Greatest Objections to Christianity?

[Ümit]

Greetings and peace be with you Predator;



Suppose you have a Muslim surgeon; a Christian surgeon and a Hindu anaesthetist working together to save the life of an atheist patient; they will have to put all their differences aside to save the patient's life. You cant have them arguing about each of their individual truths, whilst they have blades in their hands and trying to save a life.

Millions of people have lived and died as Muslims, Christians, Hindus, we are not going to change that. I think there are times when we search for a deeper meaning of how we strive to live in peace with our 'Truth'.

Blessings,
Eric

You are absolutely right. You cant have them arguing when there are lives dependent on them. I totally agree with you on that.
However that is not what our brothers are trying to tell you in this thread.
What they mean is that your own afterlife is in great danger right now. and you will not save that with inter religious cooperation...neither with saving lives...not as long as you reject Islaam.

Most people are misinformed about Islaam. So, when they reject Islaam, at least they may have some excuse because they just didn't knew any better.
You however, know a lot about Islaam...you are very well informed and you posess a lot of knowledge...so for you it is extra dangerous.
your brothers here are just concerned about you.

@ others on this thread:
Eric is a wise man. He himself already said that Allah just did not decided yet to enlighten him with Islaam. Lets just make dua for him that one day he will be among the enlightend ones...
trying to convince him to convert has no use. He probably has his reasons for it...of course it is not that easy...but lets just not keep going about it.

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you Umit my friend;

I was just about to edit my last post, but you beat me to it, I wanted to add -

Millions of people have lived and died as Muslims, Christians, Hindus, we are not going to change that. I think there are times when we search for a deeper meaning of how we strive to live in peace with our 'Truth'. Eternal salvation is at the heart of what we are all striving for.

trying to convince him to convert has no use

I could try very hard to convert you to Christianity, and ten years later I will be forced to say, it is no use trying to convert you; but I still value your friendship.

Allah cares for all his creation, he is just, compassionate, merciful and forgiving. He knows what he has placed in your heart and mine. If either of us have salvation, it will not be because we deserve it or we have earned it, rather it will be because of the mercy, compassion and forgiveness of Allah. My prayers are for salvation for all people.

May Allah bless you and all those you love and care for,

Eric

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you all;

Suppose you have a Muslim surgeon; a Christian surgeon and a Hindu anaesthetist working together to save the life of an atheist patient; they will have to put all their differences aside to save the patient's life. You cant have them arguing about each of their individual truths, whilst they have blades in their hands and trying to save a life.

I think this fictional story brings up some challenging questions about truth. Should the Christian and Muslim surgeons let the atheist patient die, after all he is probably going to hell.

Or would the Christian think, if I save his life, he will be grateful and turn to Christianity, would the Muslim surgeon think he could convert the patient to Islam for the same reasons.

And after the atheist's life has been saved would he say, thanks guys, isn't science and medicine wonderful.

How would you define the priorities of life, death, truth and justice in this story? Is there any benefit in working together to try and make this world a better place for everyone?

In the spirit of searching for justice and peace for all people,

Eric

 

[Ümit]

Greetings and peace be with you all;



I think this fictional story brings up some challenging questions about truth. Should the Christian and Muslim surgeons let the atheist patient die, after all he is probably going to hell.

Or would the Christian think, if I save his life, he will be grateful and turn to Christianity, would the Muslim surgeon think he could convert the patient to Islam for the same reasons.

And after the atheist's life has been saved would he say, thanks guys, isn't science and medicine wonderful.

How would you define the priorities of life, death, truth and justice in this story? Is there any benefit in working together to try and make this world a better place for everyone?

In the spirit of searching for justice and peace for all people,

Eric

No, letting someone die when you have the power to save him is wrong...even if you know this person is an atheist and he wont convert. you are not the judge of this person. Only Allah can decide who dies wenn and how. So in this case the muslim and christian surgeons must work together to save the atheists life.

Please elaborate what you mean with the second half of your post:
"How would you define the priorities of life, death, truth and justice in this story? Is there any benefit in working together to try and make this world a better place for everyone?"

What exactly are you asking here?

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you Umit;

Only Allah can decide who dies wenn and how. So in this case the muslim and christian surgeons must work together to save the atheists life.

Thanks for your reply, and you have answered in the same way I would answer.

Please elaborate what you mean with the second half of your post:
"How would you define the priorities of life, death, truth and justice in this story? Is there any benefit in working together to try and make this world a better place for everyone?"

