snakelegs
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namaste,
off topic: did india ever adopt a common civil code, or is it still being discussed?
Indian Muslims need gov’t help – Report
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namaste,
off topic: did india ever adopt a common civil code, or is it still being discussed?
justahumane
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Namaste Brother,
Right wing hindu party BJP (Bhartiya Janta Party) has long been demanding common civil code inspite of Muslim Personal Laws which governs muslims in India. But muslims and secular parties are harshly opposing it. Therefore it is still being discuessed........and U can take it from me......it will never see the light of the day.
Namaste again.
justahumane
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Do U have anything else than propoganda statement to discuess here brother? I really dont understand what u want to prove with ur link. Plz eleborate. This article is nothing but bundle of malaice in form of falsehood.
BTW if u have something worthwhile to refute my statements in this thread than plz come ahead, and if u dont have, than......... just chill.
Greetings.
Last edited:
Hope you will find the answer about your question on this forum http://www.islamicboard.com/world-affairs/33954-muslim-scholars-fighting-polio-india.html
justahumane
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No brother, I m yet to find my answer even there. It was due to Mullahs' and Maulvis' propoganda that poor parents refrained from giving polio drops to their children, they were told by them that drops will render their children infertile and government is planning to destroy islam. This vicious propoganda resulted in rise of polio cases among muslims. Government had to request muslim celebrities along with prominent muslim scholers to come ahead and give a message to muslims that this is no government's plot to destroy Islam but to save their own children from polio.
U know that its street muslim clerics who rule the heart and actions of muslims in India.
Hope to get ur answer NOW. but no link plz, just talk with me what u have in ur heart.
snakelegs
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namaste,
off topic (again) - what finally happened with the imrana case - was she allowed to be with her husband? have heard different things. thanks in advance.
i promise not to go off topic any more in this thread.
justahumane
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Namaste brother,
Nothing like off topic here brother, we are discussing muslims in India.
Imrana's father in law has been sentenced for 10 years in jail for raping his dauthter in law. But muslim clerics are not allowing Imrana to live with her husband coz they say that he is now like a brother to Imrana. However laws of the land allows her to live with her husband and to give her all possible protection too if she needs. U can check this link for further information, what clerics are saying on this issue.
http://www.indiaenews.com/religion/20061020/25788.htm
What are different things that u have heard? plz let me know.
Namaste again.
This is also a system which Muslims of India do face or voluntary or involuntary commit ---------------
NEW DELHI: A private TV channel today claimed to have unearthed corruption in allocation of seats to Haj pilgrims in a sting operation, alleging some members and officials of Haj Committees accepted bribes to send people on the pilgrimage. The Cobrapost-IBN7 sting operation claimed that the Haj committee members and officials of Haryana, Delhi and Himachal Pradesh took bribes ranging from Rs 800 to Rs 15,000. Nine officials of the three Haj committees were alleged to have been caught on camera accepting bribes from reporters posing as travel agents in the sting operation aired tonight. PTI
NEW DELHI: A private TV channel today claimed to have unearthed corruption in allocation of seats to Haj pilgrims in a sting operation, alleging some members and officials of Haj Committees accepted bribes to send people on the pilgrimage. The Cobrapost-IBN7 sting operation claimed that the Haj committee members and officials of Haryana, Delhi and Himachal Pradesh took bribes ranging from Rs 800 to Rs 15,000. Nine officials of the three Haj committees were alleged to have been caught on camera accepting bribes from reporters posing as travel agents in the sting operation aired tonight. PTI
NEW DELHI, Dec 27: Prime Minister Manmohan Singh on Wednesday said sections of minorities including Muslims had not shared the fruits of development in India and pledged to take measures to end “such inequities”.
Addressing a Dalit-Minority International Conference here, Manmohan Singh said some minorities, particularly the Jains and Sikhs, had fared relatively well in the process of social and economic development.
