Evil Manifest?

[Abdul Fattah]

The Guy on number 145 Gommorah Road had been pretty pious. He had double parked his Camel a few times, sworn when he bashed his thumb with a hammer and he fancied his next door neighbours daughter, but was too shy to approach her.

Coincidently, the guy on number 145 Gommorah Road was visiting his mother in law who lived a few miles south, imagine his surprise when he came back. His younger brother, who followed him in piousness, sadly was in town though. However this early death he met saved him from the long excruciating pain he would have endured would he have lived a bit longer for his tumor to develop.

No, all jokes aside, like I said, we really can't know.

All we are told apart from Lut/Lot. And strangely his family too. A single family out of a whole city, who needed evenly smiting with death.
So out they plod and the city dies. Lots wife looks back and God kills her too. For looking back!

Not according to the Qur'an, don't forget that the bible isn't accurate on details as even admitted by most Christians.
But We saved him and his family, except his wife; her We destined to be of those who lagged behind. (27:57)
So she was destined for a cause, she didn't die just because she looked back.

And when Our Messengers came to Lut, he was grieved on their account, and felt himself powerless (to protect) them: but they said: "Fear thou not, nor grieve: we are (here) to save thee and thy following, except thy wife: she is of those who lag behind. (29:33)
The part in bold is found in other translations as "household". I don't know arabic so I can't say which translation is closests. I checked a tefsir to see if perhaps it's stated wheter it was only his family or also some people who "followed" him (he had been preaching before the town was destroyed).

 

[barney]

I don't think the order of event is correct.. fact is even the best of Muslim scholars can extrapolate but not given any definitive answer..
I found this to be one of the better pieces of the end of the world.. the others are all written by sheikh a'sh3rawi and it is 'khwatir al' Quran' but of course is in Arabic and of no use for our curious friends..

Enjoy

The Day Of Wrath
cheers

I randomly clicked on a bit of that, "What has changed", and it started going on about some sort of Zionist plan. Definatly worth it for the laugh.

 

[Nerd]

Here is how John Doe justifies his murders in the movie "seven":

Mills: You only killed a bunch of innocent people so you could get your rocks off. That’s all.

Doe: Innocent? Is that supposed to be funny? Look at the people I killed. An obese man, a disgusting man who could barely stand up… who if you saw him on the street you’d point so your friends could mock him along with you. Who if you saw him while you were eating, you wouldn’t be able to finish your meal. After him I picked the lawyer. And, you both must have been secretly thanking me for that one. This was a man who dedicated his life to making money by lying with every breath he could muster… to keeping rapists and murderers on the streets. A woman… so ugly on the inside that she couldn’t bare to go on living if she couldn’t be beautiful on the outside. A drug dealer… a drug dealing pederast, actually. And, don’t forget the disease spreading *****. Only in a world this ****ty could you even try to say these were innocent people and keep a straight face. That’s the point. You see a deadly sin on almost every street corner, and in every home, literally. And we tolerate it. Because it’s common, it seems trivial, and we tolerate, all day long, morning, noon and night. Not anymore. I’m setting the example, and it’s going to be puzzled over and studied and followed, from now on.

 

[Nerd]

Let me restate my point here: I support religion, well the original intention. As a divine guidance, probably because we humans are too **** stupid to function as proper beings alone, and eventually fall into despair because our thoughts are always somehow mingled with our inevitable mortality. (According to anthropologists, this is how primitive pagan religions surfaced - out of our collective paranoia). Needless to say, religion, like their accompanying holy scriptures, has fallen into the intended dirty hands of Man, who has crafted it to benefit his own needs over time. Dominance, through any means possible; politics, wealth and even warfare.

 

[barney]

Let me restate my point here: I support religion, well the original intention. As a divine guidance, probably because we humans are too **** stupid to function as proper beings alone, and eventually fall into despair because our thoughts are always somehow mingled with our inevitable mortality. (According to anthropologists, this is how primitive pagan religions surfaced - out of our collective paranoia). Needless to say, religion, like their accompanying holy scriptures, has fallen into the intended dirty hands of Man, who has crafted it to benefit his own needs over time. Dominance, through any means possible; politics, wealth and even warfare.

