Repulsive verses in the bible

[Hiroshi]

Probably not, but that was a punishment direct from Allah, not a command from jesus or god to go and specifically kill women - including pregnant women, children and even animals

On some occasions the Israelites were used by God to make a complete extermination of his enemies, this is true. But in the passages that you quoted, Ezekiel 9:5-7 describes a vision seen by the prophet and the ones doing the slaughtering there are angels. And in Hosea 13:16 and Ezekiel 23:25, the cruelty described there is carried out by pagan nations that were allowed to conquer the Jews when God removed his protection as a punishment.

 

[Salahudeen]

The OT was replaced by the NT the same way the Quran replaced the Bible. I guess you should therefore clarify this thread to be directed to Jews not Christians.

(Psalm 19:7)The law of the LORD is perfect, restoring the soul; The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

Gods law is perfect,

Timothy 3:16 (New International Version)
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

all scripture is God breathed and usefull for teaching that INCLUDES both the N>T and O>T


Jesus orders Christians to follow the Old Testament's laws:* "Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.* I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished.* (Matthew 5:17-18)"

It is quite clear from these verses from the New Testament that Jesus peace be upon him did honor the Old Testament and did say that every single "letter" of it has to be honored, followed and fulfilled. fullfill doesnt mean to destroy it means to add to the law meaning make new ones in addition to the old ones

 

[Hiroshi]

(Psalm 19:7)The law of the LORD is perfect, restoring the soul; The testimony of the LORD is sure, making wise the simple.

Gods law is perfect,

Timothy 3:16 (New International Version)
All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness,

all scripture is God breathed and usefull for teaching that INCLUDES both the N>T and O>T


Jesus orders Christians to follow the Old Testament's laws:* "Do not think that I [Jesus] have come to abolish the Law (the Old Testament) or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them.* I tell you the truth, until heaven and earth disappear, not the smallest letter, not the least stroke or a pen, will by any means disappear from the Law (the Old Testament) until everything is accomplished.* (Matthew 5:17-18)"

It is quite clear from these verses from the New Testament that Jesus peace be upon him did honor the Old Testament and did say that every single "letter" of it has to be honored, followed and fulfilled. fullfill doesnt mean to destroy it means to add to the law meaning make new ones in addition to the old ones

Very good application of scripture.

 

[Ummu Sufyaan]

In Soorah 11:81-82 we read of fire and brimstone raining down upon Sodom with only Lot and his family escaping. Were the children and pregnant women evacuated first?

is there any evidence to suggest they weren't? how do we know that there pregnant women and child to begin with?

 

[Hiroshi]

is there any evidence to suggest they weren't? how do we know that there pregnant women and child to begin with?

Soorah 11:78-79 speaks of Lot's daughters which I believe Muslim commentators understand to refer to other women in the city (i.e. not his literal daughters). And with such a sex-crazed atmosphere it would be surprising if at least some of such women were not pregnant (otherwise why would Lot suggest that the mob have the women instead of his guests?) Also Genesis 19:4 indicates that young ones were there in the city ("from boy to old man").

 

[Ummu Sufyaan]

umm im quite lost. they were gaybo's, how did the women become impregnated genius. am i missing something here?


err its best not to jump to conclusions then present mere assumptions as evidence to support a baseless claim.

 

[Ramadhan]

Soorah 11:78-79 speaks of Lot's daughters which I believe Muslim commentators understand to refer to other women in the city (i.e. not his literal daughters). And with such a sex-crazed atmosphere it would be surprising if at least some of such women were not pregnant (otherwise why would Lot suggest that the mob have the women instead of his guests?) Also Genesis 19:4 indicates that young ones were there in the city ("from boy to old man").

1. As Aadil in the previous post has said, the verses referred to God's direct punishment to the people of Lut a.s., as opposed to jesus or god's commands in the bible verses to go and specifically kill women - including pregnant women, children and even animals.

