Has Allah written them for us?

[optimist]

Jazaak Allaah Khayr, that explains it. So if it is the Will of Allaah, it will happen, regardless of how many complications come in the way, or if you by your own knowledge cannot see it happening?

And if it is not destined for you, du'a can change that, right?

Salam,

If Allah wills each and everything it means there is no free will for man. Man will be like animals.

wassalam

 

[optimist]

Allah has set standards / measures to everything in the universe. These laws govern the creation, growth and death (or transformation) of all things.

Through a simple real time example this point could be explained. Recently an incident is reported from southern part of India, Kerala at a place called Kasarcode, where the government-owned plantation corporation, a few years before, aerially sprayed endosulfan pesticide (this is banned in several countries at the moment) in an area of nearly 5000 acres.

Today the villagers who live close to the plantation are paying the price, average one in a family is born with physical deformities, and the area is dotted with tragedy struck families battling physical deformities, cancers and disorders of the central nervous system. It is not that these people were pre-destined to be born in this way, but this happened according to measures and standards set by Allah in this universe. "Glorify the name of thy Guardian-Lord Most High Who hath created, and further, given order and proportion; Who hath ordained laws."(87:1-3)

See how true is the verse which states; “There is no tragedy which befalls you but as result of your own handiwork” (42:30).

 

[Danah]

^ There is a difference between the knowledge of Allah and the freedom of choice brother
Don't mix up things please

Edit: This was directed to ur previous post not ur last one bro optimist, we both posted at the same time

 

[AnonymousPoster]

ok lets get to the POINT

ARE THEY WRITTEN OR NOT. if so please could you quote backup to prove it. Very controversial topic.

 

[optimist]

^ There is a difference between the knowledge of Allah and the freedom of choice brother
Don't mix up things please

Salam,

I hope this question is directed to those who say Allahs knowledge means his decision and will. Yes, there is a big difference. Nothing happens in this world without the knowledge of Allah. Allah knows also if a man using his free will does so and so things the the consequences will be so and so and Allah has set natural consequences. Man is free to choose his action but is not free to change the natural consequences of that action. Everyday occurrences like fire burns if you touch it and water quenches your thirst are evident examples of this. That is why Allah will eventually hold Man responsible for his actions’. Each and every occurrence in the physical universe, as well as Man’s social world, takes place under determined laws enacted by Allah.

Wassalam

 

[THE END]

Salam,

Are you telling me there is "COMPULSION" in every happenings? Then tell me the meaning of the following verses.

When Muslims faced set back in Uhud and when they pondered upon the setback ‘ How did it happen?’, Allah’s says clearly: “Tell, (them O Prophet!), that was from your own selves.” (3:165).

Quran says at another place.

“There is no tragedy which befalls you but as result of your own handiwork” (42:30).

Here is a report from Umar (r), when a plaugue broke out, he suggested to move out of the town to a nearby safe place. At that moment Abu Obaida commented, “You are trying to escape Allah’s law?”. “Yes”, Omar replied, “I am escaping from His (one) law to His (other) law,”

Why Umar replied in this way?

Quran narrates the infidels comment: ‘How can we enrich those who are poor by Allah’s will?”. The Quran’s response to that is : “surely, you are in grave ignorance!” (36/47).

Are you challeging the above verse which clearly says people become poor not because Allah willed it?

wassalam

Qadr is a fascinating and a very deap ocean many people have drowned.
Can we do anything against allahs (swt) will?

also i have just read ibn kathir tafsirs on the 36/47 it contradicts your interpretation of the verse.

 

[optimist]

ok lets get to the POINT

ARE THEY WRITTEN OR NOT. if so please could you quote backup to prove it. Very controversial topic.

Salam,

Let us, then, try to see what does it mean "WRITTEN".

At one place in Quran Allah says ‘Strive to get whatever Allah has written for you."(2:187). If someone thing is already written why strive to get it? So the meaning of "WRITTEN" is not a predestined situation. I will expain to you the point.

First I will quote a verse Verse 57:22 where Allah says Allah has "written in a book" “No calamity comes to your society or self which had not been written in a book before We created this Universe”.

