying junk and putting hard working individuals out of work because you feel it better to save a couple of bucks.. and don't get me wrong, I am very impressed with the chinese work ethics but that is as far as it goes!

Just cause something is made in China does not necessarily mean it's junk. Lots of quality things are made in China. Also, yes, hard working individuals are out of work when they are outcompeted by a superior product but in his place a bunch of other hard working people find work. It's progress because whenever something new enters a market and beats its competitors it's usually because they've found a faster way or cheaper way to produce something which means efficiency goes up.

I am not exaggerating the problem, I am aghast that it happens at all, one person illegally imprisoned without trial is bad enough whether in Manhattan or Gitmo-- you seem to be under the impression that if it doesn't concern you and your next of kin personally that, there isn't a problem. Or is happening in isolation and won't impact the whole.. you are in fact very wrong.. it is just a matter of time.. depends on how tight or widely spaced this country comes with the next usama tape or bombing in some city street and I am pretty sure after the Gaza fiasco that they are working on something as we speak!

First, I agree if it happens once then that's horrible. Second this happens way too uncommonly to be a problem IMO & I doubt its arbitrary imprisonment-Muslims as a group aren't targeted but certain people are. The latter part of your post is a slippery slope argument and we can speculate as to what will happen. Of course, I think the bulk of the problem is within USA and not in other western countries which shows a peculiarity in the American system not of democracy/capitalism in general.

 

[جوري]

I do feel for you. If it was possible I'd wish everyone would have a decent life without many problems. I just don't think people in the West, unless they're homless, should ever be ungrateful to what they have. However, I don't want to pry into your private life...& USA health care always sucked.

if that were said in cynicism then all I'll say is that you don't know anything about my life, my personal losses whether in loved ones or years lost, financial, health wise or or.. further this isn't about how the west is paradisaical compared to the middle east or china or, they all equally suck.. they all have a malignant system meant to cater to those who have a seat on top maybe the w hores of guys and gals in the entertainment industry but that is as far as it goes.. if you want a 'comfortable' life then you'll have to work like an ass for it and then find yourself dead one day not knowing why and how it slipped away so fast... and that is where most people I know reside.. the other half are either trying hard and can't get out of the dumps or are living off the the ones working like an ass while chanting how they hate foreigners, and how their jobs were stolen as if they could reach said positions to begin with, who would deny them except that they are so good at abusing the system and unfortunately the only talent they have truly mastered? it is a system meant to oppress the masses in one form or another with false worldly lure, usury, and cheap thrills, ponzi schemes, and God forbid you should speak out against it, there is no telling which ghetto you'll end up in and what distasteful warfare will be unleashed upon you, your kin, your entire religio .. you want to speak about a 'true sign of the time' this is it right there.. bird brains with carpet bombs! ...

for what it is worth, I have never been ungrateful for what I have, but what I have are the blessings of God not of the east or west, and we thank him in the lean years and are patient in the difficult ones whatever the ratio.. I consider myself the servant of God on his earth and I desire that God would make me an instrument to do good work no more no less.. for our existence here must be tempered with the fact that it is a temporary stay.. as the prophet PBUH said

"My similitude and that of the life of this world is that of a wayfarer who took a rest at mid-day under a shade of a tree and then left it." (Ahmad, at-Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah and al-Hakim)
"Be in this world like a stranger, or a wayfarer." (Bukhari)

Just cause something is made in China does not necessarily mean it's junk. Lots of quality things are made in China. Also, yes, hard working individuals are out of work when they are outcompeted by a superior product but in his place a bunch of other hard working people find work. It's progress because whenever something new enters a market and beats its competitors it's usually because they've found a faster way or cheaper way to produce something which means efficiency goes up.

the majority of stuff from China is junk, if you want quality good from china then you can want quality goods from your fellow countrymen.. do ask the chinese why they are having little colonies here and there, in countries as odd as Tanzania and what their agenda is, it is really no different than the western one sans the sanctimoniousness of feigning it is god ordained!

First, I agree if it happens once then that's horrible. Second this happens way too uncommonly to be a problem IMO & I doubt its arbitrary imprisonment-Muslims as a group aren't targeted but certain people are. The latter part of your post is a slippery slope argument and we can speculate as to what will happen. Of course, I think the bulk of the problem is within USA and not in other western countries which shows a peculiarity in the American system not of democracy/capitalism in general.

Ok, thank you!


peace

p.s for what it is worth and even though I don't see eye to eye with you on many things, I think you are generally a decent fellow.. I do hope you make Islam your way of life before it is too late..

