French mother confesses to killing eight babies

[Danah]

his wife maintained he was unaware not only of the killings but also of the pregnancies. "Mrs Cottrez told investigators he had known neither that his wife was pregnant nor that she had got rid of them directly afterwards,"

Seriously? are you kidding me??
if it was one pregnancy that can be possible but 8?? there is something fishy in this case. I suspect that he didn't know about anything

Such people need the license that Boaz was talking about in another thread!

 

[Karl]

So the father will not be prosecuted?

Yes, that is correct.

 

[Karl]

In that case the father will get executed. Period.

Rubbish, he is the progenitor! He is the direct and closest blood relative that is possible! You are ignorant to the fact that seeing the parents are the direct relatives then worldly prosecution would be legally rendered null and void. You don't know about blood money obviously?? If the father kills his offspring, he can offer the closest relative (in this case himself) blood money. If he accepts it from himself the blood money is therefore technically accepted and worldy charges therefore waived.

 

[Karl]

Such people need the license that Boaz was talking about in another thread!

Such busybody leftist concepts as "parent licences" are about as ANTI Islamic as is possible, they are the Satanic thinking of maniacal totalitarian state worshippers and Marxists. Anyone who calls themselves "Muslim" and actually support such a despicable thing as "parent licences" should be completely ashamed of themselves.

 

[Darth Ultor]

Yes, that is correct.

I seriously doubt Sharia sanctions this.

 

[Salahudeen]

I seriously doubt Sharia sanctions this.

I will ask a sheikh and find out the answer for you.

 

[Darth Ultor]

Thank you, Squiggle.

 

[Abu Zainab]

I will ask a sheikh and find out the answer for you.

That would be great squiggee. I never heard of a guy paying blood money to himself and tell the judge (sheikh) "Your Honor I forgive myself. I know its really bad to kill my kids but what can I say I just couldn't resist...and by the way I accept the blood money paid to me by the killer - which in this case is me".

 

[Lynx]

If the father kills his offspring, he can offer the closest relative (in this case himself) blood money. If he accepts it from himself the blood money is therefore technically accepted and worldy charges therefore waived.

Lol. Excellent so Abortion is no longer a big deal in Islam since the parents can just pay themselves the blood money & honour killings are perfectly justified. Who said Islam was the common-sense religion? I think your fear of socialism is making you think a little bit irrationally...oddly enough since you don't quite get what socialism is..if you did then you'd pointing out the problems of Zakah which is inherently socialism and moreso than anything discussed in this thread since money is obviously private property but humans are arguably not.

 

[titus]

I find it interesting that Karl believes the mother has no say in this. The father holds complete authority.

 

[Rhubarb Tart]

In your ideal world Karl, a man pretty much gets away with everything. I did not say I dislike that particular comment: I dislike your comments in general. And so far what you have said proves it.
If an abusive, paedophilic and idiotic father, brother or even the uncle wants to get away with their hideous crimes they would be in a country headed by people like you. Thank god, you don’t run a country.

Peace

 

[cat eyes]

Under Shariah law the husband fully decides what to do about it. He could kill her or forgive her or banish her to a madhouse or whatever. But under French liberal socialist oppression the father has no say or power. He is just a slave of the state.

lol what are u talking about? who the hell gives a **** about whether the husband forgives her or not?? she killed 8 humans. she should be more worried about whether god will forgive her or not.

when you kill a life its like you have killed the whole of humanity. according to shariah, she would be sentenced to death so who on earth is going to care whether the husband forgives her not.

Hes probably more mentally sick then her. and what sane man is going to forgive his wife for doing such a thing.

 

[Danah]

Such busybody leftist concepts as "parent licences" are about as ANTI Islamic as is possible, they are the Satanic thinking of maniacal totalitarian state worshippers and Marxists. Anyone who calls themselves "Muslim" and actually support such a despicable thing as "parent licences" should be completely ashamed of themselves.

hey hey hey easy on me man! I can see you flaming!:hmm: Don't jump into conclusions like that!!
I didn't mean taking a license literally....but getting a very intensive education before being parent. It seems that you don't hear a lot about parents who abuse their kids. Maybe I was exaggerating a bit when I said in the other thread that I am supporting the decision because I experienced a very bad example of parent abusing their kids few days ago.

Yeah I am supporting it partially but not to an extend where you can have kids if you have a valid license, that will be very stupid if it happened. I am supporting the idea of getting potential parents into courses where they got a proper education about kids.

I don't think that a person who kill 8 of her kids is a sane one!

 

[Salahudeen]

I asked and he said "This issue has a difference of opinion among the scholars but the majority of scholars say that the father is not killed for killing his son, but that does not mean he is not subject to prosecution and could be punished in a way specified by the judge, but he cannot be executed for it according to majority.

