ENGLAND: Home of the Islamophobe extremists...

[Mustafa2012]

I don't think there's much benefit in ranting about how non-Muslims misunderstand Islam. That's their problem. If they don't want to understand, nothing we say will make them understand.

What I think we should concentrate on is to overtly demonstrate the truth of Islam. I don't think it's enough for us to just go about our lives as Muslims. We need to speak up and reach out to our neighbors, who are our neighbors regardless of whether they are Muslims or otherwise. It's not much use to make public announcements of condemnation after the attrocities have been committed by some people who claim to be Muslims. It's sort of like closing the stable door after the horse has bolted.

One other thing. I am in no position to say with certainty about the status of the two suspects in the Woolwich incident. We are told that they are Muslims. What do we know about them? Do they fulfill the conditions of being Muslims in the first place? Mind you, I am not saying that they are not Muslims. I am just asking how we know that they are Muslims in the first place?

With all due respect I think there is still some benefit in "ranting" about how non-Muslims misunderstand Islam. It's not just their problem. It's also our problem. Look at the way we speak and the way we conduct ourselves. We often give them reason to hate us.

If you read your words carefully, you seem to agree with what you disagree about.

Again with all due respect, before commenting on this issue, you need to have lived in and have a good understanding of the way the locals think. If not, then it's not fair to comment.

 

[Mustafa2012]

Bro Abz2000, with all due respect to what you've said and the evidence you've quoted, I think you have an incorrect understanding the situation and of the verses you've quoted. No scholar or speaker with a balanced understanding of Islam has said what you've said.

We cannot turn the whole world into a war zone where anything goes. We need to distinguish between lands or areas where there is peace and lands where war is taking place and between the average citizen who has no say in foreign policy and leaders.

If we followed your way of thinking, it would result in a lot of problems for Muslims everywhere.

Are you willing to take responsibility for innocent Muslim men and women being attacked and killed everywhere as a result of following your line of thought?

 

[islamica]

Getting back on topic, the extremists British terrorist strike again!

Burn mosque (House of Allah) to the ground...

http://www.huffingtonpost.co.uk/201...-fire-edl-attack_n_3389136.html#slide=2534163

 

[Ali Mujahidin]

Again with all due respect, before commenting on this issue, you need to have lived in and have a good understanding of the way the locals think. If not, then it's not fair to comment.

From what you have said, I assume you have lived near Woolwich and have a good understanding of the way the locals there think? Or you have lived in the UK and have a good understanding of the way the locals in the UK think?

I must admit that I live, more or less, on the other side of the planet and I would like to get a better understanding of what is actually going on at ground zero in Woolwich, so to say. Perhaps you can supply the much-needed localized information?

 

[Abz2000]

We cannot turn the whole world into a war zone where anything goes. We need to distinguish between lands or areas where there is peace and lands where war is taking place and between the average citizen who has no say in foreign policy and leaders.

Salamz brother, you may not have felt the same way if your families or children suffered the same fate as That of the people who's lands were illeally invaded by those dar al harb lands.
Depends on how you look at it really, obviously if you live among kuffar and interact with them on a daily basis, and are regulated by their method, you will naturally see things from a different point of view to someone on the receiving end.
We must bear in mind that living in a land regulated by kuffar leaves permanent scars on the phsyche, I am still suffering withdrawals from kufrism and finding it difficult to kick certain habits due to the last 31 years under her majesty's benevolence.
but one thing we mustn't do is accept our fate as dhimmi's when living under these criminal governments, we have a way we need to adhere to, promote, and fight for when necessary because they are doing their best to take it from us.

The situation at the moment didn't start yesterday, they've been wanting to implement it for years and paused due to think tanks advising them that it would push all the Muslims togethe
Google "contest 2" "uk law" "5 points"

This has full subtitles so you can mute it if u like

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NbVpR5xYBos

http://m.guardian.co.uk/politics/2009/feb/17/counterterrorism-strategy-muslims



I hope you can see from the signs that you will not live safely as a Muslim practicing his deen for long in the lands of the pharaoh's unless you're willing to compromise to the extent of making your deen unrecognisable, they did it to the Christians and they did it to the Jews, the Muslims are a little more difficult, but they're working on it....