You think scripture was sent by God and changed by man??

 

[Nerd]

I watched this animation from MapsofWar.com which depicts the rise and expansion of all modern faiths. After viewing it, I realized that the ancient world remained in relative tranquility, even with a handful of different faiths. Only in the last two millennia did religious conflicts arise, which I imagine must have lead to a lot of human suffering. Human Suffering. Just two words to most of us. Its hard to grasp a full understanding of this concept unless you are starving for three days because of some religious war or just had both your parents beheaded right in front of you by a heartless crusader. If you do understand it, you would share my contempt too. All in the name of God, right?

 

[barney]

Yeah, seen a bit of that.

The idea that humans could unite under one religion is a bit pipedreamy IMO.
If the world was fought down to everyone following the Church of Latter Day Saints, then the various splinter groups of that would be at each others throats till the last two humans on earth fought it out over interpreting a few lines on a 160 year old book.

 

[- Qatada -]

Allah only destroys a people who have been warned by a Messenger, these people continue to persist in evil sins - whatever they may be - and the Messenger warns and give glad tidings for the good-doers, if these people remain ungrateful to Allah and persist in their sins - they want to get rid of the source who is forbidding them from this evil, even if the believer is giving them good advice. So they attempt to imprison the believer who enjoins good and forbids wrong, or they attempt to torture and kill them so that they can continue in the evil that they are doing.


What these people have been given is a favour from Allah, something which they are accountable for and will be questioned about on the Day of Ressurection. If they are ungrateful to Allah - He can remove this from them whenever He wills, however - He is the Most Just - so He is patient, and informs the believers to be patient.

When the evildoers are excessive in their disbelief, and in the peak of their evil acts - then Allah removes them from the face of the earth and gives what is good to the believers for striving in His cause. This is because He is the Most Just, He is Grateful and He is the Powerful.



Is it fair for a people to reject the favours of Allah, and torture the believers while killing others? Yet Allah still allows them to escape from His Punishment? He is the Just, and He has promised to give the believers inheritance and power in the earth as He gave it to those before them, they will establish His law and enjoin good for mankind so that they can prosper and be successful.

 

[Abdul Fattah]

Here is how John Doe justifies his murders in the movie "seven": ...

Their is a big difference between god passing judgment and a human passing judgment to his peers:
* We don't have the right (permission)
* We don't have the responsibility (it is not our job, nor is it expected from us)
* We don't have the power (to enforce judgment of a person in a correct manner, a judgment without enforcing is meaningless)
* We don't have the ability (to judge a person by pure standards, to weigh of the total of good and bad acts a person has done)
* We don't have the insight (we can't be certain about what the intention, background of a person was)

Let me restate my point here: I support religion, well the original intention. As a divine guidance, probably because we humans are too **** stupid to function as proper beings alone, and eventually fall into despair because our thoughts are always somehow mingled with our inevitable mortality. (According to anthropologists, this is how primitive pagan religions surfaced - out of our collective paranoia). Needless to say, religion, like their accompanying holy scriptures, has fallen into the intended dirty hands of Man, who has crafted it to benefit his own needs over time. Dominance, through any means possible; politics, wealth and even warfare.

Are you making a point or simply explaining your views? Because for the latter, I have no objections to you having your views, but for the former I would have to reply that your "point" is flawed by circularity since it is based on the assumption that religion is man-made. Obviously such an argument based on such an assumption is flawed and cannot be used against religious view.

After viewing it, I realized that the ancient world remained in relative tranquility, even with a handful of different faiths. Only in the last two millennia did religious conflicts arise, which I imagine must have lead to a lot of human suffering. Human Suffering. Just two words to most of us. Its hard to grasp a full understanding of this concept unless you are starving for three days because of some religious war or just had both your parents beheaded right in front of you by a heartless crusader. If you do understand it, you would share my contempt too. All in the name of God, right?

Some important things to consider, the rise in population might also be a decisive factor, the larger a population, the more confrontation, and thus the more frustration/aggression and so on. I imagine many more factors can be brought up to explain the phenomena.
More importantly, you cannot judge a theory by it's followers. Just like you cannot judge evolution by Hitlers social Darwinism or you cannot judge love by the actions of a stalker.

