ALL religions claim that theirs is the correct one...and many originators have probably correctly claimed spiritual interaction....but, physically seeing or hearing God, angels, devils etc. is wherein concoctions arose....that is against God's own laws of nature.
Taking scripture literally
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ALL religions claim that theirs is the correct one...and many originators have probably correctly claimed spiritual interaction....but, physically seeing or hearing God, angels, devils etc. is wherein concoctions arose....that is against God's own laws of nature.
saif-uddin
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perhaps I did not make my self Plain,
The Quran states Explicitely that Allah ta'ala revealed the Religion of Islam, and that all of the Anbiya (alayhi wa salam) from Adam down to Muhammad :saws: are Muslims,
the Bible of the Christians or Jews have no such claims,
Nowhere in their Books does God All-Mighty claim that he Revealed these two Religions (Judaism & Christianity)
rather interesting to note,
regards
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Any Holy Book claiming that God All-Mighty revealed a religion does not necessitate the absolute truth...it is the spiritual recipient's perception of God All-Mighty's truth....yet, ALL men are fallible. And again, any spiritual interaction has to be translated by a preconditioned mind, so its translation is determined differently in different time periods.
Hulk
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kkawohl1, just because you do not know why Islam is the truth does not mean that it is it is not the truth. As I mentioned before, you don't even know what the basis of our beliefs are.
You have been making plenty of claims in this thread, and yet nothing to back up your claims.
We are muslims and the Quran is thus our Holy Book and we believe in it. You are trying to persuade us to accept your claims instead but yet you cannot offer any good reasons as to why we should. Please point out to me where someone in the thread says that "We should believe that a book is from God based solely on the fact that it claims to be from God.", otherwise you're merely arguing against something nobody said.
You have been making plenty of claims in this thread, and yet nothing to back up your claims.
We are muslims and the Quran is thus our Holy Book and we believe in it. You are trying to persuade us to accept your claims instead but yet you cannot offer any good reasons as to why we should. Please point out to me where someone in the thread says that "We should believe that a book is from God based solely on the fact that it claims to be from God.", otherwise you're merely arguing against something nobody said.
Eshai
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In order to know what is incorrect in this regard, you must know what is correct.
For how can you know what is wrong if you don't know what is right?
And for you to assume that you know what is correct and right equally assumes that you understand and know the nature of God.
That is quite the proclamation.
What is more likely true: that you understand the nature of God and have equal bearing as did the prophets, or that you, like the rest of us, can really only speculate as to the nature of God? Let's face it: only God understands God. Therefore, how can you say what is incorrect regarding how God delivers his messages, when you yourself do not understand God's nature?
Hello Eshai,
We, as mere mortals, attempting to understand Allah/God is like a 3 year old child attempting to comprehend his father's intellect. God has given us free will to do as we please and we will be rewarded if we live righteously.
Religions definitely have their useful purposes as long as they promote peace, love and compassion. Any religion that says one can kill another person is definitely wrong and 100% against the will of their peace loving Allah/God...even if it defies what is written in the Holy Books...they were written by fallible men and should not be interpreted literally.
[link removed]
The picture shows the entire history and the evolution of the universe and peoples varying perceptions of Allah/God; the beginning of physical rational life in the universe, the bonding of the first two souls that was the beginning of a spiritual unity; the development of mankind and man’s first perception of God from the story of Adam & Eve; Abraham & Moses, their quest into spirituality, their interaction with God and the beginning of Judaism; God’s interaction with Jesus & his life and death; the beginning of Christianity & the senseless killings in the Crusades; God’s interaction with Muhammad, the beginning of the Islam faith & the Arab struggles. The Transcendologist’s spirit also witnessed the Twin Towers tragedy of 9-11-01.
We, as mere mortals, attempting to understand Allah/God is like a 3 year old child attempting to comprehend his father's intellect. God has given us free will to do as we please and we will be rewarded if we live righteously.
