Hadith

[renak]

I am simply examining Islam, which I respect. However, I am trying to view various beliefs within Islam. I hope this article doesn't offend anyone.
History of Hadith:

The word "Hadith" is inseparable from today's Islam and can best be translated as "Sayings" of the Prophet or his companions.

Hadith is accepted as the 2nd source of Islam (the Quran being 1st) and has been well established into an entire science where people spend a lifetime merely studying the "Hadith" and its compilations.

Muslims are taught that the Prophet Mohammed brought the Quran with him as well as his sayings "Hadith" and actions "Sunna". The Muslims believe that these pillars are inseparable and that Islam cannot stand at all if any of these pillars are taken out.

What may come as a surprise to most, is that "Hadith" was not actually compiled and reviewed until over two hundred years after Mohammed's death, first by Imam Bukhari (d. 256/870), then Muslim (d. 261/875), Abu Daud (d. 275/888), Tirmidhi (d. 270/883), Ibn Maja (d. 273/886), and al-Nasa'i (d. 303/915).

In his opening statement, Bukhari (considered to be the #1 source of authentic Hadith) states that out of nearly 600,000 Hadith's which were known to him at the time, he could only record 7,397 as being authentic from the prophet. This is a recognition by the upholders of Hadith that at least 98.76%, of what people are led to believe is the 2nd revelation to the Quran and a major source of Islamic law, is pure lies!.

What people also fail to realize is that the history of Hadith itself has been overlooked and is treated as if the revelations were written down at the time of the Prophet for record keeping. In fact, the record books indicate that there was a BAN on the writing of Hadith ordered by the Prophet himself and upheld for nearly 100 years thereafter.

"The prophet said:'Do not write anything from me EXCEPT QURAN. Whoever wrote, must destroy it" (Muslim, Zuhd 72; Hanbel3/12,21,39)

The above "Hadith" is recognized and accepted by Hadith scholars the world over, however, their justification for the ban is that the prophet feared that the "Hadith" and Quran would be intermingled into one book and this ban was simply a safeguard.

What these same scholars fail to explain is WHY the same ban was still in-place nearly 30 years after the prophet's death and AFTER the Quran was supposedly compiled!

Zayd Ibn Thabit visited the Khalifa Mu'aawiya (more than 30 years after the Prophet's death), and told him a story about the Prophet. Mu'aawiya liked the story and ordered someone to write it down. But Zayd said, "The messenger of God ordered us never to write anything of his Hadith." (Reported by Ibn Hanbal)

According to the history books of Islam, the ban on writing "Hadith" was only lifted some 80 years after the Prophet had passed away by Omar Bin Abdulaziz (the grandson of Omar Bin Al-Khatab). In fact, the irony of the matter is that Omar Bin al-Khatab himself was vehemently opposed to the writing of any religion revelations EXCEPT the Quran:

Omar Bin Al-Khatab is recorded as saying: 'I wanted to write the traditions (Sun'an), and I remembered a people who were before you, they wrote other books to follow and abandoned the book of GOD. And I will never, I swear, replace GOD's book with anything' (Reported by Jami' Al-Bayan 1/67)

As we mentioned before, within a short span of 200 years from the Prophet's death (only 130 years from the lifting of the ban) there were over 600,000 Hadith's floating around at the time of Bukhari which were all attributed to the Prophet. Bukhari himself admitted to spending nearly 40 years studying the Hadith's and could only verify the chain of transmission from 1.24% of the total!.

Any comments? Has anyone researched the making of the hadith? Thanks

 

[Khaldun]

This article was clearly written by some person against hadith. Please state where you got this article from :brother:

The hadith are accepted by all muslims with sound knowledge, and the weak hadiths are seperated from the strong ones, so people know the authentic hadith.

Just to illustrate the importance of hadith, I would like to ask you to go through the entire Quran and show me which verses show how excatly to preform the prayer, as you will soon see, you will not find this anywhere in the Quran, however, from the correct teachings of the prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) we know how to preform the prayer.

