Keep it up Turkey, you know what's best

[north_malaysian]

Sadly this is true. The founding father of Malaysia has said that the nation is not meant to be an Islamic state but secularly-governed. Islam is the official religion but so far it has remained only "official".

Actually Tun Mahathir (our previous PM) declared Malaysia as already an Islamic state in the Parliament, few days after the 9/11 attacks.

And the current Prime Minister, also stressing that Malaysia is an Islamic state and introducing his "Islam Hadhari" (Civilisational Islam) principles to Malaysian public.

The DAP (Democratic Action Party) wants Malaysia to be a secular nation and ask the current government to stop declaring Malaysia as an Islamic nation.

Meanwhile PAS (Pan-Malaysia Islamic Party) wants Malaysia to be the "True" Islamic nation, and claimed that currently Malaysia is not an Islamic nation.

 

[north_malaysian]

such a thng (a mosque which is closed for months) has never happened in my country alhamdulillah,there are more than 70 000 mosques in Turkiye n all of them is open everytime(busy mosques are open everytime till night but if it s a small one,they open it in every prayer time)..

Whoa... it's a good thing that they dont control mosques in Turkey.

In Malaysia, some mosques were demolished by the authorities. Some mosques were locked and open only for prayer time. In many states, some religious figures are banned from preaching in the mosques. And the worst thing is that, the current government wants it party's members to be the chairmen and committee members in all mosques' committee. Some of those, people never pray but were chosen to be the chairmen of the mosque committees.... CRAZY!

 

[syilla]

Whoa... it's a good thing that they dont control mosques in Turkey.

In Malaysia, some mosques were demolished by the authorities. Some mosques were locked and open only for prayer time. In many states, some religious figures are banned from preaching in the mosques. And the worst thing is that, the current government wants it party's members to be the chairmen and committee members in all mosques' committee. Some of those, people never pray but were chosen to be the chairmen of the mosque committees.... CRAZY!

do you have the lists of the mosques...

 

[north_malaysian]

do you have the lists of the mosques...

* Masjid Kampung Bujal, Terengganu (demolished 26.05.2005)
* Surau Seksyen 2, Taman Bendar Puteri Jaya, Sg. Petani, Kedah (demolished 17.04.2006)
* Surau Fatimah al Zahra, Taman Kosas, Selangor
* Surau Jubli Perak, Bandar Baru Bangi, Selangor
* Masjid Al Hidayah, Kelana Jaya, Selangor
* Masjid Al Munawwarah, Petaling Jaya Selangor
* Surau Ar Rashidin, Gombak, Selangor
* Masjid Darul Ehsan, Subang Jaya, Selangor

Source: http://www.ladang.net.my/idimensi/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=752

so there are 8 mosques..

 

[Darkseid]

This is why Turkey are part of the EU. They have more sense than the others.
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Million Protesters Gather In Istanbul

Updated: 17:52, Sunday April 29, 2007
Up to a million protesters have gathered in Istanbul accusing the government of planning an Islamist state and demanding it withdraw its presidential candidate.

Despite the Istanbul protests and a threat from the powerful army to intervene in the election, Foreign Minister Abdullah Gul, architect of Turkey's EU membership drive, said he would remain the ruling AK Party's candidate for head of state.

The protesters flooded the streets of Turkey's largest city to priase the army and denounce Gul and Prime Minister Tayyip Erdogan, whose AK Party enjoys a huge parliamentary majority, as a threat to a secular order separating state and religion.

"Turkey is secular and will remain secular," they chanted.

"Turkey is under threat from the AK Party leadership. We will not be able to express our thoughts like this if they stay in power," said protester Cigdem Yilmaz, 22, a student.

Top Turkish businessmen called for early parliamentary elections, which the AK party would appear well placed to win.

Many secularists are worried by Gul's Islamist past and the fact his wife wears the Muslim headscarf banned in universities and public offices.

But the AK Party, which has vigorously pressed liberal reforms and European Union membership ambitions, since election in 2002, denies any secret agenda.

http://news.sky.com/skynews/article/0,,30200-1263302,00.html

Well if they can also manage to ask for an end to their empire over the Kurds, Zazas, and Arabs then all will be rather peachy.

 

[islamirama]

Don't read too much into the news. The media likes to lie and throw in extra stuff. There's no million man protest or other mumbo jumbo. There's several thousand people protesting and nothing more. The AKP told the parliment (since they couldn't make up their mind) to change the rules and rather then them, let the people of Turkey vote and decide who their leader be. Why would a party do that if the country was against it? Pathetic media lies and nothing more.

