Orthodox Islam being crushed?

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Zulkiflim said:
Salaam,

Why follow the labels placed and coined by the west?

They name us as Extremist Muslim,Liberal Muslim and Moderate Muslim.

I say i am just a muslim.

A muslim whow follow the Quran and the Sunnah.
Who defend the Ummah and his own society and coutnry bvy the laws of Islam.

So what makes an extremist,one who follow the Islam warpath?
And what is a moderate?..One who say peace ,,peace peace,say that the other forget the true Islam but they themselves forget to dfend and fight the enemies of Islam.

So for me these extremist and moderates who are the opposites to one another are the true HYPROCRITES and ENEMY OF The Ummah.
They seek to split the Ummah from what is in the teaching of Islam..

As the Quran say,,THEY SAY WE SEEK PEACE BUT TRULLY THEYA RE THE MISCHIEF MAKERS.
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I do agree with you..... why label ourselves as Sunnis, liberals, orthodoxs?

That's why I'm asking the author, what exactly he meant by the word "orthodox Islam?"
 
north_malaysian said:
I do agree with you..... why label ourselves as Sunnis, liberals, orthodoxs?

That's why I'm asking the author, what exactly he meant by the word "orthodox Islam?"
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:sl:
The Islam that is practiced as taught by the Prophet (pbuh), the Islam that was not invented as an offshoot or sect, the true Islam.

What I am trying to say is that the sects and fringe groups are taking power, and making the non-Muslims think wrong things about Islam. I'm not trying to promote division.

I heard a radio broadcast recently. A non-Muslim host described Muslims that want to live under Islamic law as extremists. Why? Because people like the Taliban, the Saudis and Bin Laden have made Islamic law look bad, and then some other Muslims have tried to counter this by saying 'Islamic law is not part of Islam'. Not enough people are standing up and saying 'yes, Islamic law is part of Islam, but Islamic law is good and just, not like what so-called 'Islamic states' are applying today'. We need to show the true Islam, not just the point of view of some fringe groups.
:w:
 
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Fishman said:
:sl:
The Islam that is practiced as taught by the Prophet (pbuh), the Islam that was not invented as an offshoot or sect, the true Islam.

What I am trying to say is that the sects and fringe groups are taking power, and making the non-Muslims think wrong things about Islam. I'm not trying to promote division.

I heard a radio broadcast recently. A non-Muslim host described Muslims that want to live under Islamic law as extremists. Why? Because people like the Taliban, the Saudis and Bin Laden have made Islamic law look bad, and then some other Muslims have tried to counter this by saying 'Islamic law is not part of Islam'. Not enough people are standing up and saying 'yes, Islamic law is part of Islam, but Islamic law is good and just, not like what so-called 'Islamic states' are applying today'. We need to show the true Islam, not just the point of view of some fringe groups.
:w:
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Salaam

Why should we perpetuate the views of non muslim on us?

Why perpetuate the name calling?
They dont understand Islam and its laws..
And evn when we have explained Islam to them they still persisit in calling us extremist or moderates.

Islam encompasses life,in good times and bad,in war and peace,in wealth or poor.

There is law for everything
But again extremist and moderates are actually breaking Islam apart.

Extremist uses the aggresive nature or verses in Islam to justify murder or attack,when Allah clearly say we should not trangress,and should defend.

But moderates say peace peace peace,,,we should turn the other cheek and so on thus forgetting the Quran order to defend and aid the Ummah.

So for me i am a muslim,i aid all muslim whom are in trouble as i can.
As Allah gives me stregth to give and to earn and to spen so shall i TRY my best to follow Allah ways.

To live in peace,to perform the smaller or greater Jihad....
 
Zulkiflim said:
There is law for everything
But again extremist and moderates are actually breaking Islam apart.

Extremist uses the aggresive nature or verses in Islam to justify murder or attack,when Allah clearly say we should not trangress,and should defend.

But moderates say peace peace peace,,,we should turn the other cheek and so on thus forgetting the Quran order to defend and aid the Ummah.
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:sl:
I agree with you here. They are both going astray. We should be just Muslims, or orthodox Muslims as I referred to them as before.
:w:
 
There is definitely an effort to crush orthodox Islam [meaning Islam as it was revealed in the Qur'an, explained by the Prophet and practiced by the companions]. On one hand we have the secularists who are empowered in the west to assault Islam and deceive people into thinking that the source of all recent conflicts lies in a religion that has been around for over 14 centuries. On the other hand we have the extremists who are no less deviated from the Islamic teachings, and whose views are actually completely foreign to Islam and harm the Muslim community.
 
Well no one would want to believe that we feel Islam is being attacked. President Bush kinda made it easier by using the words "Islamic fascists." The fact that he dared to even add Islam to that word. Associating the religion of Islam with fascism is both offensive and historically inaccurate.
 