What exactly are you asking here?

I think you have answered that yourself already. You said it is better to put your differences aside to help save lives. The two surgeons are in their job because they want to save lives and also because the hospital is paying them to do the job.

Supposing these same Muslim and Christian surgeons, did voluntary work together in a homeless shelter. They are not saving lives, they are not paid to do it, but hopefully they are helping make vulnerable people's lives better. Can it be possible to put our differences aside to make our community a kinder and more caring place to live in? Or would it be better that the Christian worked in a Christian shelter and the Muslim worked in a Muslim shelter?

This is how I come to believe in interfaith cooperation, there are many projects in our towns that are too big for any single group to do, sometimes they can work far better when we cooperate with others to make for a kinder and more caring society.

Blessings
Eric

 

['Abdullah]

Greetings and peace be with you Umit;

Thanks for your reply, and you have answered in the same way I would answer.

I think you have answered that yourself already. You said it is better to put your differences aside to help save lives. The two surgeons are in their job because they want to save lives and also because the hospital is paying them to do the job.

Supposing these same Muslim and Christian surgeons, did voluntary work together in a homeless shelter. They are not saving lives, they are not paid to do it, but hopefully they are helping make vulnerable people's lives better. Can it be possible to put our differences aside to make our community a kinder and more caring place to live in? Or would it be better that the Christian worked in a Christian shelter and the Muslim worked in a Muslim shelter?

This is how I come to believe in interfaith cooperation, there are many projects in our towns that are too big for any single group to do, sometimes they can work far better when we cooperate with others to make for a kinder and more caring society.

Blessings
Eric

From Islamic point of view, good deeds are only good with correct intentions.

What is the intention of every disbeliever when they do "supposed" good deeds? Is it to please the true creator who is absolute one and have no partners? If it is to please anyone else like Jesus PBUH then on the day of Judgement these good deeds will carry no weight.

There are several verses in Quran on this topic, for example:

Say, [O Muhammad], “Shall we [believers] inform you of the greatest losers as to [their] deeds? [They are] those whose effort is lost in worldly life, while they think that they are doing well in work.” Those are the ones who disbelieve in the verses of their Lord and in [their] meeting Him, so their deeds have become worthless; and We will not assign to them on the Day of Resurrection any importance. [Quran 18:103-105]

These verses are very clear in explaining the fate of those who used to think in the life of this world that they are doing very well. They are very hard workers, as far as worship; going to the places of worship on a regular basis. But, they are worshipping other than Allah. Either they are worshipping human beings, animals, idols, pictures or images. It does not matter. As long as they do not worship Allah (Glory be to Him) alone, Allah, the Almighty says:

​

I am so self-sufficient that I am in no need of having an associate. Thus he who does an action for someone else’s sake as well as Mine will have that action renounced by Me to him whom he associated with Me.[Sahih Muslim]​

​

So, setting partners to Allah in worship will make the person not eligible for Allah’s Mercy whatsoever.

In Surah Al-Nisa’, Allah (Glory be to Him) repeated this twice in two different verses, in verse number 48 and another verse afterward, it says:​

Indeed, Allah does not forgive association with Him, but He forgives what is less than that for whom He wills. [Quran 4:48]​

Prophet Muhammad PBUH has further clarified this in a famous hadith quoted below:

Anas ibn Malik (may Allah be pleased with him) reported that the Prophet (may Allah's peace and blessings be upon him) said:

When a disbeliever does a good deed, he is rewarded for it in this world. As to the believer, Allah, the Almighty, saves his good deeds to reward him in the Hereafter and provides him with sustenance in this life as a reward for his obedience." Another narration reads: "Allah does not deal unjustly with a believer regarding a single good deed. He is given blessings for it in this world and will be rewarded for it in the Hereafter. As to the disbeliever, he is given sustenance as a reward for his good deeds in this world, so when he comes to the Hereafter, there are no more good deeds for him for which he can be rewarded. [Sahih Muslim]

 

[Ümit]

Supposing these same Muslim and Christian surgeons, did voluntary work together in a homeless shelter. They are not saving lives, they are not paid to do it, but hopefully they are helping make vulnerable people's lives better. Can it be possible to put our differences aside to make our community a kinder and more caring place to live in? Or would it be better that the Christian worked in a Christian shelter and the Muslim worked in a Muslim shelter?

