Prayer

[glo]

Is it permitted/acceptable for non-Muslims to pray for Muslims? Or would Muslims be offended?

Thanks.

 

[^..sTr!vEr..^]

lol..i dont think their prayers would be answered , anyway...

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

Hi

If a non-Muslim wanted to pray for me thats up to them and no one can stop them. Why would I be offended? Sometimes Non-Muslims shout out a prayer for me and I ask Allah to guide them

 

[SATalha]

I wouldnt be offended if some one that wasnt Muslim offered me preyer

 

[glo]

lol..i dont think their prayers would be answered , anyway...

Now that's a different issue ... and I would certainly disagree with you there ...!

But my question was a different one. Would you be offended if I prayed for you?
Or is there any reason in the Qu'ran or hadiths why non-Muslims should not pray for Muslims?

After all, Muslims are not supposed to pray for non-Muslims, if I am not mistaken (unless it is for their conversion to Islam ...)

Peace

 

[SATalha]

I havnt come across any hadith or Quranic aya that say no to this.....but who am i some Scholar? :-[ :-[ Maybe some of our more well versed Brothers and Sisters have an idea.

 

[Pk_#2]

lol..i dont think their prayers would be answered , anyway...

what??!! why! :rollseyes :laugh:

'When My servants ask thee concerning Me, I am indeed close (to them): I listen to the prayer of every suppliant when he calleth on Me: Let them also, with a will, Listen to My call, and believe in Me: That they may walk in the right way'

You can make dua for Others. The Prophet, sala Allahu alaihi wa salam, said “Whenever you make a supplication for another believer and he is not present, an angel will say ‘and same to you.’” One of the ethics when making dua to others is that, if you are going to make dua to yourself and others, start with yourself first, then you make dua to others. Butif you aregoing to make dua for others only, then you don’t have to mention yourself first. An example of starting with one’s self is seen is the verse, “And those who came after them say, ‘Our Lord! Forgive us and our brethren who were before us in the faith…’” (59:10)

I hope Allah (swt) listens and asnwers to everyones oprayers

Peace

 

[glo]

You can make dua for Others. The Prophet, sala Allahu alaihi wa salam, said “Whenever you make a supplication for another believer and he is not present, an angel will say ‘and same to you.’” One of the ethics when making dua to others is that, if you are going to make dua to yourself and others, start with yourself first, then you make dua to others. Butif you aregoing to make dua for others only, then you don’t have to mention yourself first. An example of starting with one’s self is seen is the verse, “And those who came after them say, ‘Our Lord! Forgive us and our brethren who were before us in the faith…’” (59:10)

I hope Allah (swt) listens and asnwers to everyones oprayers

Peace

Yes, Muslims can and should make du'a for other Muslims ...
But can and should they make du'a for non-Muslims?

I remember reading here on LI somewhere that Muslims are not supposed to make du'a for non-Muslims (except for praying for their reversion to Islam).

Can somebody please correct me, if I am mistaken?
I posted this post before, but it seems to have gotten lost ...

Peace

 

[Curaezipirid]

Is it permitted/acceptable for non-Muslims to pray for Muslims? Or would Muslims be offended?

Thanks.

Of course your genuine prayers, when in real belief in One God, are always acceptable. No matter whom you pray for, or what religion or what sect of what religion, you pray with and in, So long as your mind to your Lord is within real belief in One Single Unifying God, creator of all real matter, and decider of the Universe, then there is no question as to whether your prayer is acceptible.

Believer's Prayers always receive the gratitude of whom it is we pray for, even when we pray for persons whose immediate worldly belief system is different from our own.


As a Christian perhaps it might benefit you to learn that Muslims are taught to mind very consciously what form of internal mental process is going on for us during prayer. Many of us are very familiar with the processing of becoming aware of imperfections in our own prayer forms, since we are taught to be more in fear of any wrong mindedness than Christians are. So if a Muslim tells you your prayers might not be received, then they may only be referring to a Muslim experience of comprhending what has potential to go wrong with an odd prayer form.

Use the Lord's Prayer, since it is a formula which has an Arabic variety also.