2. The verses in the Qur'an did not mention about god's vengeful wrath on pregnant women, children and animals, as opposed to the repulsive verses in the bible that clearly showed god as quick-tempered wrathful one.

3. The people of Lut a.s. practiced homosexuality, so how did you get to conclude there were pregnant women everywhere? Is that what your bible says or is that your own fantasy?
I think it's time for you to read your bible cover-to-back to really understand that it is full of contradictions, errors and pornography, and then maybe you will realize that there were a lot of personal interests on the part of bible authors who wrote things based on their desires that completely changed jesus' true teachings.

 

[Hiroshi]

umm im quite lost. they were gaybo's, how did the women become impregnated genius. am i missing something here?

Compare Judges 19:22-25 where a most similar atrocity was carried out by Israelites of the tribe of Benjamin (Judges 19:16). They threatened to rape a male guest in someone's house but in the end raped his concubine instead.

 

[Ummu Sufyaan]

your not being consistent. first it seems like you are attacking the Quran then you defend your view by introducing verses of the bible.

p.s we dont allow preaching of other faiths on this forum.

 

[Hiroshi]

your not being consistent. first it seems like you are attacking the Quran then you defend your view by introducing verses of the bible.

p.s we dont allow preaching of other faiths on this forum.

I was informed (or possibly misinformed) by other Muslim members of Islamic Board, that it is allowable to quote the Bible only on this section of Comparative Religion. When did I attack the Qur'an? I only pointed out that it contains similar accounts to those in the Bible such as the story of Lot. I am not preaching my faith. But this thread is concerned with finding repulsiveness in the Bible and I understood that I would be allowed to comment.

 

[glo]

your not being consistent. first it seems like you are attacking the Quran then you defend your view by introducing verses of the bible.

p.s we dont allow preaching of other faiths on this forum.

With all due respect, Ummu Sufyaan, but it seems to me that Hiroshi quoted a Bible verse in order to answer the question which you asked him.

It seems unfair to first ask for evidence and then to complain about the evidence given as 'defending one's view' and 'preaching other faiths'.

With regards to promoting faiths other than Islam, we had some useful discussions in this thread.
Here is what Woodrow recommended:

One problem I see us Muslims have is when we ask a person of another faith what their beliefs are we tend to view it as them promoting their beliefs when they honestly state what they believe. A difficult area to work around. Either we learn not to ask such questions or we learn to be more specific in how we ask or we learn to see the answer as an answer and not as promoting a faith.

Salaam

 

[Hiroshi]

1. As Aadil in the previous post has said, the verses referred to God's direct punishment to the people of Lut a.s., as opposed to jesus or god's commands in the bible verses to go and specifically kill women - including pregnant women, children and even animals.

2. The verses in the Qur'an did not mention about god's vengeful wrath on pregnant women, children and animals, as opposed to the repulsive verses in the bible that clearly showed god as quick-tempered wrathful one.

Soldiers of pagan nations in Bible times were brutal in their actions and often spared no one. One particularly nasty practice of theirs was the slaughter of pregnant women as described in Hosea 13:16. God is not here singling out pregnant women as the special target for his wrath. He is warning the people of Samaria what they must expect if they rebel against God and lose God's protection. An attack by enemy nations would have terrible consequences for them.

3. The people of Lut a.s. practiced homosexuality, so how did you get to conclude there were pregnant women everywhere? Is that what your bible says or is that your own fantasy?
I think it's time for you to read your bible cover-to-back to really understand that it is full of contradictions, errors and pornography, and then maybe you will realize that there were a lot of personal interests on the part of bible authors who wrote things based on their desires that completely changed jesus' true teachings.

Sodom was both a city and a kingdom. I'm sorry but it is ridiculous to suppose that there were no pregnant women or children there in the time of Lot.

 

[Hiroshi]

3. The people of Lut a.s. practiced homosexuality, so how did you get to conclude there were pregnant women everywhere? Is that what your bible says or is that your own fantasy?

