Do Muslims believe in Free Speech

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Ansar Al-'Adl said:
I hope you are aware that in most western countries it is a criminal offence to appear nude in public. Freedom of expression has reasonable limits in all societies.
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I'll respond to you on this point as I value your opinion and feel that unfortunately some other contributors to this thread have a somewhat less than adequate grasp of the concept of rational discourse.

Public nudity is a societal taboo, this is true. I can see no good, rational arguments to support such attitudes, but I appear to be in a minority. I grew up in a country where public nudity, particularly at the beach, was not seen as particularly offensive. If people found such things offensive, they didn't go to those particular beaches. Nobody, that I could see, was harmed in any way.

What could be argued is that real harm is done to children by indoctrination in the belief that the human body is something shameful. But that is another discussion. My point is that, while I don't agree with everything that my society expects, I am willing to come to some compromise. And hopefully attitudes that don't serve any real purpose but to infringe on personal liberties will be challenged and eventually changed. That is the mark of a dynamic, progressive society. I do not see the same coming from Islamic cultures. Centuries ago, it was the Islamic world that was bringing fresh new ideas to the rest of the planet. Sadly this does not seem to be the case, and reactionary and repressive societies are a result.

Understand that what I say might seem startlingly absolute, but that is not the intent. I enjoy having my views challenged. I have no hope of changing anyone's point of view, just the hope that some kind of mutual understanding can take place, for I am troubled by my lack of understanding of the Muslim world view.
 
abdul Majid said:
Now About God... Lemme Ask You Something Did You Create Your Self, Or Do You Beleive In The Biggg Bbbaaannngggg.....then Poof Everything Came In To Play Tell Me Fred..
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Well, if I may answer.

I don't know. But I do know one thing, it would be a betrayal of God for me to blindly accept what you, another human being, says about Him.

You must understand, that if I'm rejecting your beliefs, it isn't God I'm rejecting....it's you I'm rejecting. This goes for Jews, Christians, and Muslims and whoever else is so proud of themselves that they think they can speak for and about God.

My relationship with God is my own business. I won't betray God by following what some other human beings say about him.

Because what it comes right down to it, when you are professing your faith in Islam, it isn't Allah Himself you're professing your faith in, it's the people that have told you about Allah that you are trusting to be right.

I don't trust anyone that much.
 
Salaam.

It's about how the freedom is used that matters. Not whether we believe in it or not.

Example. Your wife/girlfriend/gay-buddy asks you does their behind look big in a certain outfit. Evidently it does. But what would you do? Exercise your freedom of speech and tell them it does, and hurt their feelings? Or say it doesn't? Common sense tells me you wouldn't.

It was an attack on the Muslims, using the freedom of speech bull**** line to say it wasn't.
 
Hang on a minute.
I thought this thread was about free speech?
About free speech. Muslims, and everyone else for that matter, have been created by God. He gave them free will in that they can follow what they want, do what they want and live how they want. There have been revelations sent down by God via the prophets and these tell us how to live our lives in a way that God is pleased with. We have the right to have freedom of speech so long as it does not insult other religions. Even i as a muslim cannot insult someone who follows another religion. Even though may not agree with the views of that religion i cannot insult and ridicule it. That is what the danish newspapers did, and that is why they got such a violent reaction
 
Hi fredbear,
Thanks for your post.
fredbear said:
Understand that what I say might seem startlingly absolute, but that is not the intent. I enjoy having my views challenged. I have no hope of changing anyone's point of view, just the hope that some kind of mutual understanding can take place, for I am troubled by my lack of understanding of the Muslim world view.
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I agree that we need to build understanding, and I look forward to having more discussions with you in the future. :)
 
Salaam

Freedom of Speech= " I CAN SAY WHAT I WANT" this is the attitude people have taken, so when you offend someone by your words don't be suprised if they react.
 
islam-truth said:
Salaam

Freedom of Speech= " I CAN SAY WHAT I WANT" this is the attitude people have taken, so when you offend someone by your words don't be suprised if they react.
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Very true, these days the laws of freedom of speech have meant that people use it whenever they say something harmful or insulting
Wassalam
 
Greetings,
mizan_aliashraf said:
Even i as a muslim cannot insult someone who follows another religion. Even though may not agree with the views of that religion i cannot insult and ridicule it.
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But you appear to have given yourself the right to insult those of all religions other than Islam, as well as those of none with many of your comments on other threads about "dirty filthy kuffars" and "filthy scum".

Peace
 
czgibson said:
Greetings,


But you appear to have given yourself the right to insult those of all religions other than Islam, as well as those of none with many of your comments on other threads about "dirty filthy kuffars" and "filthy scum".

Peace
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Peace to you
This is not how i really am and it was done out of anger
I do apologise if i have offended anyone, but understand that i am still very deeply offended.
 
Greetings,
mizan_aliashraf said:
Peace to you
This is not how i really am and it was done out of anger
I do apologise if i have offended anyone, but understand that i am still very deeply offended.
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You have every right to feel offended.

Much respect for your apology. :thumbs_up

Peace
 
I too applaud the aplology, yet remain concerned that this festering hate underpins much of what is done in the name if Islam. Non-violent muslims should, in my opinion, be much more vocal in their condemnation of violence and incitement to violence that seems to be so prevalent amongst people of Islamic faith.
 
