Respecting parents

[Jamila G]

Ok, I have joined today hoping that you good people can advise a non muslim of my sisters behaviour. I have deep respect for you all. I come from a mixed race marriage. My Father is a practising muslim and my mother is British and converted to islam.

A few years ago my father took a second wife in his country of origin. He did not speak to my mother about this - she found out the hard way. Anyway, now she lives with this and has come to accep this. None of us will ever meet the second wife, she is still in his country of origin and shall remain there.

My youngest sister has had difficulty accepting this. She has tried to influence my mother about his behaviour, this is wrong, she is a pracising muslim and should accept the decisions of her parents (or so I was led to believe). She caused some problems between them.

For one year I tried to support my sister through her difficulties. Then she stopped calling me and her mother - and no longer wanted to see her father. She stopped calling and visiting. I made efforts to take her children to see their grandparents. She allowed this but still wouldn't visit her mother.

After one year of this behaviour I began to get angry - I have done nothing wrong neither has her mother. I told her it was wrong and that she should visit her mother who is ill after sufferering three strokes. She refused. Now it is eight months ago since we have seen or spoken to her. She has had another child but only informed her mother after two weeks of the birth. My mother has never seen the grandchild. When she tries to phone her she makes excuses that she is busy and can't speak.

As muslims - can you tell me if this behaviour is right and acceptable? Thank you.

 

[nadia85]

Ok, I have joined today hoping that you good people can advise a non muslim of my sisters behaviour. I have deep respect for you all. I come from a mixed race marriage. My Father is a practising muslim and my mother is British and converted to islam.

A few years ago my father took a second wife in his country of origin. He did not speak to my mother about this - she found out the hard way. Anyway, now she lives with this and has come to accep this. None of us will ever meet the second wife, she is still in his country of origin and shall remain there.

My youngest sister has had difficulty accepting this. She has tried to influence my mother about his behaviour, this is wrong, she is a pracising muslim and should accept the decisions of her parents (or so I was led to believe). She caused some problems between them.

For one year I tried to support my sister through her difficulties. Then she stopped calling me and her mother - and no longer wanted to see her father. She stopped calling and visiting. I made efforts to take her children to see their grandparents. She allowed this but still wouldn't visit her mother.

After one year of this behaviour I began to get angry - I have done nothing wrong neither has her mother. I told her it was wrong and that she should visit her mother who is ill after sufferering three strokes. She refused. Now it is eight months ago since we have seen or spoken to her. She has had another child but only informed her mother after two weeks of the birth. My mother has never seen the grandchild. When she tries to phone her she makes excuses that she is busy and can't speak.

As muslims - can you tell me if this behaviour is right and acceptable? Thank you.

salam brother,Well I can see how ur sister is not happy but at the end of the day we only get 1 lot of parents and I dont think she should stop visiting

 

[transition?]

That is sad, you can only be patient with until she realizes that every soul tastes death and that children have an obligation to look over their parents. Her parents have done no wrong and even if they did, is it right to treat them so? Did they abandon your sister at the first sign of disobedience? Have you by chance told her that Muslim children must also be as kind as possible if their parents are Non Muslim?

As her sister you can only do so much. Have tried pointing out how you bore with her your own sister as you believed her to be wrong?

 

[Intisar]

I don't understand what exactly she's mad at. ^o) Is she mad at the fact that her father remarried, without telling her mum? Or is she just against polygamy and is mad at the fact that her mum never spoke out against it? If so, then that's really childish and none of her business. To get mad over something that doesn't really include her, her dad married someone else, and it's her mom's situation and it's her mom's job to remain patient (and she did alhamdulilah).

It is haraam to cut ties with family, so your mum should talk to her about this and tell her that even in the Quraan it states that when your parents are old, you must look after them and be nice and respectful to them as they have looked after you when you were young. That is disgusting behaviour, I don't know how one could disrespect their mother in such a way subhan'Allaah. You should really give her islamic advice on this and tell her that ''jannah lies under thy mother's feet'' and to kiss them if she has to, because after knowing that her mum had three strokes she still hasn't said talked to her, that's just really wrong behaviour.