I found some info on a website that gives you some idea of the scale of Sodom and the surrounding cities that were destroyed by God.

Quote:
"Archaeology confirms that in the time just before Abraham, the settlement pattern of the land was also quite different than it is today. The hill country up above the Jordan Rift on the east and west, where almost all the population lives today, was sparsely settled, leaving lots of open space for Abraham to pasture his flocks. Most of the large population centers were in the lowlands. This includes the Jordan Rift Valley, where five large cities were discovered by archaeologists dating to this period. To give you an idea of the size of these cities: the first burial ground discovered (at Bab edh-Dhra) held up to 500,000 burials! That's one of the largest cemeteries yet found in the entire ancient Middle East. Two others were soon discovered with nearly equal numbers of burials (at Feifa and Khanazir): that's a total of up to 1.5 million burials! There must have been a lot of people living here at the time. This confirms that the land was more fertile in the past. Otherwise it's hard to imagine how so many people could have survived here. These five cities match the five "cities of the plain" mentioned in Genesis: Sodom, Gomorrah, Admah, Zeboiim, and Bela (Gen. 14:2)."

It seems that I am not yet allowed to include links in my posts so I cannot give the link for this.

 

[Hiroshi]

With all due respect, Ummu Sufyaan, but it seems to me that Hiroshi quoted a Bible verse in order to answer the question which you asked him.

It seems unfair to first ask for evidence and then to complain about the evidence given as 'defending one's view' and 'preaching other faiths'.

Thanks for your note of support there Glo.

 

[Seek]

Hello brothers and sisters,

It seems that I'm coming out all of a sudden and asking a question that might have been answered. But my Christian brothers and sisters, what do you think of these verses? I just want simple opinions please thank you

 

[Hiroshi]

3. The people of Lut a.s. practiced homosexuality, so how did you get to conclude there were pregnant women everywhere? Is that what your bible says or is that your own fantasy?
I think it's time for you to read your bible cover-to-back to really understand that it is full of contradictions, errors and pornography, and then maybe you will realize that there were a lot of personal interests on the part of bible authors who wrote things based on their desires that completely changed jesus' true teachings.

Actually I confess that I do see a flaw in my own argument. In Genesis 18:32 God declares that he will not destroy Sodom if he finds even ten righteous men there. This seems to say that only the wicked were destroyed, not anyone innocent.

 

[Hiroshi]

Hello brothers and sisters,

It seems that I'm coming out all of a sudden and asking a question that might have been answered. But my Christian brothers and sisters, what do you think of these verses? I just want simple opinions please thank you

What verses Seek?

 

[Ummu Sufyaan]

EDIT.......:hmm:

 

[Ummu Sufyaan]

I was informed (or possibly misinformed) by other Muslim members of Islamic Board, that it is allowable to quote the Bible only on this section of Comparative Religion.

i see...i didnt know this...or at least it slipped my mind. i didn't bother with the other thread that Woodrow started. i figured it was getting filled up with too much crap and there is only a certain amount my smelling mechanisms can handle.

When did I attack the Qur'an? I only pointed out that it contains similar accounts to those in the Bible such as the story of Lot.

your question about pregnant women and children being evacuated seemed to indicate a different intent. perhaps i misunderstood... i'll give the benefit of the doubt.

I am not preaching my faith. But this thread is concerned with finding repulsiveness in the Bible and I understood that I would be allowed to comment.

you asked a question about the quran, i thought it would only be relevant to answer from that point of view. considering my reply wasn't based on the biblical opinion, im not entirely sure why biblical verses were posted in attempt to explain your point of view. perhaps i wasn't wasn't clear? again i'll give the benefit of the doubt.

 

[Zafran]

Sodom was both a city and a kingdom. I'm sorry but it is ridiculous to suppose that there were no pregnant women or children there in the time of Lot.

No it isnt because 1 -there is no evedince for it 2 - God specifically gave a warning to the people that commited sodomy.