“However, other minorities, especially the Muslim community in certain parts of our country, have not had an equal share of the fruits of development,” he said, reading out a prepared speech. “It is incumbent upon any democratically elected government to redress such imbalances and eradicate such inequities. Our government is indeed committed to doing so.”
And in an obvious reference to the opposition to the reservation of seats for the underprivileged in institutions of higher learning, he said it was incumbent upon the government to ensure that the growth process was not only equitable but also seen to be so.
“Even as absolute poverty may be reduced by growth, inequalities can get sharpened. This can be politically and socially destabilizing. Hence, we have to take steps that reduce social and economic inequalities, without hurting the process of growth and without reducing the incentives for individual enterprise and creativity.”
But he emphasized that administrative measures the government takes to develop the capabilities of such groups are not the end-all and be-all of positive action against social discrimination and disparities. “We need a change in mindsets. This requires a wider, broad-based social, political and cultural movement against all forms of discrimination and injustice. The battle for social equality has to be waged and won in our minds.
“We have to recognize that even in a free society there are glass windows and glass ceilings. The first step in dealing with such problems is to recognize their existence. “The second step is to come up with universally acceptable policies that are not viewed as a zero sum game, but as win-win solutions through which everyone is better off and no one is worse off.”
Manmohan Singh also said that Dalits had faced “a unique discrimination” in Indian society that could be compared only with Apartheid and that anti-Dalit attitudes had not gone away. “Even after 60 years of constitutional and legal protection and support, there is still social discrimination against dalits in many parts of our country. The political, social, cultural and intellectual battle against such discrimination must continue.“Our government is deeply and sincerely committed to the equality of all sections of our society and will take all necessary steps to help in the social, educational and economic empowerment of Dalits.”
Wednesday’s meeting was organized by Steel Minister Ram Vilas Paswan and attended among others by former prime ministers V.P. Singh and Inder Kumar Gujral.
Speaking about minorities, Manmohan Singh said that their specific problems should ideally be dealt with based on certain universal principles.
“These principles, I believe, are defined by the idea of equality before law, the universal application of the rule of law, commitment to basic human rights, and the right of minority groups to protect, preserve and promote the values cherished by such groups.”
He urged the conference to “pay more attention to finding solutions to a problem rather than merely harp on the problem”.
The prime minister made a pointed reference to Narendra Jadhav of the Reserve Bank of India, saying his book “Outcaste” had deeply moved him. “It was a soul stirring account of empowerment and liberation.” IANS
Addressing a Dalit-Minority International Conference here, Manmohan Singh said some minorities, particularly the Jains and Sikhs, had fared relatively well in the process of social and economic development.
“However, other minorities, especially the Muslim community in certain parts of our country, have not had an equal share of the fruits of development,” he said, reading out a prepared speech. “It is incumbent upon any democratically elected government to redress such imbalances and eradicate such inequities. Our government is indeed committed to doing so.”
And in an obvious reference to the opposition to the reservation of seats for the underprivileged in institutions of higher learning, he said it was incumbent upon the government to ensure that the growth process was not only equitable but also seen to be so.
“Even as absolute poverty may be reduced by growth, inequalities can get sharpened. This can be politically and socially destabilizing. Hence, we have to take steps that reduce social and economic inequalities, without hurting the process of growth and without reducing the incentives for individual enterprise and creativity.”
But he emphasized that administrative measures the government takes to develop the capabilities of such groups are not the end-all and be-all of positive action against social discrimination and disparities. “We need a change in mindsets. This requires a wider, broad-based social, political and cultural movement against all forms of discrimination and injustice. The battle for social equality has to be waged and won in our minds.
“We have to recognize that even in a free society there are glass windows and glass ceilings. The first step in dealing with such problems is to recognize their existence. “The second step is to come up with universally acceptable policies that are not viewed as a zero sum game, but as win-win solutions through which everyone is better off and no one is worse off.”