Oh and AKP has done more for Turkey then any of these other secular parties. AKP helped improve the economy and so many other facits and helped pull Turkey to where it is right now. If they were unpopular they wouldn't hold most seats in the gov't

A comparison of the seats these parties held in the Turkish Parliament before (Oct 27) and after Nov 3, 2002:


AKP (Justice and Development Party) : Founded in 2001 as a pro-Islamist party by Mr. Erdogan and Mr. Gul, AKP gradually gained higher votes in each local and general elections surprising other political parties. In 2002 they became as the first party from the polls, with Abdullah Gül first as the Premiere, then Tayyip Erdogan after his political ban ended. All three coalition parties eliminated. CHP emerged as main opposition. For the first time in almost two decades, AKP ended up forming a single-party government. AKP rejects the "Islamist" label and claims that it is a pro-Western mainstream party with a "conservative" social agenda but also a firm commitment to liberal market economy and European Union membership. Today they have 367 members in TBMM.

 

[Skywalker]

The fact that the "AKP" is a somewhat Islamically-oriented party is very encouraging. What surprised me from that article was that Abdullah Gul is the one that's in charge of the EU membership drive, and at the same time is a man who supposedly has Islaimic values.

What I don't understand is how this AKP is Islamically-oriented when they're "vigorously pressing liberal reforms"? Anybody care to explain?

 

[north_malaysian]

The fact that the "AKP" is a somewhat Islamically-oriented party is very encouraging. What surprised me from that article was that Abdullah Gul is the one that's in charge of the EU membership drive, and at the same time is a man who supposedly has Islaimic values.

What I don't understand is how this AKP is Islamically-oriented when they're "vigorously pressing liberal reforms"? Anybody care to explain?

Abdil Han should have a good answer for that...

 

[KAding]

Don't read too much into the news. The media likes to lie and throw in extra stuff. There's no million man protest or other mumbo jumbo. There's several thousand people protesting and nothing more. The AKP told the parliment (since they couldn't make up their mind) to change the rules and rather then them, let the people of Turkey vote and decide who their leader be. Why would a party do that if the country was against it? Pathetic media lies and nothing more.

Oh and AKP has done more for Turkey then any of these other secular parties. AKP helped improve the economy and so many other facits and helped pull Turkey to where it is right now. If they were unpopular they wouldn't hold most seats in the gov't

A comparison of the seats these parties held in the Turkish Parliament before (Oct 27) and after Nov 3, 2002:


AKP (Justice and Development Party) : Founded in 2001 as a pro-Islamist party by Mr. Erdogan and Mr. Gul, AKP gradually gained higher votes in each local and general elections surprising other political parties. In 2002 they became as the first party from the polls, with Abdullah Gül first as the Premiere, then Tayyip Erdogan after his political ban ended. All three coalition parties eliminated. CHP emerged as main opposition. For the first time in almost two decades, AKP ended up forming a single-party government. AKP rejects the "Islamist" label and claims that it is a pro-Western mainstream party with a "conservative" social agenda but also a firm commitment to liberal market economy and European Union membership. Today they have 367 members in TBMM.

Nobody ever claimed the AK was not popular. You really should stop always accusing everyone else of lying and erecting these straw men, it betrays a very negative world view. If you would take a look at the chart you posted, you would notice the AK party got 34% of the vote. This is not a majority, it means 66% of the people voted for one of the other parties, pretty much all of which are more secular than the AKP. The Turks are simply very divided about this issue. Stop making this an issue of a few secular madman against the will of the people represented by the AK party.

Besides, are you sure you really want to side with the AK party? These are the same people that loudly praise Ataturk and want Turkey to join the European Union. This is the same Gul and Erdogan that wanted to support the US in the Iraq invasion but eventually got defeated by a parliamentary majority.

http://www.turkishweekly.net/news.php?id=44995

Two opinion polls published Thursday showed that the AKP was still Turkey's most popular party, leading its rivals with a wide margin ahead of the parliamentary elections.

The first survey, carried in the weekly magazine Tempo, found that 41.3 percent of respondents would vote for the AKP if elections were held instantly, reported AFP.

The CHP was second with only 13.6 percent of the vote.

A second poll, published in the Vatan newspaper, measured support for the AKP at 29.04 percent, with CHP second with 14.08 percent.

The survey published in Tempo found that 39.3 percent of Turks support the military's intervention, while 42.7 believe it was wrong.