This is how I come to believe in interfaith cooperation, there are many projects in our towns that are too big for any single group to do, sometimes they can work far better when we cooperate with others to make for a kinder and more caring society.

Blessings
Eric

Dear Eric, I do not know why you are asking this. I am starting to think that you think we muslims are some kind of barbarians or something...that we have a totally different set of morals and values....we don't...
We also love humanitarian work, give to charity, reach out to the ones in need etc...regardless muslim or non-muslim.

I also said in my latest post that we are not the judges of anyone...so it is not to us to decide who is a muslim and deserves our help and who not. We do not know what plans Allah has for these people...the people you look down on today as a helpless non muslim...can reach out his helping hand to you tomorrow...you never know.

A man goes to a doctor: doctor, "I am in such pain...". First thing the doctor asks: " you a muslim right?"
Would be a really awkward situation right? The patients religion is none of his business.

But again...you seem to mix stuff up...interreligional cooperation and saving your own soul in the afterlife are two different subjects. Interreligional cooperation focusses on this world. to make this world a better place....saving your soul focusses on the afterlife which is permanent and not temporarily like this world...so you should not underestimate that.

Islaam does not prohibit interreligional cooperation.

 

[Predator]

Dear Eric, I do not know why you are asking this. I am starting to think that you think we muslims are some kind of barbarians or something...that we have a totally different set of morals and values....we don't...
We also love humanitarian work, give to charity, reach out to the ones in need etc...regardless muslim or non-muslim.

I also said in my latest post that we are not the judges of anyone...so it is not to us to decide who is a muslim and deserves our help and who not. We do not know what plans Allah has for these people...the people you look down on today as a helpless non muslim...can reach out his helping hand to you tomorrow...you never know.

A man goes to a doctor: doctor, "I am in such pain...". First thing the doctor asks: " you a muslim right?"
Would be a really awkward situation right? The patients religion is none of his business.

But again...you seem to mix stuff up...interreligional cooperation and saving your own soul in the afterlife are two different subjects. Interreligional cooperation focusses on this world. to make this world a better place....saving your soul focusses on the afterlife which is permanent and not temporarily like this world...so you should not underestimate that.

Islaam does not prohibit interreligional cooperation.

Agree,the way eric always deviates the topic to interfaith cooperation reminds us of the behavior of the proverbial ostrich and continued ignorance to warning about the hereafter doesn't look good at all

 

[taha_]

Agree,the way eric always deviates the topic to interfaith cooperation reminds us of the behavior of the proverbial ostrich and continued ignorance to warning about the hereafter doesn't look good at all

Assalam o alaikum rahmatullahi wa Barakatuhu

Allah says in Surah E Baqarah

( 256 ) There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.


We cant force anyone to accept islam. Let Allah guide whoever He wills. The only way is ask Allah to guide Eric to Islam. So let us make duas and ask Allah

JazakAllah khair

 

[Predator]

Yes,we can't force anyone to accept Islam ,but we have a duty to convey the message and correct misconception.In this case,Eric seems to have a wrong impression that Islam and Muslim don't support humanitarian work ,charity or interreligious cooperation which isn't true

 

['Abdullah]

Yes,we can't force anyone to accept Islam ,but we have a duty to convey the message and correct misconception.In this case,Eric seems to have a wrong impression that Islam and Muslim don't support humanitarian work ,charity or interreligious cooperation which isn't true

I posted a new thread on interest based economic system and its curse on humanity. To me the best humanitarian thing we can do is not to support the interest based system and follow the Divine law. If someone is part of such a system then they are partly responsible for death of millions of children in poor countries every year, they are also partly responsible for poor and homeless people within Western countries. We can't solve our social issues unless we treat the root cause and that is not to follow the "Divine Laws." No matter what we do at the name of humanitarian cause, if we don't follow the Divine Laws, our actions will mean nothing and will have no benefit in this life or hereafter.

 

[Eric H]

Greetings and peace be with you Predator;

Agree,the way eric always deviates the topic to interfaith cooperation reminds us of the behavior of the proverbial ostrich and continued ignorance to warning about the hereafter doesn't look good at all

You must understand I am a Christian, and I have my own Christian hopes for salvation. I am a guest on your forum; and as such should be careful not to promote Christianity here. I respect your faith, I know Muslims do a lot of good charitable work, you have good morals, you fast and pray.

If I have caused offence to anyone, then I humbly ask your forgiveness, it has never been my intention to offend.

Blessings

Eric