 

[barney]

. Obviously such an argument based on such an assumption is flawed and cannot be used against religious view.

.

Well it can, but you just dont happen to beleive it!

 

[Keltoi]

Is this another thread about the "problem of evil" or is this about the end times? I suppose they are connected.

The truth is that Biblical scripture is cryptic on the matter. Many of the verses in the NT that are accepted as relating to the end of days were actually written as code in reference to the Roman Empire, not the world. I can explain that in more detail if necessary but I'll need more cups of coffee and some time.

 

[جوري]

I randomly clicked on a bit of that, "What has changed", and it started going on about some sort of Zionist plan. Definatly worth it for the laugh.

Actually it is a re-interpretation of the book of daniel.. but whatever gets your humerous going, let me not stand in its way..

cheers

 

[Nerd]

Their is a big difference between god passing judgment and a human passing judgment to his peers:

Exactly my point, God is:

1. Allah: Allah, He who has the Godhood which is the power to create the entities.

2. Ar-Rahmaan: The Compassionate, The Beneficient, The One who has plenty of mercy for the believers and the blasphemers in this world and especially for the believers in the hereafter.

3. Ar-Raheem: The Merciful, The One who has plenty of mercy for the believers.

4. Al-Malik: The King, The Sovereign Lord, The One with the complete Dominion, the One Whose Dominion is clear from imperfection.

5. Al-Quddoos: The Holy, The One who is pure from any imperfection and clear from children and adversaries.

6. As-Salaam: The Source of Peace, The One who is free from every imperfection.

7. Al-Mu'min: Guardian of Faith, The One who witnessed for Himself that no one is God but Him. And He witnessed for His believers that they are truthful in their belief that no one is God but Him.

8. Al-Muhaimin: The Protector, The One who witnesses the saying and deeds of His creatures.

9. Al-Azeez: The Mighty, The Strong, The Defeater who is not defeated.

10. Al-Jabbaar: The Compeller, The One that nothing happens in His Dominion except that which He willed.

11. Al-Mutakabbir: The Majestic, The One who is clear from the attributes of the creatures and from resembling them.

12. Al-Khaaliq: The Creator, The One who brings everything from non-existence to existence.

13. Al-Bari': The Evolver, The Maker, The Creator who has the Power to turn the entities.

14. Al-Musawwir: The Fashioner, The One who forms His creatures in different pictures.

15. Al-Ghaffaar: The Great Forgiver, The Forgiver, The One who forgives the sins of His slaves time and time again.

16. Al-Qahhaar: The Subduer, The Dominant, The One who has the perfect Power and is not unable over anything.

17. Al-Wahhaab: The Bestower, The One who is Generous in giving plenty without any return. He is everything that benefits whether Halal or Haram.

18. Al-Razzaaq: The Sustainer, The Provider.

19. Al-Fattaah: The Opener, The Reliever, The Judge, The One who opens for His slaves the closed worldy and religious matters.

20. Al-Aleem: The All-knowing, The Knowledgeable; The One nothing is absent from His knowledge.

21. Al-Qaabid: The Constricter, The Retainer, The Withholder, The One who constricts the sustenance by His wisdomand expands and widens it with His Generosity and Mercy.

22. Al-Baasit: The Expander, The Englarger, The One who constricts the sustenance by His wisdomand expands and widens it with His Generosity and Mercy.

23. Al-Khaafid: The Abaser, The One who lowers whoever He willed by His Destruction and raises whoever He willed by His Endowment.

24. Ar-Raafi: The Exalter, The Elevator, The One who lowers whoever He willed by His Destruction and raises whoever He willed by His Endowment.

25. Al-Muiz: The Honorer, He gives esteem to whoever He willed, hence there is no one to degrade Him; And He degrades whoever He willed, hence there is no one to give Him esteem.

26. Al-Muthil: The Dishonorer, The Humiliator, He gives esteem to whoever He willed, hence there is no one to degrade Him; And He degrades whoever He willed, hence there is no one to give Him esteem.

