NASA - Stardust Mission

[root]

News Update

It's a great time for cometry science. Date from swift telescope that observed the NASA projectile slamming into comet Temple 1 last year has shown for the first time the ammount of water comets actually hold. During the impact with an object only the size of a standard washing machine noted above, the Comet realeased 250,000 tonnes of water.

Not only are comets thought of as a strong contender for spreading life around the universe they are implicated as the method of delivery for water to planets.

 

[nimrod]

Root I have been following the news articals about Titan and Europa, interesting stuff indeed.

Thanks
Nimrod

 

[extinction]

Atheist I say to you what I say all non-muslims say Laa-ilaha-illahu-muhammadur-rasoolullah/There is none worthy of worship besides Allah and Mohammad SAW is his messenger

 

[extinction]

otherwise if you are wrong(which you are) there will be hell to pay...literally

 

[root]

Atheist I say to you what I say all non-muslims say Laa-ilaha-illahu-muhammadur-rasoolullah/There is none worthy of worship besides Allah and Mohammad SAW is his messenger

Muslim, I say to thee like I say to all faiths. Be free (figure of speech) to have faith in what you choose, you could be just as wrong as I. But I wish you peace and please don't double post your BS on this great thread.

 

[root]

New Update

Meteorites that have fallen to Earth contain some of the most primitive stuff of life, a new study has found. Contrary to popular belief, they are packed with ancient carbon-rich (organic) molecules that were essential for life to get started on Earth.

Pre-solar origin

UK planetary expert Ian Wright, of the Open University in Milton Keynes, believes we now have the potential to be able to study pre-solar organic molecules in the laboratory.

"That organic molecules in carbonaceous chondrites are, at least in part, pre-solar in origin, is not a new idea," he told the BBC News website.

"What is presented here are data that show that the distribution of isotopic compositions within the organic complex is [highly varied].

"I guess it is possible that we could be looking at the remnants of precursor organic molecules, formed in the interstellar medium before the Solar System even existed, embedded in a complex that formed at a later time (perhaps within the solar nebula itself)."

Source:http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4973696.stm

 

[Soldier2000]

True, one can merely regress creation and say God created the raw materials.

that means God must exists?

 

[root]

Root:
True, one can merely regress creation and say God created the raw materials.

that means God must exists?

Sorry, unfortunately for religion it offers no such proof.

 

[Soldier2000]

So who created the Raw materials

 

[Halima]

that means God must exists?

Of course he exists-well, maybe not to the athesits..however, it's all a matter of how he created things like the universe, the stars, rocks and the clouds, it's pretty interesting if you ask me.

The amazing fact that he created the earth in just 7 days...

 

[Soldier2000]

but i dont understand why atheist belief God does not exist when science cannot disprove with certainty the existance of God!

 

[root]

So who created the Raw materials

If the raw materials are enough for life to begin that to me is a prity amazing piece of information which we don't yet have. Personally, since this thread is more to do with abiogenesis more precisely the fundamental building blocks required for abiogenesis. research may yet show how primitive life was able to form from the otgaanic material from space, I think it's implications will be far reaching especially for religion & science.

but i dont understand why atheist belief God does not exist when science cannot disprove with certainty the existance of God!

Simply because science cannot give you absolute proof on anything, even Gravity. All it can say is that the evidence of "God" is not consistent with the scientific data, only religion offers an absolute proof based on faith.

This is going off-topic though, the purpose of this thread is to discuss the possibility that life or the componants required for life originates in space and is delivered to planets such as earth.

 

[Soldier2000]

Your right root, hence i have started a new thread titled "if god existed..., i would very much appreaciate your participation on that thread

 

[root]

Just to reiterate the latest information:

New Update

Meteorites that have fallen to Earth contain some of the most primitive stuff of life, a new study has found. Contrary to popular belief, they are packed with ancient carbon-rich (organic) molecules that were essential for life to get started on Earth.