Someone has to speak to her about this, to let her go on like this, so arrogantly and ignorantly is really unbelievable. It's very despicable behaviour, and who knows if she even knows what Islaam says about how you should treat your parents and that cutting ties with family members is haraam.

I just don't get why she's made a such a big deal out of something that really has nothing to do with her. :rollseyes *Sigh*

 

[Jamila G]

Ameena, thank you so much. I have a sister called Amina so there is something deeper in your answer for me. My mother has forgiven her husband and is prepared to live with this situation - my sister say's she cannot live with this situation. How dare she? How dare she judge her parents and not see them or allow them to see their grandchildren. She also refused to speak to me because

I told her this was wrong. She is wilful and selfish yet calls herself a good muslim. Her mother may die soon. I am beside myself with anger but try to remain calm.

 

[nadia85]

Ameena, thank you so much. I have a sister called Amina so there is something deeper in your answer for me. My mother has forgiven her husband and is prepared to live with this situation - my sister say's she cannot live with this situation. How dare she? How dare she judge her parents and not see them or allow them to see their grandchildren. She also refused to speak to me because

Well If ur mum is ok with it y is she stil botherd about it I can understand In the beging she didnt like what ur father did but she should have got over it

 

[Intisar]

Ameena, thank you so much. I have a sister called Amina so there is something deeper in your answer for me. My mother has forgiven her husband and is prepared to live with this situation - my sister say's she cannot live with this situation. How dare she? How dare she judge her parents and not see them or allow them to see their grandchildren. She also refused to speak to me because I told her this was wrong. She is wilful and selfish yet calls herself a good muslim. Her mother may die soon. I am beside myself with anger but try to remain calm.

Lol no problem sis. You know honestly I think your sis is wayyyy overreacting, and it's a really thing sad situation...not talking to your mum. I could never imagine not talking to my mum, I'd just be heartbroken, it brings me to tears just thinking about it subhan'Allaah. imsad And the fact that she won't even talk to you makes it even harder. Perhaps there's another deeper issue that she hasn't told you about, because I find it very weird and hard to understand her reason for not talking to y'all. You should really try to find out, insha'Allaah she's not that stubborn.

 

[Jamila G]

She is very stubborn. She thinks I take the side of my father - which I do not. I try to remain objective and be there for them in their final years. My husband died suddenly I know how it is to lose someone - I can't imagine how she will feel if this happens and she doesn't make peace with her father. My mother is patient and loving - she doesn't want to cause any upset so doesn't call her about it.
The only thing I can think of is post natal depression - I had this too and I know its hard but it is no excuse. Her husband has not been in contact with his in-laws either. It is disgusting and really hard to handle.

 

[Jamila G]

That is sad, you can only be patient with until she realizes that every soul tastes death and that children have an obligation to look over their parents. Her parents have done no wrong and even if they did, is it right to treat them so? Did they abandon your sister at the first sign of disobedience? Have you by chance told her that Muslim children must also be as kind as possible if their parents are Non Muslim?

As her sister you can only do so much. Have tried pointing out how you bore with her your own sister as you believed her to be wrong?

Yes I have told her what you said - it only made her more angry. She is not prepared to listen. Only to condemn.

 

[Uthman]

Islam places great importance on maintaining the ties of kinship.

The Prophet, peace and blessings be upon him, said: “Whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day should maintain good relation with his kindred.” (Reported by al-Bukhari and Muslim)

 

[Al-Zaara]

I don't understand what exactly she's mad at. ^o) Is she mad at the fact that her father remarried, without telling her mum? Or is she just against polygamy and is mad at the fact that her mum never spoke out against it? If so, then that's really childish and none of her business. To get mad over something that doesn't really include her, her dad married someone else, and it's her mom's situation and it's her mom's job to remain patient (and she did alhamdulilah).

