how christian women view muslim women

[Umm Yoosuf]

This does seem to be the unfortunate case. It does appear that the Muslim woman has a much harder time accepting and respecting the non-muslim woman, than vice versa. This makes me wonder why there are SO many threads pertaining to the Muslim woman trying to defend her attire. To be quite honest,

Bearing in mind that this forum is a populated by muslims then of course people are going to defend the Hijab and are for Covering. I don't dislike non-muslim women i just don't like their action's and how they make their bodies public.

I don't think that many non-muslim women care how the Muslim woman dresses (nor do they tend to pass judgement).

The number of non-muslim women who are interesting in the way i dress is phenomenal. Also the number of women I have seen revert to Islam due them finding the beauty of the HIjab is amazing.

Some if not all do pass judgements. There a the few that just except the Hijab. I think what is shocking to most non-Muslim women is the fact that we Muslim actually feel sorry for the you dress. Many non-Muslim are expecting the Muslim women to say, “I wish I was librated” or “I am oppressed” however, you come to relies that we feel comfortable and our perspective of the Hijab is a noble view.

 

[MinAhlilHadeeth]

I don't know where you are located. However, I really don't think that the majority of people in the USA view the Muslim woman as being oppressed, or automatically consider them to be victims of domestic abuse. I think the Muslim woman is fretting about this needlessly.

Uh no... you should see the comments I get. One day i came to school with a face cover, and my tutor asked me if i had been forced into a marriage.....:rollseyes.

 

[irsha]

I am from Australia. I dont think we actually think much about them as far as they are dressed, but there is a certain amount of distrust when you see them, from the point of view that they dont mix with us, they tend to keep to themselves, we never see them smile or laugh, and of course there is the terrorism thing, one does get a bit uncomfortable when a muslim walks in wearing a backpack.

 

[HeiGou]

It's true that Muslim women are perceived as oppressed by alot of people. It's a shame, because most Muslimahs feel liberated by their hijab.

Well, without wanting to sound rude, how do you know? Have you polled all that many? I know of a lot of Muslimas who say that but if pushed say the real reason they wear it is because God wants them to. Which is not the same as feeling liberated.

Islam gave us rights that modern women were only given in the last 100 years.

This one comes up a lot too. What rights do you have in mind? To a limited extent you are right in that the Victorian period in the English-speaking world was tough on women's property rights. But they gave women other rights as well. Still you can't, in all fairness, take a very restricted period of time, in a very restricted part of the world, and argue that applies to all non-Muslim women in the world, can you? And even then, what makes you think that Muslim women were better off than English women in the late Nineteenth century? A lot of Muslim men came to the West and saw Western women and I assure you precisely none of them I know of said, poor Western women look how oppressed they are! What they said is, more or less, Western men allow their women a shameless degree of freedom and immorality.

Alot of people forget this and think we are 'hiding' behind the veil, and our fathers/husbands have probably beaten us into wearing hijab.

That may not be true for you, but do you think it might be true for some? Some people see the need to enforce hijab by throwing acid at women or cutting them with razors. Do you think that the women who wear it because of those threats are oppressed?

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

I am from Australia. I dont think we actually think much about them as far as they are dressed, but there is a certain amount of distrust when you see them, from the point of view that they dont mix with us, they tend to keep to themselves, we never see them smile or laugh, and of course there is the terrorism thing, one does get a bit uncomfortable when a muslim walks in wearing a backpack.

How about you pop in a mosque and talked to some muslim women. In my local mosque we normally get non-muslim visitors. The Non-muslim women go to the sisters section and they talk to us and learn bit about Islam. We joke and lught with them and they with us also we answer their question. There is where they truly find sisterhood. And alot of their misconception about Islam flies out of the window. Some revert to Islam and some do not choose to either way we try our best to stay in contact

 

[renak]

Bearing in mind that this forum is a populated by muslims then of course people are going to defend the Hijab and are for Covering. I don't dislike non-muslim women i just don't like their action's and how they make their bodies public.

