Muslim Population to grow by about 35% over the next 20 years

[ardianto]

Partially correct. When Muslim women are given the oppurtunity that may be true (I do not know the statistics, I'll take your word for it), but the fact remains that (excluding Indonesia and some others (noted Woodrow)) Muslim women as a whole around the world are less educated than the average American or European and that is a major factor in the birth rate.

Many Muslim women can't get high education because their communities forbid it. And those women are forced to marry in young age with husbands that chosen by their families.

But actually, it's based on cultural, not sharia. I don't find any rule in sharia that forbid women to get education that same with men.

 

[جوري]

Partially correct. When Muslim women are given the oppurtunity that may be true (I do not know the statistics, I'll take your word for it), but the fact remains that (excluding Indonesia and some others (noted Woodrow)) Muslim women as a whole around the world are less educated than the average American or European and that is a major factor in the birth rate.

Again, not true, there are more women sitting in the parliament in Iran than there are women in the U.S, more female doctors in Egypt than there are in the U.S percentage wise, and I'd go the distance to say if you strip the scholars you've here of their citizenship you'll find that they come from elsewhere!

That is true in some cases. The United States does try to gather experts in many fields to move the US. Your assertion that private and government institutions are mostly composed of foreigners is mistaken, although they do often make up a substantial portion.

Well you're right they must employ minions and minions often make the majority of workers!

As usual you are trying to turn every thread I am in into a personal attack and accuse me of some sordid deed or intention. I would be interested, though, in hearing what you believe my intent is by starting this thread and what devious personal interest it is that you believe I am trying to fulfill.

How is it a personal attack to state the obvious? If you weren't so busy saving face from holes you dig for yourself you'd see it as clearly as we do.
You should ask yourself what your interests are? I am not the one to answer that Q for you..

all the best

 

[Ramadhan]

Again, not true, there are more women sitting in the parliament in Iran than there are women in the U.S,

I would also want to add that the four most populous muslim countries all already had women as heads of governments/states: Indonesia, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh. Meanwhile, USA is still dreaming about having its first female president.

 

[titus]

Again, not true, there are more women sitting in the parliament in Iran than there are women in the U.S, more female doctors in Egypt than there are in the U.S percentage wise, and I'd go the distance to say if you strip the scholars you've here of their citizenship you'll find that they come from elsewhere!

What exactly did I say that was not true?

I said, and let me quote myself since you seem to have completely missed it:

but the fact remains that (excluding Indonesia and some others (noted Woodrow)) Muslim women as a whole around the world are less educated than the average American or European and that is a major factor in the birth rate.

Yes, there are exceptions, but as a whole my comment is correct.

The number of women in the Iranian parliament has absolutely zero to do with my comment.

How is it a personal attack to state the obvious? If you weren't so busy saving face from holes you dig for yourself you'd see it as clearly as we do.
You should ask yourself what your interests are? I am not the one to answer that Q for you..

I thought you might have some insight into my interests since you claim I am making up facts to serve them. Since you now claim to not be able answer that question I guess I was wrong.

By the way, claiming I am making up facts to serve my personal interest is a personal attack. If you can quote one thing that I have said in this thread that is not true and can show facts to refute it then please do so.

If you believe my claim about education is wrong then please show me the average years of education women receive in the US and Europe and compare it with the average number of years of education a woman receives in a Muslim majority nation.

If I am wrong then I will admit it. If you are wrong then you can apologize for claiming I am making up facts which I have already supported with evidence.

And don't try and turn this into some kind of attack, or try to paint me as someone trying to make Muslims look bad. Poor education in some Muslim countries is a fact and only and ignorant person would try to deny it. Only by pointing it out is there any chance of fixing it. If you want it to continue then bury your head in the sand and ignore it, or even try to convince people that education for Muslim women around the world is superior than that of the US or Europe.

 

[titus]

I would also want to add that the four most populous muslim countries all already had women as heads of governments/states: Indonesia, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh. Meanwhile, USA is still dreaming about having its first female president.

Very true, but completely irrelevant to any comment I made.

 

[جوري]

I would also want to add that the four most populous muslim countries all already had women as heads of governments/states: Indonesia, Pakistan, India, Bangladesh. Meanwhile, USA is still dreaming about having its first female president.

Indeed-- and quite relevant ..

 

[titus]

Please refer back to the chart I posted showing Muslim majority nations and comparing their average years of education with their birth rates. You can see the correlation easily.

You can also look at this chart here, with a few examples listed

SOURCE


Country or area and average years of education for women

Afghanistan 5
Bangladesh 8
Iraq 8
Nigeria 8
Pakistan 6

Jordan 13
Indonesia 13
Egypt 11
India 10
Libya 17


USA 17
France 16
UK 17
Netherlands 17

It shows the average years of education for education for nations around the world and even differentiates between men and women.

As a whole Muslim nations fall far behind the US and Europe when it comes to education. This can be seen in the illiteracy rates of those countries also which has already been posted.