Apologies for the haphazard method of writing, can't see the sentence before on this phone so it's the best I can do without constant scrolling.

Peace

 

[Jedi_Mindset]

^

True, they want us to keep our deen in ourselves, to just stay in the mosques, not show it et cetera. They dont want to give us dawah, or anything. They are only pleased when we follow their ways of life. But, they can't stop us from doing our islamic duties. lets just give dawah on the streets, and other good deeds. I know we can't escape from the fitnah in these streets, but it shouldnt stop us either from doing our obligations.

 

[GuestFellow]

With all due respect I think there is still some benefit in "ranting" about how non-Muslims misunderstand Islam. It's not just their problem. It's also our problem. Look at the way we speak and the way we conduct ourselves. We often give them reason to hate us.

:wa:

I agree that some Muslims have given some non-Muslims a good reason to hate us. I find it ironic when these particular Muslims complain about non-Muslims misunderstand and hate them but commit acts that make non-Muslims hate them even more. A good example is Anjem Chourdary.

 

[Ali Mujahidin]

A good example is Anjem Chourdary.

Just curious. What has Anjem said or done that shows that he is talking about Islam?

 

[GuestFellow]

Just curious. What has Anjem said or done that shows that he is talking about Islam?

:wa:

Anjem is a Muslim that promotes the Sharia. I agree with him on many issues. However, it is the way he presents those issues and his followers are intimidating. He can come across as being rude and his followers are aggressive (one of his followers are known to slap those that disagree with them). He was also involved in burning poppies which many British people find disrespectful.

So in a nutshell he's rude and organises stupid demonstrations. He is one of the reasons why some non-Muslims hate Muslims.

 

[Abz2000]

I like the fact that he gives a different point of view from what we see regurgitated every day in the lamestream media.
BeIng a lawyer can mean sounding like an a-hole sum times but his arguments often leave them flustered and irritated, I usually find them to be rude and him to be patient- especially when it's fox news.

If kuffar want to hate on people for saying the truth, it's their own issue.

A & B are opposites,
B invades A's house and trashes it and kills his family members,
A complains to society - everyone including the U.N says "we're helpless"
Then A when is frustrated by the injustice and does exactly the same (actually a lot less), even A's family are expected to condemn him????
R u serious???

Maybe empathy is something that will cause the British, french and american people to demand that their government stop it's killing and plundering.
The more silent we are the more they attack us, don't ever dream you'll appease them by condemning your brothers who strive for justice and truth.

 

[GuestFellow]

BeIng a lawyer can mean sounding like an a-hole sum times

:wa:

He's not a Solicitor anymore. He struck off by the Law Society. So no excuse for him to sound "mean"...

but his arguments often leave them flustered and irritated, I usually find them to be rude and him to be patient- especially when it's fox news.

Oh yes the mainstream media are rude and behave worse.

Maybe empathy is something that will cause the British, french and american people to demand that their government stop it's killing and plundering.
The more silent we are the more they attack us, don't ever dream you'll appease them by condemning your brothers who strive for justice and truth.

Whatever you think of him you have to admit he's doing a terrible job. What is the point of organising huge protests, burning poppies and flags? It has not gotten Muslims in the UK anywhere. Just gives the mainstream media an excuse to complain about how violent those Muslims are.

There are so many Islamic scholars that do a better job than he does. They can put their point across without demonstrations/burning stuff.

 

[Mustafa2012]

I like the fact that he gives a different point of view from what we see regurgitated every day in the lamestream media.
BeIng a lawyer can mean sounding like an a-hole sum times but his arguments often leave them flustered and irritated, I usually find them to be rude and him to be patient- especially when it's fox news.

If kuffar want to hate on people for saying the truth, it's their own issue.

A & B are opposites,
B invades A's house and trashes it and kills his family members,
A complains to society - everyone including the U.N says "we're helpless"
Then A when is frustrated by the injustice and does exactly the same (actually a lot less), even A's family are expected to condemn him????
R u serious???

Maybe empathy is something that will cause the British, french and american people to demand that their government stop it's killing and plundering.
The more silent we are the more they attack us, don't ever dream you'll appease them by condemning your brothers who strive for justice and truth.