According to the way we understand it would mean a pre-determined situation. But Quran says in Sura Shura: “There is no calamity which befalls you but as result of your own handiwork” (42:30). Also Sura Aale-Imran states that when they (people) are struck by an affliction, they wonder where it came from (أنى هـذا) - ‘ Tell them: “it is of your own doing” (3:164).

The Quran doesn’t contradict itself:

The term written in a book does not refer to a predetermined situation. Here is the evidence.

1. Sura Nisa uses the word Kitab for prohibition of marriage to certain relatives. (4:24) كِتَابَ اللَّهِ عَلَيْكُمْ Yousuf Ali has translated as “Thus hath Allah ordained (Prohibitions) against you”, meaning thereby that he translates kitab as ‘order’.

2. Sura Baqara uses the word kitab in (2:235). Yousuf Ali translates the verse thus: “nor resolve on the tie of marriage till the term prescribed is fulfilled” حَتَّىٰ يَبْلُغَ الْكِتَابُ أَجَلَهُ Hence ‘kitab’ has been translated as ‘prescribed’ i.e., prescribed by Allah. This is His order, decision or LAW.

3. “prayers are enjoined on believers at stated (prescribed) times.” (4:103)
فَأَقِيمُوا الصَّلَاةَ إِنَّ الصَّلَاةَ كَانَتْ عَلَى الْمُؤْمِنِينَ كِتَابًا مَوْقُوتًا

4. “In it (the Quran) there are established laws (kutub)”. (98/3)

5.“About lonely women: “You don’t give them what has been determined (by law - kuteba) for them”. (4/12)

6. Sura An’aam talks about Allah’s knowledge encompassing the Universe - every leaf which falls off a tree, grains in the darkness of the earth, good and bad, dry and wet - everything is in ‘the clear book’ (6:59). Obviously, the book here means the laws of the physical universe.

7. Sura Aal-Imran talks about the ‘established’ regulations given in clear-cut terms (as compared to the ‘similes and, examples’ to give universal truths). These ‘established’ (محكمات ) are referred to as ‘mother of the book’ (3:6), ‘Mother of the book’ means Allah’s knowledge which is absolutely comprehensive -- “Don’t you know that Allah knows what ever is there in the skies and the earth? That (knowledge) is in a book” (22:70), says Sura Hajj. Elsewhere, it is referred to as “the clear book” (27:75).

Therefore, each and every occurrence in the physical universe, as well as Man’s social world, takes place under determined laws enacted by Allah, which is referred as “the book”.

Allah has pre-determined laws not only for calamities but also for alleviating them. For example, fire burns, but balm soothes. The words ‘whatever Allah has written for us’ do not mean our pre-determined fate but whatever law has already been established. Fore example, see (2:187) where it says:‘Strive to get whatever Allah has written for you. “obviously, ‘written’ in this verse does not mean pre-determined fate’ because that is inevitable and, as such, does not require any effort to get.

Wassalam

 

[optimist]

also i have just read ibn kathir tafsirs on the 36/47 it contradicts your interpretation of the verse.

Salam,

I quote five Quran translation for this verse.

And when they are told, "Spend ye of (the bounties) with which Allah has provided you," the Unbelievers say to those who believe: "Shall we then feed those whom, if Allah had so willed, He would have fed, (Himself)?- Ye are in nothing but manifest error." (Yousuf Ali)

And when it is said to them: Spend out of what Allah has given you, those who disbelieve say to those who believe: Shall we feed him whom, if Allah please, He could feed? You are in naught but clear error.(M.H.Shakir)

And when it is said unto them: Spend of that wherewith Allah hath provided you, those who disbelieve say unto those who believe: Shall we feed those whom Allah, if He willed, would feed? Ye are in naught else than error manifest.(Pickthall)

And when it is said to them: "Spend of that with which Allah has provided you," those who disbelieve say to those who believe: "Shall we feed those whom, if Allah willed, He (Himself) would have fed? You are only in a plain error."(Mohsin Khan)

Thus, when they are told, "Spend on others out of what God has provided for you as sustenance," those who are bent on denying the truth say unto those who believe, "Shall we feed anyone whom, if [your] God had so willed, He could have fed [Himself]? Clearly, you are but lost in error!"(Mohammed Asad)

Wassalam

 

[IbnAbdulHakim]

make dua for the best to happen and relax


stressing over stuff like this aint helping no one - especially you !

