My name is Misbah not Molly

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glo said:
In fairness, is it not rather the case that mothers are generally more likely to receive the guardianship over their children of minor age?
I am no sure to what extend cultural or religious background would influence the judge's decision ... but then, I may just be naive ... :rollseyes

peace :)
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peace glo,

i dont have a repesentative sample so cant say other than from my own experience but where one partner is muslim and the other not then custody has gone to the non-muslim every time i have heard of it whether the muslim is male or female.

peace,

Daw'ud
 
Dawud_uk said:
peace glo,

i dont have a repesentative sample so cant say other than from my own experience but where one partner is muslim and the other not then custody has gone to the non-muslim every time i have heard of it whether the muslim is male or female.

peace,

Daw'ud
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Hi Daw'ud

I don't have any statistics either. :rollseyes

But if we are talking about Muslim/non-Muslim marriages, wouldn't it always be the case that the woman is the non-Muslim, and the man the Muslim?
(It's just that I thought Mulsim women weren't permitted to marry non-Muslim men, not even people of the book)
If that was the case, then custody being given to the mother would automatically coincide with custody being given to the non-Muslim parent - without the religion necessarily being of relevance.

As far as I know it is by far more common for the custody to be given to the mother - in any custody battle.

I found these (rather depressing) statistics (from 1994 though)
UK Marriage/Divorce Statistics 1994
Marriages/year 331.2K/year
Divorces/year 173.6K/year
Divorces with children (< 16)/year 99.55K/year
Probability of divorce 41%
Total children (<16) in married families 9M 12M-2.5M-0.5M
Total Children (< 16) in family divorce/year 189K/year 99.55 * 1.9
Average age of children in divorce 7 years
Percent mothers awarded sole residence 71%
Percent fathers awarded sole residence 7%
Percent joint residence awards (read mother) 21%
No. of married fathers loosing custody/year 91K/year 99.5 * 91.4%
% of married fathers loosing all contact after 3 years 50%
No. married of fathers loosing all contact after 3 yrs 45.2K/year 91K * 50%
http://www.coeffic.demon.co.uk/stats.htm
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peace.
 
glo said:
Hi Daw'ud

I don't have any statistics either. :rollseyes

But if we are talking about Muslim/non-Muslim marriages, wouldn't it always be the case that the woman is the non-Muslim, and the man the Muslim?
(It's just that I thought Mulsim women weren't permitted to marry non-Muslim men, not even people of the book)
If that was the case, then custody being given to the mother would automatically coincide with custody being given to the non-Muslim parent - without the religion necessarily being of relevance.

As far as I know it is by far more common for the custody to be given to the mother - in any custody battle.

I found these (rather depressing) statistics (from 1994 though)


peace.
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Very good point actually. I think you arte right, in most cases custody goes to women regardless of ethnicity/religion, unless the woman is known to be an unfit mother

In Islam the mother has the right of custody of the child, and upon reaching puberty it is the child's choice. I think so anyway, maybe someone else can confirm
 
Dawud_uk said:
assalaamu alaykum,
sounds too much like just about every case of a muslim i know marrying a non-muslim, they eventually break up and the judges and social workers decide it is in the best interests of the kids to stop with the non-muslim parent as more the norm of society, no matter what level of practice of islam they lived by prior to the break up.
Daw'ud
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:sl:

Your right bro, but in this particalur case, the mother of this child was actually a muslim for 10-15 years (she converted/reverted to islam at 16 yrs old), so she was actually a muslim when she got married to Misbah's father, before she apostated and left her family. She now claims to be a christian (although a so-called practising christian wouldnt commit adultury as she did).
 
Yea aparenrly she has to go back to scotland and have a trail thing there. This is amazing, surely they'd let her decide where to be, its not like she's 2 or something.
 
:sl:

what's the big deal, she's almost 16 she can simply apply for uni in pakistan then go live with her dad simple
 
this is the first i've heard of this case. it's interesting because 2 different countries are involved, each with their own laws.
and yes, i'm sure prejudice is involved.
but, having said that i think it's pretty clear-cut.
if the mother has legal custody i don't think it would even be an issue.
kids have no legal rights at 16.
i think pakistan will have no choice but to force her to go back against her wishes and the wishes of her family.
it all depends on what agreements pakistan and uk have, i guess.
if shes' forced to go back to uk, then she has 2 more years to wait and then she can go home.
 
snakelegs said:
this is the first i've heard of this case. it's interesting because 2 different countries are involved, each with their own laws.
and yes, i'm sure prejudice is involved.
but, having said that i think it's pretty clear-cut.
if the mother has legal custody i don't think it would even be an issue.
kids have no legal rights at 16.
i think pakistan will have no choice but to force her to go back against her wishes and the wishes of her family.
it all depends on what agreements pakistan and uk have, i guess.
if shes' forced to go back to uk, then she has 2 more years to wait and then she can go home.
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yep its been declared that she has to go back to scotland and do a trial or something.

2 years, I feel sorry for her. A 14 (if she is)who knows she wants to be with her dad but is prevented :(
 
ooops - just realized she is only 12 - then she has 6 years to wait. dunno where i got the idea she is 16.
right or wrong, kids have no rights.
 
This is a sad story.

The thing is, custody has by no means been decided yet. That will be for the courts in Scotland to decide.

For now the court in Pakistan ruled that Misbah's father and sister acted unlawfully when they brought Misbah out of Scotland and into Pakistan - even if they acted according to her wishes.