27. As-Samee: The All-Hearing, The Hearer, The One who Hears all things that are heard by His Eternal Hearing without an ear, instrument or organ.

28. Al-Baseer: The All-Seeing, The One who Sees all things that are seen by His Eternal Seeing without a pupil or any other instrument.

29. Al-Hakam: The Judge, He is the Ruler and His judgment is His Word.

30. Al-Adl: The Just, The One who is entitled to do what He does.

32. Al-Lateef: The Subtle One, The Gracious, The One who is kind to His slaves and endows upon them.

33. Al-Khabeer: The Aware, The One who knows the truth of things.

34. Al-Haleem: The Forebearing, The Clement, The One who delays the punishment for those who deserve it and then He might forgive them.

35. Al-Azeem: The Great One, The Mighty, The One deserving the attributes of Exaltment, Glory, Extolement,and Purity from all imperfection.

36. Al-Ghafoor: The All-Forgiving, The Forgiving, The One who forgives a lot.

37. Ash-Shakoor: The Grateful, The Appreciative, The One who gives a lot of reward for a little obedience.

38. Al-Aliyy: The Most High, The Sublime, The One who is clear from the attributes of the creatures.

39. Al-Kabeer: The Most Great, The Great, The One who is greater than everything in status.

40. Al-Hafeez: The Preserver, The Protector, The One who protects whatever and whoever He willed to protect.

41. Al-Muqeet: The Maintainer, The Guardian, The Feeder, The Sustainer, The One who has the Power.

42. Al-Haseeb: The Reckoner, The One who gives the satisfaction.

43. Aj-Jaleel: The Sublime One, The Beneficent, The One who is attributed with greatness of Power and Glory of status.

44. Al-Kareem: The Generous One, The Bountiful, The Gracious, The One who is attributed with greatness of Power and Glory of status.

45. Ar-Raqeeb: The Watcher, The Watchful, The One that nothing is absent from Him. Hence it's meaning is related to the attribute of Knowledge.

46. Al-Mujeeb: The Responsive, The Hearkener, The One who answers the one in need if he asks Him and rescues the yearner if he calls upon Him.

47. Al-Wasi: The Vast, The All-Embracing, The Knowledgeable.

48. Al-Hakeem: The Wise, The Judge of Judges, The One who is correct in His doings.

49. Al-Wadood:The Loving, The One who loves His believing slaves and His believing slaves love Him. His love to His slaves is His Will to be merciful to them and praise them:Hence it's meaning is related to the attributes of the Will and Kalam (His attribute with which He orders and forbids and spoke to Muhammad and Musa -peace be upon them- . It is not a sound nor a language nor a letter.).

50. Al-Majeed: The Most Glorious One, The Glorious, The One who is with perfect Power, High Status, Compassion, Generosity and Kindness.

51. Al-Baith: The Reserrector, The Raiser (from death), The One who resurrects His slaves after death for reward and/or punishment.

52. Ash-Shaheed: The Witness, The One who nothing is absent from Him.

53. Al-Haqq: The Truth, The True, The One who truly exists.

54. Al-Wakeel: The Trustee, The One who gives the satisfaction and is relied upon.

55. Al-Qawiyy: The Most Strong, The Strong, The One with the complete Power.

56. Al-Mateen: The Firm One, The One with extreme Power which is un-interrupted and He does not get tired.

57. Al-Waliyy: The Protecting Friend, The Supporter.

60. Al-Hameed: The Praiseworthy, The praised One who deserves to be praised.

61. Al-Muhsee: The Counter, The Reckoner, The One who the count of things are known to him.

62. Al-Mubdi': The Originator, The One who started the human being. That is, He created him.

63. Al-Mueed: The Reproducer, The One who brings back the creatures after death.

64. Al-Muhyi: The Restorer, The Giver of Life, The One who took out a living human from semen that does not have a soul. He gives life by giving the souls back to the worn out bodies on the resurrection day and He makes the hearts alive by the light of knowledge.

65. Al-Mumeet: The Creator of Death, The Destroyer, The One who renders the living dead.

66. Al-Hayy: The Alive, The One attributed with a life that is unlike our life and is not that of a combination of soul, flesh or blood.