Religions definitely have their useful purposes as long as they promote peace, love and compassion. Any religion that says one can kill another person is definitely wrong and 100% against the will of their peace loving Allah/God...even if it defies what is written in the Holy Books...they were written by fallible men and should not be interpreted literally.
[link removed]
The picture shows the entire history and the evolution of the universe and peoples varying perceptions of Allah/God; the beginning of physical rational life in the universe, the bonding of the first two souls that was the beginning of a spiritual unity; the development of mankind and man’s first perception of God from the story of Adam & Eve; Abraham & Moses, their quest into spirituality, their interaction with God and the beginning of Judaism; God’s interaction with Jesus & his life and death; the beginning of Christianity & the senseless killings in the Crusades; God’s interaction with Muhammad, the beginning of the Islam faith & the Arab struggles. The Transcendologist’s spirit also witnessed the Twin Towers tragedy of 9-11-01.
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Eshai
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Well, personally I do not know what is true when it comes to what God wants. I can't say anything about God with 100% certainty. But I believe that if God wants to do something, God will do it, whether or not we think it is good or bad, right or wrong.
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Seems that your position is not exactly one that is based on logic.
You say that you believe we will be rewarded if we live righteously. This then begs the question as to what is right? How do you know that what you think is right is in accordance to what God commands? You want to talk about peace, love, compassion. Can there be true peace when there is injustice? Oppression? Your idea of belief is one that is not rooted with the nature of this world.
You want us to dismiss our Holy Book as something that is only to be taken "lightly", and yet you cannot offer any proper reason to do so. Trying to back up your claim with another claim is a fallacy.
You say that you believe we will be rewarded if we live righteously. This then begs the question as to what is right? How do you know that what you think is right is in accordance to what God commands? You want to talk about peace, love, compassion. Can there be true peace when there is injustice? Oppression? Your idea of belief is one that is not rooted with the nature of this world.
You want us to dismiss our Holy Book as something that is only to be taken "lightly", and yet you cannot offer any proper reason to do so. Trying to back up your claim with another claim is a fallacy.
Hello Hulk,
We are all energy bubbles living within a larger energy bubble within this universe. Allah/God is the supreme energy. When one lives righteously, upon our physical demise the energy within our spirit is transmitted, cleansed (born-again) and then received to be a part of God where our spirit can operate individually or in unison and access all of the wonders and knowledge of the universe.
A deserving (clean) spirit consists of ethics, morality, good deeds, kindness, consideration for and helping others; being "righteous" insures the survival of the soul. The conscience is guided by its capacity to disseminate between pure and improper acceptable social norms. A determination is made by the conscience to abide by either the pure or proper, or to stretch the norm.
Deeds contrary to purity eventually anesthetizes the conscience and lines of communication with the spirit and God are severed. Evil is not adaptable to, or compatible with Pure Intelligence. The cultural norm deduces acceptable proper behavior. If one lives thereby, the conscience is clear and no deity in the spiritual realm will judge or condemn anyone.
People often believe they will be condemned if they do not believe a certain way. When peoples' concept of God is flawed, corrections, truth, logic and common sense thereof must eventually prevail. Human fallibility and misconceptions have labeled God for past millennia as one who interferes with the natural forces and free will of people by threatening punishment to those who disobey his bidding.
The God of our ancestors had to be humanized in order to have the masses adapt the thought processes to that time period. God does not change with the times but our perception of who God is should change as societies eliminate their superstitious beliefs. God, the Ultimate Spirit consists of Supreme Purity, Pure Intelligence, Pure Logic, etc., is not encumbered by human attributes and has no needs, or a desire to be worshiped, prayed to, exalted, venerated, deified, or anything else that we have to offer.
Human characteristics are to exercise upon others: power, control, dominance, destruction, punishment, revenge, and judgment. Everyone is individually and personally totally responsible for his own soul's destiny. The destruction of civilizations, most sufferings and premature deaths are due to human frailties, stupidity or imperfections and are not God's doings. God, exists in a spiritual realm and never has and never will interfere with anything on earth or in the universe.