Assalamu Alaikum

 

[Danah]

Salam,

I hope this question is directed to those who say Allahs knowledge means his decision and will. Yes, there is a big difference. Nothing happens in this world without the knowledge of Allah. Allah knows also if a man using his free will does so and so things the the consequences will be so and so and Allah has set natural consequences. Man is free to choose his action but is not free to change the natural consequences of that action. Everyday occurrences like fire burns if you touch it and water quenches your thirst are evident examples of this. That is why Allah will eventually hold Man responsible for his actions’. Each and every occurrence in the physical universe, as well as Man’s social world, takes place under determined laws enacted by Allah.

Wassalam

Then can you please explain how your two comments do compliment each other when u just said this:

Allah has not pre-written whom we will end up getting married to. If someone argues in this way, it would mean Allah has written someone will end up divorcing someone and we know there are thousands of people who are unable to marry due to poverty and many other reasons and it would mean that Allah has written that so and so people will end up not marrying anyone. Such ideas are completely wrong.

I am a bit confused :hmm:

 

[optimist]

Then can you please explain how your two comments do compliment each other when u just said this:

Salam,

It is erroneous to conclud that Allah can know Man’s future only if the future is pre-determined. In simpler words, Man is capable of exercising his free will and to change his decisions. Allah knows what decisions Man is going to take. Therefore, Man does not know his own future actions whereas Allah does (know man’s future actions). Allah has given free will to Man to choose from two possibilities. Man is free to choose one of the two paths but is NOT free to choose the destination (result). This fact (law) is unchangeable. He can choose an action but has to bear its consequence (pre-ordained by Allah) for each action. This is the Law of Results of Action, which is constant and firm. ‘Ye shall reap what ye shall sow’ is the fundamental basis of life.

Wassalam

 

[Danah]

and to answer the question of the thread starter.....

Are rizq (provision) and marriage written in al-Lawh al-Mahfooz?.


Praise be to Allaah.

Everything from when Allaah created the Pen until the Day of Resurrection is written in al-Lawh al-Mahfooz, because when Allaah first created the Pen, He said to it: “Write.” It said: “My Lord, what should I write?” He said: “Write what is to be. So at that moment it began to write what would be until the Day of Resurrection. And it is proven from the Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) that when the foetus in its mother’s womb is four months old, Allaah sends an angel to breathe the soul into it and write down its provision, its lifespan and its deeds, and whether it is doomed or blessed.
Provision is also written down and connected to its means, and it does not increase or decrease. Among those means are that man should work to seek provision, as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“He it is Who has made the earth subservient to you (i.e. easy for you to walk, to live and to do agriculture on it); so walk in the path thereof and eat of His provision. And to Him will be the Resurrection”
[al-Mulk 67:15]



Other means are:
upholding ties of kinship, such as honouring one’s parents and upholding ties with relatives. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “Whoever would like his provision to be abundant and his lifespan to be extended, let him uphold his ties of kinship.”
Fearing Allaah (taqwa), as Allaah says (interpretation of the meaning):
“And whosoever fears Allaah and keeps his duty to Him, He will make a way for him to get out (from every difficulty).
3. And He will provide him from (sources) he never could imagine. And whosoever puts his trust in Allaah, then He will suffice him. Verily, Allaah will accomplish his purpose. Indeed Allaah has set a measure for all things”
[al-Talaaq 65:2-3]
Do not say “Provision is foreordained and limited and I will not do any of the things that lead to it,” because this is helplessness; smartness and resolve mean striving to seek provision and that which will benefit you in religious and worldly terms. The Prophet (peace and blessings of Allaah be upon him) said: “The smart man is the one who takes stock of himself and strives to do that which will benefit him after death, and the helpless one is the one who follows his own whims and desires and engages in wishful thinking, (assuming that Allaah will forgive him regardless of what he does and that he does not need to strive to good deeds).”
Just as provision is written and connected to its means, so too marriage is also written and preordained. For both spouses it is written that he or she will be the spouse of this particular person. Nothing is hidden from Allaah on earth or in heaven. End quote.