This is the number one factor in birth rates.

The countries mentioned by Naidamar (Indonesia, Pakistan, India and Bangladesh) are a mixed bag when it comes to education. Indonesia and India both do decently, but Pakistan and Bangladesh (with combined populations of close to 350,000,000) are woefully behind when it comes to years of education, with their average citizen getting about half of what the average American or European gets. With their population sizes they, along with other countries, bring the education numbers for Muslims as a whole around the world down considerably.

The fact that they had women leaders has absolutely nothing to do with these facts and is not an indicator of the level of education of women in those countries compared to the US and Europe.

If you truly believe that the level of education received in countries such as Bangladesh, Pakistan or Nigeria which all have huge Muslim populations is anything near that of Europe or the US then you are mistaken.

 

[Al-Mufarridun]

Assalaamu Alaikum

Regarding the Muslims in China, even though the Chinese don't do censuses based on Religion, reports say there are about 20Million Muslims in china. This number is probably in the low range.

 

[جوري]

Assalaamu Alaikum Regarding the Muslims in China, even though the Chinese don't do censuses based on Religion, reports say there are about 20Million Muslims in china. This number is probably in the low range.

wa3lykoum aslaam..

indeed it is a matter of time insha'Allah before there is a powerful Muslim empire the likes of what we've seen with the Umayyad, the fatamids, the Abbasids, the Ottomans..
China can censor its Muslims and their numbers as do westerners of the debt they owe the Muslim world.. but we're seeing change happen in a matter of days and I am hopeful that good things are ahead for this ummah insha'Allah..

thank you for sharing

 

[aadil77]

Assalaamu Alaikum

Regarding the Muslims in China, even though the Chinese don't do censuses based on Religion, reports say there are about 20Million Muslims in china. This number is probably in the low range.

That is a low figure, the BBC website puts it at 65 million, that was years ago, most likely around 100 million

 

[titus]

The Pew report puts the population in China at around 22,000,000.

 

[جوري]

What exactly did I say that was not true?
I said, and let me quote myself since you seem to have completely missed it:
but the fact remains that (excluding Indonesia and some others (noted Woodrow)) Muslim women as a whole around the world are less educated than the average American or European and that is a major factor in the birth rate.
Yes, there are exceptions, but as a whole my comment is correct.
The number of women in the Iranian parliament has absolutely zero to do with my comment.
I thought you might have some insight into my interests since you claim I am making up facts to serve them. Since you now claim to not be able answer that question I guess I was wrong.

Much of what you write is incorrect.. and you do it for several reasons, I wonder if you yourself are even aware of what they're?
part of it undoubtedly to save face, especially when you find yourself at a loss to reconcile your beliefs with the fact that you yourself interpret based on your own personal bias, and the second reason, if because you're quite frankly naive to what goes on in the world around you and unable to be critical of data or even interpret it correctly.. as such like many times before google the first article that will echo your sentiment often times in your sad quest undermining your own point. Google doesn't a scholar make..
for I can just as easily google this:

An average of 24 cases are submitted to the U.S. Office of Research Integrity annually, according to Dr. Luther. And in a survey of NIH-funded scientists published in Nature, researchers calculated that scientists observed a minimum of 2,325 incidents of scientific misconduct per year (June 19, 2008, Vol. 453:7198, pp. 980-982).


lies, dam n lies and statistics as the adage goes.

and given that you have zero credentials to loan you a sliver of a critical mind to approach much of what you write here, you can only be too happy with the little petty attempts at what you in your own mind perceive as battles won.


Most of the times I find what you write or quote only too laughable really like the article you quoted by some nameless student in a catholic university as a fact on Afghanistan, or your recent aid to your fellow atheist with statistics that have only undermined the point you were trying to make, and numerous others.. believe me under normal circumstances I wouldn't even bother reply to you all together, but at times I can't pass up the opportunity to expose you for a fraud as many westerners not unlike yourself are!

By the way, claiming I am making up facts to serve my personal interest is a personal attack. If you can quote one thing that I have said in this thread that is not true and can show facts to refute it then please do so.

I believe I have done so and repeatedly, the problem is with your short or rather should say selective memory loss!

If you believe my claim about education is wrong then please show me the average years of education women receive in the US and Europe and compare it with the average number of years of education a woman receives in a Muslim majority nation.

I have no interest in running that kind of research and have no desire to take your word for it as accurate for reasons afore mentioned!

If I am wrong then I will admit it. If you are wrong then you can apologize for claiming I am making up facts which I have already supported with evidence.

please.. you'll admit you're wrong one day I guarantee, but it will be too late to matter at that stage!

And don't try and turn this into some kind of attack, or try to paint me as someone trying to make Muslims look bad. Poor education in some Muslim countries is a fact and only and ignorant person would try to deny it. Only by pointing it out is there any chance of fixing it. If you want it to continue then bury your head in the sand and ignore it, or even try to convince people that education for Muslim women around the world is superior than that of the US or Europe.

