Did Jesus (p) Deny Being God?
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bro please am not saying your being mean am just saying can we all talk politer please
take care
I will talk politer... what I was getting at is that he said that the Bible contradicts itself and well he states it meaning that he should know exactly which verses contradict each other.
Al-Mu'min
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Peace Nicola,
Hello again. Hope your fine.
You mentioned something about Bible scholars and thier opinion. Well,
no credible Biblical scholar on this earth will claim that the Bible was written by Jesus himself. They all agree that the Bible was written after the departure of Jesus peace be upon him by his followers. So, if the authors of the Bible were people other than Jesus, then did they have Jesus or the Holy Spirit in them guiding their hands and dictating to them word for word what to write? As it happens, once again the answer is no. Who says so? The majority of today's credible Christian scholars do. For example:
Dr. W Graham Scroggie of the Moody Bible Institute, Chicago, a prestigious Christian evangelical mission, says:
"..Yes, the Bible is human, although some out of zeal which is not according to knowledge, have denied this. Those books have passed through the minds of men, are written in the language of men, were penned by the hands of men and bear in their style the characteristics of men...."
"It is Human, Yet Divine," W Graham Scroggie, p. 17
Another Christian scholar, Kenneth Cragg, the Anglican Bishop of Jerusalem, says:
"...Not so the New testament...There is condensation and editing; there is choice reproduction and witness. The Gospels have come through the mind of the church behind the authors. They represent experience and history..."
"The Call of the Minaret," Kenneth Cragg, p 277
For example, we read in the Bible the words of the author of "Luke":
"It seemed good to me (Luke) also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, (Luke 1:3)"
If you consider the Bible the word of GOD, well, it is quite obvious that Luke decided to write his Gospel because he wanted to please the president or the
leader at that time Theophilus. This however has several problems: (1) It compromises GOD because there is a biger purpose than GOD to write the Gospel, (2) It shows that Luke wouldn't have written his Gospel if it wasn't for that leader, and (3) Luke was not inpired when he wrote his Gospel because he said that he decided to write it after he had full understanding of it, which means that he wrote it with his own human words and thoughts and not GOD's.
If you want, I can qoute hundreds of more statements like the above ones. I know you want to believe that the word of God has been altered. No one does. But unfortunately we cannot control the actions of evil people.
But God didn't leave us there. He gave us the Quran. Please read it with an open heart and mind. You are right, if God wills, then no one can change His words. Today the Noble Quran is as it was revealed with no contradictions and no scientical errors. I know a lot of people who have only read two chapters and embrassed Islam. So I invite you to read it as well.
Peace and blessings.
Hello again. Hope your fine.
You mentioned something about Bible scholars and thier opinion. Well,
no credible Biblical scholar on this earth will claim that the Bible was written by Jesus himself. They all agree that the Bible was written after the departure of Jesus peace be upon him by his followers. So, if the authors of the Bible were people other than Jesus, then did they have Jesus or the Holy Spirit in them guiding their hands and dictating to them word for word what to write? As it happens, once again the answer is no. Who says so? The majority of today's credible Christian scholars do. For example:
Dr. W Graham Scroggie of the Moody Bible Institute, Chicago, a prestigious Christian evangelical mission, says:
"..Yes, the Bible is human, although some out of zeal which is not according to knowledge, have denied this. Those books have passed through the minds of men, are written in the language of men, were penned by the hands of men and bear in their style the characteristics of men...."
"It is Human, Yet Divine," W Graham Scroggie, p. 17
Another Christian scholar, Kenneth Cragg, the Anglican Bishop of Jerusalem, says:
"...Not so the New testament...There is condensation and editing; there is choice reproduction and witness. The Gospels have come through the mind of the church behind the authors. They represent experience and history..."
"The Call of the Minaret," Kenneth Cragg, p 277
For example, we read in the Bible the words of the author of "Luke":
"It seemed good to me (Luke) also, having had perfect understanding of all things from the very first, to write unto thee in order, most excellent Theophilus, (Luke 1:3)"
If you consider the Bible the word of GOD, well, it is quite obvious that Luke decided to write his Gospel because he wanted to please the president or the
leader at that time Theophilus. This however has several problems: (1) It compromises GOD because there is a biger purpose than GOD to write the Gospel, (2) It shows that Luke wouldn't have written his Gospel if it wasn't for that leader, and (3) Luke was not inpired when he wrote his Gospel because he said that he decided to write it after he had full understanding of it, which means that he wrote it with his own human words and thoughts and not GOD's.