Please also read.

http://www.islamicboard.com/sects-divisions/1399-sectarian-article-quranites.html

and

http://www.islamicboard.com/sects-divisions/1063-general-article-status-sunnah-islam.html

 

[Cheb]

We are required to follow the same actions of the Prophet and through the Hadith we are able to do so. The Hadith is very helpful when it comes to specific things. For example how to pray, as brother Khaldun said.
And notice in the article he is using Hadith to support his arguments. Kind of ironic dont you think.

 

[renak]

This article was clearly written by some person against hadith. Please state where you got this article from :brother:

The hadith are accepted by all muslims with sound knowledge, and the weak hadiths are seperated from the strong ones, so people know the authentic hadith.

Just to illustrate the importance of hadith, I would like to ask you to go through the entire Quran and show me which verses show how excatly to preform the prayer, as you will soon see, you will not find this anywhere in the Quran, however, from the correct teachings of the prophet (peace and blessings be upon him) we know how to preform the prayer.

Please also read.

http://www.islamicboard.com/sects-divisions/1399-sectarian-article-quranites.html

and

http://www.islamicboard.com/sects-divisions/1063-general-article-status-sunnah-islam.html

The article was from http://www.free-minds.org/

 

[renak]

We are required to follow the same actions of the Prophet and through the Hadith we are able to do so. The Hadith is very helpful when it comes to specific things. For example how to pray, as brother Khaldun said.
And notice in the article he is using Hadith to support his arguments. Kind of ironic dont you think.

Who requires muslims to follow the same actions as the Prophet? Was it required from the Prophet or Allah?

 

[Khaldun]

Who requires muslims to follow the same actions as the Prophet? Was it required from the Prophet or Allah?

The Prophet of Allah doesnt require anything himself, its stated in the Quran a command of Allah.

O you who believe! obey Allah and obey the Apostle and those in authority from among you; then if you quarrel about anything, refer it to Allah and the Apostle, if you believe in Allah and the last day; this is better and very good in the end. [Surah Nisa Ayah 59]

Whoever obeys the Apostle, he indeed obeys Allah, and whoever turns back, so We have not sent you as a keeper over them.[Surah Nisa Ayah 80]

 

[Cheb]

Consider also these Ayas from the Quran:

*{And as Allah took compact with the Prophets [that], “Indeed, whatever I bring you of Book and Wisdom, thereafter a Messenger comes to you sincerely verifying what is with you, indeed you shall definitely believe in him, and indeed you shall definitely vindicate him.” He said, “Do you ratify [that]? And do you take My obligation on those [conditions]?” They said, “We have ratified [that].” He said, “Then, bear witness, and I am with you among the witnesses.”}* (Al-Baqarah 2:81–82)

*{The ones who closely follow the Messenger, the Prophet, the Illiterate one, whom they find written down in their presence in the Tawrah (Torah) and the Injil (Gospel) … So the ones who believe in him, and rally to him (in assistance) and vindicate him, and closely follow the light that has been sent down with him, those are they [who] are the prosperous.}* (Al-A`raf 7:157)

In this respect the Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him) said:

"By Allah, if my brother Musa were alive, and witnessed my Prophethood, he would have no choice but to follow me" (Ad-Darimi).

 

[Cheb]

Question:

As-salamu `alaykum.

I once talked with some ahl al-Hadith person and was surprised to get to know their way of thinking. According to them, we can be Muslims without accepting prophets’ teachings, because they think that if prophets die, then their doings also die with them. They think if they did good acts, then that was for them; their deeds have no impact on us.

They also do not accept to go to great scholars mazars because they consider it shirk (polytheism). I tried so many times to convince them but I think I can never convince them like you. So, please help me and answer me on this topic.

Allah Hafiz.

Answer:

Salam, Sumera.

Thank you for your question.

This is really quite weird and strangely challenging! The question intrigues me— are we really in need of prophets and are we in need of following their example?

I wonder how this person calls himself one of the ahl al-Hadith (the people of hadith or followers of hadith) while he completely denies Hadith and places the final pin in its coffin. The Sunnah of the Prophet will always remain as strong and bright as it is.

Let’s start with posing an important question, if we are in no need of prophets’ examples, deeds, and teachings, then what is the job of a prophet other than being an ordinary person living with other people?