You couldn't make Muslims look bad if you tried.. and I certainly don't find you as vile as posters outside of this forum, but that may very well be for the sake of your longevity on this forum.. either way how you think or feel about Muslims has always been and will always be inconsequential!

all the best

 

[titus]

As usual from you a long rant with many insults and no facts pertaining to the topic. You quote me then post something completely irrelevant to what I posted and claim "victory" where there wasn't even a battle except for the one in your own mind.

And the funny thing is I really have no idea why you are upset with me or what I have posted, especially on this thread. What exactly is it that you disagree with that I have posted? Please be specific.

 

[Zafran]

As usual from you a long rant with many insults and no facts pertaining to the topic. You quote me then post something completely irrelevant to what I posted and claim "victory" where there wasn't even a battle except for the one in your own mind.

And the funny thing is I really have no idea why you are upset with me or what I have posted, especially on this thread. What exactly is it that you disagree with that I have posted? Please be specific.

Your basically saying muslim women are stupid and western women are smart becasue they can read and write. Futhermore that means that stupid women have more children and smarter women have less.

 

[titus]

I never said anything about "smart" or "stupid". If that was your interpretation then you were mistaken.

Myself and some of your fellow Muslims (including Woodrow) have explained some of the reasons that there is a correlation between the level of education of someone and the number of children they have.

Now, do you believe that Woodrow is calling Muslim women stupid also? If not then why accuse me of it?

Facts are facts. Ignoring them does not make them go away. It is a fact that education needs to improve, for both men and women, in countries such as Pakistan, Afghanistan and Niger which all have Muslim majority populations. I don't point this out in order to make Muslims seem "stupid". Far from it.

Instead of getting upset with me people need to get upset with what is causing the lack of education in those countries.

 

[جوري]

As usual from you a long rant with many insults and no facts pertaining to the topic. You quote me then post something completely irrelevant to what I posted and claim "victory" where there wasn't even a battle except for the one in your own mind.

Do you have to come right out and beat on your chest for people to figure out your motive here? As I said you're not particularly sophisticated in how you handle the claims you present and unable to defend them properly!

And the funny thing is I really have no idea why you are upset with me or what I have posted, especially on this thread. What exactly is it that you disagree with that I have posted? Please be specific.

I am not upset at all-- I am undermining your credibility and it isn't very difficult to do!

all the best

 

[titus]

Do you have to come right out and beat on your chest for people to figure out your motive here?

When you claim to know what it is then hem and haw about what you think it is you bet I do.

 

[Zafran]

I never said anything about "smart" or "stupid". If that was your interpretation then you were mistaken.

Myself and some of your fellow Muslims (including Woodrow) have explained some of the reasons that there is a correlation between the level of education of someone and the number of children they have.

Now, do you believe that Woodrow is calling Muslim women stupid also? If not then why accuse me of it?

Facts are facts. Ignoring them does not make them go away. It is a fact that education needs to improve, for both men and women, in countries such as Pakistan, Afghanistan and Niger which all have Muslim majority populations. I don't point this out in order to make Muslims seem "stupid". Far from it.

Instead of getting upset with me people need to get upset with what is causing the lack of education in those countries.

we're not ignoring them but its odd how you can focus on the muslims and yet forget about India (an upcoming economy has a preety low literacy rate) african countries that are in red as well

I also like the way you say YOUR fellow muslim (woodrow) as if your on one group and muslims in another just to remind you most muslims on this forum are western as we are muslims.

Its not facts its statistics and eductaion isnt the only problem war is another especially in regions like Pakistan, afgahinstan, Iraq and somalia.

 

[titus]

we're not ignoring them but its odd how you can focus on the muslims and yet forget about India (an upcoming economy has a preety low literacy rate) african countries that are in red as well

Because the topic is about the Muslim population growth so I have focused on Muslim countries. I only brought up Western education levels in response to another poster.

I also like the way you say YOUR fellow muslim (woodrow) as if your on one group and muslims in another just to remind you most muslims on this forum are western as we are muslims.

Again, you are too sensitive. This is a Muslim forum therefore is it not natural to categorize someone as either Muslim or not Muslim? Heck, it's announced under our names on every post. I was simply trying to point out that stating facts about education levels and discussing its correlation with child bearing is not an attempt to be anti-Muslim as there were Muslims who were discussing it also.

ts not facts its statistics and eductaion isnt the only problem war is another especially in region like Pakistan, afgahinstan, Iraq and somalia.

I never claimed it was the only problem. That doesn't mean we should pretend the problem doesn't exist.

 

[جوري]

When you claim to know what it is then hem and haw about what you think it is you bet I do.

Dude go clean your droppings from the other thread, you're being owned by 18 year olds.. like I said it isn't very difficult to do, as you're extremely under-educated or superficially educated at best!

all the best