Tayyaba said:
Well no one would want to believe that we feel Islam is being attacked. President Bush kinda made it easier by using the words "Islamic fascists." The fact that he dared to even add Islam to that word. Associating the religion of Islam with fascism is both offensive and historically inaccurate.
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Do you know what fascism is? Fascism is a radical totalitarian political philosophy that combines elements of corporatism, authoritarianism, extreme nationalism, militarism, anti-anarchism, anti-communism and anti-liberalism. Isn't Islam all of these things? But to address Islamic fascism in itself, when we say Islamic fascism we aren't saying that Islam is a fascist idealology. People that take this point of view are normally muslims that are trying to find a reason to be offended. When we say Islamic Fascist we are speaking specificly to certain fascist that try to us Islam as a pretense for their goals.
 
Geronimo said:
Do you know what fascism is? Fascism is a radical totalitarian political philosophy that combines elements of corporatism, authoritarianism, extreme nationalism, militarism, anti-anarchism, anti-communism and anti-liberalism. Isn't Islam all of these things? But to address Islamic fascism in itself, when we say Islamic fascism we aren't saying that Islam is a fascist idealology. People that take this point of view are normally muslims that are trying to find a reason to be offended. When we say Islamic Fascist we are speaking specificly to certain fascist that try to us Islam as a pretense for their goals.
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yes i know it means that, but some felt like meaning it to be a terrorist act of some sort. prolly thats why.
 
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Geronimo said:
Once again, what exactly are muslims trying to defend? Who is attacking Islam and how?
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this is not an attack by any specific group, it is an attack caused by non-Islamic Influences in the secular world. There are n-n-Muslim religious groups that will falsify religous beliefs in their attempts to "save" us poor lost Muslims.

There are the influences of the secular world that bombard us daily, immodest clothing, some TV shows, some Music some advertising campaigns.

There are also Muslims within our selves with extremist views who seem to misinterpret our beliefs and cause confusion among us as to what it really means to be a Muslim.

Then there are the battles we each wage within our own selves to keep on the right path and to live our lives in true submission to God(swt)

The enemy that is attacking "Orthodox" Islam is not a specific person or group. It is anything that leads us away from living our lives as Muslims.

An anology would be the Christian groups who say that some of the enemies of Christianity are "alcohol, rap music, pornography, drugs, false religions, crime."

Just Substitute the word Muslim for Christian in that sentence and that is what is attacking us.

Now that I understand what was meant as Orthodox by the thread starter I should have answered yes in the poll.
 
:sl:
Geronimo said:
Do you know what fascism is? Fascism is a radical totalitarian political philosophy that combines elements of corporatism, authoritarianism, extreme nationalism, militarism, anti-anarchism, anti-communism and anti-liberalism. Isn't Islam all of these things?
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Watch out when you post stuff like this, I have a very good history teacher!

1. I have no idea what corporatism is.
2. Islam is anti-nationalistic. The prophet (pbuh) even compared nationalism to biting your father's genitals.
3. Islam is slightly anachistic, as it urges obedience to Allah (swt) alone.
4. Islam is only anti-communist because communism is a man-made ideology, and because it promotes atheism. It shares many values with communism, such as equality between leaders and the people, giving to the needy, and wishing to unite all humanity. In fact, I would say Islam has much more in common with socialism and the left than fascism and the right.

From how my history teacher explains fascism, he says that fascists believe that some people are physically or naturally better or inherently worth more than others. Thus, if someone believed that whites are inherently superior to blacks, or that disabled people are worth less than the rest of people, that is fascism. Neither Islam nor any other religion I know believes these things. Islam believes that good Muslims are ideologically and morally superior to others. Islam believes that all people and races are of equal value except by piety. An Arab king who was born a Muslim could end up with less in the hereafter than a female black convert who is disabled in such a way that she cannot pray properly, or vice-versa.

Also, communism believes that it's true followers are ideologically superior to non-communists, and as we all know, communism is completely anti-fascist. I think there are quite a lot of similarities between communism and Islam. Both were started by a man who rose and awakened the masses against tyranny, both seek to unify humanity, both believe that all humans are physically equal, both have been mistreated and bad-mouthed by the West, and both have had followers who committed terrible atrocities in their name. But today people accept communists and hate Muslims.

BTW, I'm not saying that communism is compatible with or better than Islam. One of communism's demands is an atheist state, which is considered totally unacceptable by Islam. Communism is also a man-made political ideology, whilst Islam is a divinely-relvealled theological ideology.

Conclusion: Bush should not be saying Islamic fascists, but Islamic commies!
:w:
:w:
 
Oh God i like ur history! u made my point. thanx lol. The way Bush meant it wasnt in a nice way either! At least if hes smart he'd keep it to himself. He jus made it easier by sayin it.
 
Tayyaba said:
Oh God i like ur history! u made my point. thanx lol. The way Bush meant it wasnt in a nice way either! At least if hes smart he'd keep it to himself. He jus made it easier by sayin it.
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:sl:
Did I mention that my history teacher's a communist himself?
:w:
 
:sl:
that was good info fishman, i learned a lot:thumbs_up
and i read this hadith and i think it may apply
"Islam began as something strange and will return as something strange, so glad tidings to the strangers"
(true) Islam will stay strong Insha Allah regardless of what Non-Muslims
and Muslims say or do
 
I could be mistaken, but I believe the word "orthodox" would mean a more traditional and strict version. In other words, not changed or altered by more secular beliefs.
 

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