Here I will try to find a variety in English:

In the name of the Holy Active and of the Holy passivity and in the name of the Holy Reconciliation in Jesus Christ
Because in Isa alone have I come into Islam
Hear this prayer will survive me

In the name of Allah the Beneficient and the Merciful
This is a Prayer
Oh Allah of Faith
Allah of Freedom
Allah prepare me for this
My body and mind
Be clean and well thought of
That I may turn to you alone in Prayer
Prepare that I fear not
To sacrifice my want
And prepare that I receive
That I am able accept
Unconditionally Loved by all and sundry
My soul ever
Faithful in Prayer
Allah is who can protect me from the accursed
Glory be Allah’s
Praise be Allah’s
Blessed in Majesty Mercy and Grace
Alone Highest in Judgment
First of the world
We worship Truly
And ask for Help only in truth
Lead us upon the way of truth
As favoured in you
Not the path of those whom anger you
Or those who lead us astray
I have this much I know I sacrifice when I Pray
And am in Faith that those who blaspheme
Your name will loose all their wealth
Grant Glory to the cause of my being
And that I may worthily fulfil
And worthily worship
Allah alone be praised
None is before Allah
That all Praise belong to
Only who sustain believing true
Glory to who created my being
Glory upon the most high
To Allah alone I pray
Allah begetteth not
Neither is begotten
And none can invite
Greetings to all Allah’s prophets
Allah’s Peace and Blessings be upon
Ever well remembered Mohammud
For teaching us to sustain this Faith
That all pious people are enabled
Worship belonging only in Allah
I manifest this belief in my Prayer
By words dress and posture
Be that I abstain from temptations
And am among the worldwide community of Moslims
Who can understand
This my account
In the Freedom of Faith
Is alone in me with Allah
And I am in preparation ever
To spread this good message
Allah’s people are any
And none designated more worthy
Than any other one
But only in that we accept
Truly to live in Allah
Accepting His Beneficence
Accepting His Mercy and Grace
His compassion our face
Bless all the people of Mohammed’s
Greatest of inheritances
Of Faith sustaining
The protection of children
That children also
May Dream in Peace
Accept our sacrifice
Giving up our want
To receive that we must for Peace
By Faith and Hope in Jesus and Love being among
Allah whose work is in Heaven
Forever Holy and Praiseworthy your name
All Earthly matters of Governance by yours Forever more
May we ever enact only within your will
That this our Earth become liken to Heaven in governance by Faith
Bless us with daily providence
Let us know your truth in Forgiveness
Exactly as we are able to administer our own compassion to your people
Lead us not towards those patterns that tempt us to continue unbelieving
But release us from the prisons of our fall
For in your Greatness you alone Allah
Hold every answer I need
That in truth I pray we folk of this Earth
Can govern justly
In your light
Ever Praising
And Honouring
Your Glory
And Forevermore
Giving up that Power
We have perceived
For it ever was yours
Oh Allah the Beneficent and Merciful
Hear our Prayer


Ameen



You can read it is the same as the Lords Prayer in Christian thought form, but its words tell out the full story within the Lord's prayer. This one is a rendition of those words used in Islam, made for Christians also to believe.

 

[glo]

Thank you, Curaezipirid.
That's very interesting! There is not much in that prayer that I would not agree with.

Since you seem to be knowledgeable in this field, perhaps you can answer this question of mine too?

"I remember reading here on LI somewhere that Muslims are not supposed to make du'a for non-Muslims (except for praying for their reversion to Islam)"

Thanks

 

[AmarFaisal]

HI sis glo,

If I have good friend, who is a non muslim, and is suffering(God Forbid), I have in the past and would in future pray for her. I'd pray something like this "Ya Allah, ease her pain" or "Grant her Sabr" etc

May I ask my brothers n sisters here : Is this haram?

 

[Umar001]

Sometimes Non-Muslims shout out a prayer for me and I ask Allah to guide them

WHAT? Non Muslims shout prayers out for you? ^o)

To the point, I would feel more upset if someone prayed for me a prayer which included shirk. If someone said 'Oh Jesus, deliver Eesa from Confusion' I'd feel pretty annoyed. That'd be like me being a means for shirk. When I speak to Christians I do say that I will and do pray to the God that created us, and leave it at that.