If you want, I can qoute hundreds of more statements like the above ones. I know you want to believe that the word of God has been altered. No one does. But unfortunately we cannot control the actions of evil people.
But God didn't leave us there. He gave us the Quran. Please read it with an open heart and mind. You are right, if God wills, then no one can change His words. Today the Noble Quran is as it was revealed with no contradictions and no scientical errors. I know a lot of people who have only read two chapters and embrassed Islam. So I invite you to read it as well.
Peace and blessings.
Omar Khalil
Rising Member
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Assalamu-Alakium
The way I view this question is... we as Muslims know that "Isa" (p.b.h.) was a creation of Allah, just as us. As long as we keep in our hearts the teachings that the "Prophet Mohammad" (p.b.u.h.) in the Quran about "Isa" (p.b.u.) will be alright "Insha Allah"!
The way I view this question is... we as Muslims know that "Isa" (p.b.h.) was a creation of Allah, just as us. As long as we keep in our hearts the teachings that the "Prophet Mohammad" (p.b.u.h.) in the Quran about "Isa" (p.b.u.) will be alright "Insha Allah"!
Al-Mu'min
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Brothers and Sisters of Christianity,
Hello,
Can these words bellow be the words of God? If they can't be the words of God, then is it not safe for us to conclude the Bible is not entirely the work of God because it has been altered by man?
You decide:
MT 5:18-19 The OT law is to remain in effect until heaven and earth pass away.
GE 1:28 Be fruitful and multiply. Fill the earth and subdue it. Have dominion over all living things. (Note: God appears to be totally unconcerned with population control or ecology.)
GE 3:16, CO 11:3-9, EP 5:22-24, CN 3:18, TS 2:5, PE 3:1-6 The husband is to rule over his wife. Wives are to be subject to their husbands even when the husband is disobedient to God. Man is the image and glory of God, while woman is the glory of man. Man was not created for woman but woman for man.
GE 3:16 Women should suffer pain during childbirth. (Note: This verse was used by the Church to oppose the use of anesthesia during childbirth.)
GE 15:18 Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Syria, Yemen, and part of Iraq belong to the Jews only.
GE 17:10 "This is my covenant, ...every male among you shall be circumcised." (Note: God seems to have an obsession with this--the words circumcise, circumcised, circumcising, circumcision, uncircumcised, uncircumcision, foreskin, and foreskins appear 157 times in the KJV. Although the KJV correctly translates the oldest Hebrew and Greek manuscripts, versions since the KJV attempt to soften this apparent obsession by creatively translating these words in a different fashion wherever possible.)
GE 17:14 A child/man be punished by having his "soul cut off from his people" if his parents fail to have him circumcised when he was an infant of 8 days old.
GE 38:8-10 A man who refuses to impregnate his widowed sister-in-law is "wicked in the LORD's sight" and so is put to death.
EX 20:8-11, 31:15-17, 34:21, 35:1-3 No work of any kind is to be done on the Sabbath, not even lighting of a fire. This commandment is permanent. Death is required for infractions. (Note: This would require even that essential services, such as hospitals, police departments, etc., shut down on the Sabbath.)
EX 21:7-11 A father can sell a daughter into slavery to pay a debt. A daughter sold into slavery is not released at the end of six years as is an ordinary male slave.
EX 21:12 Whoever strikes a man so that he dies is to be put to death--except that, in some cases, God will appoint a place to which the offender may flee instead.
EX 21:15 Whoever strikes his father or mother is to be put to death. (As opposed to Islam where a man ia ccountable to God for a misdeed such as this.)
EX 21:16 Whoever steals a man is to be put to death. (Note: This is in spite of the fact that a father can sell his daughter into slavery; see EX 21:7-11.) EX 21:17, LE 20:9, DT 21:18-21 A child who curses his parent(s) is to be put to death. A stubborn and/or rebellious child is to be put to death.