Manmohan Singh also said that Dalits had faced “a unique discrimination” in Indian society that could be compared only with Apartheid and that anti-Dalit attitudes had not gone away. “Even after 60 years of constitutional and legal protection and support, there is still social discrimination against dalits in many parts of our country. The political, social, cultural and intellectual battle against such discrimination must continue.“Our government is deeply and sincerely committed to the equality of all sections of our society and will take all necessary steps to help in the social, educational and economic empowerment of Dalits.”
Wednesday’s meeting was organized by Steel Minister Ram Vilas Paswan and attended among others by former prime ministers V.P. Singh and Inder Kumar Gujral.
Speaking about minorities, Manmohan Singh said that their specific problems should ideally be dealt with based on certain universal principles.
“These principles, I believe, are defined by the idea of equality before law, the universal application of the rule of law, commitment to basic human rights, and the right of minority groups to protect, preserve and promote the values cherished by such groups.”
He urged the conference to “pay more attention to finding solutions to a problem rather than merely harp on the problem”.
The prime minister made a pointed reference to Narendra Jadhav of the Reserve Bank of India, saying his book “Outcaste” had deeply moved him. “It was a soul stirring account of empowerment and liberation.” IANS
snakelegs
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thanks for the link. i was following this case in the beginning, but haven't recently and have heard conflicting stories.
as far as i know, she wanted to remain with her husband, and he wanted her to - is she with him now finally (in spite of the opinion of some clerics)? i am glad to hear that her father-in-law has been jailed for his criminal act.
i have read that many muslims are not at all happy with the All India Muslim Personal Law Board (AIMPLB) and do not consider their decisions as binding or representative.
the article confirms what i knew - that there is a diversity of views among clerics themselves as to what the shariah ruling on this case should be. in many cases, there is not even such a thing as "The Shariah" because the clerics are not of one mind (which is how it should be, i think).
i have read that there are many indian muslims who would welcome a common civil code.
in general, i think india's version of secularism (including money for haj, as mentioned in some other posts on this thread) is sort of flawed, and cannot help but cause resentment/backlash. a better model would be the concept of "separation of church and state", as understood in the u.s. (though it has never been fully practiced and is being chipped away by the fundamentalist christians who have gained so much influence in u.s. government in recent years). under this model, there would be no money for haj from the government, or any other special privileges for any group.
how much pressure is there on imrana and her husband to follow the harsher ruling?
it's a sad case.....
“Muslim problem” not economic: Sachar report must pave way for Dalit-Muslim unity
Muslims in “Hindu India” are hated, persecuted, jailed, dubbed terrorists and killed in thousands not because they are poor. But our learned PM does not know even this simple truth.
India’s “Muslim problem” is not economic. It is social and cultural. We have said this many times.
They are hated by the Brahminical Social Order not because they are poor but because the religion of Muslims cuts at the very root of Brahminism which helped make India’s 15% micro-minority upper castes rulers of this land.
Serpent & mongoose: Islam and Brahminism, which goes by the name of Hinduism, are like mongoose and serpent. The Hindus hate Islam because its values are much superior, more attractive and dynamic to the oppressed millions under Hinduism. Muslims ruled India for about 1,000 years and a “foreign religion” simply attracted the Untouchables, Tribals, Backward Castes, the three segments persecuted by the Hindus. Already the Muslim population is nearing 20%. And it is increasing day by day.
So much so Hindu India may soon disappear and Islam has a glorious future is the prediction made by a Hindu (Dr. S. Bheemappa, India on the path of Islamisation, 2006, Rs. 195, copies available with DV office).
But our “brilliant” Prime Minister and his cronies in the cabinet floating in their dream-land of 9% GDP do not know these simple facts.
Sachar’s shocking verdict: Manmohan Singh’s ignorance of India’s socio-cultural situation is appalling. That is why in his Dec.9, 2006 speech at the National Development Council that “Muslims must have claim on resources” and “we will have to devise innovative plans to ensure that minorities... are empowered to share equitably the fruits of development”, he spoke nonsense.
