Hello just a question

[جوري]

Before Abraham I am was a dream of John or one of the apostles.. do you base a religion on dreams?

 

[Hamza Asadullah]

I am very interested in Islam and I have been reading a lot about Islam lately and I know that Muslims do not believe that Jesus was divine.
But in the Bible (John 8-58) Jesus applied God's Holy name to himself.

Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks in advance

Mausi

Hello there Mausi your questions are most welcome and the only way to gain clarification on any matter is to ask questions and research the topic properly.

In regards to your question i need to use no other sources than the Bible itself to prove that NO where did Jesus ever say or even imply that he is God but the Bible proves itself that Jesus was a creation of God and that ONLY God is worthy of worship:

1- How can Jesus be GOD Almighty in the light of the following verses?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Mark 12:29 Jesus said "Here, O Israel: The Lord our God is one Lord." The words"our God" indicate that Jesus had a higher God over him, a stronger God than him. Jesus didn't say "Your God". He said "our God" which includes Jesus as the creation of GOD.

If Jesus was GOD, then why did he ask for GOD's Forgiveness in Luke 23:34? Please visit:

How can Jesus be GOD Almighty when he asked for GOD's Forgiveness?: http://www.answering-christianity.com/jesus_and_god.htm

If Jesus was GOD, then why Mark 15:34 says "And at the ninth hour Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eloi, Eloi, lama sabachthani?"—which means, "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"

If Jesus was GOD, then did Paul say in 1 Corinthians 8:6 "yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and for whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live."

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 20:17 Jesus said "Do not hold on to me, for I have not yet returned to the Father. Go instead to my brothers and tell them, 'I am returning to my Father and your Father, to my God and your God.' "

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 8:28 Jesus said "I do nothing of myself"? Can't GOD do anything he wills?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 14:28 Jesus said "My Father (GOD) is greater than I"?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Luke 23:46 Jesus said "Father (GOD), into thy hands I commend my spirit"?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Mark 10:18 Jesus said “And Jesus said to him, ‘Why do you call me good? No one is good but God alone.”?

Also in Luke 18:19 Jesus said only GOD Almighty is Good: ""Why do you call me good?" Jesus answered. "No one is good—except God alone."

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 26:39 Jesus begged his GOD to have mercy on him and to pass the cup to death (kill Jesus in another words) before Jesus goes through the pain of crucifixion?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 18:38 he didn't reply when he was asked about the truth?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 24:36 Jesus said "No one knows about that day or hour, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son, but only the Father." Jesus told his followers that no one (including Jesus) knows when the judgment day will come, only GOD knows?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Isaiah 11:2-3 GOD had put the spirit of fearing GOD in Jesus? Also see GOD's Spirit in the many others beside Jesus: http://www.answering-christianity.com/spirit.htm

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:31 Jesus told his followers that if he (Jesus) bears witness of himself, then his record is not true?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:30 Jesus told his followers that he can't do a single thing of his own initiative?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:36-38 Jesus said that GOD had assigned him (Jesus) work and GOD is a witness on Jesus?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in John 5:32 Jesus told his followers that they have never seen GOD at anytime nor ever heard his voice?

If Jesus was GOD, then why did he pray to his GOD in Luke 5:16?

If Jesus was GOD, then why in Matthew 26:39 Jesus fell on his face and prayed to his GOD?

If Jesus was GOD, then how come in Hebrew 5:7 he prayed and cried for GOD to hear him and give him mercy by saving him from death?

If Jesus was GOD, then how come in John 1:18 he said "No one has ever seen God, but God the One and Only, who is at the FATHER'S side, has made HIM known." Where do you see Trinity in this Verse?

If Jesus was GOD, then how come in John 5:37 he said "And the FATHER who sent me has himself testified concerning me. You have never heard HIS voice nor seen HIS form," Jesus and the GOD are different. People heard Jesus, but never heard GOD.

2- The "God" title given to others beside Jesus: http://www.answering-christianity.com/godtitle.htm

3- The "Son" title also given to others beside Jesus:

How come Christians take the "God's Son" title literally with Jesus and they don't take it literally for the rest of the prophets and people who were called the Sons of God?
In John 3:16 Jesus was called God's only Begotten Son.

In Exodus 4:22 "Thus saith Jehovah, Israel is my son, even my firstborn." Israel was called God's First Son.