EX 21:20-21 A slave owner is to be punished if he strikes his slave and the slave dies shortly thereafter. If the slave lives a day or to and then dies, the slave owner is not to be punished. A slave is the same as money to his owner.
EX 21:23-25, LE 24:17-21, DT 19:21 An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, etc.
EX 21:28-32 When an ox gores a man to death, the ox must be stoned. If the ox has gored a man previously, the animal's owner must also be put to death; in the case of the goring of a slave, the only requirement is that the owner of the ox must pay thirty shekels to the owner of the slave.
EX 22:16-17 An unbetrothed virgin is required to marry her seducer.
LE 12:2 A woman who has a child, especially a female child, is unclean and purification rites are required.
LE 15:19 A woman who is menstruating is unclean. Anyone who touches her is unclean.
LE 15:20 Anything which a woman who is menstruating sits on or lies on is unclean.
LE 15:21 Anyone who touches the bed of a woman who is menstruating must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:22 Anyone who touches anything which was sat upon by a woman who is menstruating must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:28 After her flow stops, a woman who was menstruating must count off seven days before she is considered clean again. On the eighth day, she must present two birds to the priest for an atonement for having had a menstrual discharge.
LE 20:15-16 If a person engages in sex with an animal, both the animal and the person must be put to death. (What fault is it of the innocent animal?)
LE 21:9 If a priest's daughter becomes a prostitute, she is to be burnt with fire.
LE 21:14 A priest (or descendant of Aaron) must not marry a widow, a divorced woman, a woman who has been defiled, or a harlot, but only a virgin.
LE 25:44-46, DT 15:17, EP 6:5, CN 3:22, TS 2:9, PE 2:18 Slavery is an everlasting institution. Slaves are to obey their masters in everything.
LE 27:3-7 Males are more valuable than females.
LE 27:29 Human sacrifice is condoned.
NU 3:10 An unauthorized person who acts as a priest must be put to death.
NU 31:18, 35, JG 21:12 Young virgins are considered a spoil of war and can be taken for the use of the victors.
DT 15:1-3 Every seven years, a brother (meaning a fellow Israelite) should be released from his debt. Only a foreigner should be required, again, to honor his debt.
DT 22:6-7 If you want to live a long time, you must not take a mother bird from her young, but you may take the young from the mother.
DT 22:13-21 A bride in whom "the tokens of virginity" are not found is to be put to death. (Note: The bridegroom who falsely accuses his bride gets off with a fine.)
DT 22:23-24 A betrothed virgin who is seduced in the city is to be put to death unless she cries for help.
DT 22:28-29 A virgin who is raped must marry her rapist (if they are "found").
DT 23:2 A bastard--and his offspring to the tenth generation--are to be punished for his illegitimacy and cannot enter a congregation of the Lord.
DT 25:5-10 A man has an obligation to produce a child for his widowed sister-in-law.
1KI 5:13, 9:3, 15 Forced labor is apparently sanctioned inasmuch as the Lord consecrated the house that Solomon built for the Lord using forced labor.
PR 13:24, 22:15, 23:13 Children are to be disciplined with the rod-- if beaten with a rod, they will not die. (Note: Many Christian parents have inadvertently beaten a child to death following this precept.)
HO 4:14 The sins of female prostitutes and adulterers can be excused when the men themselves set a bad example.
MT 23:9 Do not call any man on earth "father."
MT 19:12, RO 8:13 Men should consider castration, thereby making themselves eunuches, for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. If you live after the flesh, you shall die, but if you put to death the deeds of the body, you shall live. (Note: During the dark and middle ages, saints castrated themselves by the thousands in order to become more godly. Even now, the practice continues in some sects.)
MK 10:2-12, LK 16:18 Divorce is wrong, and to remarry is to commit adultery.
MK 10:29, LK 18:29 A man who leaves his house, wife, brothers, parents, or children for the sake of the kingdom of God will receive special rewards.
LK 14:26 One cannot be a disciple of Jesus unless he hates his mother, father, wife, children, brothers, sisters, and even his own life.
LK 14:33 "... any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple."
