Question to our non-Muslim Friends

[Ibrahim Spinoza]

Whoa! Sorry, but I see it as the exact opposite. My journey to Islam has been nothing but "ask", "find out", "explore". Not once did I ever ask a question about something in Islam and got the answer "Oh, that's just what God wants, accept it", except maybe from a few Islamically uneducated individuals. Islam pretty much orders you the seek knowledge that can benefit you, and what can benefit you more than knowledge about Islam itself?

I am glad to hear that, that was my impression of Islam and what I want to believe. Particularly in classical times the Islamic philosophers were some of the greatest minds around. (The Kalaam cosmological argument is very strong at present, which is an argument attributed to Ibn Russhd )

However, the number of ignorant people around saddens me. This is probably true of people in general, rather than Islam in particular. Christians, for example, have a number of stupid hateful people amonst them.

You did ask for what non-Muslims think of Islam, ie what your "public image" is like. So I am not claiming my impressions are correct, only that this is how muslims can appear to some outsiders.

I suppose that Muslims should restrain and reprimand their rude bretheren, and Christians should do the same. It always seems to be the hateful ones that get the press and make the most noise. I would like to see the reasonable, polite people get more media attention.

Incidentally, Christians too are commanded to "love God with their mind", something which many are unaware of.

peace

 

[جوري]

reasonable and polite people don't make the news.. it doesn't make for good entertainment and it certainly is not news worthy.. I have never tuned on my set to see, the murder that didn't happen, the foiled assault, or now in health news.. look at all these healthy adults and children.. has anyone ever seen that happen?.. sort of like poetry.. what great poetry has come from a state of happiness?-- I don't know.. Anyhow, I'll maintain people always find what they seek, if you seek goodness, I am sure it will find you back and the opposite is also true...

peace!

 

[Ibrahim Spinoza]

very true, PurestAmbrosia

 

[Ibrahim Spinoza]

There is a difference between intellectual literature and that which is considered false and malicious publication printed for the purpose of defaming a man, a religion or people!...

I agree. But neither of the sites I mentioned were intended to defame anyone. Yes, they would probably be considered controversial, but the intention was to inform or debate, not to defame.

do you consider the protocols of the elders of Zion 'intellectual'?

No I don't, but I do contend that it should be allowed to be published. Truth has nothing to fear from lies... they are easily enough shown to be false.

If there are false things being published, then those who know the truth can also publish in response to it.

For example, when the book/movie by Dan Brown "The Da Vinci Code" came out, several people have published scholarly refutations showing how weak the scholarship behind it is.

 

[جوري]

I think the books were/are indeed allowed to be published? also the protocols are being passed off as fiction... none of these malicious anti-Islamic books are being depicted as anything but truth!.. I am in a bit of a hurry but if you research back in time you'll find that though the Spanish kicked the Jews and Muslims from their land, we absorbed the Jews in our countries.. a famous Jew named Maimondes wrote a book basically mocking the sons of Ishmael as he called it, meant to speak ill of Muslims, and though he was a guest in our countries, what happened was another author wrote a book about the accolades of the sons of Ishmael.. no one kicked him, killed him, or out death threats against him, he was allowed to share his point of view.. now a days the media looks for any disgraceful and malicious events to blow out of proportion and say.. see those are the Muslims, uncivilized and barbaric... If it were the case, Islam wouldn't have prospered to what is collectively known as the age of enlightenment at a time where Europe was experiencing its darkest ages...

peace!

 

[MaiCarInMtl]

This is one of the difficulties I have with Islam. There seems to be no tolerance for intellectual questioning, and this is not attractive. If Islam is true, it can withstand questioning, and has nothing to fear.

I personally have to disagree with you here. I find the religion itself encourages people to learn and to question things. Perhaps you are having problems with people who practice the religion. I've often found the people to be more than willing to answer my questions, but of course some people will just call you stupid and give you a hard time, etc etc But you find that in every faith.

 

[Ibrahim Spinoza]

Salaam

I thought I would rewrite what I wrote earlier.