If a Christian or anyone jus said 'Oh Almighty God, Creator....' then I'd be abit uncomfortable, but ok I guess.

As for me praying for someone else, I think, its crucial, it would be illogical and silly for a Muslim to pray for a non Muslim about anything other than getting guided. Example,

"Oh Allah help Tyrone to get a new job"

A muslims believes that this life is but a test, and that the truly sucessful are not those who have money or women or children but those who are on the straight path. So it would be silly for a Muslim to say the above prayer if the person had more important matters in which they need help with, specially if the matter was to do with eternal life. I'd say for get the job and think about the permenant place of dwelling for Tyrone.

Thats in my mind why I would not raelly pray for anything much except the guidance of a non Muslim since in my mind this is the best and most precious thing one can have. Just like I would not give my mom the crusty part of my sandwhich but I would give her the suculent part, the best part, similarly I would pray for her to have the most delicious affair in this life and the next. Not just this.

 

[glo]

As for me praying for someone else, I think, its crucial, it would be illogical and silly for a Muslim to pray for a non Muslim about anything other than getting guided. Example,

"Oh Allah help Tyrone to get a new job"

A muslims believes that this life is but a test, and that the truly sucessful are not those who have money or women or children but those who are on the straight path. So it would be silly for a Muslim to say the above prayer if the person had more important matters in which they need help with, specially if the matter was to do with eternal life. I'd say for get the job and think about the permenant place of dwelling for Tyrone.

Greetings, Eesa

Are you saying that there is no point in praying for a non-Muslim, because their conversion is of greater importance than enything else?
(Is there anything in the Qu'ran or hadiths to that effect, or is that your personal feeling?)

Whilst I would agree with that from a Christian standpoint, it would not stop me from praying for God's protection and blessing in the lives of Christians and non-Christians.

Firstly, I believe that God loves us all, therefore we are all worthy of him in our lifes ... and who am I do decide who deserves God's blessing and who doesn't? I would rather leave that decision to God himself ...

Secondly. who knows if God's intervention (through healing or removing a difficult situation, for example) in somebody's life will not lead them to the truth?

For clarification, if I prayed 'God, guide Eesa in the truth' (thereby leaving it to God what exactly 'the truth' is) ... surely you wouldn't have a problem with that? :?

Peace

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

Hi

Glo, I feel you’re confusing between the two:

Whether, it is permissible for a Muslim to make supplication for a non-Muslim.
Whether, Non-Muslims supplications are answered by God.

As for the first, I do not think it is permissible for a Muslim to make du’a (supplication) for a non-muslim. Allah Knows Best.

As for the second, then yes even the Non-Muslims Du’a is Answered by Allah. And Allah Knows Best.

 

[Umm Yoosuf]

The Prohibition of supplicating for Polytheists


Imam Ahmad recorded that Ibn Al-Musayyib said that his father Al-Musayyib said, "When Abu Talib was dying, the Prophet went to him and found Abu Jahl and `Abdullah bin Abi Umayyah present. The Prophet said,


«أَيْ عَمِّ، قُلْ لَا إِلَهَ إِلِّا اللهُ كَلِمَةً أُحَاجُّ لَكَ بِهَا عِنْدَ اللهِ عَزَّ وَجَل»


(O uncle! Say, `La ilaha illa-llah,' a word concerning which I will plea for you with Allah, the Exalted and Most Honored.) Abu Jahl and `Abdullah bin Abi Umayyah said, `O Abu Talib! Would you leave the religion of Abdul-Muttalib' Abu Talib said, `Rather, I will remain on the religion of Abdul-Muttalib.' The Prophet said,


«لَأَسْتَغْفِرَنَّ لَكَ مَا لَمْ أُنْهَ عَنْك»


(I will invoke Allah for forgiveness for you, as long as I am not prohibited from doing so.) This verse was revealed,


[مَا كَانَ لِلنَّبِىِّ وَالَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ أَن يَسْتَغْفِرُواْ لِلْمُشْرِكِينَ وَلَوْ كَانُواْ أُوْلِى قُرْبَى مِن بَعْدِ مَا تَبَيَّنَ لَهُمْ أَنَّهُمْ أَصْحَـبُ الْجَحِيمِ ]