RO 13:1-4, PE 2:13-14 Be subject to every human institution. All authorities (laws and governments) are from God. (Note: This would include those of a Nazi Germany, yet believers seldom follow this injunction. Even Jesus and his Disciples violated this principle.)
1CO 7:1-38 Men and widows should not marry. Although it is well for a man to remain chaste, the temptation to immorality is a valid reason to marry; a man should marry if he cannot control himself. Yet, a man who is already married should live as if he were not. He that is unmarried is concerned about how he can please the Lord while he that is married is concerned about pleasing his spouse. It is better to remain single so as to attend to the Lord without distraction.
1CO 14:34-35 Women are to be silent in church. If they have any questions, they are to ask their husbands at home. It is a shame for women to speak in church.
2TH 3:10 Anyone who doesn't work should not be allowed to eat. (So much for charity)
1TI 2:11-12 Women are to learn in silence (from men) in all submissiveness.
1TI 2:12 Women are not permitted to teach or have authority over men.
1 JN 1:9-11 Do not allow anyone into your house who is not a fellow believer.
Islam is the only religion that makes loving, respecting and believing in Prophet Jesus (peace be upon him), including his miraculous birth, an article of faith. Muslims believe he indeed did raise the dead and he also brought a message, The Injeel from God.
It is precisely because Muslims believe in Prophet Jesus as a great man and because we believe in the infinite mercy and grace of God, that we cannot accept the Bible as the word of God. In fact, anyone with even an ounce of common sense and basic sense of humanity and morality will reject the claim that the Bible is the word of God after reading this.
Peace and blessings.
Hello,
Can these words bellow be the words of God? If they can't be the words of God, then is it not safe for us to conclude the Bible is not entirely the work of God because it has been altered by man?
You decide:
MT 5:18-19 The OT law is to remain in effect until heaven and earth pass away.
GE 1:28 Be fruitful and multiply. Fill the earth and subdue it. Have dominion over all living things. (Note: God appears to be totally unconcerned with population control or ecology.)
GE 3:16, CO 11:3-9, EP 5:22-24, CN 3:18, TS 2:5, PE 3:1-6 The husband is to rule over his wife. Wives are to be subject to their husbands even when the husband is disobedient to God. Man is the image and glory of God, while woman is the glory of man. Man was not created for woman but woman for man.
GE 3:16 Women should suffer pain during childbirth. (Note: This verse was used by the Church to oppose the use of anesthesia during childbirth.)
GE 15:18 Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia, Lebanon, Syria, Yemen, and part of Iraq belong to the Jews only.
GE 17:10 "This is my covenant, ...every male among you shall be circumcised." (Note: God seems to have an obsession with this--the words circumcise, circumcised, circumcising, circumcision, uncircumcised, uncircumcision, foreskin, and foreskins appear 157 times in the KJV. Although the KJV correctly translates the oldest Hebrew and Greek manuscripts, versions since the KJV attempt to soften this apparent obsession by creatively translating these words in a different fashion wherever possible.)
GE 17:14 A child/man be punished by having his "soul cut off from his people" if his parents fail to have him circumcised when he was an infant of 8 days old.
GE 38:8-10 A man who refuses to impregnate his widowed sister-in-law is "wicked in the LORD's sight" and so is put to death.
EX 20:8-11, 31:15-17, 34:21, 35:1-3 No work of any kind is to be done on the Sabbath, not even lighting of a fire. This commandment is permanent. Death is required for infractions. (Note: This would require even that essential services, such as hospitals, police departments, etc., shut down on the Sabbath.)
EX 21:7-11 A father can sell a daughter into slavery to pay a debt. A daughter sold into slavery is not released at the end of six years as is an ordinary male slave.
EX 21:12 Whoever strikes a man so that he dies is to be put to death--except that, in some cases, God will appoint a place to which the offender may flee instead.
EX 21:15 Whoever strikes his father or mother is to be put to death. (As opposed to Islam where a man ia ccountable to God for a misdeed such as this.)
EX 21:16 Whoever steals a man is to be put to death. (Note: This is in spite of the fact that a father can sell his daughter into slavery; see EX 21:7-11.) EX 21:17, LE 20:9, DT 21:18-21 A child who curses his parent(s) is to be put to death. A stubborn and/or rebellious child is to be put to death.