I absolutely disagree with the entirety! Excuse me, but what is childish and naive is to think the relationship and actions between the parents has nothing to do with the child or that it won't influence the child. Their marriage is first and foremost their relationship, but the children come next, wether you want it or not. It is inevitable that actions like those give results in everything that is tied to the person/persons somehow. The children are included, it is a very difficult thing, family.

She shouldn't make her mother suffer like this, neither make herself suffer. She doesn't have to accept the situation, but she must understand it. It does her greater good if she ignores the situation and concentrates on the other aspects of life with her mother and father.

It is interesting to see that she makes the active attacks on her mother, while it is the father that has done what is the core to the problems. Through attacking her mother actively, she is passively fighting her father, whom it to me seems she has not had an as close relationship with. She might feel betrayed, as someone she has looked up to (mother) has 'given up' and her (daugther) values and insights in life, opinions and attitudes are damaged by very close links.

A situation like this is complicated. The father did of lack of understanding, not talk about it, the mother was surprised and hurt and the children are affected by all of this. Again, she can hate this for the rest of her life but she can show humane and intellectual understanding to her mother and not include her in the hate she has for the situation that now cannot be taken back.

I believe it would require a deep dialogue between the mother, father and daughter to actually see some progress.

If nothing works, you gotta continue to pray althrough the time. Sometimes, you are ought to accept a situation you cannot change and through small gestures try to make a greater movement.

 

[Jamila G]

I absolutely disagree with the entirety! Excuse me, but what is childish and naive is to think the relationship and actions between the parents has nothing to do with the child or that it won't influence the child. Their marriage is first and foremost their relationship, but the children come next, wether you want it or not. It is inevitable that actions like those give results in everything that is tied to the person/persons somehow. The children are included, it is a very difficult thing, family.

She shouldn't make her mother suffer like this, neither make herself suffer. She doesn't have to accept the situation, but she must understand it. It does her greater good if she ignores the situation and concentrates on the other aspects of life with her mother and father.

It is interesting to see that she makes the active attacks on her mother, while it is the father that has done what is the core to the problems. Through attacking her mother actively, she is passively fighting her father, whom it to me seems she has not had an as close relationship with. She might feel betrayed, as someone she has looked up to (mother) has 'given up' and her (daugther) values and insights in life, opinions and attitudes are damaged by very close links.

A situation like this is complicated. The father did of lack of understanding, not talk about it, the mother was surprised and hurt and the children are affected by all of this. Again, she can hate this for the rest of her life but she can show humane and intellectual understanding to her mother and not include her in the hate she has for the situation that now cannot be taken back.

I believe it would require a deep dialogue between the mother, father and daughter to actually see some progress.

If nothing works, you gotta continue to pray althrough the time. Sometimes, you are ought to accept a situation you cannot change and through small gestures try to make a greater movement.

No her relationship with both of them was close. Equal. She looked up to her father more as a good muslim. Not her mother. She says she cannot visit her mother because she doesn't want to see her father. She stays away from us all. I'm sorry but she is not a child she is 41yrs old with five children and a husband. If she is a good muslim she has to show understanding of her fathers situation also. He was under great pressure from his family to take a wife in his country of origin. THis pressure continued for years. His problem is he found it impossible to tell his first wife through fear of hurting her...not because he is a bad person. I have an understanding of his situation - I know his mistakes are difficult for him to deal with but hopefully all of the family will come through this with the understanding of my mother. The situation is made worse by my sister who cannot forgive and move on. She is intolerant and controlling of every situation - this is one situation which she cannot control so she has walked away. This is not right.

 

[Al-Zaara]

I didn't say it was right. She is the child to the parent, although she of course is a mature woman aswell. I will always be my parents child, although I grow over 50.
I did say she's acting the wrong way and as many have said, Islam tells us to have a strong bond to the family.

But now condemning her and talking bad of her, does it help release the situation? If you want something, you gotta give it in return. You see yourself as the more objective, Islamic and understanding side. Well, you have no other choice than to continue like that and invite her to that side. Although she's attacking, small things do touch the core. I honestly do not see how you can change her, as she is mature now and has her own life, she will have to grow from it by herself. I know it sounds brutal, but if she still is so stubborn, one cannot do much else than continue slowly but steadily to talk to her.