67. Al-Qayyoom: The Self-Subsisting, The One who remains and does not end.

68. Al-Waajid: The Perceiver, The Finder, The Rich who is never poor. Al-Wajd is Richness.

69. Al-Waahid: The Unique, The One, The One without a partner.

70. Al-Ahad: The One.

71. As-Samad: The Eternal, The Independent, The Master who is relied upon in matters and reverted to in ones needs.

72. Al-Qaadir: The Able, The Capable, The One attributed with Power.

73. Al-Muqtadir: The Powerful, The Dominant, The One with the perfect Power that nothing is withheld from Him.

74. Al-Muqaddim: The Expediter, The Promoter, The One who puts things in their right places. He makes ahead what He wills and delays what He wills.

75. Al-Mu'akh-khir: The Delayer, the Retarder, The One who puts things in their right places. He makes ahead what He wills and delays what He wills.

76. Al-'Awwal: The First, The One whose Existence is without a beginning.

77. Al-'Akhir: The Last, The One whose Existence is without an end.

78. Az-Zaahir: The Manifest, The One that nothing is above Him and nothing is underneath Him, hence He exists without a place. He, The Exalted, His Existence is obvious by proofs and He is clear from the delusions of attributes of bodies.

79. Al-Baatin: The Hidden, The One that nothing is above Him and nothing is underneath Him, hence He exists without a place. He, The Exalted, His Existence is obvious by proofs and He is clear from the delusions of attributes of bodies.

80. Al-Walee: The Governor, The One who owns things and manages them.

81. Al-Mutaali: The Most Exalted, The High Exalted, The One who is clear from the attributes of the creation.

82. Al-Barr: The Source of All Goodness, The Righteous, The One who is kind to His creatures, who covered them with His sustenance and specified whoever He willed among them by His support, protection, and special mercy.

83. At-Tawwaab: The Acceptor of Repentance, The Relenting, The One who grants repentance to whoever He willed among His creatures and accepts his repentance.

84. Al-Muntaqim: The Avenger, The One who victoriously prevails over His enemies and punishes them for their sins. It may mean the One who destroys them.

85. Al-Afuww: The Pardoner, The Forgiver, The One with wide forgiveness.

86. Ar-Ra'uf: The Compassionate, The One with extreme Mercy. The Mercy of Allah is His will to endow upon whoever He willed among His creatures.

87. Malik Al-Mulk: The Eternal Owner of Sovereignty, The One who controls the Dominion and gives dominion to whoever He willed.

88. Thul-Jalali wal-Ikram: The Lord of Majesty and Bounty, The One who deserves to be Exalted and not denied.

89. Al-Muqsit: The Equitable, The One who is Just in His judgment.

90. Aj-Jaami:The Gatherer, The One who gathers the creatures on a day that there is no doubt about, that is the Day of Judgment.

91. Al-Ghaniyy: The Self-Sufficient, The One who does not need the creation.

92. Al-Mughni: The Enricher, The One who satisfies the necessities of the creatures.

93. Al-Maani: The Preventer, The Withholder.

94. Ad-Daarr:The Distresser, The One who makes harm reach to whoever He willed and benefit to whoever He willed.

95. An-Nafi: The Propitious, The One who makes harm reach to whoever He willed and benefit to whoever He willed.

96. An-Noor: The Light, The One who guides.

97. Al-Haadi: The Guide, The One whom with His Guidance His belivers were guided, and with His Guidance the living beings have been guided to what is beneficial for them and protected from what is harmful to them.

98. Al-Badi: The Incomparable, The One who created the creation and formed it without any preceding example.

99. Al-Baaqi: The Everlasting, The One that the state of non-existence is impossible for Him.

100. Al-Waarith: The Supreme Inheritor, The Heir, The One whose Existence remains.

101. Ar-Rasheed: The Guide to the Right Path, The One who guides.

102: As-Saboor: The Patient, The One who does not quickly punish the sinners.

 

[MSalman]

@nerd

did you omit the part in which Dr. Bilal may mentioned the reason why Imam Mahdi (May Allah be pleased with him) would wage the war on non-Muslims--more correctly the oppressors and fitna spreaders? Or have you never heard of it?