You are absolutely right about the way injustice, justice and terrorism is presented in the media. Many would argue that what the UK and US are doing in Muslim countries falls under the definition of "terrorism" yet they call it something else. But calling it something else doesn't change the action.

In terms of innocent taking of lives I'd say 15 innocent lives are far more than 1 british soldier like in the case of the U.S. army general who intentionally shot and burned 15 non combatant afghani men, women and children and the murder of Lee Rigby. The only difference is the motive which we've already established was not justified.

We can see the injustice being committed by the very people who are labelling their victims as "terrorists". We see how they make excuses for their own people like say they did it because they suffered from mental health issues or had a bad childhood etc. when they carry out mass murders even on their own people yet when a Muslim commits a similar crime, it's always an act of terrorism. With Muslims, you never hear them make excuses like they do for their own people.

I know there's a lot of injustice going on in the world but just in case you didn't notice, Muslims as a whole are not in a position of strength right now.

Until we correct our aqeedah, intentions and actions we need to be patient and not stoop to the low levels that we see our oppressors stooping to.

This way the world will be able to clearly see who the real terrorists are and who are being oppressed :ia:

Until we get our strength back as an Ummah, forbidding the evil can be done by the tongue, the pen and the heart.

 

[Taabuu]

This is the law of physics that every action has equal opposite reaction. It is the universal principle. The unjust everyday annihilation of countless innocent Muslims in Iraq, Afghanistan, Palestine (and also dispossessing them - their home land, destroying their crop, livelihood, homes, schools and houses - strangulating them to a slow and painful death), Pakistan, and Somalia by the American, Israel and US European allies cannot go without creating avenging mentality among the suffering lot. It is natural, even the most peace loving people will tolerate such atrocities for some time but not for so long. Call it terrorism or what ever but know for sure – by discrediting such retaliatory action as – terrorism, you will not be able to stop it. The only way to do so – just by stopping the injustices that you are perpetrating against these hapless people. Let wisdom prevail. Let there be peace in the world - Muslims love that more than any body.

 

[Taabuu]

What about this US soldier who has killed more than a dozen civilians in a shooting spree in southern Afghanistan.:hmm:

A member of the Kandahar provincial council who visited the site of the shooting in Panjwai district told Al Jazeera that at least 16 civilians were killed when the soldier left his base early on Sunday morning and opened fire.
The Kandahar governor’s office put the number of killed civilians at 15.
“Eleven members of my family are dead. They are all dead,” Haji Samad, an elder from Panjwai district, told the AFP news agency.

Captain Justin Brockhoff, a spokesman for the NATO-led International Security Assistance Force (ISAF), could not confirm any fatalities in the incident.
“This is a horrific incident, and our thoughts are with the families of the affected. Our initial reports indicate multiple civilians – between four and six- are wounded. Those civilians are receiving care at coalition medical facilities,” he told Al Jazeera.
“At this point we do not have an indication – we can not speculate about the individual’s motives.”
Al Jazeera’s Bernard Smith, reporting from Herat, said the soldier entered three houses near the base and opened fire on civilians.
“We are now being told by the police sources that the US soldier left his base at three o clock this morning. It would have been pitch-black wherever he walked,” he said.
Civilian casualties have been a major source of friction between President Hamid Karzai’s government and the NATO forces in Afghanistan.”The soldier went through three separate houses, shooting at people as they slept in their beds. After the soldier shot these people, he turned himself in.”
Anti-American sentiment had already been running high before news of the latest civilian casualties.
“It is frankly disastrous. It is not just a disaster for the people who were murdered and killed in their houses, it is disaster for the country I suspect,” our correspondent said.
Afghan President Hamid Karzai condemned the shooting rampage and labeled the incident as “intentional murders” and demanded an explanation from the United States.
The victims of the shooting spree, which left up to 16 civilians dead, included nine children and three women, Karzai’s office said in a statement.
Anger gripped the nation after US soldiers burned a large number of copies of the Quran, the Muslim holy book, at a NATO base last month, which the alliance said was “inadvertent”.
At least 41 people were killed in protests that followed the burning.
Najeeb Azizi, a Kabul-based Afghan analyst, said the shooting will have deep repercussions on the already tenuous relations with the US.
“It is a very tragic incident in particular because the Afghan and US governments are trying to sign a strategic agreement for a long term,” he said.
“A very bad message the Afghan people are getting – that if US military remains in Afghanistan beyond 2014 and their attitude and behaviour remains the same – of killing innocent civilians- what will be the consequences, and how will the Afghan people respond to it.”