I do understand that this is an Islamic forum. However, the Hijab was never insulted. There is no need to defend it. I find it disheartening that many feel the need to insult the western dress.


The number of non-muslim women who are interesting in the way i dress is phenomenal. Also the number of women I have seen revert to Islam due them finding the beauty of the HIjab is amazing.

Some if not all do pass judgements. There a the few that just except the Hijab. I think what is shocking to most non-Muslim women is the fact that we Muslim actually feel sorry for the you dress. Many non-Muslim are expecting the Muslim women to say, “I wish I was librated” or “I am oppressed” however, you come to relies that we feel comfortable and our perspective of the Hijab is a noble view.

You probably live in an area in which the Muslims have not integrated into Western society. What you explained above would bother me a bit. I'm just used to living in an area in which the Muslims have fully integrated, and dress like Westerners.

On a lighter note, I have offered to my boyfriend that I would wear Hijab because it would be easier than styling my hair.kay:

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

On a lighter note, I have offered to my boyfriend that I would wear Hijab because it would be easier than styling my hair.kay:

hahahahaha

Yeah just pop it on...no one will see your when your having a bad hair day

 

[renak]

hahahahaha

Yeah just pop it on...no one will see your when your having a bad hair day

My idea exactly! I even offered to wear the burka, but he wasn't interested in that either. See, where I live, Muslims really don't find covering to be of importance. It is interesting to hear about women in other regions, who still adhere to the dress code.

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

My idea exactly! I even offered to wear the burka, but he wasn't interested in that either. See, where I live, Muslims really don't find covering to be of importance. It is interesting to hear about women in other regions, who still adhere to the dress code.

Is your boyfriend muslim is he:rollseyes

Well thats the difference between practising Muslim's and not practising Muslim's. The Hijab is a command from Allah to the women.

 

[renak]

Is your boyfriend muslim is he:rollseyes

Well thats the difference between practising Muslim's and not practising Muslim's. The Hijab is a command from Allah to the women.

He is muslim. However, very few muslims in my area wear the hijab. Most would still consider themselves practicing muslims.

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

He is muslim. However, very few muslims in my area wear the hijab. Most would still consider themselves practicing muslims.

Your area been....?

May Allah guide him. How about you invite him to the fourm. Hijab is not merely a covering dress of the head. Theres more to the Hijab then this

 

[Abu Zakariya]

Keep it clean and respectful, please.

I think this was a fair question to ask.

When a brother criticized prostitution, Knut asked him if he did this because he was offended because prostitution preceded Islam, according to him.

I think it's fair then to ask him if he is offended and defends prostitution because it is maybe the profession of his sister and mother. Maybe even his girlfriend/wife? If he has one.
That may very well be the reason for his defence of prostitution.

 

[Mohsin]

hey renak you're a christian right and you believe in the NT

Well Jesus PBUH says

You have heard that it was said, 'You shall not commit adultery'. But I say to you that everyone who so much as looks at woman with evil desire for her has already committed adultery with her in his heart. (Matt. 5:2728)

Now adultery is a big sin. If you're gonna dress in a revealing way so that men look at you, you're causing them to committ adultery. So you're helping them sin. Can't you see here Jesus PBUH has said you can't look at a woman. it's the same with islam, its what is says in the Qur'an, for us to lower our gazes, but Islam is practical, it provides a way, by having hijab for sisters so that men don't look with evil desires

 

[HeiGou]

Now adultery is a big sin. If you're gonna dress in a revealing way so that men look at you, you're causing them to committ adultery. So you're helping them sin. Can't you see here Jesus PBUH has said you can't look at a woman. it's the same with islam, its what is says in the Qur'an, for us to lower our gazes, but Islam is practical, it provides a way, by having hijab for sisters so that men don't look with evil desires

Actually it is not quite the same with Islam - at least not the Islam we have seen displayed around here. Jesus does not blame the women. He says if a man looks at a woman with lust in his heart, he has sinned. Not if a man has looked at a woman with lust is his heart, she's a slut.

