Re: Bible verses about sodomy
:bism: (In the Name of God, the Most Beneficent, the Most Merciful)
(Peace be upon you)
True, and I repeat herein, my default position is to respect all human beings.
Do you respect pedophiles who rape children?
Do I respect the heinous action? No, brother. However, I do make a distinction between this person and the evil he's committed.
Allah has said in the Quran (17:70), "And We have certainly honored the children of Adam."
They also fall under the category of "human beings".
All human beings, no matter how much of a "monster" they act, remain in the category of "human beings."
What about a pedophile who rapes and kills his own children? Will you respect him?
Does the action described herein shock me? Yes, brother. Is the action something I find unable to contemplate even? Yes, brother.
However, do I respect this individual's humanness even in the face of his manifest evil? Yes, brother.
You have to understand that as human beings we're all born in innocence which is why there is no sin written for children, but as adults, our actions are weighted according to intentions, and as adults, we commit evil because of
nafs (ego),
shaitaan (satan),
dunya (world), and
hawa (idle desires).
Is salvation possible for even this human being despite his evil action? Yes, brother.
You are the scholar, and since you are, please you tell me what is from wisdom (that which is not learned from the books) that you are able to take from this
hadith (prophetic tradition) in Sahih Bukhari Volume 4, Book 56, Number 676:
"There was a man who had heartlessly murdered ninety-nine people. Then, he felt remorse.
He went to a learned man and told him about his past, explaining that he wished to repent, reform, and become a better person.
"I wonder if Allah will pardon me?" he asked.
For all his learning, the scholar was a man who had not been able to digest what he had learned.
"You will not be pardoned," he said.
"Then I may as well kill you, too," said the other.
And kill him he did.
He then found another worthy individual and told him that he had killed a hundred people.
"I wonder," he said, "whether Allah will pardon me if I repent?"
Being a truly wise man, he replied, "Of course you will be pardoned; repent at once. I have just one piece of advice for you: avoid the company of wicked people and mix with good people, for bad company leads one into sin:"
The man expressed repentance and regret, weeping as he sincerely implored his Lord to pardon him.
Then, turning his back on bad company, he set off to find a neighborhood where righteous people lived.
On the way, his appointed hour arrived, and he died.
The angels of punishment and of mercy both came to take away his soul.
The angels of punishment said that as a sinful person he rightfully belonged to them, but the angels of mercy also claimed him, saying, "He repented and had resolved to become a good man. He was on his way to a place where righteous people live, but his appointed hour had come."
A great debate ensued, and Gabriel was sent as an arbitrator to settle this affair.
After hearing both sides he gave this verdict: "Measure the ground. If the spot where he died is closer to the good people, then he belongs to the angels of mercy, but if it is nearer to the wicked people, he will be given to the angels of punishment."
They measured the ground. Because the man had just set out, he was still closer to the wicked.
But because he was sincere in his repentance, the Lord moved the spot where he lay and brought it to just outside the city of the good people. That penitent servant was handed over to the angels of mercy."
What about a rapist who rapes and kills someone close to you? Will you still respect him?
Let's go back to the
Seerah (biography) and see what the prophetic attitude is even in the face of manifest evil like you've described.
Hind bint `Utbah went out with the army of Quraish in Uhud prompting them to her utmost to eradicate Muslims. When the pagan army fled away from Muslims at the beginning of the battle, she was very angry. On that day, she did not flee like the men had. On the other hand, she committed a very evil and repugnant act. In addition to mutilating the Muslim corpses, she approached Hamzah ibn `Andil-Muttalib and split open his belly and out of rancor and enmity to Prophet Muhammad :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him), she pulled out his liver and chewed on it.
At the end of the battle when the disbelievers won Muslims, Hind committed a very repugnant act. She began maiming the corpses of Muslims one by one. She was cutting ears and noses. She approached Hamzah ibn `Andil-Muttalib and split open his interior, she pulled out his liver and, out of rancor, she masticated it, but she spit it out as it tasted unpleasant to her.
Can you imagine the distress of Prophet Muhammad :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him)? And yes, indeed, he
(peace and blessings be upon him) was very distressed.
Moreover, Hind went out with the disbelievers in Al-Ahzab battle and continued confronting Islam shortly before the opening of Mecca, even she refuse her husband attitude when he asked the people of Mecca to enter their homes seeking the protection of the prophet. Besides, she prompted people of Mecca to kill her husband as he acted submissively to Prophet Muhammad :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him).
However, when she came to the Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) to accept Islam, he :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) accepted her Islam. If Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) had stopped respecting her as a human being, she would never have been able to bring Islam.
Forgiving a person who has wronged you or a wrongdoer who has harmed your family member is very, very, very hard. If I pretended to be a saint here to you or anyone, I'd surely be a liar. For sure, I would be shaken, and like any human being, I would probably want revenge and would be emotionally and mentally disturbed due to what's happened. I'd want the perpetrator punished. However, at the same time, I'd also know that my feelings do not determine Islam, but Islam should determine my feelings. Therefore, I'd still have to know that respecting human being is the default position in itself and the evidence for this is as follows:
Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) said, "All creatures are like Allah's family. The best one in the sight of Allah is he who treats his family well." (Bayhaqi).