Besides, it was not just the press that was 'lying' about the huge demonstrations. Your attempt to change a million protesters into 'thousands' is not supported by any facts. These figures were estimates by the police, not 'lying media'.

 

[KAding]

The fact that the "AKP" is a somewhat Islamically-oriented party is very encouraging. What surprised me from that article was that Abdullah Gul is the one that's in charge of the EU membership drive, and at the same time is a man who supposedly has Islaimic values.

What I don't understand is how this AKP is Islamically-oriented when they're "vigorously pressing liberal reforms"? Anybody care to explain?

When you are repressively secular and nationalist such as Turkey, liberal reforms also mean more religious and cultural freedom, for all groups, be they Christians, Kurds or indeed Muslims. So in this sense being more liberal also means being less hostile to Islam. It is only when you insist on starting to enforce Islamic rulings that liberalism and Islam become each others opposites.

 

[islamirama]

When you are repressively secular and nationalist such as Turkey, liberal reforms also mean more religious and cultural freedom, for all groups, be they Christians, Kurds or indeed Muslims. So in this sense being more liberal also means being less hostile to Islam. It is only when you insist on starting to enforce Islamic rulings that liberalism and Islam become each others opposites.

Have you looked at turkey lately? Islam is like banned there. Any one who wears a headscar is not allowed into the university or public offices for employment. There is no religious freedom there, only secular extremism.

 

[aLiTTLeTiMe]

Have you looked at turkey lately? Islam is like banned there. Any one who wears a headscar is not allowed into the university or public offices for employment. There is no religious freedom there, only secular extremism.

you are right brother..nobody live with rule of islam.such as headscar,religious school....

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

If anything no one is forcing Islam there. Practicing Muslims can't even enforce it on themselves without harassment! The only thing being enforced with force is secularist ideas. It's only when you have people with a blind heart that one doesnt seem to encompass that.

 

[KAding]

When you are repressively secular and nationalist such as Turkey, liberal reforms also mean more religious and cultural freedom, for all groups, be they Christians, Kurds or indeed Muslims. So in this sense being more liberal also means being less hostile to Islam. It is only when you insist on starting to enforce Islamic rulings that liberalism and Islam become each others opposites.

Have you looked at turkey lately? Islam is like banned there. Any one who wears a headscar is not allowed into the university or public offices for employment. There is no religious freedom there, only secular extremism.

Which is exactly why I said "when you are repressively secular and nationalist such as Turkey" in my post! But overall Turkey has become less oppressive to pretty much all groups in the last 10 years or so, also thanks to the AK party.

 

[Khan-Ghalgha]

a place like KSA which is Sharia country.

LOOOOOOOOL, gimme a friggin brake, shariah country, do you live on the moon? LOL :laugh:

had a great laugh tho, I still hope you were joking, how can people get so misinformed?

 

[Skywalker]

LOOOOOOOOL, gimme a friggin brake, shariah country, do you live on the moon? LOL

had a great laugh tho, I still hope you were joking, how can people get so misinformed?

Hmm...I'm glad you found it funny. And actually yes it is a Sharia country, but a contemporary one. All the judicial courts in KSA are Sharia-based, it just doesn't apply the Sharia 100% right. It's the closest thing to it anyway.

 

[Darkseid]

Their country still needs to stop being such an empire.

The same I could say about Iran, Israel, Syria, and Iraq.

 

[abdil han]

The fact that the "AKP" is a somewhat Islamically-oriented party is very encouraging. What surprised me from that article was that Abdullah Gul is the one that's in charge of the EU membership drive, and at the same time is a man who supposedly has Islaimic values.

What I don't understand is how this AKP is Islamically-oriented when they're "vigorously pressing liberal reforms"? Anybody care to explain?

this government is trying to make Turkiye more free,,this is a reason for pressing reforms...

for example;when we enter EU,the hijab problem will be solved... (army n socialist partieswill not be able to stop it anymore)...

also EU will bring some economical benefits,

this AKP government says that they are trying to intibate europe in economical issues especially,,,

thats why they support EU...

but also they are trying to improve relationships between islamic n african countries(actually everycountry in the world),,and it works ..when they took control in 2002,the number of export was only 30billion$,but now its about 95billion$...

the most important reason is economy and then freedom...

 

[north_malaysian]

for example;when we enter EU,the hijab problem will be solved... (army n socialist partieswill not be able to stop it anymore)

France in the EU too, but they still have hijab problem.

 

[abdil han]

France in the EU too, but they still have hijab problem.

it has just happened there bro

but the other EU countries doesnt support them...