Life on earth as a test

[barney]

God is all powerful and all knowing.

He knows everything we are going to do, and everything he is going to do.

So no matter what we do, he's already aware of it. If we are going to hell, he's already aware of it. Nothing is going to change that, because then God would be wrong. if he's wrong he's not all knowing. if he cant change what we do, he's not all powerful.

Therefore life isnt a test according to the organised religions, its more of a movie for the director to watch....but he made it so he knows whats going to happen....kinda boring, but beats watching Big Brother 2007.

 

[Trumble]

Simple anthropomorphism. Were there actually an omnipotent, omniscient God, He would have no need for 'worshippers', or to be 'pleased'. Those are requirements of imperfect beings (i.e humans) not perfect ones.

The 'test' idea is even more implausible. Given the omnipotence/free will situation explained above the idea of 'hellfire' blows apart any idea of a 'merciful' God. Why would a supposedly benevolent God create beings that He knows, even before actually creating them, will end up in hell and watch them struggle through life only to end up there? It would, indeed, be divine 'Big Brother' and hence such a God cannot possibly exist.

If triangles believed in God then God would have three sides.

 

[Malaikah]

God has no need for anyone or anything to worship Him. Just because He is worthy of it, doesn't mean He needs it.

 

[- Qatada -]

I don't think you guys read the thread properly.


We clarified in the thread that the test is for US, as humans. We aren't aware of the future, and we have a freedom of choice. Will we take the good path, or the path of evil? It is our own choice. Yet Allaah is All Aware of what we do.


The concept of anthropomorphism isn't exactly how people put it, because Allaah's attributes are different to human attributes. So if Allaah is the All Seeing, we don't need to question 'how' He sees. But He does so in a way which befits His Majesty. We don't need to question the how's since our minds are limited to this world only.


Also something which we stated in the previous posts was that Allaah knows what would happen, even if it never happened. An example given is of the disbelievers, and how much regret they would have on the Day of Judgement. Yet if they were sent back to this world, they would reject the message once again.


So it's upto you guys, if you ask Allaah for guidance - He will guide you. If you don't want it, then you wait, we too are waiting. And Allaah will judge us on what we differ. The truthfull will benefit from their truth, and those who disbelieve will have nothing but regret, and they will be no turning back on that Day.




Peace.

 

[IbnAbdulHakim]

will we worship God or not... <--- this is the test in essence

translation of the ayyat:
And I did not create the jinn and mankind except to worship Me. [Qur'an 51: 56]


why has Allah placed this test on us you ask? i will be completely honest, after reading many many answers to this question and coming to many reasonable conclusions i still will say

"LA ADRI (I DONT KNOW)" because i really dont and i wont attempt to understand the vast wisdom behind Gods will. But i will submit because i know that whats revealed is indeed true...

i hope that makes sense... my point is basically if you find something to be true is it always necessary to question why? :?

 

[Umar001]

Simple anthropomorphism. Were there actually an omnipotent, omniscient God, He would have no need for 'worshippers', or to be 'pleased'. Those are requirements of imperfect beings (i.e humans) not perfect ones.

The 'test' idea is even more implausible. Given the omnipotence/free will situation explained above the idea of 'hellfire' blows apart any idea of a 'merciful' God. Why would a supposedly benevolent God create beings that He knows, even before actually creating them, will end up in hell and watch them struggle through life only to end up there? It would, indeed, be divine 'Big Brother' and hence such a God cannot possibly exist.

If triangles believed in God then God would have three sides.

That's exactly it though, if one does struggle then would he go hell? I don't think so. If one truly struggles I don't think he will go hell.

 

[Pygoscelis]

It would, indeed, be divine 'Big Brother' and hence such a God cannot possibly exist.

Unless of course God is not so nice and doesn't care so much about humans and we are just created for his amusement. Just as plausible.

 

[barney]

The alternetive hypothosis is everybody has got it all horribly wrong, there is no test there is no messages and we are constructing massively complicated social cohesion and coercion measures which, since we are all taught them at birth, are easier to follow than thinking for ourselves.

 

[IbnAbdulHakim]

Unless of course God is not so nice and doesn't care so much about humans and we are just created for his amusement. Just as plausible.

or maybe God has a divine plan and for all those who do good and are patient he will reward them, and for those who do evil they will be rewarded in a different manner.

 

[DAWUD_adnan]

This one is easy, it is not for Allah to find out but to show us why we will be in either heaven or hell Allah knows He wrote it for us but it is for us to see why!

 

[barney]

or maybe God has a divine plan and for all those who do good and are patient he will reward them, and for those who do evil they will be rewarded in a different manner.

#
And mayby as part of his plan he kills several hundred's of thousands of Muslims in Tidal waves and Earthquakes. Indeed his ways are mysterious!

 

[Trumble]

Unless of course God is not so nice and doesn't care so much about humans and we are just created for his amusement. Just as plausible.

I don't think so, not when you consider the attributes which God would need to have. To something that could create galaxies at will, what could humans possibly do that would amuse? No, I think it's far more likely there simply is no such God other than as a human creation. Only as a human creation would such a being have the slightest interest in homo sapiens at all. To God we would evolve, live, and become extinct in the blink of an eye (or the nearest equivalent).