Now I do not know what Islam says specifically, but the way that it is sometimes crudely interpreted around here is problematic.

 

[suhura]

I can see that renak and her friend is frustrated by our fellow muslimah who are defending the hijab by criticising the modern women dress code instead.

I feel the same too about the modern women dressing. One reason for us muslims to feel so is because of how women are being treated.

Did you know that before Islam was introduced women had no rights to speak up, to decide, to education and to earn. They were treated as slaves, men used them to earn money by selling them off as prostitues. women at that time didnt wear much clothings. Basically, women were deppressed and oppressed!

When Islam came into this world prophet muhammad pbuh helped women by letting them know that they have a right to be respected as a human not as an object for sexual desires.

One of these rights meant to cover themselves with clothings that only reveals the palm and face so man are not distracted by sexual desires when communicating with women.

Generally, women have gone through so much just to be respected as an equal. Just think, how could women have made that leap from being used to being liberated? Men's weakness is women's body. So Men can only see the real us if we cover ourselves.

Educated Muslim woman who wear hijab are just angry as to why women want to go back to that time by wearing dresses that are revealing.We want to be seen and heard as an individual by speaking up not by revealing our assets.

 

[HeiGou]

Did you know that before Islam was introduced women had no rights to speak up, to decide, to education and to earn. They were treated as slaves, men used them to earn money by selling them off as prostitues. women at that time didnt wear much clothings. Basically, women were deppressed and oppressed!

Really? This is the same society that produce Khadija? Didn't she run her own business - sending men to Syria to trade. Didn't she choose her own husband over the choices of her father? In what way did she not have the right to speak up and to decide? As for getting educated, well, few people back then got educated but what is the evidence that Khadija did not? She certainly had the right to earn her own living didn't she? How can you claim that she, or any other Arab woman before Islam, was treated as a slave? Muslimas converted, can you name one that was sold off as a prostitute because of it? I may not be reading the right accounts, but they sounds neither depressed nor oppressed to me. Why do you think they were?

And, incidentally, the Arab world was a tiny part of the larger world. Even if all this applied to Arab women in Mecca, what makes you think it applied to anyone else?

When Islam came into this world prophet muhammad pbuh helped women by letting them know that they have a right to be respected as a human not as an object for sexual desires.

Can you name a Muslim woman who had a career like Khadija's?

Men's weakness is women's body. So Men can only see the real us if we cover ourselves.

Some men perhaps, but do you think that really applies to all men?

Educated Muslim woman who wear hijab are just angry as to why women want to go back to that time by wearing dresses that are revealing.We want to be seen and heard as an individual by speaking up not by revealing our assets.

What makes you think you will be seen and heard at all? Are the women of Saudi Arabia seen and heard much?

 

[Ansar Al-'Adl]

First of all, last warning to everyone - stay on topic or the thread will be closed.

Hello Renak,

I would say that it is a very good assumption that it was man made.

I don't care for conjecture, imagination or assumptions, especially when they are illogical as men only lose from women covering themselves and abstaining from sex.

Sure. Explain in more detail please.

Which part did you not understand?

Are you saying that slavery does or does not exist in Islamic Law?

Islam restricted the sources of slavery and encouraged (mandated in some cases) the freeing of slaves - this has already been covered in this topic:
http://www.islamicboard.com/refutations/8369-slave-girls.html

Not all muslims on this site practice modest dress. I've known very few muslims, out of very many, who practice modest dress. Are you saying that these individuals are wrong? If only those muslims who practice modest dress are true muslims, I would venture to say that this world has far fewer muslims than it likes others to believe.

Muslims who do not adhere to the laws of Islam are mistaken and have erred but that doesn't mean they are automatically disbelievers. May God help us all to improve in the practice our religion.