EX 21:20-21 A slave owner is to be punished if he strikes his slave and the slave dies shortly thereafter. If the slave lives a day or to and then dies, the slave owner is not to be punished. A slave is the same as money to his owner.
EX 21:23-25, LE 24:17-21, DT 19:21 An eye for an eye, a tooth for a tooth, etc.
EX 21:28-32 When an ox gores a man to death, the ox must be stoned. If the ox has gored a man previously, the animal's owner must also be put to death; in the case of the goring of a slave, the only requirement is that the owner of the ox must pay thirty shekels to the owner of the slave.
EX 22:16-17 An unbetrothed virgin is required to marry her seducer.
LE 12:2 A woman who has a child, especially a female child, is unclean and purification rites are required.
LE 15:19 A woman who is menstruating is unclean. Anyone who touches her is unclean.
LE 15:20 Anything which a woman who is menstruating sits on or lies on is unclean.
LE 15:21 Anyone who touches the bed of a woman who is menstruating must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:22 Anyone who touches anything which was sat upon by a woman who is menstruating must wash his clothes and bathe, and is unclean until evening.
LE 15:28 After her flow stops, a woman who was menstruating must count off seven days before she is considered clean again. On the eighth day, she must present two birds to the priest for an atonement for having had a menstrual discharge.
LE 20:15-16 If a person engages in sex with an animal, both the animal and the person must be put to death. (What fault is it of the innocent animal?)
LE 21:9 If a priest's daughter becomes a prostitute, she is to be burnt with fire.
LE 21:14 A priest (or descendant of Aaron) must not marry a widow, a divorced woman, a woman who has been defiled, or a harlot, but only a virgin.
LE 25:44-46, DT 15:17, EP 6:5, CN 3:22, TS 2:9, PE 2:18 Slavery is an everlasting institution. Slaves are to obey their masters in everything.
LE 27:3-7 Males are more valuable than females.
LE 27:29 Human sacrifice is condoned.
NU 3:10 An unauthorized person who acts as a priest must be put to death.
NU 31:18, 35, JG 21:12 Young virgins are considered a spoil of war and can be taken for the use of the victors.
DT 15:1-3 Every seven years, a brother (meaning a fellow Israelite) should be released from his debt. Only a foreigner should be required, again, to honor his debt.
DT 22:6-7 If you want to live a long time, you must not take a mother bird from her young, but you may take the young from the mother.
DT 22:13-21 A bride in whom "the tokens of virginity" are not found is to be put to death. (Note: The bridegroom who falsely accuses his bride gets off with a fine.)
DT 22:23-24 A betrothed virgin who is seduced in the city is to be put to death unless she cries for help.
DT 22:28-29 A virgin who is raped must marry her rapist (if they are "found").
DT 23:2 A bastard--and his offspring to the tenth generation--are to be punished for his illegitimacy and cannot enter a congregation of the Lord.
DT 25:5-10 A man has an obligation to produce a child for his widowed sister-in-law.
1KI 5:13, 9:3, 15 Forced labor is apparently sanctioned inasmuch as the Lord consecrated the house that Solomon built for the Lord using forced labor.
PR 13:24, 22:15, 23:13 Children are to be disciplined with the rod-- if beaten with a rod, they will not die. (Note: Many Christian parents have inadvertently beaten a child to death following this precept.)
HO 4:14 The sins of female prostitutes and adulterers can be excused when the men themselves set a bad example.
MT 23:9 Do not call any man on earth "father."
MT 19:12, RO 8:13 Men should consider castration, thereby making themselves eunuches, for the sake of the kingdom of heaven. If you live after the flesh, you shall die, but if you put to death the deeds of the body, you shall live. (Note: During the dark and middle ages, saints castrated themselves by the thousands in order to become more godly. Even now, the practice continues in some sects.)
MK 10:2-12, LK 16:18 Divorce is wrong, and to remarry is to commit adultery.
MK 10:29, LK 18:29 A man who leaves his house, wife, brothers, parents, or children for the sake of the kingdom of God will receive special rewards.