(It is not (proper) for the Prophet and those who believe to ask Allah's forgiveness for the Mushrikin, even though they be of kin, after it has become clear to them that they are the dwellers of the Fire.) Concerning Abu Talib, this Ayah was revealed,


[إِنَّكَ لاَ تَهْدِى مَنْ أَحْبَبْتَ وَلَـكِنَّ اللَّهَ يَهْدِى مَن يَشَآءُ]

(Verily, you guide not whom you like, but Allah guides whom He wills) [28:56].'' This Hadith is recorded in the Two Sahihs. Ibn Jarir recorded that Sulayman bin Buraydah said that his father said, "When the Prophet came to Makkah, he went to a grave, sat next to it, started talking and then stood up with tears in his eyes. We said, `O Allah's Messenger! We saw what you did.' He said,


«إِنِّي اسْتَأْذَنْتُ رَبِّي فِي زِيَارَةِ قَبْرِ أُمِّي فَأَذِنَ لِي، وَاسْتَأْذَنْتُهُ فِي الْاسْتِغْفَارِ لَهَا فَلَمْ يَأْذَنْ لِي»


(I asked my Lord for permission to visit the grave of my mother and He gave me permission. I asked for His permission to invoke Him for forgiveness for her, but He did not give me permission.) We never saw him more tearful than on that day.''' Al-`Awfi narrated from Ibn `Abbas about Allah's statement,


[مَا كَانَ لِلنَّبِىِّ وَالَّذِينَ ءَامَنُواْ أَن يَسْتَغْفِرُواْ لِلْمُشْرِكِينَ]


(It is not (proper) for the Prophet and those who believe to ask Allah's forgiveness for the Mushrikin) "The Prophet wanted to invoke Allah for forgiveness for his mother, but Allah did not allow him. The Prophet said,


«إِنَّ إِبْرَاهِيمَ خَلِيلَ اللهِ صلى الله عليه وسلّم قَدِ اسْتَغْفَرَ لِأَبِيه»

(Ibrahim, Allah's Khalil, invoked Allah for his father.) Allah revealed,


[وَمَا كَانَ اسْتِغْفَارُ إِبْرَهِيمَ لاًّبِيهِ إِلاَّ عَن مَّوْعِدَةٍ وَعَدَهَآ إِيَّاهُ]


(And Ibrahim's invoking (of Allah) for his father's forgiveness was only because of a promise he [Ibrahim] had made to him (his father)). '' `Ali bin Abi Talhah narrated that Ibn `Abbas commented on this Ayah, "They used to invoke Allah for them (pagans) until this Ayah was revealed. They then refrained from invoking Allah to forgive the dead among them, but were not stopped from invoking Allah for the living among them until they die. Allah sent this Ayah,


[وَمَا كَانَ اسْتِغْفَارُ إِبْرَهِيمَ لاًّبِيهِ]


(And Ibrahim's invoking (of Allah) for his father's forgiveness was only...) [9:114].'' Allah said next,


[فَلَمَّا تَبَيَّنَ لَهُ أَنَّهُ عَدُوٌّ لِلَّهِ تَبَرَّأَ مِنْهُ]

(But when it became clear to him [Ibrahim] that he (his father) is an enemy of Allah, he dissociated himself from him) [9:114]. Ibn `Abbas commented, "Ibrahim kept asking Allah to forgive his father until he died, when he realized that he died as an enemy to Allah, he disassociated himself from him.'' In another narration, he said, "When his father died he realized that he died as an enemy of Allah.'' Similar was said by Mujahid, Ad-Dahhak, Qatadah and several others. `Ubayd bin `Umayr and Sa`id bin Jubayr said, "Ibrahim will disown his father on the Day of Resurrection, but he will meet his father and see dust and fatigue on his face. He will say, `O Ibrahim! I disobeyed you, but today, I will not disobey you.' Ibrahim will say, `O Lord! You promised me that You will not disgrace me on the Day they are resurrected. What more disgrace than witnessing my father being disgraced' He will be told, `Look behind you,' where he will see a bloody hyena -- for his father will have been transformed into that -- and it will be dragged from its feet and thrown in the Fire.''' Allah's statement,


[إِنَّ إِبْرَهِيمَ لأَوَّاهٌ حَلِيمٌ]


(Verily, Ibrahim was Awwah and was forbearing.) means, he invoked Allah always, according to `Abdullah bin Mas`ud. Several narrations report this from Ibn Mas`ud. It was also said that, `Awwah', means, `who invokes Allah with humility', `merciful', `who believes with certainty', `who praises (Allah)', and so forth.