 

[Nerd]

@nerd

did you omit the part in which Dr. Bilal may mentioned the reason why Imam Mahdi (May Allah be pleased with him) would wage the war on non-Muslims--more correctly the oppressors and fitna spreaders? Or have you never heard of it?

I missed that bit, would you care to enlighten us on this matter Brother

 

[MSalman]

^In future, a time will come when Christians will rule most of the world and they would reach Khabr, then some from the family Abou Sufiyan (May Allah be pleased with him) will emerge and kill the king and take over the Arab. Meanwhile, in Europe, Christians will be divided in two groups and one of the group will become ally of the Muslim king in Arab. Then both of these groups will fight against the other Christian group and they will win. During the end of the battle a Christian soldier will say that we won due to the blessings of the cross (Christianity) but a Muslim soldier will say that we won due to the help and blessing of Allah. So they will start fighting and call for help. The war will erupt and Muslim king will be martyred during the battle. The Christian will take over the Muslim lands and will reach Khabr (near Medina) and both Christian parties will become ally again (1).

Then Muslims will start looking for Imam Mahdi (May Allah be pleased with him). Meanwhile, Imam Mahdi will appear and will try to avoid from people recognizing him (2). Eventually, one person will recognize him in Kahana Kaba. Finally, many Muslims will join him and he will build the army to fight against the Christians to get back Muslim lands.

wallahu a'alim (and Allah knows best)

Foot Notes
(1) this story has been reported in Sunan Abu-Dawud
(2) this has been also reported in Sunan Abu-Dawud and classified as sahih

 

[Eeman]

This is the contrast in which you find life. I have seldom come across things very defined in black and white...I never could quite understand how people who are 'putatively intelligent', can have such a puerile ilogical approach and revel in self-indulgent fantasies-- circumstantial and haphazardly collected 'evidence' to draw such asinine conclusions.
& without abashment or apology introduce the products of the dark mind for the rest of the world.. I gather most of the time it goes un-answered cast off as the rambling of a delusional angry man, now approaching death and in need of justification of a laundry list of immoralities...

It must be consoling.. but pointless nonetheless.

Want to discuss the signs of the end go ahead... want to get into each individual life of who deserves what ( I am sure that will be long and amusing) want to present a piece in which a conclusion is already drawn for us, then I recommend the poetry section.. I too vent there on occasion.... But in the refutation section we don't start pieces in an ended fashion as to have only fixed limits and restrictions on conclusions drawn by a man who is self-professed to hate God!

cheers

Dear sister,

I really think that you need a chill pill, just cos people do not believe in your believes or differ in opinion to yourself there is no need to attack them like that and call them the above things that you have said.
I really think that your should re think yur debating techniques and the way you word your arguments.
You sound like a miserable bitter person, (NO OFFENCE) and i mean this from the bottom of my heart but honestly you talk sense sometimes, but your too harsh, maybe you need a break, time to reflect, and seriously reflect upon your mannerism in the way you put things.
I yet apologise for saying anything to you that might be hurtful but as a fellow muslim sister i am just pointing out to you something that i see and no ones perfect, if that is something you lack i think its better for someone to point it ut to you so you know rather than no one uttering a word and you thinking everything is holy and jolly good!

ma salama.

 

[Azy]

I love how atheists try to absolve themselves from the manner of which they choose to live life, by traducing against God or religion... When more death and famine was created under atheists and their regime than that of all the religions combined (Mao Xedong, Saloth Sar, Enver Hoxha Josef Stalin Sung 1I anyone?)

Interestingly Marx himself called atheism meaningless and unnecessary, so why would you ascribe the actions of these Marxist leaders to atheism?

There is the notable exception of Hitler who was most definitely a theist. Armenian genocide, Muslim invasion of India, Bangladesh 1971, Crusades?

 

[------]

Hitler was a mass murderer that will be tortured in Hell forever.

 

[Nerd]

^ How can a mere human being decide/know the fate of another human being in the hereafter before it has happened?

^^^^Thats very interesting, thank you for sharing that bit islamiclife