LK 14:26 One cannot be a disciple of Jesus unless he hates his mother, father, wife, children, brothers, sisters, and even his own life.
LK 14:33 "... any of you who does not give up everything he has cannot be my disciple."
RO 13:1-4, PE 2:13-14 Be subject to every human institution. All authorities (laws and governments) are from God. (Note: This would include those of a Nazi Germany, yet believers seldom follow this injunction. Even Jesus and his Disciples violated this principle.)
1CO 7:1-38 Men and widows should not marry. Although it is well for a man to remain chaste, the temptation to immorality is a valid reason to marry; a man should marry if he cannot control himself. Yet, a man who is already married should live as if he were not. He that is unmarried is concerned about how he can please the Lord while he that is married is concerned about pleasing his spouse. It is better to remain single so as to attend to the Lord without distraction.
1CO 14:34-35 Women are to be silent in church. If they have any questions, they are to ask their husbands at home. It is a shame for women to speak in church.
2TH 3:10 Anyone who doesn't work should not be allowed to eat. (So much for charity)
1TI 2:11-12 Women are to learn in silence (from men) in all submissiveness.
1TI 2:12 Women are not permitted to teach or have authority over men.
1 JN 1:9-11 Do not allow anyone into your house who is not a fellow believer.
Islam is the only religion that makes loving, respecting and believing in Prophet Jesus (peace be upon him), including his miraculous birth, an article of faith. Muslims believe he indeed did raise the dead and he also brought a message, The Injeel from God.
It is precisely because Muslims believe in Prophet Jesus as a great man and because we believe in the infinite mercy and grace of God, that we cannot accept the Bible as the word of God. In fact, anyone with even an ounce of common sense and basic sense of humanity and morality will reject the claim that the Bible is the word of God after reading this.
Peace and blessings.
Al-Mu'min
Esteemed Member
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yep bro thanks for the biggg info and sis nicola i hope you understand
and bro you a star
take care
Salaam,
May peace be upon you sister. Lets pray for our brothers and sister of other faiths to recognise the truth.
Ameen.
Arch_warrior
Senior Member
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Oh it does contradict its self very well , the old testimant clearly goes on about god being 1 , the new testimant is claming God to be in 3 , now which testimant is telling the porkies? :?
Folks I have been catching up on the thread. One of the first things that I noticed is there was a new member to the discussion that was imo abusing the word God by using it as his user name.
I don’t know if he is of the Christian faith or not. But if he is I would like to offer an apology to the forum on behalf of Christians every where.
I don’t approve of his use of the word God as a user name. Also I would like to apologize for his posting style. The apostle Paul was a much better example to follow in style.
We should not use our posts to beat someone into submission. We should use our postings to lead to a common understanding.
I am sure that you all see me as being misguided in my understandings and beliefs, just the same as I see Islam as being misguided and Muslims being mistaken.
I am doing my best to lead Islam to a better understanding, as I am sure you are trying to do lead me and my faith to a better understanding.
If you ever catch me posting as the new member was doing, please call my hand on it and ask me to stop it.
Thanks
Nimrod
I don’t know if he is of the Christian faith or not. But if he is I would like to offer an apology to the forum on behalf of Christians every where.
I don’t approve of his use of the word God as a user name. Also I would like to apologize for his posting style. The apostle Paul was a much better example to follow in style.
We should not use our posts to beat someone into submission. We should use our postings to lead to a common understanding.
I am sure that you all see me as being misguided in my understandings and beliefs, just the same as I see Islam as being misguided and Muslims being mistaken.
I am doing my best to lead Islam to a better understanding, as I am sure you are trying to do lead me and my faith to a better understanding.
If you ever catch me posting as the new member was doing, please call my hand on it and ask me to stop it.
Thanks
Nimrod
both testaments go along fine with each other. and if that wasn't the case then why would Christians faithfully have both in the Bible if they knew that one contradicted the other?
Prim3, even people who believed in the book of Adolf Hitler "My War", thought that it was the right thingbut do u agree that book was right?
never read that book... but did it contradict itself... like you are assuming the Bible does?
Ps...sorry if my statements seem childish...
Last edited:
Al- Mu’ min I have been going back over a few things.