 

[Lynx]

if that were said in cynicism then all I'll say is that you don't know anything about my life, my personal losses whether in loved ones or years lost, financial, health wise or or.. further this isn't about how the west is paradisaical compared to the middle east or china or, they all equally suck.. they all have a malignant system meant to cater to those who have a seat on top maybe the w hores of guys and gals in the entertainment industry but that is as far as it goes.. if you want a 'comfortable' life then you'll have to work like an ass for it and then find yourself dead one day not knowing why and how it slipped away so fast... and that is where most people I know reside.. the other half are either trying hard and can't get out of the dumps or are living off the the ones working like an ass while chanting how they hate foreigners, and how their jobs were stolen as if they could reach said positions to begin with, who would deny them except that they are so good at abusing the system and unfortunately the only talent they have truly mastered? it is a system meant to oppress the masses in one form or another with false worldly lure, usury, and cheap thrills, ponzi schemes, and God forbid you should speak out against it, there is no telling which ghetto you'll end up in and what distasteful warfare will be unleashed upon you, your kin, your entire religio .. you want to speak about a 'true sign of the time' this is it right there.. bird brains with carpet bombs! ...

for what it is worth, I have never been ungrateful for what I have, but what I have are the blessings of God not of the east or west, and we thank him in the lean years and are patient in the difficult ones whatever the ratio.. I consider myself the servant of God on his earth and I desire that God would make me an instrument to do good work no more no less.. for our existence here must be tempered with the fact that it is a temporary stay.. as the prophet PBUH said

"My similitude and that of the life of this world is that of a wayfarer who took a rest at mid-day under a shade of a tree and then left it." (Ahmad, at-Tirmidhi, Ibn Majah and al-Hakim)
"Be in this world like a stranger, or a wayfarer." (Bukhari)



the majority of stuff from China is junk, if you want quality good from china then you can want quality goods from your fellow countrymen.. do ask the chinese why they are having little colonies here and there, in countries as odd as Tanzania and what their agenda is, it is really no different than the western one sans the sanctimoniousness of feigning it is god ordained!



Ok, thank you!


peace

I didn't mean any cynicism or sarcasm. I strongly believe in what it says down there on my signature: everyone's fighting a hard battle and i don't want to add on to anyone's burden ( I make some exceptions here & there). I am sorry to hear about your predicament. I guess it's a matter of perspective; neither me nor my family are well off, or even close to middle class, yet I still believe we are lucky to be here and get what we do get. But everyone leads a different life and has different goals and ideals.

p.s for what it is worth and even though I don't see eye to eye with you on many things, I think you are generally a decent fellow.. I do hope you make Islam your way of life before it is too late..

that's kind of you. i wish for you the best in your goals and hope that your hard work pays off sooner rather than later.

 

[جوري]

I didn't mean any cynicism or sarcasm. I strongly believe in what it says down there on my signature: everyone's fighting a hard battle and i don't want to add on to anyone's burden ( I make some exceptions here & there). I am sorry to hear about your predicament. I guess it's a matter of perspective; neither me nor my family are well off, or even close to middle class, yet I still believe we are lucky to be here and get what we do get. But everyone leads a different life and has different goals and ideals.

my family struggled very much too but I was blessed with parents who believed in the value of good education.. Everyone I can think of in my family has had some horrible calamity befall them, my grandmother was widowed at 36, and my grandfather left her with 7 children and a business partner who stole his factory after his death.. you can imagine a house wife's predicament in raising children the youngest who happened to have been 2 at the time of my grandfather's death, and still managed in spite of everything that happened to raise engineers and teachers and two diplomats.. one those diplomats happened to have been my aunt who in her teenage yrs was working moving bricks and cement products for some contractors for 'pennies' and enrolling in night school.. and so on and so on, where you'd think there is no life after today, yet a new day comes with its own hopes and often times miseries.

that is why I am telling you, I have positively zero tolerance for the lazy and whiny type and those with a strange sense of entitlement which is definitely a 'western syndrome'

that's kind of you. i wish for you the best in your goals and hope that your hard work pays off sooner rather than later.

Thanks I wish you well.. I don't know what is keeping you, you are already an 89% decent human being, why not crown that with perfection?
anyhow you should go it at your own pace..

all the best

 

[Argamemnon]

that is why I am telling you, I have positively zero tolerance for the lazy and whiny type and those with a strange sense of entitlement which is definitely a 'western syndrome'

true, but it's not always easy to tell who is whiny and who is seriously struggling through no fault of their own.

 

[جوري]

true, but it's not always easy to tell who is whiny and who is seriously struggling through no fault of their own.

you are right ,.. on the net it is difficult.. real life it isn't. but the moral even though a total derailment from the topic.. is that if people can make it from homelessness to Harvard (and I have posted two articles about two such girls) or from rags literally (I won't say to riches) but to a decent comfortable and fairly prestigious social status, then there is no reason for others to try to overcome the little blebs on the road that come their way.. we aren't in paradise.. life is a struggle and for the most part through difficult circumstances which we must do our best to overcome.. you've heard the adage 'If it doesn't kill you it can only make you stronger'-- I am a firm believer in that!

and Allah swt knows best

 

[Lynx]

that is why I am telling you, I have positively zero tolerance for the lazy and whiny type and those with a strange sense of entitlement which is definitely a 'western syndrome'

the abdunance of wealth in the west has certainly created lazy fat people.