Islam teaches us that prophets are the chosen servants of Allah selected to convey the message of the Creator to His creatures. Apart from this, prophets should themselves be actual examples and real manifestations of the guidance and the message they bring to people. How can a prophet give guidance to people while he himself is unable to apply this guidance?

Here, we should note that the deeds and the actions of prophets are to be divided into two main categories: deeds that are of a personal nature, such as those deeds relating to the prophet himself as a person, and other deeds that are of legislative nature, i.e., those deeds in which he is to be followed.

If we agree with you that the deeds of prophets are buried with them, then we will abolish many basic and important parts of Islam, including Prayer (salah). The Qur’an tells us nothing about the number of daily Prayers and the way of performing them. All of that is known only through the actions of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him), who said, “Perform Prayer the way you saw me performing it.”

Many teachings of Islam are known through the Sunnah (sayings and deeds) of Prophet Muhammad (peace be upon him). Denying the Sunnah is surely tantamount to disbelief and takes the person totally out of the fold of Islam. If you bury the deeds of the prophets with them, then you bury the whole religion and destroy it.

I would like to cite here the following words of Sheikh Yusuf Al-Qaradawi:
Actually, some people claim that the Qur’an is so inclusive that there is no need for the Sunnah. They support their claim by citing the Qur’anic verse that says what means:
*{And We reveal the Scripture unto thee as an exposition of all things…}* (An-Nahl 16:89).

However, this claim is completely wrong and rejected by the Qur’an itself. Allah Almighty says what means:
*{… and We have sent down unto thee (also) the Message; that thou mayest explain clearly to men what is sent for them, and that they may give thought}* (An-Nahl 16:44).

In addition, Allah declares that obeying the Prophet is obligatory, as it is part of obedience to Allah Himself (see 3:31; 4:80; 33:36; 47:33, etc.). Therefore, it is not proper for a Muslim who knows Islamic Law to make such a claim.

By and large, the Qur’an sets the general rules without details. For example, there is no mention in the Qur’an that there are five obligatory Prayers to be performed daily. Nor is the number of rak`ahs of each Prayer specified. The same is true of the percentage to be paid in zakah, the details in the rituals of Hajj, and other such ordinances and dealings. All of these details are profoundly dealt with in the Sunnah.
As for the second part of your question concerning going to great scholars, your meaning is not entirely clear to me. If you mean to go to a scholar to ask a question or to ask him or her to pray for you, there is no problem. But if you mean to visit the grave of a scholar or “saint” to ask him or her to intercede for you or grant some request, this is clearly shirk. We say 17 times daily in our Prayers what means *{You alone we worship and from You alone we seek assistance}* (Al-Fatihah 1:5).

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/...kAboutIslamE/AskAboutIslamE&cid=1123996016424

 

[أحمد]

I am simply examining Islam, which I respect. However, I am trying to view various beliefs within Islam. I hope this article doesn't offend anyone.
History of Hadith:

The word "Hadith" is inseparable from today's Islam and can best be translated as "Sayings" of the Prophet or his companions.

Hadith is accepted as the 2nd source of Islam (the Quran being 1st) and has been well established into an entire science where people spend a lifetime merely studying the "Hadith" and its compilations.

Muslims are taught that the Prophet Mohammed brought the Quran with him as well as his sayings "Hadith" and actions "Sunna". The Muslims believe that these pillars are inseparable and that Islam cannot stand at all if any of these pillars are taken out.

What may come as a surprise to most, is that "Hadith" was not actually compiled and reviewed until over two hundred years after Mohammed's death, first by Imam Bukhari (d. 256/870), then Muslim (d. 261/875), Abu Daud (d. 275/888), Tirmidhi (d. 270/883), Ibn Maja (d. 273/886), and al-Nasa'i (d. 303/915).

Any comments? Has anyone researched the making of the hadith? Thanks

It is quite interesting that this article only mentions amongst the very newest books of Ahadeeth; if you really want to know about Ahadeeth literature, then I have come across books that date back to within the 1st century AH. You should do a little more research, but I'll give details Insha-All, its just that writing information about so many Ahadeeth books will take some time, so Insha-Allah; I'll write it up as a text document first. By the way, I won't give you a shock by writing just yet about how early certain books were written, but if you look at just one book, which wasn't even that early, you may get some idea. The book is very well known, its written by the student of Imam Malik, its called Mu`atta Imam Malik. Just this book cancels out two centuries from the article you posted.

