Distinction between Muhammad (saw) and False prophets

[Curaezipirid]

Re: Sikhism

What is the theological distinction between Mohammed, Peace be upon Him and his descendents, and a person whom comes after Him and speaks of Prophesies, and is believed by their community to be a Prophet, but speaks no new Prophesy to those Mohammed, Peace be upon Him and his descendents, spoke.

For example, if an Australian Aboriginal Man, began to go into regular trances, and began to recite Qur'an, in this present time, and to a community not at this time familiar with Qur'an, and if all the other words he spoke were alike in meaning to every word Mohammed, Peace be upon Him and his descendents, spoke, then how should we regard such a man, especially if He was able to cause that we all become Muslim?

He could have no cause to claim to be giving new Prophesises, and every cause to tell that Mohammed spoke truth, but if His own community regarded Him as a Prophet, and their regard for the evidence they perceived in Him was exactly what they need to reinstate their Faith in Allah, then He would neither be the last Prophet, since Mohammed has been already, but nor would He be wrong in letting His community believe that He is speaking in Prophesy.

Surely there are many persons, maybe like Mujahideen, whom enter trances, and are then only able to speak what is in Qur'an and Ahadith, but what is the correct regard to hold such persons in?

 

[Curaezipirid]

Re: Sikhism

It is only that you have misunderstood what I was asking. I stated no belief what so ever. Neither have I quoted from Qur'an. It is that I used an unusual syntax of the English language. I can make it more plain.

If there is a person in another place where there is not modern Arabic speaking form of Islam, say, for example, if such a person existed in the remote parts of Brazillian rainforests. And they begin to go into trances regularly and recite Qur'an. And they are studied and it is found that most of what they say is forms of expression inimical with all ahadith. We all know that they are not the last prophet, because we know the story of Mohammed, (Peace be upon Him and all his descendents). But for other persons it that remote Brazilian rainforest, the man going into a trance would bear an equivalent status in their region to Mohammed, (Peace be upon Him and all his descendents).

While this example is perhaps only a metaphor for Sikhism, and I do not know if it has really occurred, it could well have occurred. Such things could well have occurred rather often even within all cultures that are not by natural inclination culture of the people of the book. That is, in other parts of Earth the traditions are not inclusive of keeping written historical records. In Australia one of the results of such, is that we are necessarily very strict with our selves in Dream interpretation. In most cultures without writing traditions there are very very strong Shaman traditions because we were all far more dependent upon Dreams. In fact in most Shamanic tradition the story of how Mohammed received Qur'an is far more readily accepted as real than it is by people living within a school that was traditionally maintained by a written tradition. It is in fact the merging of these two traditions, and also with that tradition of story telling that is at its pinnacle in Mahabarata etc, that is a large part of the miracle of Qur'an.

If it happens, and you were to receive a knowledge of a Brazilian Shaman becoming able to recite Qur'an without previous contact with Islam, could you blame any follower of such a Shaman for supposing that that Shaman were the last Prophet? I want to know what is the Muslim "theological" response to this question.

Rather, what is the position of the various Madhab in this matter? Maybe it is that there has never needed to be any response because if a group of people believe, then we simply let them believe, rather than trying to fault the form of their belief. It is wrong to seek faults in each other only for money.

 

[Curaezipirid]

Re: Sikhism

AlaikumAssalam, oops, it is that I took a post directed at a quote as though directed at my self. I am become so accustomed to having the only posts after mine in some other forums bieng "we can not understand your meaning" that I was all together to quick to accept as though accused, my apology, wasalam

 

[Fishman]

Re: Sikhism

AlaikumAssalam, oops, it is that I took a post directed at a quote as though directed at my self. I am become so accustomed to having the only posts after mine in some other forums bieng "we can not understand your meaning" that I was all together to quick to accept as though accused, my apology, wasalam

Yeah, that is rather strange how you write really complicated essays for your posts that are so good that most people can't even understand them.