One thing I have tried to stress is that in trying to determine if scripture is man made (tampered with) or from God. That is about the biggest and most common mistake I have seen Muslims making as I study and read this forum.
I have seen scripture I have posted on this very thread being dismissed for no logical reason. The only reason given in some cases is that it doesn’t agree with the Koran.
The illogical reason that seems to given is that man can not corrupt God’s scripture.
The reason this is illogical is that the Muslims strongly state that much scripture before the Koran has been corrupted.
So on one hand we have statements saying scripture cannot be corrupted all the while these same people are saying that scripture has been corrupted.
I didn’t want to guilty of doing the same thing with scripture you posted, so here is why I doubt your scripture is from God and that it is only from man’s imaginings:
Mary pointed to the child; but they said, 'Hoe shall we speak to one who still in the cradle, a little child. And he said, 'Lo, I am God's servant, God has given me the Book and made me a Prophet Blessed He has made me ,wherever/may be; and hi has enjoined me to prayer, and to give the alms so long as I live, and likewise to cherish my mother; He has not made me arrogant and wicked. Peace be upon me, the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I am raised up a live. "
Behold! I taught thee the Book and Wisdom, the Law and the Gospel and behold! thou makest out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My leave, and thou breathest into it and it becometh a bird by My leave,
It makes no sense that the men you accuse of tampering with the bible omitting your scripture lesser than he is and it makes no sense for these same men after omitting your scripture that they would leave the scripture you discount as false in place.
It makes no sense that the very ones who knew him best (the Apostles) would fail to know of the miracles you cited and not to have mentioned them.
It makes no sense what so ever.
We both agree that God isn’t the author of confusion, so I have to credit Islam with the confusion because it must agree with earlier scripture or be able to explain why not.
I am sure you credit the Christian with the source of confusion. Fair enough as long as your reasoning stands up to reason.
Thanks
Nimrod
One thing I have tried to stress is that in trying to determine if scripture is man made (tampered with) or from God. That is about the biggest and most common mistake I have seen Muslims making as I study and read this forum.
I have seen scripture I have posted on this very thread being dismissed for no logical reason. The only reason given in some cases is that it doesn’t agree with the Koran.
The illogical reason that seems to given is that man can not corrupt God’s scripture.
The reason this is illogical is that the Muslims strongly state that much scripture before the Koran has been corrupted.
So on one hand we have statements saying scripture cannot be corrupted all the while these same people are saying that scripture has been corrupted.
I didn’t want to guilty of doing the same thing with scripture you posted, so here is why I doubt your scripture is from God and that it is only from man’s imaginings:
Mary pointed to the child; but they said, 'Hoe shall we speak to one who still in the cradle, a little child. And he said, 'Lo, I am God's servant, God has given me the Book and made me a Prophet Blessed He has made me ,wherever/may be; and hi has enjoined me to prayer, and to give the alms so long as I live, and likewise to cherish my mother; He has not made me arrogant and wicked. Peace be upon me, the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I am raised up a live. "
Behold! I taught thee the Book and Wisdom, the Law and the Gospel and behold! thou makest out of clay, as it were, the figure of a bird, by My leave, and thou breathest into it and it becometh a bird by My leave,
It makes no sense that the men you accuse of tampering with the bible omitting your scripture lesser than he is and it makes no sense for these same men after omitting your scripture that they would leave the scripture you discount as false in place.
It makes no sense that the very ones who knew him best (the Apostles) would fail to know of the miracles you cited and not to have mentioned them.
It makes no sense what so ever.
We both agree that God isn’t the author of confusion, so I have to credit Islam with the confusion because it must agree with earlier scripture or be able to explain why not.
I am sure you credit the Christian with the source of confusion. Fair enough as long as your reasoning stands up to reason.
Thanks
Nimrod
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I think you need to re-read the posts of brother Al-Mu'min about the Bible, but as for Hitler's book, i was not talking in specific about the contradictions, but just wanted to tell you, that there are poeple in this world that are the worst creatures on earth, that they think their book teaches right, but if u bring evidence (for ex. for the inferiority of other races except arian race), then actually Hitler's book is contradicting science facts, where all races have the same blood color, can share they organs if they are same blood group etc etc.
Peace