Freedom of Speech is something that has to be used carefully! Some might debate that if it is Ok to say anything about anyone can i stand in the street and say

"I LOVE TERROISM AND I THINK ITS CORRECT AND ALL THE NON-MUSLIMS SHOULD DIE AND THEN BURN IN HELL"

Huh!:?

Obviously NOT!

Now Freedom of Speech SHOULD be a given right to those that will exercie it correctly! What i mean is that THESE pictures werent printed by some back street firm that sent a couple of leaflets out. NO it was a National paper! Surely the Danes have something better to write about! :?
 
Sis786 said:
Freedom of Speech is something that has to be used carefully! Some might debate that if it is Ok to say anything about anyone can i stand in the street and say

"I LOVE TERROISM AND I THINK ITS CORRECT AND ALL THE NON-MUSLIMS SHOULD DIE AND THEN BURN IN HELL"

Huh!:?

Obviously NOT!
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Not so 'obviously not'. Freedom of speach means exactly that. The freedom to say whatever is on your mind. You are not free to cause physical harm to another person or their property. If I want to proclaim the nature of your faith on the streetcorner, even if it advocates violence, I should be free to do so. And that's precicely what I see going on in this forum. There are countless justifications for acts of violence here. It is as it should be.

That being said, if I am calling for acts of violence to be comitted, I should expect some form of law enforcement surveilance. Not because of what I said, but because what I said is an indication of what I might do.

In general, Muslims don't appear to understand the concept of free speech. It's not free if it has to be adjusted to comply with the mores of a specific group. I recommend you read Voltaire: "I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
 
mizan_aliashraf said:
Peace to you
This is not how i really am and it was done out of anger
I do apologise if i have offended anyone, but understand that i am still very deeply offended.
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Understandably.

And I support your right to call anyone kufar or scum all you like. Many people probably deserve it. I may be offended, but I don't have the right to not be.

Perhaps you can start a Danish Defamation Websight.

The only think I take issue with is a violent response to speech.
 
fredbear said:
Not so 'obviously not'. Freedom of speach means exactly that. The freedom to say whatever is on your mind. You are not free to cause physical harm to another person or their property. If I want to proclaim the nature of your faith on the streetcorner, even if it advocates violence, I should be free to do so. And that's precicely what I see going on in this forum. There are countless justifications for acts of violence here. It is as it should be.

That being said, if I am calling for acts of violence to be comitted, I should expect some form of law enforcement surveilance. Not because of what I said, but because what I said is an indication of what I might do.

In general, Muslims don't appear to understand the concept of free speech. It's not free if it has to be adjusted to comply with the mores of a specific group. I recommend you read Voltaire: "I may not like what you say, but I'll defend to the death your right to say it."
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I suppose if this is the case then what we will see happening is MORE RACISM, MORE HATE, INCITING VIOLENCE AND A LACK OF RESPECT!!! Brill World Cant Wait!!!:offended:
 
Smok said:
Salaam.

I believe in free speech. But I will not insult other religions because it hasn't any sense. I'm agains any censorship but I don't want to insult anyone.

Maa salama.
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I agree.

I think freedom of speech should be used responsibly, because like it or not, there are certain people who will react violently. While I do not condone the violence, I feel it can be easily avoided by using freedom of speech in a responsible manner.

Like Spidey's Uncle Ben said: 'With great power comes great responsibility' ;)
 
Sis786 said:
I suppose if this is the case then what we will see happening is MORE RACISM, MORE HATE, INCITING VIOLENCE AND A LACK OF RESPECT!!! Brill World Cant Wait!!!:offended:
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Except the more that people accept the freedom of speech, the less racism, hate, violence and lack of respect there is. It is an irony. But once everyone accepts the principle that we can all say what we like, we move beyond the world of prejudice and bigotry. When the government lays down laws that tell people what they can or cannot say, they create a link between believers (of whatever sort) and power. Basically, if the government persecutes people for their beliefs, then it is important that every Belief seizes power and keeps it. This embitters the power struggle. It means that people murder to get into, and stay, in power. It means that dissenters are persecuted as are critics. Once there is no need for Believers to hold power (because they are tolerated) and they come to accept that the proper way to prove Truth is peacefully, the bitterness and hatred disappears.

You can see this anywhere you like. When was the last time anyone was murdered for their beliefs in the West? Theo van Gogh perhaps - but that is the exception that proves the rule. Someone did not accept his right to speak his mind. Find me a country that has and enforces blasphemy laws and I will show you a country full of persecution and injustice.
 
Muezzin said:
I agree.

I think freedom of speech should be used responsibly, because like it or not, there are certain people who will react violently. While I do not condone the violence, I feel it can be easily avoided by using freedom of speech in a responsible manner.

Like Spidey's Uncle Ben said: 'With great power comes great responsibility' ;)
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I believe that freedom of speech should be used responsibly because it can hurt people's deeply held feelings. But it must not be "not used" because of threats of violence. People who kill must not be appeased but arrested. People who makes threats to kill should be in jail. They must not be allowed to win. If you go down the path of restricting what you say because of threats of violence, there is an incentive to use threats of violence to get your ends. Anyone can threaten to kill someone. If you let one group do it, another will want to as well. Then everyone will be doing it and there will be no freedom left. You have to draw the line somewhere.
 

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