But you know what I just got thinking - Jelaousy. Her father's love to be shared with another woman, although althrough her life she is used to him giving only the selected women his love, the sisters, mother, daugthers and wife. Now a new woman comes in. It's a big change suddenly.

How old is the second wife? She might just also be jealous of her. She is the youngest, it is a different issue and role to be the youngest daugther.

 

[Intisar]

I absolutely disagree with the entirety! Excuse me, but what is childish and naive is to think the relationship and actions between the parents has nothing to do with the child or that it won't influence the child. Their marriage is first and foremost their relationship, but the children come next, wether you want it or not. It is inevitable that actions like those give results in everything that is tied to the person/persons somehow. The children are included, it is a very difficult thing, family.

I feel she is overstepping her boundaries, why? Not only does her father not need her permission to marry another, but he doesn't even need his wife's. Is this really enough to hold a grudge over with your mother who really had nothing to do with it? Imho, that's what makes it childish. Daddy dearest did not and does not ever need his daughter's permission to marry anybody, and for her to use her mom as a casualty is utterly despicable. Even if she did hate the second wife, she doesn't have to meet her, speak to her, or even see her. And she claims, as her older sister says, to be such a good Muslim subhan'Allaah. Allaah commands us to be respectful to our parents and to never cut ties with our family. She hasn't just cut ties with her Dad, but with her mom and sister who have really done nothing to deserve this. I don't know what else to tell you sis, but what Jamila's just said about her sister is just really really heartbreaking. Especially knowing that her mother is sick, she's already suffered three strokes, subhan'Allaah that is just heartless. And not only that, she isn't even allowed to see her grandchildren. imsad

Her Dad deciding remarry again does effect her, but she is just taking it way too far.

 

[Al-Zaara]

Sorry to be this blunt, but that's understood already, that the youngest daugther has taken things too far.

And just 'cause you don't need permission, doesn't make things a free-go. Weak argumentation, but nonetheless, her actions are psychologically explainable (not favoured or good, but there are reasons, call them childish or not).

To question her Muslim identity or even to talk bad of it, isn't it something like backbiting?

She asked if it's OK to act like this. Obviously NO. Do you wanna continue to backbite and say how horrible of a person she is, how much she is sinning and how much you've suffered, or do you wanna solve it? The issue is how to solve it. Well, you cannot do much, seeing of the current situation! Give it time. It is how it is. If one sees oneself as the better Muslim through having more understanding and patience, I cannot say what more can be done than pray, pray and pray.

I hope Allah gives them time. One year is not much if you think how fast time flies by, but one year can be a lot of tomorrow never comes. InshaAllah, she grows over herself and inshaAllah they will be able to have a good dialogue about this issue one day.

 

[Intisar]

To question her Muslim identity or even to talk bad of it, isn't it something like backbiting?

No I didn't, all I said was she claims to be a good Muslim but doesn't respect her parents (going off what Jamila said). My point was, to perhaps to tell her sister that severing the ties of kinship is haraam and to be a good Muslim you need to respect and talk to your mother (parents). She's depriving her children of even seeing their grandmother, yet another casualty.

She asked if it's OK to act like this. Obviously NO. Do you wanna continue to backbite and say how horrible of a person she is, how much she is sinning and how much you've suffered, or do you wanna solve it? The issue is how to solve it. Well, you cannot do much, seeing of the current situation! Give it time. It is how it is. If one sees oneself as the better Muslim through having more understanding and patience, I cannot say what more can be done than pray, pray and pray.

And now you're going off on a tangent...I don't know if this is even directed at me. I never said she was a horrible person, but that her actions are despicable and heartbreaking.

I hope Allah gives them time. One year is not much if you think how fast time flies by, but one year can be a lot of tomorrow never comes. InshaAllah, she grows over herself and inshaAllah they will be able to have a good dialogue about this issue one day.