Inscribed on the sword of Prophet Muhammad :saws: were the words: "Forgive him who wrongs you; join him who cuts you off; do good to him who does evil to you, and speak the truth although it be against yourself."
Also, is
shirk (idolatry) not more heinous than any other sin a person commits in the world? Yet Qais ibn Sa’d reported: "A funeral passed by the Messenger of Allah, :saws: peace and blessings be upon him, and he stood up. It was said to him, 'It is a Jew.' The Prophet said, 'Was he not a soul?'" (Bukhari.)
If Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) showed respect to a non-Muslim in a funeral bier upon his death, then is it not more the right of a sinful human being upon us to show respect for him/her when he/she is alive?
Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) showed that respect to the non-Muslim in the funeral bier when he himself :saws: (peace and blessings be upon him) is sinless. Is it not more then our responsibility to show respect for a sinful human being when we are not sinless?
AllahuAkbar (God is Great).
If you say "yes", then there's no point in me discussing further. If you say "no", then why are you differentiating between these guys and homosexuals? What makes them unworthy of respect but the others worthy of respect? If you say "it's because they're harming other people while the homosexuals aren't harming anyone", then that isn't true. Homosexuality is Haraam; when they do it, they're opposing Allaah Ta`aalaa. The consequence of the sin of homosexuality is that the entire area is afflicted by `Adhaab (punishment) from Allaah Ta`aalaa (in many different forms). Allaah Ta`aalaa destroyed the entire towns of Sodom and Gomorrah because they were homosexuals. There is a narration which says that when Zinaa becomes rampant in a society, the rain is withheld. Zakaah, too; if people do not pay it, the rain is withheld. So sins can and do affect an entire community, not just the perpetrator.
I would agree with you that illegal intercourse in either homosexuality or heterosexuality harms society. I also agree with you that as Muslims we do believe that individual sins spiritually, if enough people do so engage in sins, do collectively harm society; however, there is a proactive and constructive approach that needs to be taken to this issue. I have said this before on IB, and I'd say it again, that in our time not only non-Muslims need
dawaa (invitation) but also Muslims.
So, what we have to understand that the widespread illegal intercourse (whether in homosexuality or heterosexuality) in a society is a symptom of the problem, and the problem lays in the heart. Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) said, "There is in the body a clump of flesh - if it becomes good, the whole body becomes good and if it becomes bad, the whole body becomes bad. And indeed it is the heart" (Bukhari). Where does Islam reside? In the heart. Where is
iman (faith)? In the heart. Where is
ihsan (excellence)? In the heart. When any of these things are missing in the heart, the heart needs to be awakened.
The reason the heart needs to be awakened is because they have forgotten Allah and so Allah has made them to forget themselves (Quran 59:19), that is, have made the people forget their purpose in life.
In this instance, as always, we should go back to the Quran for the solution. The Quran (29:45) says: “Recite what has been revealed to you of the Book, and perform the s
alah. Verily, the
salah prevents from
al-fahsha’ (immoral sins) and
al-munkar (evil deeds) and the remembering (praising) of Allah is greater indeed. And Allah knows what you do.”
The first solution comprises of reciting the Quran to people, Muslims and non-Muslims, and explaining to them the importance of living a righteous life under the shelter of Allah. That's what you have to do; you don't have to make value judgments about them. Let Allah's Revelation talk to them and their hearts. Let the conversation be between Allah and the sinful servant, and don't bring in yourself and your judgments because that is unnecessary and detracts from the conveyance of the Message. Please understand Islam is a breathing, living, miraculous, positive, transformation-inducing vehicle in a human being's life if channeled properly into the hearts of people. All you really have to do is be the means through which this vehicle is accepted to be lived as a way of life. You won't be able to do that if you make people to run away from you. And that's why Prophet :saws: said, “
Treat people with ease and do not be hard on them; give them glad tidings and do not make them run away (from Islam).”
The second solution as given by Allah is
salah (prayer) for people, and so you have to urge the Muslims as a Islamic scholar to inculcate a prayerful life so that they can be prevented from committing illegal intercourse and other misdeeds. Again, remind people but in a way that is conducive to them taking your advice and implementing it in a practical way in their life.
That said, every single person - `Aalim and non-`Aalim - commits sins. Rasoolullaah صلى الله عليه وسلم clearly stated this in a Hadeeth. "All of the children of Adam are sinners, but the best of sinners are those who repent." Only Ambiyaa are sinless.
So we are not saying the doors of repentance are closed; on the contrary, they're very wide open. For all of us.
Alhamdhullilah (all praise, thanks, and credit is to Allah).
The fact is this: the whole world today has become pro homosexuality and homosexuals. It has become a crime to say that homosexuality is Haraam. Very soon the West will expect `Ulamaa to speak pro homosexuality as well. To say that it is permissible. To conduct gay marriages in the Masaajid. When such a lax, lackadaisical attitude exists regarding a particular sin/abomination, it must be spoken against far more intensely than would otherwise be the case. You need to pull people out of this idea that homosexuality is "okay". It's not. Those who commit sodomy have been cursed in the Hadeeth.