[وَمَا كَانَ اللَّهُ لِيُضِلَّ قَوْماً بَعْدَ إِذْ هَدَاهُمْ حَتَّى يُبَيِّنَ لَهُم مَّا يَتَّقُونَ إِنَّ اللَّهَ بِكُلِّ شَيْءٍ عَلِيمٌ - إِنَّ اللَّهَ لَهُ مُلْكُ السَّمَـوَتِ وَالاٌّرْضِ يُحْىِ وَيُمِيتُ وَمَا لَكُمْ مِّن دُونِ اللَّهِ مِن وَلِىٍّ وَلاَ نَصِيرٍ ]


(115. And Allah will never lead a people astray after He has guided them until He makes clear to them what they should avoid. Verily, Allah is the All-Knower of everything.) (116. Indeed to Allah belongs the dominion of the heavens and the earth, He gives life and He causes death. And besides Allah you have neither any protector nor any helper.)

Tafsir ibn Kathir.

I'll see if I can find more stuff on this issue.

 

[Umar001]

Howdy Glo,

Greetings, Eesa

Are you saying that there is no point in praying for a non-Muslim, because their conversion is of greater importance than enything else?
(Is there anything in the Qu'ran or hadiths to that effect, or is that your personal feeling?)

Personal feelings. And yes, I do belive that I rather pray continuosly for a person to go heaven than for him to have a mercedes.

Whilst I would agree with that from a Christian standpoint, it would not stop me from praying for God's protection and blessing in the lives of Christians and non-Christians.

What's the greatest protection though? I understand kind of what you mean, but to me, unless the greatest needs are met I wouldn't feel any point in moving to lesser and more trivial matters.

Firstly, I believe that God loves us all, therefore we are all worthy of him in our lifes ... and who am I do decide who deserves God's blessing and who doesn't? I would rather leave that decision to God himself ...

I don't know if this is in reply to me, but I agree that it's God's descion. Still would not stop me for praying for the person's guidance. I do belive that noone is guided except by Allah, yet, I still do pray that my family is guided by His permission and that they accept the guidance.

Secondly. who knows if God's intervention (through healing or removing a difficult situation, for example) in somebody's life will not lead them to the truth?

But then this would be included in the prayer for their guidance. If I pray for God to get me to the masjid on time, whether the method of transportation is a car or bus, it is included within the prayer. I could also pray, God please let the bus arrive quickly, but if I am not mistaken, that request would be included in me asking 'please let me get to the masjid on time'.

When I pray that God guides someone, I feel I also include the means for that guidance, if they have a near death experience to make them realise and their end product is their being guided then wouldn't that be an answer to the prayer.

For clarification, if I prayed 'God, guide Eesa in the truth' (thereby leaving it to God what exactly 'the truth' is) ... surely you wouldn't have a problem with that? :?

The thing is Glo, I know, or feel, that any Christian who believes in the trinity, only prayes in Jesus' name because they are really wanting me to have their 'joy'. So when someone says 'Please God help Eesa to see through this presentation that you are Three in One and that you Sacrifised your Son, In Jesus' name I pray' I do understand taht they are saying this because they genuinly want me to be 'saved'.

But at the same time, I feel akward, because in my mind, they are doing the greatest wrong, in my sake. I'm sure you see what I mean, I wouldn't feel comfortable to see someone kill their mother infront of me, how much more then when someone does something greater because of me.

 

[glo]

Greetings Eesa

I wasn't making an argument against praying for God's guidance in people's lives.
Instead I was trying to argue for also praying for other divine interventions (such as healing, dealing with difficult situations etc).

The thing is Glo, I know, or feel, that any Christian who believes in the trinity, only prayes in Jesus' name because they are really wanting me to have their 'joy'. So when someone says 'Please God help Eesa to see through this presentation that you are Three in One and that you Sacrifised your Son, In Jesus' name I pray' I do understand taht they are saying this because they genuinly want me to be 'saved'.