 

[IbnAbdulHakim]

#
And mayby as part of his plan he kills several hundred's of thousands of Muslims in Tidal waves and Earthquakes. Indeed his ways are mysterious!

you value life so much, yet this life is a mere trial, its not for enjoyment of pleasure. in those tidal waves good could have given many of those people comfort you have never felt and as we speak they could be lying in such peace in their graves.


really its all about believing in God to begin with, finding a religion, reading about its teachings, dont expect to understand God before taking these steps...

 

[wilberhum]

yet this life is a mere trial, its not for enjoyment of pleasure

What a sad way to live a life. Life should be hell, right?

 

[Muezzin]

Hey everyone,

I'm slowly starting to understand many of the ideas and arguments behind Islam and other religions. Yet, there is something that still baffles me about the Abrahamic religions.

If God is omnipotent and is our Creator, why do we need to be tested? I mean, if I would build a car and I would be 100% sure my design would be perfect and the manufacturing process would be faultless, I wouldn't bother test driving it, right?

I'm not looking for a debate. I'm just wondering how the Abrahamic religions explain this. I'm guessing it has something to do with free will?

Thanks .

KAding

I write fiction in my spare time. Good fiction requires good, strong characters. And the best way to illustrate their strength is to throw obstacles in their way. It's those victories over the many conflicts in the characters' lives which proves the characters' strength to (in the case of fiction) the readers, but more importantly to the characters themselves. That's kind of how I understand the concept (and my understanding as I have presented it here is not necessarily indicative of how the concept should be understood Islamically, rather it's an elaboration of my own gut instincts). Feel free to disagree, for it is healthy and builds character and understanding both.

The alternetive hypothosis is everybody has got it all horribly wrong, there is no test there is no messages and we are constructing massively complicated social cohesion and coercion measures which, since we are all taught them at birth, are easier to follow than thinking for ourselves.

Whatever floats your boat.

Life's a steeplechase, and I think we should all spend more time trying to reach the finishing line rather than fruitlessly debating who set up the course.

 

[Yanal]

Hey everyone,

I'm slowly starting to understand many of the ideas and arguments behind Islam and other religions. Yet, there is something that still baffles me about the Abrahamic religions.

If God is omnipotent and is our Creator, why do we need to be tested? I mean, if I would build a car and I would be 100% sure my design would be perfect and the manufacturing process would be faultless, I wouldn't bother test driving it, right?

I'm not looking for a debate. I'm just wondering how the Abrahamic religions explain this. I'm guessing it has something to do with free will?

Thanks .
KAding

Sorry but that makes no sense if you won't test it how will you know you are not god that you will know and allah made a test because he just can't out everyone in heaven he has to test us beacause without your exams/report cards you won't be going to different grades so it is exactly like that because if he puts everyone in heaven he won't know if their is a kindness feeling towards god and if i am not mistaken allah does not create people he created the prophets(pbut)pbut=peace be upon them of course the prophets are going to heaven but allah wants to c how we do on the test

 

[- Qatada -]

Unless of course God is not so nice and doesn't care so much about humans and we are just created for his amusement. Just as plausible.

We created not the heavens and the earth and all that is between them for a (mere) play.

Had We intended to take a diversion, We could have taken it from [what is] with Us - if [indeed] We were to do so.

Rather, We dash the truth upon falsehood, and it destroys it, and thereupon it departs. And for you is destruction from that which you describe.

To Him belongs whoever is in the heavens and the earth. And those near Him are not prevented by arrogance from His worship, nor do they tire.


[Qur'an 21: 16-19]
​

 

[Muslim Knight]

#
And mayby as part of his plan he kills several hundred's of thousands of Muslims in Tidal waves and Earthquakes. Indeed his ways are mysterious!

You know what, maybe He planned to spare the cruel life on earth and send them up to Paradise instead in an instant? What do you know of the mind of a God?

But then again, maybe you don't believe in afterlife. However, we Muslims do believe in Paradise in the Hereafter.

 

[Nσσя'υℓ Jαииαн]

What a sad way to live a life. Life should be hell, right?

Life being a trial doesnt mean its supposed to be like hell. I dont know where u got that idea from, besides from yourself. It is hell when you(generally speaking) act in a rude, cruel and repugnant manner to others. Not only are you hurting others but your hurting yourself. I find it useless to think i will live life unguided and die and jus rot in the ground with the worms. And since you and others like you believe nothing of about religion or that we have a soul and we'll be left behind like dirt.

I cant imagine not being rewarded for all the good I have ever done for someone. To die with all my good deeds and then never have an everlasting reward for all the great I have tried to achieve wilst being alive. There are some things we as humans do that are good that go unseen. And if another human can't see it, at least God will reward me. Boasting and too much pride isnt exactly a plus point either. It's actually a bit egotistical. If you do good, it should be with humbleness. And the remembrance of Allah(swt) for us reminds to behave in such a manner because we are no greater or less than another human. I dont want a temporary reward for doing good from another human who will die like me and make mistakes like me. I definitely cant imagine coming into existance from a speck of particles! And obviously even that speck or process needs a beginning no? You cant have a process unless someone is the one starting it! And in my opinion, that is God(swt).

Just my two cents

 

[Pygoscelis]

You know what, maybe He planned to spare the cruel life on earth and send them up to Paradise instead in an instant? What do you know of the mind of a God?

But then again, maybe you don't believe in afterlife. However, we Muslims do believe in Paradise in the Hereafter.

So its a good thing for people to get killed, because it spares them time on this horrible earth and takes them to the next life? Scary line of thought that is.