Misbah is not nearly 16, as somebody posted here. She is 12.
My own daughter is 12, and although she is very able to form and express opinions, she is also still very impressionable, and her opinions can be swayed quite easily.

My guess is this young girl needs support to explore what she really wants to do.
Having your family pulled apart and being taken into the farthest corner of the country (as I understand out of the mother's fear that her daughter may be abducted? :(), then being in the lime light of the media and becoming a pawn in the present political playing field, is nothing I would wish for any 12-year-old!

In the meantime the courts will have to decide which parent offers the best place for this young minor to grow up in ... until she is old enough to legally make her own choices ...

I hope this family will find peace, and the rifts and damages will heal over time.

peace
 
misbah's mother ran off with another man, is living with him and has taken his name even though they are not married,

misbah herself asked even if journalists called her molly, not to call her campell which is the name of the man her mother ran away with and was living in an illiciate relationship with.

what is more, as well as aposticating she was encouraging misbah to eat haram food and drink alcohol as well as verbally attacking islam.

i would suggest misbah would be right to run away again, she is obviously not wanting to live in such an unislamic environment and if she is forced to return to the uk i hope she runs away if her mother will not let her practice islam and insha'allah any muslim community she comes to will protect her.

ideally she and her father should move nwfp and ask for protection and help from the people there.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
 
I heard Nicholson Institute has a history of notorious hazing. One of their student committed suicide and another is suing the school.
 
Dawud_uk said:
misbah's mother ran off with another man, is living with him and has taken his name even though they are not married,

misbah herself asked even if journalists called her molly, not to call her campell which is the name of the man her mother ran away with and was living in an illiciate relationship with.

what is more, as well as aposticating she was encouraging misbah to eat haram food and drink alcohol as well as verbally attacking islam.

i would suggest misbah would be right to run away again, she is obviously not wanting to live in such an unislamic environment and if she is forced to return to the uk i hope she runs away if her mother will not let her practice islam and insha'allah any muslim community she comes to will protect her.

ideally she and her father should move nwfp and ask for protection and help from the people there.

assalaamu alaykum,
Abu Abdullah
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Hi Dawud

Can I ask you for a source for this information?

The reason I am asking is that depending what artice you read you get very different information - i.e. the father tutored Misbah to make allegations against her mother etc, etc.

My guess is that neither of the extremes reflects the true scenario, but that the truth lies somewhere between!

By the end of the day this is a messy custody battle, with a vulnerable 12-year-old caught in the middle!
There are thousands of such cases in the UK - but this one is more apparent, because it goes across two religions, two cultures and two continents, it adds ammunition to the present political climate and is therefore very much in the media's attention.

It would be better if this poor family was left alone to sort out their differences.
I am sure both parents have their good sides and their bad sides (as we all do!), I am sure both have Misbah's best interest at heart (even if they have different views on what that might be), and both have made mistakes.
It will be hard for the courts to decide Misbah's fate.

May God protect this young girl, and all who love her!

Peace
 
:sl:
Well, read a BBC article, and saw that Misbah didn't want to live with her mum, because her mum's partner kept shouting at her..
And given the choice of living in a big spacious house up in Pakistan with her older siblings and father, or a cramped one in Scotland with her mother and mother's partner, can you guess what she'd want?
Poor girl :(..all the limelight and she's only 12!
:w:
 
Custody battles are seldom fought fairly. Quite often the deciding factor is which attorney is the better at showing the advantages and hiding the faults of his client. Sadly, it is only the parents that the courts attempt to be just with.

The child has the least say and is often manipulated to say what somebody wants the child to say.

All of this publicity is producing no benefit to anyone except for who ever gains political recognition as a result.

Although I agree with Dawud in his post a few spots above. The truth is the law can not be taken into a persons own hands. That would only result in more pain to all involved, including Misbah.
 
Here is a BBC article which (hopefully) gives a representation of both sides of the story:
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/highlands_and_islands/6192406.stm

[...]
Ms Campbell said she was overjoyed that her daughter would be coming back to Scotland but added that Misbah would be "confused and scared".
She told BBC Scotland: "My immediate thoughts are a big hug - hug her and breathe her in.
"I would love to talk to her on the phone to reassure her that the case is still going on over here and she gets to say her point of view.

"I think Molly is going to be quite scared and confused. I just want to tell her that it is all going to be okay - it's all going to work out."

[...]

Naheeda Mahboob Elahi said:[...]
"This was not a decision about custody. It was a decision on whether Mr Rana had acted improperly by violating the court order made at the Court of Session in Scotland in June last year."

The lawyer added: "Misbah should get a chance at the Court of Session to say who she wants to live with."

[...]

Mr Rana said his daughter was "devastated" by the decision.
Speaking outside the court in Lahore, he said he would be seeking legal advice about lodging an appeal to the supreme court.
Mr Rana said: "I was very surprised and shocked by this decision.
"Misbah is very devastated, she was crying, she is very upset.

"She doesn't want to go back to Scotland, she wants to stay here in Pakistan."
[...]
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:sl:

I think the girl should be allowed to have a say in the case. She quite clearly doesnt want to lie with her mother. And the fact that she has to go back there will only make the situation worse as far as i can see it....

Also, i read yesterday on bbc that her mother prevented her from salaah and that even tho shes trying to live as a Muslim her mother prevents her also.....that was also on bbc.

i make duaa that Allah keeps her in the best of company and gives her enuf sabr to last until shes 16 at which point inshallah she can legally make decisions for herself....

:w:

Rabi'ya:rose:
 

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