Firstly, a little about me: I used to be a christian for many years. I am very well read in christian thinking, so can probably help with some of the trickier questions.

I realise this thread is not specifically aimed at christians, but at any non-muslim.

I have a reasonable education in Islam. I have done comparitive religion courses, read some of the Koran in translation (i intend to read more), read articles by Islamic apologists. I once planned to live in a Muslim country, and began learning Arabic.

Of course, this does not mean I know everything. As I well know, the experience of practicing a religion adds a dimension beyond what one can know from academia alone.

===

So, you've asked "What do non-muslims think of Islam/Muslims?"

Firstly, thankyou for asking. Many religious people only seem interested in preaching rather than listening. I think it will be helpful for all of us to learn from each other in a spirit of respect.

There are many things I admire in Islam - for example, the commitment to God's oneness, to justice, to good morals, to the poor. I value the contribution that Islamic philosophy, architecture and culture have made to the world.

Against that, I find the ignorance and rudeness of - apparently - many muslims sad. I won't link to websites where you can find evidence of this, but let me say I was shocked by the hateful insulting language and poor thinking I have read by some muslims. Yes, I have also read more reasonable things, but this is the minority.

I say "apparently", because I am aware I do not know every muslim on earth. But you've asked how muslims "in general" come across to outsiders. Maybe it's only the vocal ones who are hateful.

In general, I think many non-muslims are afraid of muslims. Thanks to the extremists, many non-muslims think all muslims want to kill them. I have heard that Islam is a religion of peace. I want to believe that.

Alongside this, Islam appears intolerant, and unable to engage in reasonable intellectual debate. When Islam is challenged intellectually, it appears to respond with hatred and insults rather than reason.

You asked how you "appear" to outsiders. I am aware that how it "appears" is not how it IS. But that's what you wanted to know. I am sad to say, Islam does not come across well even to thoughtful and sympathetic people.

 

[Ibrahim Spinoza]

I think the books were/are indeed allowed to be published? also the protocols are being passed off as fiction... none of these malicious anti-Islamic books are being depicted as anything but truth!.. .

For a long time, to use your example, the protocols were published as 'truth'. I have no problem with anyone publishing them as 'truth' again. I think anyone educated will soon discover they are poor scholarship.

No doubt there are anti-Islamic books out there. But I wasn't referring to those. Also, I contend they should be allowed to be published. It is up to the faithful to show the information they are wrong.

The two examples I gave were a website about Islamic art, and a review of a book by a muslim woman about her experiences. Neither of these were intended to be insulting, and the woman in question claims that she loves Islam and is a committed muslim.

Now, they may be wrong, but the way to counter them is with argument, not with censorship.

 

[جوري]

I can safely assume if you were able to purchase the books that, they are not in fact censored? And have in my afore post showed you times in history when obvious malice was met with forgivingness... You can purchase a reputable history book of that era and confirm that for yourself...

If you have any honest rational debates you can post them in the refutation section... I surmise that what you are looking for is some disapprobation for all the Muslims that you have encountered that met with your disapproval? Ones whom you find wrong, morally and socially culpable for one reason or another.. I don't think any member here will dispense with an apology for what seems plainly a subjective view!...

To be honest speaking for my person and I know it goes against the request of this thread.. but, I don't care how Islam is being perceived by some or even most non-muslims.. every one is entitled to his/her opinion.. so long as it doesn't turn into mob violence I don't see why I should personally care?
Each soul is held in pledge by its own deeds-- this isn't a communal effort.. We go to God as we are not held accountable for what the neighbors did...

peace and I hope you find what you are looking for...

 

[SATalha]

Thanks Every one for their post.

Just a comment on the last post, we all know the sitiuation that is taking place when it comes to the image of Islam. We see it in the media everyday and we hear about it from people that we know. Now if these people are representing Islam in a negative way, than it is our duty to spread the truth.

Thats why i wanted to post this thread, i wanted to see if peoples opinions are being changed or not. Iam like you sis, sometimes i realy couldnt care less.......but than i think we are give a duty by Allah (SWT) to propogate Islam to as many people as we can.