Ameen.

 

[Al-Zaara]

No I didn't, all I said was she claims to be a good Muslim but doesn't respect her parents (going off what Jamila said).

How can you continue from somewhere which you know nothing about? Again, her claims are personal/subjective, the girl might pray and wear hijab and whatnot, yes, this is horrible behaviour but y'know, people have been labelled good Muslim and done far worse.

And now you're going off on a tangent...I don't know if this is even directed at me. I never said she was a horrible person, but that her actions are despicable and heartbreaking.

Actually, it was directed at the threadstarter. And you should start seeing my posts and meanings as a whole and not just pick up from somewhere, I was mainly taking an example, 'how a bad of a persona someone is who behaves that horrible' etc.

 

[Jamila G]

I didn't say it was right. She is the child to the parent, although she of course is a mature woman aswell. I will always be my parents child, although I grow over 50.
I did say she's acting the wrong way and as many have said, Islam tells us to have a strong bond to the family.

But now condemning her and talking bad of her, does it help release the situation? If you want something, you gotta give it in return. You see yourself as the more objective, Islamic and understanding side. Well, you have no other choice than to continue like that and invite her to that side. Although she's attacking, small things do touch the core. I honestly do not see how you can change her, as she is mature now and has her own life, she will have to grow from it by herself. I know it sounds brutal, but if she still is so stubborn, one cannot do much else than continue slowly but steadily to talk to her.


But you know what I just got thinking - Jelaousy. Her father's love to be shared with another woman, although althrough her life she is used to him giving only the selected women his love, the sisters, mother, daugthers and wife. Now a new woman comes in. It's a big change suddenly.

How old is the second wife? She might just also be jealous of her. She is the youngest, it is a different issue and role to be the youngest daugther.

I'm sorry but Ameena is right on this. I am not condeming my sister or speaking badly, I am trying to understand if this is acceptable for a practicing "good muslim" to behave this way. Many people have told me this is not. It is because I don't want to be angry with her that I have posted on here - to try and understand this behaviour and to try to understand if this behaviour is acceptable as a muslim. I don't believe it is. Of course I can't change her or the situation, I have tried to speak to her but she won't listen. I'm afraid her mother will die and she will have life long sorrow about this. Its incomprehensible to me that she can avoid all of the family for the acts of her father. She blames us all for accepting it. What other option is there? I love my father and mother equally. I'm not prepared to disown them for any mistakes they make. That is not my place.

 

[Al-Zaara]

I'm sorry but Ameena is right on this. I am not condeming my sister or speaking badly, I am trying to understand if this is acceptable for a practicing "good muslim" to behave this way.

I'm sorry aswell, but it did sound like you were condemning her. And speaking badly. As it seems you needed a ranting place to get it all out.

I don't really see what you will get out of this, as you seemed to know from beginning on it is wrong. What more do you wonder? People have shown how wrong it is. I gave you a few reasons to understand her behaviour, no idea if you bothered to think about them, but best you ask her for an comprehensive answer. If you really want to know.

 

[Jamila G]

How can you continue from somewhere which you know nothing about? Again, her claims are personal/subjective, the girl might pray and wear hijab and whatnot, yes, this is horrible behaviour but y'know, people have been labelled good Muslim and done far worse.

Actually, it was directed at the threadstarter. And you should start seeing my posts and meanings as a whole and not just pick up from somewhere, I was mainly taking an example, 'how a bad of a persona someone is who behaves that horrible' etc.

Al-Zaara, you are very fiery. I want an answer to this based on what islam dictates. Not on your feelings and imaginings about my sisters relationship with her father. You are thinking too deeply about this. She is not jealous of the wife - she has never met her! She will never meet her. None of us will ever meet her. It is irrelevant. She believes my father acted against the teachings of Islam, yet is she not also acting against the teachings of Islam. Is there not some element of hypocricy here? I am not in competition to be the better Muslim. I am not a practicing Muslim. This is why I wanted to speak to others. Anyway, thank you for your thoughts.