The `Ulamaa must speak out against it much more, and harshly.
I do agree that illegal intercourse (whether in homosexuality or heterosexuality) is accepted and even becoming more acceptable. That said, I strongly believe that you as an Islamic scholar should convey that illegal intercourse is
haram (forbidden) as a fact without making value judgments about the people committing these sins (and I've already given you the reason above).
Also, what does the West have anything to do with anything? Do you recite the Quran and forget yourself what (8:30) Allah has said, "But they plan, and Allah plans. And Allah is the Best of Planners."
Recite the Revelation (Quran) and let Allah talk to the sinner himself/herself, because otherwise governments in the West or East will indeed say that you are spreading hatred and you will yourself be giving them ammunition to say so because you're interjecting yourself into this conversation with your value judgments instead of letting Allah's Revelation giving the talking-to to the sinful. Whether you are in the West or East, having the choice of moral conscience or religion is protected as an individual human right and as law, and it is this that that will protect you if Allah wills after you place your trust in Allah if you're truly able to withhold value judgments and instead speak within the boundaries of respect that should also be your default position as a human being for another human being no matter how sinful this person is because this person is Allah's creation.
Neither should you nor I accept illegal intercourse ever as acceptable behavior, because that is the cause of moral and social corruption in the land; however, both you and I have to be able to come to terms with the fact that it is happening and deal with this happening in a constructive and proactive way.
And also, again, you have to realize that illegal intercourse is a symptom of the problem and should not be confused with the problem itself. The problem is something else, and I'll tell you what the problem is: Illegal intercourse is becoming widespread because Islam has been failed to be established in the hearts of people, and therefore the outward manifestation of that lack of establishment of Islam in the heart is the limbs committing illegal intercourse. People are committing illegal intercourse because they are failing to find either compassion and practical solutions from the very
'Ulamaa (scholars) that are supposed to be relieving them of their distress and stresses in life, even though the
hadith characterizes
'Ulamaa (scholars) as the "inheritors of the prophet." You're as an Islamic scholar supposed to inherit not only the knowledge of Prophet :saws:
(peace and blessings be upon him) but his :saws: attitude and mannerisms which made him to be so beloved to the people and enabled Islam to be established in the hearts of people (even in the hearts of people who hated Islam more than they hated anything). Instead, what we're finding here and elsewhere with the
'Ulamaa (scholars) is that there's a very real and and growing disconnect between the common persons and the
'Ulamaa (scholars). Why? Because the
'Ulamaa (scholars) are harsh in their language and uninterested in attempting to understand the struggles of the common laypersons. The
'Ulamaa (scholars) are chastising first and showing mercy second as an afterthought (if at all). The
'Ulamaa (scholars) are concerned now about growing Islamophobia in the West and the East but had not been concerned for years and years about giving their non-Muslim neighbors
dawaa (invitation) with their actions or fulfilling the rights of their neighbors; in fact, the
'Ulamaa (scholars) would still rather speak about Islamophobia than address the disrespectful attitude they sometimes even know exists in many Muslims towards non-Muslims' honor, property, and life and is also practiced in many Muslim-majority countries. The
'Ulamaa (scholars) are more concerned about whether their knowledge and positions are being respected as "scholars" and not about whether they themselves are giving others respect as human beings. With such manifestation of poor
akhlaaq (character and manners) and
adab (etiquette) in our
'Ulamaa (scholars), how are the common people that are corrupted supposed to become free of their corruption? The
'Ulamaa (scholars) are only seeing a reflection of their own corrupt heart and attitudes in the people.
With that, I also want to say that you as an Islamic scholar have struggled to attain the knowledge of Islam you have, and that is an impressive feat
Masha-Allah (as Allah willed). I have nothing but best wishes and respect for you and wish you attain glorious heights as a humble and beautiful Islamic scholar and also a person
Insha-Allah (God-willing). I hope you take what I've here on board in the best way because ultimately your success as an Islamic scholar and as a human being is also my success and our
ummah's (nation's) success. And therefore, your individual adoption
InshaAllah (God-willing) of a prophetic attitude is also one in the best interest of our
ummah (nation). I have said this once on IB, but I'll say it here, that I believe we're currently in the time akin to the Meccan period of the
Seerah (biography), and therefore our attitude to our weak brothers and sisters whether in humanity or faith should ideally be about meeting them in a corrupt world with knowledge, compassion, and support humbly in the face of their struggles. We must be firm and truthful always about what is
halal (permissible) and
haram (forbidden) but we must also be sympathetic and let them know of the Infinite Pleasure of Allah to be attained in their
jihad (struggle) against their own selves and their desires. In today's corrupt world, everything is topsy-turvy and people have been socially conditioned from top-to-down about following their desires and therefore we have to talk to the people at their weak level (with feeble knowledge and discernment of truth and falsehood and indwelt little to no faith) because Prophet Muhammad :saws: said, "Speak to the people according to their level of knowledge, do you want Allah and His Messenger to be rejected?" (Bukhari)
Barkallahu feek (may Allah bless you).
:wa: (And peace be upon you)