 

[iqbal_ibn_adam]

I am simply examining Islam, which I respect. However, I am trying to view various beliefs within Islam. I hope this article doesn't offend anyone.
History of Hadith:

The word "Hadith" is inseparable from today's Islam and can best be translated as "Sayings" of the Prophet or his companions.

Hadith is accepted as the 2nd source of Islam (the Quran being 1st) and has been well established into an entire science where people spend a lifetime merely studying the "Hadith" and its compilations.

Muslims are taught that the Prophet Mohammed brought the Quran with him as well as his sayings "Hadith" and actions "Sunna". The Muslims believe that these pillars are inseparable and that Islam cannot stand at all if any of these pillars are taken out.

What may come as a surprise to most, is that "Hadith" was not actually compiled and reviewed until over two hundred years after Mohammed's death, first by Imam Bukhari (d. 256/870), then Muslim (d. 261/875), Abu Daud (d. 275/888), Tirmidhi (d. 270/883), Ibn Maja (d. 273/886), and al-Nasa'i (d. 303/915).

In his opening statement, Bukhari (considered to be the #1 source of authentic Hadith) states that out of nearly 600,000 Hadith's which were known to him at the time, he could only record 7,397 as being authentic from the prophet. This is a recognition by the upholders of Hadith that at least 98.76%, of what people are led to believe is the 2nd revelation to the Quran and a major source of Islamic law, is pure lies!.

What people also fail to realize is that the history of Hadith itself has been overlooked and is treated as if the revelations were written down at the time of the Prophet for record keeping. In fact, the record books indicate that there was a BAN on the writing of Hadith ordered by the Prophet himself and upheld for nearly 100 years thereafter.

"The prophet said:'Do not write anything from me EXCEPT QURAN. Whoever wrote, must destroy it" (Muslim, Zuhd 72; Hanbel3/12,21,39)

The above "Hadith" is recognized and accepted by Hadith scholars the world over, however, their justification for the ban is that the prophet feared that the "Hadith" and Quran would be intermingled into one book and this ban was simply a safeguard.

What these same scholars fail to explain is WHY the same ban was still in-place nearly 30 years after the prophet's death and AFTER the Quran was supposedly compiled!

Zayd Ibn Thabit visited the Khalifa Mu'aawiya (more than 30 years after the Prophet's death), and told him a story about the Prophet. Mu'aawiya liked the story and ordered someone to write it down. But Zayd said, "The messenger of God ordered us never to write anything of his Hadith." (Reported by Ibn Hanbal)

According to the history books of Islam, the ban on writing "Hadith" was only lifted some 80 years after the Prophet had passed away by Omar Bin Abdulaziz (the grandson of Omar Bin Al-Khatab). In fact, the irony of the matter is that Omar Bin al-Khatab himself was vehemently opposed to the writing of any religion revelations EXCEPT the Quran:

Omar Bin Al-Khatab is recorded as saying: 'I wanted to write the traditions (Sun'an), and I remembered a people who were before you, they wrote other books to follow and abandoned the book of GOD. And I will never, I swear, replace GOD's book with anything' (Reported by Jami' Al-Bayan 1/67)

As we mentioned before, within a short span of 200 years from the Prophet's death (only 130 years from the lifting of the ban) there were over 600,000 Hadith's floating around at the time of Bukhari which were all attributed to the Prophet. Bukhari himself admitted to spending nearly 40 years studying the Hadith's and could only verify the chain of transmission from 1.24% of the total!.

Any comments? Has anyone researched the making of the hadith? Thanks

As seeing from ur profile u are a Christian, before jumping on sum1 else's back can u answer my questions about the book u follow which is bible.