In Jeremiah 31:9 "I am a father to Israel, and Ephraim is my firstborn." Ephraim is God's First Son and First Born.

In Psalm 2:7 "....Jehovah had said onto me (David), thou art my Son; this day have I begotten thee." David was called God's Begotten Son.


4- Jesus' Miracles were not unique in the Bible:

If Jesus is believed to be GOD because he could do miracles, he could heal leprosy, he could cause blind men to see, or raise the dead, then what about the others who performed the same miracles?

Elisha and Elijah fed a hundred people with twenty barley loaves and a few ears of corn (2 Kings 4:44). Elisha told Naaman, who was a leper, to wash in the river Jordan (2 Kings 5:14) and he was healed. Elisha caused a blind man to see in (2 Kings 6:17,20). Elijah and Elisha raised the dead in (1 Kings 17:22, and 2 Kings 4:34). Even Elisha's dead bones restored a dead body in (2 Kings 13:21). Indeed Jesus had prophesied that people will worship him uselessly and will believe in doctrines not made by GOD but by men "But in vain they do worship me, teaching for doctrines the commandments of men. (Matthew 15:9)"

In Matthew 15:9 above, we see Jesus warning that Trinity (the bogus lie) will dominate, and people will take Jesus as GOD and worship him, which is a total sin according to what Jesus said !!.

Allah Almighty (GOD) in the Noble Quran (The Muslims' Holy Scripture) states in Verse 5:72 "They do blaspheme who say: 'God is Christ the son of Mary.' But said Christ: 'O Children of Israel ! worship God, my Lord and your Lord.' "

Also in Noble Verse 5:73 "They do blaspheme who say God is one of three in a Trinity: for there is no god except One God. If they desist not from their word (of blasphemy), verily a grievous penalty will befall the blasphemers among them."

And also in Noble Verse 4:171 "O People of the Book! Commit no excesses in your religion: Nor say of God aught but the truth. Christ Jesus the son of Mary was (no more than) an apostle of God, ..."

Please visit Jesus' Miracles were not unique in the Bible for more details and elaborations:

http://www.answering-christianity.com/jesus_miracles.htm


Source: http://www.answering-christianity.com/questions.htm

 

[IAmZamzam]

Psalm 2:7, a Psalm of David, speaks of God as having a son. Do you include that saying as being from God?

If it is not a product of textual corruption, which of course we don't know. The expression is very commonly found all around the Bible in reference to any number of different people from Adam (P) to Solomon (P) to the angels. It's never literal.

I don't believe that it does. The Qur'an refers to scriptures being given distorted meanings but not to corruption of the written text itself.

Both of these issues are things I establish all up and down my website and am tired of talking about. Just read the articles.

 

[IAmZamzam]

Hiroshi, imagine God being called someone's brother or uncle instead of their son. Do you see how it sounds? Not only is God too far above us to have a familial relationship with us, it simply isn't necessary in the first place. Wouldn't a more appropriate analogy be that of master and pet? I think Christians just find the idea of a God who has an identifiable, warm-feeling and familiar kind of known relationship with them to be comforting and this is the only real reason why it's so important to them, never mind that there's no rhyme or reason in the notion that just as much comfort couldn't come otherwise. He cares about us enough to give us a shot at paradise: why isn't that enough all by itself? Why is familial love or goodness better than any other kind, and why should it necessarily be the truth in this instance?

 

[mausi]

Thanks for the info. I always thought that Muslims believe in the entire Gospel.

 

[Insaanah]

Thanks for the info. I always thought that Muslims believe in the entire Gospel.

We believe in the divine scriptures as revealed by Allah to the Prophets (peace be upon them). It was originally God's words, that were revealed to Jesus (peace be upon him). Christians admit that parts of the book now called the New Testament or Gospels, are written by humans such as Paul, John etc. Our belief is that Allah revealed a scripture to Jesus (peace be upon him), called the Injeel. We do not believe that the current day Bible is the scripture that was revealed to Jesus (peace be upon him). Most of that has been corrupted by the addition of human writings. Possibly, some of Allah's orginal words may remain. We now have the final scripture from Allah with us, 100% Allah's words, which confirms what was revealed in the earlier scriptures; that there is only one God, with no associates whatsoever in His Divinity. This scripture, the Qur'an, has never changed over time, and will never change. There are no versions. In it, Allah sets the record straight about the man-made notions of Jesus's divinity and being a son of God.