The PM belongs to the same jati of Rajinder Sachar. Both are upper caste Khatris. The only difference is Sachar is a Hindu and the PM a Sikh. The latest report of Sachar, who cannot be credited with any anti-Hindu bias, is a shocking verdict on the Hindu hatred. Anybody reading the report will come to the conclusion that the Hindu rulers of India suffer from serious anti-Muslim prejudices. Nay. Hinduism itself is another word for hate.
On one side they hate Muslims and another side they also hate Dalits. Hate is the staple diet of Hindus.
We don’t want to go into the details of the Sachar report. India’s “national” toilet papers have covered it. The only conclusion that we can draw is that during the 60 years of Brahminical rule the Hindus have reduced the Muslims as the new Dalits (Untouchables).
Explosive commodity: Having Hinduised (enslaved) the Dalits in a big way, the Hindu rulers of India have injected their Hindu poison and made them suffer in silence. But that is not the case with Muslims. The rulers might have persecuted Muslims and violently tackled them but they could do nothing with their revolutionary religion of Islam. The more they pounce upon Muslims and plunder them the more they hug Islam and become better Muslims. India is already the world’s largest Muslim country (barring Indonesia) and once this combustible community explodes in fury the grass-eating cowardly Hindus will be hounded and humbled. Beware.
In their hurry to jump into the crumbling American bandwagon and become the tail of the West, the rulers of India are playing with fire. Remember, Muslims are an explosive commodity. Even the world’s most powerful country, America, is learning this lesson at great cost. The whole of Christian West is trembling before the Islamic fury. The mighty Israel got defeated by the puny Hezbollah.
The Brahminical rulers have antagonised every section of India’s population. The more they irritate them and needle them, the more violent they will become. The explosion of Maharashtra Dalits in the first week of December 2006 is yet another warning.
Muslims of India by and large have been simply suffering the pains and pangs of Hindu persecution. But they are about to lose their patience. Sachar committee report has spoken the truth.
Once a substantial section of Muslim masses lose their patience, it will simply turn into a killer Katrina. Till this day Muslims of India did not produce a single suicide bomber. Not even the Modi experiment in the Gujarat Genocide of 2002 produced one. But the Sachar committee report is sure to add fuel to fire.
And once the Dalits and Muslims, the country’s two worst persecuted sections, turn combustible who can control them?
Brahminical rulers are driving the peace-loving destitutes towards bloody violence.
Bahujan unity: Knowing the Hindus and their shastras (scriptures) we have no hope of the hate-mongering Hindus changing their value system which comes from their religion. Their religion (Sanatana Dharma) has not changed even a coma since their (Aryan) invasion thousands of years ago. How can it change now when the Hindus have become the rulers of the land and flying high in the 9% GDP cloud?
Sachar or no Sachar, the “Hindu mind” will continue to be a hate-filled can of poisonous snakes.
That means as the country’s two most important persecuted sections — Dalits and Muslims — lose their patience and decide to confront the micro-minority hate-mongers, what will happen we can well imagine. Dalit-Muslim unity, which we have been advocating since 30 years, is the only solution to bring peace to this strife-torn land. Once the unity of the 20% Dalits and another 20% Muslims takes place the BCs will automatically come and we have the Bahujan Samaj of Babasaheb Ambedkar’s dream.
For such a unity the initiative has to come from the toiling Muslim masses who are already living with Dalits and one with Dalits. Such a unity will bring a new leadership to the fore rejecting the existing elite leadership of the Muslims and the corrupt leadership of Dalits. And thereby rescue our India from its alien rulers.
http://dalitvoice.org/Templates/jan2007/editorial.htm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the above editorial will give some light to the Muslims and non Muslims alike, the problem of Muslims of india is multi - dimensional .