Can u tell me and provide sum proofs that bible is 100% correct and also how it was complied and by whose orders ?



good luk wid ur search
Will wait for ur reply

 

[Maimunah]

we as muslims r ordered by allah to obey n follow the messenger pbuh as it states in the quraan "Say: "If ye do love Allah, Follow me: Allah will love you and forgive you your sins: For Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful." as therefore we r required to follow the prophet's sayings.
brother iqbal_ibn_adam is right proof for us if the book u follow is 100% correct?

salaam

 

[Cheb]

I do not think her intention was to attack us so please try to keep it on topic. I think it is best if we just stick to disproving this article.
Peace.

 

[renak]

I do not think her intention was to attack us so please try to keep it on topic. I think it is best if we just stick to disproving this article.
Peace.

It is not my intention to attack the hadith, or Islam. I am just someone who has to examine all information before I can commit to a belief.

I'm not denying that the bible has errors. In fact, I do not believe that it should be taken literally.

I appreciate everyones imput, and I'm researching the information everyone has provided for me. Thanks to all!

 

[AceOfHearts]

Much of the contents of the article are infact true.
Within the context of the article, no where did it say reject hadiths.

But if you cross-check all that is contained in the article, you will find that they are correct and established information in Islamic history which most have forgotten about today.

 

[boriqee]

sorry to come in late

nearly half the article is itself a miscontruence of reality from even historical precedent.

for one Bukharee did not mention with the word s that he viewed only 7158 (or however many ahadeeth in his saheeh) to be saheeh and the rest lies. Now this is beyond the farbications of the liars and the mascinations of the igrnoant. No one knows why he only limited his saheeh to be 7158. The very fact that he only put that much in it out of his vast number of hadeeth does not entail the idea that everything else is dha'eef.

Likewise another major, in fact beyond major, fact that they have miscontrued is that the hadeeth were taken down 2 and a half centuries after the prophet. only an ignorant could say this. The very fact that we have precedent for the prophet who abrogated the first command to not right down ahadeth is itself proof. The fact that we have narrations form compansion that were written down in his time is proof that hadeth were written in his time. Theearliest works of hadeeth is really before a century of he completion of Islam came about. Sufyaan ath-Thawri has a musnaad. In fact there were collections of hadeeth books in manuscripts over a century before bukharee. Bukharee is only recognized as the first to distinguish saheeh and dha'eef from a more scientific level whic made him one of he pillars of uloomu-rijaal and jarh wa t'adeel.

Musl;im followed suit in the same critique. However there were those before him who were at his level like Imaam Ali Ibnu-Madinee and Abdur-Rahman bin Mahdee who were Imaams of rijaal.The tradition for te muhaditheen befoe Bukharee was in collecting ahadeth to say that they had compliled nearly everything known as "sunaan" lso many of hem compiled musanad and the most famous of them is the musnaad of Ahmad. However they did not bother to delve into which were dha'eef or saheeh as it was not the norm of the day. Usually the muhaditheen of their time already knew the gradings of these narrations based on the matn and the narrator. So Bukharees brilliance really helped for the generations after his time who by defualt will be no match to their intellectual level and their level of ilm in any matter of the religion due to the fact that these first three generations were the greatets of men is proved by prophetic command.

asalamu alaikum

 

[AceOfHearts]

Some Muslims say hadeeths were written during prophets lifetime. Names of one or two of these books are mentioned sometimes, however they acknowledge that these books are non-existent today.

That is why the Quran represents the most accurate and authentic representation of the Messengers preachings - which is the message of the Quran.

 

[itsme01]

Also - Many Hadiths are Provided by Ayesha [Peace Be Upon Her] Wife of Prophet Muhammad[PBU Him] and mother of Muslims. Therefore, collection of the Hadith started to take place right after Prophet Muhammad [PBUH] passed away. Ayesha [PBU Her] was blessed at memorizing information. If She heard something, She was able to recall it exactly.

Scholars, such as Imam Buckhari collected(gathered) the sayings [Hadiths] of Prophet Muhammad [PBUH]. Some of the Reasons why not all Hadiths were put into book are:

1. Not Enough Time
2. Some Hadiths were weak
3. Some were from unreliable sources

 

[iqbal_ibn_adam]

I am simply examining Islam, which I respect. However, I am trying to view various beliefs within Islam. I hope this article doesn't offend anyone.
History of Hadith:

The word "Hadith" is inseparable from today's Islam and can best be translated as "Sayings" of the Prophet or his companions.

