Moses and the Injil

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ummzayd said:
Firstly, Deuteronomy is in the Torah:

'A prophet I will raise up for them from among their brethren, llike you (ie Moses) and I shall indeed put My words in his mouth' Deut 18:18

Prophet Muhammad pbuh, leader of his community, a family man, who brought laws from God - who else could possibly be compared to Moses? certainly not Jesus pbuh.


secondly, if you read the qur'an excerpt that brother Sami Zaatari quoted, it seems clear to me that 7:157 is not part of the dialogue with Prophet Moses pbuh.

This qur'an is very different from the bible. It's not a story book in the same way as the bible (I mean in a literary sense I'm not being insulting). The qur'an is not a narrative of past happenings, it is a recitation that is addressed to an audience, it addresses us as it addressed the Prophet pbuh and those around him. You are looking for 'mistakes' in what God said to Moses, but God is speaking to us in the qur'an not Moses. I don't think I'm expressing what I mean very well, sorry, perhaps someone else can explain it better.

peace
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That is brilliant ukhty.. I didn't bother with a thorough search yesterday.. Thanks for clarifying.. reps.. once I regain my rep-ability insha'Allah--- =)
fi aman illah
:w:
 
rav said:
Shalom Eleichem (Peace be upon you),

Posted from here:
http://www.islamicboard.com/712307-post34.html

Claim: The Torah Itself Predicts Mohammed as a Prophet

Many Muslims will claim that the Torah itself (apparently the "uncorrupted" part) predicts the coming of their so-called prophet some time after the giving of the Torah. All Bible translations are directly from the Hebrew, all of them literal.

Where Did They Get That Idea?

The relevant verse of the Torah is as follows:

Deuteronomy 18:18 A prophet I will raise up for them from amongst their brethren like you and I will give my words into his lips and he will speak about them all that I command him.​

We must ask the following: who is "I", who is "you", who is "them/their"? "I" is G-d, "you" is Moses, "them/their" refers to the Israelites.
So a paraphrase could be: G-d will raise up for the Israelites a prophet from the Israelites' brethren some time in the future that will be like Moses and speak the words of G-d.

​
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thanks for the detailed reply, it's interesting to have an insight into the 'old testament' from a Jewish perspective. but you didn't say who the Prophet referred to in 18:18 is? & in what way is he specifically 'like Moses'?

thanks too for the link I will be looking them up insha'Allah, I have a (non-Muslim) nephew who is really interested in studying religions especially Judaism & Islam but it's so hard to find the same kinds of books about Judaism as there are about Islam - probably because Judaism is not about spreading a message as such but is more of a 'closed club' that's quite difficult to get into.....is that a fair comment?

Peace to you​
 
ummzayd said:
thanks for the detailed reply, it's interesting to have an insight into the 'old testament' from a Jewish perspective. but you didn't say who the Prophet referred to in 18:18 is? & in what way is he specifically 'like Moses'?

thanks too for the link I will be looking them up insha'Allah, I have a (non-Muslim) nephew who is really interested in studying religions especially Judaism & Islam but it's so hard to find the same kinds of books about Judaism as there are about Islam - probably because Judaism is not about spreading a message as such but is more of a 'closed club' that's quite difficult to get into.....is that a fair comment?

Peace to you
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Shalom,

Well your observation is a bit true. I would not label Judaism a "closed club" but instead a much more accurate analogy would be a club that is not seeking members, but you can certainly make an appointment. The reason is because non-Jews can go to heaven and have a specific purpose as do Jews, so there is no need to convert unless the non-Jew believes he will spiritualy benefit from a conversion.

Therefore, most Jewish texts, seforim and commentaries are in hebrew because this is the language of the Jewish people.

Oh yea, I think I asked him if he had a Jewish Translation of the Scripture of Dueteronomy that I could read online, have you?
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Shalom,

Here is a good online translation:

http://bible.ort.org/books/pentd2.asp

However, I must warn you that they will always be translations, and when reading them you must note that you are most likely not grasping 100% of what the text is trying to say, unless you read and understand the Hebrew langauge. If you understand Hebrew then I can provide many links for you which have kept me up many nights.

Basically, it is a translations, and our Blessed Sages of Memmory told us that translating our scriptures was like the sin of the Golden Calf. It would inspire the gentiles to believe in G-d, but at the same time would create idol worship since they would not be able to grasp the Torah without their knowledge of Hebrew, and the Oral Tradition. Which is exactly what occured after the Torah was translated into Greek and then translated into about every other language known to man from there.
 
Philosopher said:
Wow.......strong waste of life :-/
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sheesh.....seems to me that for someone who thinks this discussion is such a waste of time you keep coming back to check on what's being said.....there must be a million discussion boards that would bore me to tears but here's a hint for you.........I DON'T GO ON THEM!!
 
Well at least they are doing something and not just coming on a forum saying 'What a waste of life'
 
Ahh depends what they get out of it Philosipher.

I could , but dont, worship the Spice girls. The doctrine would be Girl Power, Have fun, look after yourself and drink lots n lots of beer and have self confidence. It's not a bad doctrine. The flip side is I would be devoting years of my life to screechy self obsessed dullards pushing out plastic pop when I could be living my own life and making my own path.

And im not a Girl...so its no good to me. they look fairly hot though apart from Scary Spice, who's a moose.
 
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What with all the cheesy allegory?... at least make it bit more adroit like the Death of the Dauphin-- I find it hard relating these examples to any doctrine, the cross between condescension and clever equivocation is often lost to me, if that is the intent of such posts..

peace!
 
When I created this thread I never imagined the Spice Girls would be brought up...that is probably a sign that it has served its purpose.
 
Wasnt directed at you Purest, the allagory isnt something someone with faith would understand. I was writing to philosopher and Agnostics/Athiests.

In a nutshell i mean I agree with his post, but some people can gain value in religion.
 
barney said:
the allagory isnt something someone with faith would understand. .
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oh why not? what are we to you?-- country oafs?
SouthPark.jpg
 
LOL, no of course not. But as I've said before to you, Faith is not provable, you have to take it...well...on faith!

Some other posters have called it "faith-blindness". Because it's a in-built part of faith that It cant be questioned to a conclusion. I think it was philosipher who coined the phrase "God Steps In".

I'm not doubting your intelligence in the slightest, but in order to analyse some concepts you would have to lose faith or at the very least question it, and I doubt that you would want that even if you could & Certainly ,i wouldnt want that.

I like a good debate , but if I converted someone to agnosticism, I'd feel like a heel. Sometimes Agnostics are more Evangelical than the Fundamentalists.
 
Believing in Jesus/Allah is as logical as believing in the tooth fairy, snow white and the seven dwarfs, or even






the flying spaghetti monster (may sauce be upon him).
 
Philosopher said:
the flying spaghetti monster (may sauce be upon him).
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this can only be amusing for so long... how about some new material? If I am going to waste my time reading, I would in the least appreciate some non-recycled rhetoric...


peace!
 

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