Pre-solar origin

UK planetary expert Ian Wright, of the Open University in Milton Keynes, believes we now have the potential to be able to study pre-solar organic molecules in the laboratory.

"That organic molecules in carbonaceous chondrites are, at least in part, pre-solar in origin, is not a new idea," he told the BBC News website.

"What is presented here are data that show that the distribution of isotopic compositions within the organic complex is [highly varied].

"I guess it is possible that we could be looking at the remnants of precursor organic molecules, formed in the interstellar medium before the Solar System even existed, embedded in a complex that formed at a later time (perhaps within the solar nebula itself)."

Source:http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/sci/tech/4973696.stm

 

[root]

The world of scientific discovery rarely stands still. Yet more discoveries are made.

Relic of ancient asteroid found

A large fragment of an asteroid that punched 160km-wide (100 miles) hole in the Earth's surface has been found. The beachball-sized fossil meteorite was dug out of the 145-million-year-old Morokweng crater in South Africa. It is a unique discovery because large objects are widely believed to completely melt or vaporise as they collide with the planet.

We now know that large objects do not always vaporise. The Morokweng crater is one of the largest on Earth, and was formed at the boundary of the Jurassic and Cretaceous periods. Created by an asteroid measuring about 5-10km (3-6 miles) in diameter, the impact bowl lies hidden beneath the sand of the Kalahari Desert.

This would have been a mass extinction event for localised species, the "crator" is hidden beneath the Kalahari desert but is apparent to satellite instruments that can detect anomalies in the Earth's gravitational field linked to unusual structures in the rock can clearly be seen.

 

[root]

Asteroid set for close encounter

A large asteroid is set to pass Earth in a close encounter which scientists say will pose no danger. The asteroid, estimated at half a mile (800m) wide, will sweep within 270,000 miles (433,000km) of the planet - only slightly further away than the moon. "It's not Earth-threatening," said Don Yeomans, who heads Nasa's Near Earth Object Program.

The asteroid, 2004 XP14, should be visible by telescope from N America and Europe, most clearly on Monday 3rd July 2006.

For something of this size to come this close is unusual

 

[jss]

Kewl info and pics root bruv

 

[Abdul Fattah]

Soem comments although that picture of a hearth shaped dustparticle is pretty amasing, it is not that rare since the molecular shape of these particles lie very close to a hearthsape. Also note, this is not an organic molecule. Here's the wiki of it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olivine
That it contains water is not such an oddity. it is one of teh most simple basic molecules in chemistry. In fact I would consider it odd if there wasn't any water found on difrent planets and comets. I've seemed to have missed your link where you showed the comet contains organic material, could you please repost that?
And finally, this still does not answer how life came to be. Panspermia is simply a theory that states how the difrent building blocks were gathered at a certain time at a certain place. It still fails to explain how these building blocks build up a complex RNA molecule.

 

[root]

All quotes by Steve

QUOTE=steve;382453]Soem comments although that picture of a hearth shaped dustparticle is pretty amasing, it is not that rare since the molecular shape of these particles lie very close to a hearthsape. Also note, this is not an organic molecule. Here's the wiki of it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Olivine

Firstly let's clear up some misunderstandings in the first part of your post. In reference to heart shaped particles and your reference to the molecular shape of these particles. I cannot make no sense of that, could you please expand (briefly) and provide a source. Are you sure you have not made the mistake in thinking the heart shaped dust particle was an Olivine mineral?