Muslims in “Hindu India” are hated, persecuted, jailed, dubbed terrorists and killed in thousands not because they are poor. But our learned PM does not know even this simple truth.
India’s “Muslim problem” is not economic. It is social and cultural. We have said this many times.
They are hated by the Brahminical Social Order not because they are poor but because the religion of Muslims cuts at the very root of Brahminism which helped make India’s 15% micro-minority upper castes rulers of this land.
Serpent & mongoose: Islam and Brahminism, which goes by the name of Hinduism, are like mongoose and serpent. The Hindus hate Islam because its values are much superior, more attractive and dynamic to the oppressed millions under Hinduism. Muslims ruled India for about 1,000 years and a “foreign religion” simply attracted the Untouchables, Tribals, Backward Castes, the three segments persecuted by the Hindus. Already the Muslim population is nearing 20%. And it is increasing day by day.
So much so Hindu India may soon disappear and Islam has a glorious future is the prediction made by a Hindu (Dr. S. Bheemappa, India on the path of Islamisation, 2006, Rs. 195, copies available with DV office).
But our “brilliant” Prime Minister and his cronies in the cabinet floating in their dream-land of 9% GDP do not know these simple facts.
Sachar’s shocking verdict: Manmohan Singh’s ignorance of India’s socio-cultural situation is appalling. That is why in his Dec.9, 2006 speech at the National Development Council that “Muslims must have claim on resources” and “we will have to devise innovative plans to ensure that minorities... are empowered to share equitably the fruits of development”, he spoke nonsense.
The PM belongs to the same jati of Rajinder Sachar. Both are upper caste Khatris. The only difference is Sachar is a Hindu and the PM a Sikh. The latest report of Sachar, who cannot be credited with any anti-Hindu bias, is a shocking verdict on the Hindu hatred. Anybody reading the report will come to the conclusion that the Hindu rulers of India suffer from serious anti-Muslim prejudices. Nay. Hinduism itself is another word for hate.
On one side they hate Muslims and another side they also hate Dalits. Hate is the staple diet of Hindus.
We don’t want to go into the details of the Sachar report. India’s “national” toilet papers have covered it. The only conclusion that we can draw is that during the 60 years of Brahminical rule the Hindus have reduced the Muslims as the new Dalits (Untouchables).
Explosive commodity: Having Hinduised (enslaved) the Dalits in a big way, the Hindu rulers of India have injected their Hindu poison and made them suffer in silence. But that is not the case with Muslims. The rulers might have persecuted Muslims and violently tackled them but they could do nothing with their revolutionary religion of Islam. The more they pounce upon Muslims and plunder them the more they hug Islam and become better Muslims. India is already the world’s largest Muslim country (barring Indonesia) and once this combustible community explodes in fury the grass-eating cowardly Hindus will be hounded and humbled. Beware.
In their hurry to jump into the crumbling American bandwagon and become the tail of the West, the rulers of India are playing with fire. Remember, Muslims are an explosive commodity. Even the world’s most powerful country, America, is learning this lesson at great cost. The whole of Christian West is trembling before the Islamic fury. The mighty Israel got defeated by the puny Hezbollah.
The Brahminical rulers have antagonised every section of India’s population. The more they irritate them and needle them, the more violent they will become. The explosion of Maharashtra Dalits in the first week of December 2006 is yet another warning.
Muslims of India by and large have been simply suffering the pains and pangs of Hindu persecution. But they are about to lose their patience. Sachar committee report has spoken the truth.
Once a substantial section of Muslim masses lose their patience, it will simply turn into a killer Katrina. Till this day Muslims of India did not produce a single suicide bomber. Not even the Modi experiment in the Gujarat Genocide of 2002 produced one. But the Sachar committee report is sure to add fuel to fire.
And once the Dalits and Muslims, the country’s two worst persecuted sections, turn combustible who can control them?