Hadith is accepted as the 2nd source of Islam (the Quran being 1st) and has been well established into an entire science where people spend a lifetime merely studying the "Hadith" and its compilations.

Muslims are taught that the Prophet Mohammed brought the Quran with him as well as his sayings "Hadith" and actions "Sunna". The Muslims believe that these pillars are inseparable and that Islam cannot stand at all if any of these pillars are taken out.

What may come as a surprise to most, is that "Hadith" was not actually compiled and reviewed until over two hundred years after Mohammed's death, first by Imam Bukhari (d. 256/870), then Muslim (d. 261/875), Abu Daud (d. 275/888), Tirmidhi (d. 270/883), Ibn Maja (d. 273/886), and al-Nasa'i (d. 303/915).

In his opening statement, Bukhari (considered to be the #1 source of authentic Hadith) states that out of nearly 600,000 Hadith's which were known to him at the time, he could only record 7,397 as being authentic from the prophet. This is a recognition by the upholders of Hadith that at least 98.76%, of what people are led to believe is the 2nd revelation to the Quran and a major source of Islamic law, is pure lies!.

What people also fail to realize is that the history of Hadith itself has been overlooked and is treated as if the revelations were written down at the time of the Prophet for record keeping. In fact, the record books indicate that there was a BAN on the writing of Hadith ordered by the Prophet himself and upheld for nearly 100 years thereafter.

"The prophet said:'Do not write anything from me EXCEPT QURAN. Whoever wrote, must destroy it" (Muslim, Zuhd 72; Hanbel3/12,21,39)

The above "Hadith" is recognized and accepted by Hadith scholars the world over, however, their justification for the ban is that the prophet feared that the "Hadith" and Quran would be intermingled into one book and this ban was simply a safeguard.

What these same scholars fail to explain is WHY the same ban was still in-place nearly 30 years after the prophet's death and AFTER the Quran was supposedly compiled!

Zayd Ibn Thabit visited the Khalifa Mu'aawiya (more than 30 years after the Prophet's death), and told him a story about the Prophet. Mu'aawiya liked the story and ordered someone to write it down. But Zayd said, "The messenger of God ordered us never to write anything of his Hadith." (Reported by Ibn Hanbal)

According to the history books of Islam, the ban on writing "Hadith" was only lifted some 80 years after the Prophet had passed away by Omar Bin Abdulaziz (the grandson of Omar Bin Al-Khatab). In fact, the irony of the matter is that Omar Bin al-Khatab himself was vehemently opposed to the writing of any religion revelations EXCEPT the Quran:

Omar Bin Al-Khatab is recorded as saying: 'I wanted to write the traditions (Sun'an), and I remembered a people who were before you, they wrote other books to follow and abandoned the book of GOD. And I will never, I swear, replace GOD's book with anything' (Reported by Jami' Al-Bayan 1/67)

As we mentioned before, within a short span of 200 years from the Prophet's death (only 130 years from the lifting of the ban) there were over 600,000 Hadith's floating around at the time of Bukhari which were all attributed to the Prophet. Bukhari himself admitted to spending nearly 40 years studying the Hadith's and could only verify the chain of transmission from 1.24% of the total!.

Any comments? Has anyone researched the making of the hadith? Thanks

I am sorry if u was offended by my post, i had fowt u was tryin to cause a problem here like many others do.

 

[renak]

I am sorry if u was offended by my post, i had fowt u was tryin to cause a problem here like many others do.

Not a problem.

 

[boriqee]

Some Muslims say hadeeths were written during prophets lifetime. Names of one or two of these books are mentioned sometimes, however they acknowledge that these books are non-existent today.

That is why the Quran represents the most accurate and authentic representation of the Messengers preachings - which is the message of the Quran.

the musnaad of I beleive Amr Bin al-Aas and the hadeeth reported (not all) by Abu Hurairah have reached us today. The earliest hadeeths manuscripts date during the time oft he khulafa rashideen and the tabieen form the first of the umawi khulafa.

asalamu alaikum