 

[Taabuu]

An old muslim MAN was killed by a white racist when he was walking home for no reason IN THE UK (the west), no one heard about it, one week later the opposite happens and a white man is killed, country goes up like never before and it's on the front news of every newspaper.


White man's blood is worth a million times more. Also muslims didn't start raging when one of their elderly were killed by a white racist, so why are these scum attacking all muslims because a white person was killed? You'll never see an ethnic minority blaming all white people, but you'll always see it the other way round.

 

[Independent]

An old muslim MAN was killed by a white racist when he was walking home for no reason IN THE UK (the west), no one heard about it, one week later the opposite happens and a white man is killed, country goes up like never before and it's on the front news of every newspaper.

Are you referring to Mahammad Saleem? As has already been said in this thread, it remains the case that nobody knows who killed him. The killer may be of any race, and of any religion including Islam. It did make the national news but in the absence of any other information (and without the gruesome but spectacular video) it remains an unsolved murder with no political aspect.

Also muslims didn't start raging when one of their elderly were killed by a white racist

We don't know who killed him so that would have been a remarkable reaction. And in fact, many Muslims like yourself are indeed raging about this. Many Muslims now firmly believe that it has actually been confirmed that this was a white racist.

You'll never see an ethnic minority blaming all white people, but you'll always see it the other way round.

That's not true. There are millions of people all round the world who blame 'westerners' (by which they mean white people) for all the evils in the universe.

As for racism in the UK - of course it exists. Do you think other countries are immune? Many countries have zero racism statistics by the simple expedient of never letting in any foreigners. The UK has had one of the most open door policies to immigration of any country in the world. Unlike others, which allow foreign workers but never give them citizenship, many immigrants have been permitted to naturalise completely. So who is the real racist? The country that brings people together and therefore has to deal with the stresses it causes? Or the country that bans immigrants altogether? Excuse the pun, but this is not a black and white issue.

 

[سيف الله]

Salaam

Another update. This was on 2 days ago.

Its an interview with the leader of the EDL (yeah I know) but it gives a good idea of how they think and what Muslims are up against.

 

[Born_Believer]

Islamaphobia is definitely on the march and yet many are still in denial that this phenomena even exists...hack my PC dictionary doesn't even recognise the term (agoraphobia comes up as a correction). Having said that, I do believe England and Britain as a whole is far more tolerant of Mulsims and our way of life in comparison to a number of other European countries, namely France, Germany and most of the countries in the eastern bloc.

In the handful of days after the Woolwich attack, over a 150 attacks were carried out against Muslims and our mosques, schools, homes...these were just the cases which were reported. Why are people like Tommy Robinson put on tv or radio? Why is their view allowed to be broadcast to millions on political programmes even though these people are not members of parliament.

It's not the street thugs we need to worry about but those who are smart enough to allow the thugs onto tv or newspapers, the people who give them enough leeway to carry out violence, the people who are in charge of the media and say one thing but do another. There is a network of Islamaphobes which stretches into Parliament and the very governance of this nation who are playing a very clever game.

 

[observer]

Why are people like Tommy Robinson put on tv or radio? Why is their view allowed to be broadcast to millions on political programmes even though these people are not members of parliament.

I'm glad he's put on TV. The guy's an idiot and every TV appearance shows that. He always faces hostile questioning that shows his lack of substance. The way to show this guy is wrong is to debate with him, hear his view and show it to be wrong. I think the British press has done this very well.

The VAST majority of people in the UK are anti-EDL.

 

[Born_Believer]

I'm glad he's put on TV. The guy's an idiot and every TV appearance shows that. He always faces hostile questioning that shows his lack of substance. The way to show this guy is wrong is to debate with him, hear his view and show it to be wrong. I think the British press has done this very well.

The VAST majority of people in the UK are anti-EDL.

Yes but there is still a minority who listens to him on tv/radio and actually falls into what he is saying.

But I totally agree with you (for once lol) that the vast majority of people in the UK are anti-EDL.