And Allaah knows best.
Shaykh Muhammad ibn Saalih al-‘Uthaymeen (may Allaah have mercy on him)


Fataawa Noor ‘ala al-Darb (p. 36).

source: islam-qa.com

 

[Danah]

Salam,

It is erroneous to conclud that Allah can know Man’s future only if the future is pre-determined.

sorry brother but I am really confused now, you are saying the totally opposite thing to what you said in your old post that I quoted.

and now you said that its not only because the future is pre-determined that Allah know our future.......Is there any other reasons for that you are trying to say?

Its because of the future being pre-determined by him only since he is the all knowledgeable the all knowing that know every single thing in this world

 

[optimist]

sorry brother but I am really confused now, you are saying the totally opposite thing to what you said in your old post that I quoted.

and now you said that its not only because the future is pre-determined that Allah know our future.......Is there any other reasons for that you are trying to say?

Its because of the future being pre-determined by him only since he is the all knowledgeable the all knowing that know every single thing in this world

Salam,

Oh....please don't misunderstand what I am saying......Man has got freewill to choose any path of his choise. But the result of his action action is pre-determined by Allah. Everyday occurrences like fire burns if you touch it but balm soothes, water quenches your thirst, A flame burns anyone - believer or non-believer alike, poison kills both, etc. Tilling land according to sound agricultural knowledge brings good harvest to everyone. This is applicable every aspects of a mans life, in the physical world as well as in the social world, as per the prescribed laws (pre-determined laws) of Allah.

This point is illustrated by a story about Omar (r), I quoted earlier. When plague broke out, he suggested moving out of the town to a nearby forest. Abu Obaida commented, “You are trying to escape Allah’s law?”. “Yes”, Omar replied, “I am escaping from His (one) law to His (other) law,”. If one stays in a plague-infected area, death comes according to God’s taqdeer (law). But, if one leaves the epidemic-affected environment for cleaner, safer ground, death is avoided according to Allah’s ‘taqdeer’ (law). The choice between the two ‘taqdeers (laws) is entirely Man’s own. Incidenly Abu Obaida ignored the advice of Umar and he got infected with plague and died

Wassalam

 

[Danah]

^ I dont want examples that has nothing to do with what I am asking about, I wanna know what else you think that make our future known by Allah other than the future being pre-destined?

anyways..........going to pray Taraweeh now

 

[optimist]

^ I dont want examples that has nothing to do with what I am asking about, I wanna know what else you think that make our future known by Allah other than the future being pre-destined?

anyways..........going to pray Taraweeh now

Salam,

I already told you that it is an erroneous belief to conclude that Allah can know Man’s future only if the future is pre-determined. Allah knows what man will do using the freewill he has given to man. A man is taking poison not because Allah willed it, but if someone take poison he will die. This result is the one pre-determined by Allah, not the fact of someone taking poison. If you are telling me that if so and so person took poison and died because Allah pre-determined so and so people shoud take poison and die, you are wrong.

wassalam

 

[cat eyes]

surely if a girl ends up marrying a guy who came all the way from the other side of the world to her country and the chances of him of getting that visa were slim as it usually is then surely that had to be written down for them to meet and then get married:><:opcorn:

 

[Salahudeen]

This thread has confused me like mad

 

[AnonymousPoster]

YOU LOT ARE JUST MAKING THINGS COMPLICATED n driving ppl mad

Ok everything is 'written' ofcourse everything is written Allah knows everything.

However, does he choose the ppl we marry? or is that free will?

You know how we cant choose our gender - thats becuase Allah chose what gender we gonna be - we have no control.

So as for marriage - do we choose that person or Did Allah will that person for you.

 

[Ansariyah]

Allah decreed but u will do what he knows u will do.