Brahminical rulers are driving the peace-loving destitutes towards bloody violence.
Bahujan unity: Knowing the Hindus and their shastras (scriptures) we have no hope of the hate-mongering Hindus changing their value system which comes from their religion. Their religion (Sanatana Dharma) has not changed even a coma since their (Aryan) invasion thousands of years ago. How can it change now when the Hindus have become the rulers of the land and flying high in the 9% GDP cloud?
Sachar or no Sachar, the “Hindu mind” will continue to be a hate-filled can of poisonous snakes.
That means as the country’s two most important persecuted sections — Dalits and Muslims — lose their patience and decide to confront the micro-minority hate-mongers, what will happen we can well imagine. Dalit-Muslim unity, which we have been advocating since 30 years, is the only solution to bring peace to this strife-torn land. Once the unity of the 20% Dalits and another 20% Muslims takes place the BCs will automatically come and we have the Bahujan Samaj of Babasaheb Ambedkar’s dream.
For such a unity the initiative has to come from the toiling Muslim masses who are already living with Dalits and one with Dalits. Such a unity will bring a new leadership to the fore rejecting the existing elite leadership of the Muslims and the corrupt leadership of Dalits. And thereby rescue our India from its alien rulers.
http://dalitvoice.org/Templates/jan2007/editorial.htm
----------------------------------------------------------------------
I think the above editorial will give some light to the Muslims and non Muslims alike, the problem of Muslims of india is multi - dimensional .
Again one of the many problems facing Muslims of india is ----------
Muslim prisoners
According to unofficial estimates, there are over 30% Muslim prisoners in most of the Indian jails. In proportion to the total population of Muslims, such a large number is a matter of great concern for which the biased attitude of police and courts is responsible. According to official statistics, the Muslim population of India is about 13.5%. But if we talk abut jails, the number of Muslims is estimated to be more than 30%. In jails of big cities like Delhi and Bombay, the condition is even worse where it is 35 to 40%.
—(Milli Gazette, Dec.1, 2006)
Muslim prisoners
According to unofficial estimates, there are over 30% Muslim prisoners in most of the Indian jails. In proportion to the total population of Muslims, such a large number is a matter of great concern for which the biased attitude of police and courts is responsible. According to official statistics, the Muslim population of India is about 13.5%. But if we talk abut jails, the number of Muslims is estimated to be more than 30%. In jails of big cities like Delhi and Bombay, the condition is even worse where it is 35 to 40%.
—(Milli Gazette, Dec.1, 2006)
What it really means is that a higher proportion of muslims are behaving as criminals in India. You are reading to much into the data. Why does it always have to be somebody elses fault?
PTI said CHENNAI:Karunanidhi's remarks at a meeting here in 2002, where he is reported to have said that Hindus meant 'thieves'.
Most of the time the crimes that the INDIAN Licenced Terrorists(ILT) do never come in the real media.
These ILT`s have the licence to enter your house any time they wish for without any search warrants or what so ever and loot the valuables you have (money, necklaces etc.,).
Now if you are going to say anything against them then they even may shoot you and declare you a terrorist.
Many muslim children have seen their father being beaten, money being stolen, belongings of their house being thrown from here to there, seen AK-47 being pointed at their head, etc.,etc.,
All this time I was not talking about KASHMIR, all this happens in ASSAM........................................................................................
Most of the time the crimes that the INDIAN Licenced Terrorists(ILT) do never come in the real media.
These ILT`s have the licence to enter your house any time they wish for without any search warrants or what so ever and loot the valuables you have (money, necklaces etc.,).
Now if you are going to say anything against them then they even may shoot you and declare you a terrorist.
Many muslim children have seen their father being beaten, money being stolen, belongings of their house being thrown from here to there, seen AK-47 being pointed at their head, etc.,etc.,
All this time I was not talking about KASHMIR, all this happens in ASSAM........................................................................................