If someone kills a person, he will not be executed also if only one of the close relatives of the deseased forgives the killer"

 

[Karl]

In your ideal world Karl, a man pretty much gets away with everything. I did not say I dislike that particular comment: I dislike your comments in general. And so far what you have said proves it.
If an abusive, paedophilic and idiotic father, brother or even the uncle wants to get away with their hideous crimes they would be in a country headed by people like you. Thank god, you don’t run a country.

Peace

Sorry but I can't help it if I am conservative. I noticed that you often go out of your way to add "paedophilic" along with "abusive" and "idiotic" (as if they were all the same and one). lol. Well I don't prefer to employ newly founded atheist expressions as "paedophilia", because there is simply nothing against so-called "paedophilia" in Islam. Every time you employ it you are only fuelling the infidels' attacks against the prophet (PBUH). In the past the infidels used to label him "the mad poet", now it's inane pc expressions like "paedophile" instead. It's utterly pathetic.

 

[Salahudeen]

Sorry but I can't help it if I am conservative. I noticed that you often go out of your way to add "paedophilic" along with "abusive" and "idiotic" (as if they were all the same and one). lol. Well I don't prefer to employ newly founded atheist expressions as "paedophilia", because there is simply nothing against so-called "paedophilia" in Islam. Every time you employ it you are only fuelling the infidels' attacks against the prophet (PBUH). In the past the infidels used to label him "the mad poet", now it's inane pc expressions like "paedophile" instead. It's utterly pathetic.

There is such a thing against paedophilia in Islam, if the marriage is consummated before the girl reaches the age of maturity the man will be punished for child abuse. As the girl is not ready for such relations physically.

 

[Karl]

according to shariah, she would be sentenced to death so who on earth is going to care whether the husband forgives her not..

You are another who is clearly unaware about blood money. If a person kills someone they can offer something called "blood money" to the direct kin. If they accept the blood money the killer is then technically off the hook, at least in the worldly dimension. So in this particular case, if the mother killed her babies and she offers blood money to her husband and he accepts, then he or anyone else can NOT kill her. Of course she cannot still escape whatever fate Allah (swt) has decided for her in the afterlife.

 

[Karl]

There is such a thing against paedophilia in Islam, if the marriage is consummated before the girl reaches the age of maturity the man will be punished for child abuse. As the girl is not ready for such relations physically.

ABSOLUTE RUBBISH. It is only recommended (not threatened by worldy punishment) under Islam that a girl should reach menses before marriage is consummated. And furthermore, the atheists so-called "paedophilia" definition does NOT just denote full sexual intercourse, it also by extension means sensuous love making as well. But the recommendation under Islam for a girl to wait until menses is only to do with full sexual intercourse. Sensual and erotic love making is perfectly ok irregardless of her physical maturity. Anyway let's not get off the thread...

 

[Salahudeen]

ABSOLUTE RUBBISH. It is only recommended (not threatened by worldy punishment) under Islam that a girl should reach menses before marriage is consummated. And furthermore, the atheists so-called "paedophilia" definition does NOT just denote full sexual intercourse, it also by extension means sensuous love making as well. But the recommendation under Islam for a girl to wait until menses is only to do with full sexual intercourse. Sensual and erotic love making is perfectly ok irregardless of her physical maturity. Anyway let's not get off the thread...

I never knew this, where is the evidence? which madhab holds this opinion? hanafi? maliki? hanbali? shafi? So you would allow consummation with a baby? tell me friend which scholar has this opinion and what is the evidence for it? so I may research, Who else holds this opinion amongst the 'ulema? because I've never heard of it.

So I would like to know where are you taking this information from? And what is your evidence for saying Islam allows the consummation with a girl who has not reached her period? Bring your evidence and enlighten us.

What you are in fact saying is you can consummate the marriage with a baby who has not reached her period and do other erotic stuff that may be harmful to her body. So bring your evidence inshaAllah. And your evidence should be from the Qur'an and sunnah. This would be better for you if you backed up what you said with evidence from the Qur'an and sunnah instead of claiming what other people say is absolute rubbish when you yourself have provided no evidence that what you said is allowed.

 

[Lynx]

I asked and he said "This issue has a difference of opinion among the scholars but the majority of scholars say that the father is not killed for killing his son, but that does not mean he is not subject to prosecution and could be punished in a way specified by the judge, but he cannot be executed for it according to majority.

If someone kills a person, he will not be executed also if only one of the close relatives of the deseased forgives the killer"

So I posted a possibility earlier in the thread and since you've asked a scholar maybe you can also ask about abortion and honour killings. If a man and a wife decide to abort their fetus could they not just pay themselves blood money or forgive themselves? Thus far it appears to be a rule that isn't properly clarified and I am tempted to say +1 for secular law and another reason why Shariah law should not be implemented, ever...but I don't want to jump the gun! It just appears this ruling is inconsistent with the general meaning of verses like 'don't kill your newborns' ;\.