Actually, I pray exactly in the manner as I wrote in my previous post:
'God, please guide [person X] in the truth' ... what God makes of that I gladly leave to him ...

Look at it this way:
You truly believe that Islam is correct, right?
If Islam is correct, why then should it worry you that other people are praying for you? If my faith is wrong, what harm can I do to you by praying falsly??? Allah is surely greater than my false prayers.
If, on the other hand, Christianity is correct (I know, I know ... just humour me for a moment ...), then God may answer my prayer and really come and lead you to the truth ...
What would be wrong with that? If it is from God, then surely it is good! All the time!

If there is one thing we can agree on, it is that we both desire and strive for God's truth to be revealed in our lives! What an adventure!

Peace, eesa

 

[Umar001]

I understand the point, but I still think any energy I put into praying for someone I should put into praying for the best thing ever for them.

As for the instance of your prayer, then I do not really object to it, though even then I'd wonder who you mean by God, and I would have assumed by truth you would mean Christianity since that is the truth in your view, else you wouldnt be following it. Thats why I would feel abit wierd, since I would understand a Muslim says 'God guide him to the truth' to mean God guide him to Islam, and a Christian saying God guide him to the truth as being God guide him to Christianity.

 

[- Qatada -]

I agree with what you say glo, that's a good prayer - to ask God to guide everyone upon the truth. And no matter what we disagree on, if we are truelly sincere - God will guide us since He knows our sincerity in wanting to follow the true path.


It reminds me of this;


Allaah says:

“O My slaves, all of you are astray except those whom I guide, so ask Me for guidance, and I will guide you. O My slaves, all of you are hungry except those whom I feed, so ask me for food and I will feed you. O My slaves, all of you are naked except those whom I clothe, so ask Me for clothing and I will clothe you. … O My slaves, if the first of you and the last of you, your humans and your jinn, were to stand on a single plain and ask of Me and I were to give each one what he asked for, that would not cause any loss to Me greater than what is lost when a needle is dipped into the sea.”

Narrated by Muslim (2577).
​

Peace.

 

[glo]

I agree with what you say glo, that's a good prayer - to ask God to guide everyone upon the truth. And no matter what we disagree on, if we are truelly sincere - God will guide us since He knows our sincerity in wanting to follow the true path.

Peace.

You said it better than me, Qatanda!

It is God's truth I am yearning for, God's guidance in my life, God's Spirit in me!
That means - by definition - that I have to free myself (daily) from my own desires (or that of others) and my own interpretations (or that of others) of what God may want from me, and instead listen to Him and be guided by Him alone ...

I try to start every day with that attitude of surrender and openess to God.

If I felt that it was God's will for me to stop eating pork, pray 5 times a day in a prescribed manner and cover my head, then I would! Without a doubt.
Truth is, I do not feel God prompting me in that way ...
My relationship with God is alive and buzzing in the faith I am following right now, whereas everytime I have pondered Islam, I (personally) have not felt God's presence or guidance in it ...

That's all I can go by.
May God lead us all in the truth ... and may we all be willing to hear and ready to follow!

When Jesus gathered his disciples, we just said 'Follow me', and they dropped what they were doing and followed ...
I pray that we are all prepared to follow God in such a way!

Jesus also said that there will be some who will close their hearts to the truth.

In them is fulfilled the prophecy of Isaiah:
" 'You will be ever hearing but never understanding;
you will be ever seeing but never perceiving.
For this people's heart has become calloused;
they hardly hear with their ears,
and they have closed their eyes.
Otherwise they might see with their eyes,
hear with their ears,
understand with their hearts
and turn, and I would heal them.' But blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear. For I tell you the truth, many prophets and righteous men longed to see what you see but did not see it, and to hear what you hear but did not hear it."
(Matthew 13: 14-17)

May that not be any of us!

You see, I find it strangely simple:
As long as we believe in God, trust ourself into his hands, really be open to his guidance in our lives, follow when we hear him calling ... we cannot go wrong ...! :statisfie

God alone matters! Not what you think, or I, or the Pope, or any scholar, preacher or imam ...
God alone matters!

Peace