However, you are neglecting to take into account the prostitutes who make the decision to enter into the profession, and control all aspects of their lives. In the USA they are quite numerous.

I am not neglecting that. You said that when someone is reduced to an object of desire they increase in power, authority, and influence - a statment that is blatantly false. A person of authority and influence is one who is intelligent and can lead others; you do the greatest disservice to women when you state that their greatest influence is as a material possesion.

However, in my society, as a working woman, I would not be accepted if I were covered. Dressing in modern fashion is a necessity.

This is the part where I say, "Aha!" Can you not see the problem in what you have just said? Can you not see the contradiction in claiming liberation and then admitting that
a) you would not be accepted in society if you did not dress in a revealing manner pleasing to men and
b) that a woman in western society has maximum influence when she is reduced to an object of desire.

These are both points you have made which indicate that the position of women in your society is much worse than it seems.

Hello Irsha,
You missed my post here:
http://www.islamicboard.com/243862-post68.html

I would really like your response to my comments on your statements that I found to be franlky very bigoted and narrow-minded.

Hey, thats a bit unfair, I already said you have every right to dress how you want, and so do I, it only becomes a problem if one of us tells the other what they MUST do.

I think the problem comes in you statements that you feel sorry for Muslims who are "shackled by their jealous rules" - such a statement reeks of intolerance and effectively negates your claim of mutual respect.

No because God commands men and women to dress in the modest manner outlined in the Qur'an and the Sunnah whereas there is no command to take slaves.

In your opinion

No, not in my opinion, it's fact. Show me a quote from the Qur'an or Sunnah mandating slavery.

That is their right to think that, but have you asked the vast majority if they really think that? I think it would depend on how you asked the question. Many would have their price when it came down to it, after the movie "indecent proposal" I asked a few women who's first reaction was - "no way" when I asked them, what if someone offered you 10 million dollars, thinking of how much charity they could do- quess what, many changed their tune. Also, ask a Palestinian women would she do it for the price of freedom for her whole country- I can quess what the answer may be. The point is- everyone has their price, some just higher than others.

Thank you for proving my point. You just pointed out that these women only do it for the money or freedom, not because they find the job elevating or influential - if they had an alternative to get the money or freedom they would do it.

peace.

 

[Lush]

Why any women would want to display her body to the public, I don’t understand?! Suppose you have a very valuable necklace made of natural diamond or a precious jewel, you would be keen to keep it safe, at the same admire, and be fond of it. You would not go and put it freely within the hands of other people or to misallocate in such a way that it can be liable to the risks of theft and loss or alternatively to keep, fear on and conserve it in a safe place where nobody’s hand can be able to reach to or even be viewed to by whatsoever eyes. Why not liken your body to this and keep it your own business? Everyone around you knows that you posse a precious jewel, however, they cannot see or predict its shape or colour.

This is an argument I encounter over and over again on messageboards, and websites, and the like.

A Muslim woman who willingly objectifies herself by comparing herself to an inanimate object.

You are not a necklace! You're a human being! Dress however you like, wear an abaya, a niqaab, or peacock feather, but DO NOT, for the sake of all that is holy in all of us, compare yourself to a pretty little rock! You have a soul! You are NOT an object!

On another thread, a Muslim guy compared a woman to a hamburger, and then everyone got all surprised when I took issue with that... Holy cow, do people not realize that by doing this they are practicing basic dehumanization?!

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

I see you have no other objectives. Stop been so critical and debate my point.

 

[Lush]

I have already posted my comments regarding dress code on this thread, you're welcome to read them, they're a few pages back.

Dehumanizing yourself and other women like you have just done is a real issue. Think about the implications of your words before you compare women to pretty playthings or anything of that matter. I've got a number of female Muslim friends who say that wearing hijab makes them feel closer to God and farther away from the material world. That's a point of view I respect, not demeaning statements that reduce women to glittering inanimate objects.