 

[Muhammad]

Re: Sikhism

What is the theological distinction between Mohammed, Peace be upon Him and his descendents, and a person whom comes after Him and speaks of Prophesies, and is believed by their community to be a Prophet, but speaks no new Prophesy to those Mohammed, Peace be upon Him and his descendents, spoke.

The answer to this question might be found by reading into the biography of the Prophet :arabic5: (you can refer to some of the threads mentioned at the end of the post). For example, his companions witnessed the revelation of the Qur'an to him, as well as many of the miracles that he performed and in general, his whole lifestyle attested to the truth of his message and sincerity in his actions.

Therefore, just because somebody reads the Qur'an or knows some hadeeth does not make them a prophet. The context in which the Qur'an and hadeeth were revealed clearly identifies the time and person to whom they were revealed, and the prophethood of Muhammad :arabic5: has been established in many ways such as those mentioned above.

So in the scenario of a Brazilian Rainforest, many such important points would need to be borne in mind (for example: from where did this person learn the Qur'an, and if he is making the same prophecies as Muhammad :arabic5:, what use are those that already came true a long time ago?) and many others, such as the lifestyle and nature of the claimant would render his assertion incoherent.

The following threads might be helpful for a brief insight into the life and character of the Prophet :arabic5::

http://www.islamicboard.com/comparative-religion/18565-evidence-truth-prophethood-muhammad.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/prophet-muhammad-p/14223-muhammad-s-mercy-mankind.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/prophet-muhammad-p/14113-noble-qualities-muhammad-s.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/prophet-muhammad-p/14096-simple-life-muhammad-saws.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/comparative-religion/17044-muhammad-z.html

http://www.islamicboard.com/islamic-multimedia/5839-life-muhammad-s-w-medina-period-vol-1-a.html

 

[AvarAllahNoor]

Saying Guru Nanak is a false Prophet i find extremely offensive!! What was wrong with the thread remaining where it was??

 

[Muhammad]

Greetings,

This is not supposed to be a comparison between Guru Nanak and Muhammad (pbuh), but in answer to Ridicurezipa's question, what makes Muhammad (pbuh) different from someone reading Qur'an and copying his hadeeth and prophecies to a society ignorant of Islam.

If I have understood it wrong, and it was relevant to the Sikhism thread, I will happily move it back .

Peace.

 

[Mohsin]

Saying Guru Nanak is a false Prophet i find extremely offensive!! What was wrong with the thread remaining where it was??

We find it offensive when you say muhammed is a liar, or when you allege the Qur'an is changed.

Muhammmd PBUh said time and time again he is the last prophet to the whole world, now if you believe Guru nanak to be a prophet, then you are saying Muhammed PBUH is lieing and is false, so you are just as guilty

 

[Curaezipirid]

Alaikum Assalam,

the moderator is correct in asserting that if a person in a Brazillian rainforest were to begin to experience Qur'an being revealed to them in the same way as it was revealed to Mohammed, that we can have no real regard for such without any actual evidence of. So it was sort of pointless speculation, yet it touches upon a far broader issue of inter-cultural relations.

Also I am 100% certain that a number of persons of my acquaintance have begun to experience Islamic Dreams as though they have been hearing Qur'an and ahadith regularly, but when they have never had any access to such, and nor are at all interested in Islam. Obviously what is a part of what they have Dreamed is that these teachings were first transmitted through Mohammed, (Peace be upon Him and all His descendents) otherwise they would not clearly be able to question what these matters are about. But the question is supposing that in the Brazilian rainforest the community had no prior knowledge of Islam, and so naturally gravitated toward regarding the first person to Dream Qur'an as special. Obviously in this time, we can all only wish for such persons to become Muslims. But what if persons begin to Dream Islamic lessons but are prevented from learning among Muslims. In my situation even though persons have tried to prevent me, I can at least go to a public library and find copy of Qur'an, but there are many persons in the world whom can not. So the question is what is the correct regard for such occurances. Surely when any person Dreams Qur'an Islam becomes their Religion whether they are enabled to identitfy it as their Religion or not. This is an important matter since it relates to one of the signs of the approach of the hour of judgment.

wasalam