And when Allah will say: "O Jesus, son of Mary! Did you say unto mankind: Take me and my mother for two gods beside Allah?"

He will say: "Be Glorified! It was not mine to utter that to which I had no right. If I used to say it, then You knew it. You know what is in my mind, and I know not what is in Your Mind. Lo! You, only You, are the Knower of Things Hidden.

I spoke unto them only that which You commanded me, (saying): Worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord. I was a witness of them while I dwelt among them, and when You took me, You were the Watcher over them. You are Witness over all things.

If You punish them, lo! they are Your slaves, and if You forgive them (lo! they are Your slaves). Lo! you, only You, are the Mighty, the Wise." (Qur'an 5:116-118)

They surely disbelieve who say: "Lo! Allah is the Messiah, son of Mary." The Messiah (himself) said: "O Children of Israel, worship Allah, my Lord and your Lord." Lo! whoso ascribes partners unto Allah, for him Allah has forbidden paradise. His abode is the Fire. For the wrong-doers there will be no helpers. (5:72)

It befits not (the Majesty of) Allah that He should take unto Himself a son. Glory be to Him! When He decrees a thing, He says unto it only: Be! and it is.

[Jesus said]: "And indeed, Allah is my Lord and your Lord, so worship Him. That is the right path."(19:35-36)

And they say: The Beneficent hath taken unto Himself a son. Assuredly ye utter a disastrous thing. Whereby almost the heavens are torn, and the earth is split asunder and the mountains fall in ruins, That they attribute to the Most Merciful a son. When it is not meet for (the Majesty of) the Beneficent that He should choose a son.There is no one in the heavens and earth but that he comes to the Most Merciful as a servant. (19:88-93)

And they say: The Beneficent hath taken unto Himself a son. Be He Glorified! Nay, but (those whom they call sons) are honoured slaves. (21:26)

Peace.

 

[IAmZamzam]

Nobody know which Gospel the Koran was referring to but it's definitely not any of the "canonical" biblical ones. For instance, it quotes a passage which isn't to be found in any currently known still existing Gospel by anyone.

 

[peaceandlove]

I am very interested in Islam and I have been reading a lot about Islam lately and I know that Muslims do not believe that Jesus was divine.
But in the Bible (John 8-58) Jesus applied God's Holy name to himself.

Any help with this would be greatly appreciated.
Thanks in advance

Mausi

Two answers to your question to the best of my knowlege Allah has given to me.

a) First of all we Muslims believe in Original scriptures to be the word of Allah , like Torat,Zaboor,Injell,Quran etc.

There is no where Bibble is mentioned as Holy Book in Quran. Bibble might contain some translation from original scripture , but that not the original form now, that what will be the first answer.

b) What I know Bibble means books of books, it might contain translation from orignal scripture,It might contain words of Prophets, It might contain words of companions of Prophet, It might contain words by Christian scholars etc

And if you see you might find a 'red letter bibble' red letter means those word (according to Christian sources are words of Prophet Eisa alisalam) , the rest are word might be from Paul or some other scholars, read that book and I think the verse you quotes is not from red letter that mean it might be word of some scholar and not Prophet Eisa alisalm.

 

[selsebil]

Hello Brother,
We,Muslims, love Jesus as a great Prophet of God,but not son of God or God.Jesus is a human being like you and me. Almighty God is above having mother and father, relatives or wife.Quran denies the divinity of those who have offspring and parents and equals; and it is to show that they are not worthy of being worshipped.Almighty God is above all relations which suggest giving birth and being born. He is exempt from having any partners, helpers, or fellows. His relations with all beings are those of Creator. He creates through His pre-eternal will with the command of “Be!,” and it is. He is far beyond having any relation which is contrary to perfection, or is compelling, necessitating, or involuntary.Almighty God is pre-eternal and post-eternal, He is the First and the Last. Neither in His essence, nor in His attributes, nor in His actions, has He in any way any equal, peer, like, or match, or anything similar, resembling, or analogous to Him. Only, in His acts, there may be comparisons expressing similarity.
Original Bible is the word of God.Bible and Torah have been translated again and again, and a great many alien words have become intermingled with them. Also, the words of commentators and their false interpretations have been confused with their verses. In addition, the distortions of the ignorant and the hostile have been incorporated into them. In these ways, the corruptions and alterations have multiplied in those Books.
Hope that helped.

Peace!