Secondly, your point in bold. Nobody has stated at any time that the Olivine mineral was organic, afterall it's a mineral as you have pointed out. The reason why the presence of Olivine is an intrueging one is that meteorites were suppose to have been formed in the outer edge of the solar system where it is extremely cold, yet Olivine is formed in the hottest, innermost regions of the disk of gas and dust that formed the Sun and planets. If these minerals in the comet are from our solar system then they probably formed close to the young Sun and were transported all the way from inside the orbit of Mercury past the orbit of Neptune. Another option is that these "hottest minerals found in the coldest place" actually formed around other stars. The distinction between solar system and extra-solar origin of these minerals will be determined by measuring their isotopic compositions. The abundances of the isotopes of elements like oxygen is quite different in true stardust grains, formed around other stars, than it is for materials formed in our solar system. One of the most exciting outcomes of the workshop was preliminary data suggesting that the comet is a mix of both stardust grains from other stars as well as materials formed in the solar system.

That it contains water is not such an oddity. it is one of teh most simple basic molecules in chemistry.

Of course it is easy to make such a statement currently. Only 40 years in our past and it was a very difficult question to answer. Of course now with scientific discovery we find water is quite common within our solar-system.

I've seemed to have missed your link where you showed the comet contains organic material, could you please repost that?

I could post the link but I am not going to. the reason for this is that the Nasa - Stardust team was broken down into the following areas of study;

1. bulk composition
2. organics
3. mineralogy
4. isotopes
5. spectroscopy and craters in the aluminum holding frame.

These groups are now currently involved in co-ordinating all the data and analysis into a research paper due to be released into peer reviewed scientific institutions & released to the general public in a little over 4 weeks time. Perhaps, given this it would be best to wait until such time as this. I for one cannot wait.

And finally, this still does not answer how life came to be. Panspermia is simply a theory that states how the difrent building blocks were gathered at a certain time at a certain place. It still fails to explain how these building blocks build up a complex RNA molecule.

Quite right too. currently Panspermia is implicated in bringing organic matter to the planet or even bringing "life" itself to the planet since either option is clearly now on the table as two "possible" means of how life began on our planet. Again, 40 years ago such notions were very unpopular and heavilycriticised. Whilst organic material & water is very big news for panspermia and Abiogenesis we have to reserve further discussion until the research papers are released very soon.

 

[Abdul Fattah]

Firstly let's clear up some misunderstandings in the first part of your post. In reference to heart shaped particles and your reference to the molecular shape of these particles. I cannot make no sense of that, could you please expand (briefly) and provide a source. Are you sure you have not made the mistake in thinking the heart shaped dust particle was an Olivine mineral?

Oh you got me there. I indeed made that mistake of thinking the picture was an olivine mineral, sorry for the confusion.
So do they have an Idea what it really is?

Of course it is easy to make such a statement currently. Only 40 years in our past and it was a very difficult question to answer. Of course now with scientific discovery we find water is quite common within our solar-system.

Yes that's the narrowmindedness of the past. What I was actually refering to was from a chemical point of view, it's only natural to expect to find water, since hydrogen and oxygen are quite simple atoms (respectivle 1 neutron and 8 neutrons) and since these two bind quite easely.

I could post the link but I am not going to. the reason for this is that the Nasa - Stardust team was broken down into the following areas of study;

1. bulk composition
2. organics
3. mineralogy
4. isotopes
5. spectroscopy and craters in the aluminum holding frame.


These groups are now currently involved in co-ordinating all the data and analysis into a research paper due to be released into peer reviewed scientific institutions & released to the general public in a little over 4 weeks time. Perhaps, given this it would be best to wait until such time as this. I for one cannot wait.

Fair enough, I'm sure you'll keep us updated since this is really your cup of tea.

Quite right too. currently Panspermia is implicated in bringing organic matter to the planet or even bringing "life" itself to the planet since either option is clearly now on the table as two "possible" means of how life began on our planet. Again, 40 years ago such notions were very unpopular and heavilycriticised. Whilst organic material & water is very big news for panspermia and Abiogenesis we have to reserve further discussion until the research papers are released very soon.

Yes well if any of those two possibilitys were actually true without devine intervention, I'd put my money on the comet bringing life itself since I'm having a real hard time imagening it being formed in teh heat of collision. But this of course begs the quetsion, where did the comet got it from?