God is interested in and is involved in humanity, but does not interfere in any way in our physical lives. God guides the development of the universe and everything thereon like a Master Planner. Our relationship and interaction of our spirit with the Spirit of God is for our, not God's benefit.
God Will Not Condemn Anyone
Our intelligence compared to God is like that of a 2-year-old child. God will make allowances for our ignorance.
It doesn't matter to God whether we believe that God is/was:
1. Created by the spirit and soul and evolved to be the supreme intelligence.
2. The beginning, always was, came out of nowhere and created the heavens
and earth.
3 The one supreme ruler who dominates the universe.
4. Called God, God Almighty, Jehovah, God of Abraham, Allah or whatever.
It doesn't matter to God whether we:
1. Think that Jesus is God or a prophet.
2. Believe that the Bible or the Qur'an is the word of God or man.
3. Eat pork, dress or pray a certain way.
4. Are straight, gay, white, black, or whatever.
It is of no importance during our physical life whether God exists or not if one so chooses. Whether or not one believes in a spirit or God really makes no difference to God. Righteous living will determine the continuance and destiny of our spirit/soul.
Our life on earth is to prepare us and to give us examples of the hereafter. Everything is progressive and accumulative. We are here to accumulate experiences of feelings, the beauty of every organism that surrounds us, the landscape that adds to our perception; then we can begin our next journey. We should live our life to its fullest. One hundred years from now, almost every single person alive today will have died. Several billion people wiped off the face of this earth. Our life is but a blip on the radar screen of time.
We are all energy bubbles living within a larger energy bubble within this universe. Allah/God is the supreme energy. When one lives righteously, upon our physical demise the energy within our spirit is transmitted, cleansed (born-again) and then received to be a part of God where our spirit can operate individually or in unison and access all of the wonders and knowledge of the universe.
A deserving (clean) spirit consists of ethics, morality, good deeds, kindness, consideration for and helping others; being "righteous" insures the survival of the soul. The conscience is guided by its capacity to disseminate between pure and improper acceptable social norms. A determination is made by the conscience to abide by either the pure or proper, or to stretch the norm.
Deeds contrary to purity eventually anesthetizes the conscience and lines of communication with the spirit and God are severed. Evil is not adaptable to, or compatible with Pure Intelligence. The cultural norm deduces acceptable proper behavior. If one lives thereby, the conscience is clear and no deity in the spiritual realm will judge or condemn anyone.
People often believe they will be condemned if they do not believe a certain way. When peoples' concept of God is flawed, corrections, truth, logic and common sense thereof must eventually prevail. Human fallibility and misconceptions have labeled God for past millennia as one who interferes with the natural forces and free will of people by threatening punishment to those who disobey his bidding.
The God of our ancestors had to be humanized in order to have the masses adapt the thought processes to that time period. God does not change with the times but our perception of who God is should change as societies eliminate their superstitious beliefs. God, the Ultimate Spirit consists of Supreme Purity, Pure Intelligence, Pure Logic, etc., is not encumbered by human attributes and has no needs, or a desire to be worshiped, prayed to, exalted, venerated, deified, or anything else that we have to offer.
Human characteristics are to exercise upon others: power, control, dominance, destruction, punishment, revenge, and judgment. Everyone is individually and personally totally responsible for his own soul's destiny. The destruction of civilizations, most sufferings and premature deaths are due to human frailties, stupidity or imperfections and are not God's doings. God, exists in a spiritual realm and never has and never will interfere with anything on earth or in the universe.
God is interested in and is involved in humanity, but does not interfere in any way in our physical lives. God guides the development of the universe and everything thereon like a Master Planner. Our relationship and interaction of our spirit with the Spirit of God is for our, not God's benefit.
God Will Not Condemn Anyone
Our intelligence compared to God is like that of a 2-year-old child. God will make allowances for our ignorance.
It doesn't matter to God whether we believe that God is/was:
1. Created by the spirit and soul and evolved to be the supreme intelligence.
2. The beginning, always was, came out of nowhere and created the heavens
and earth.
3 The one supreme ruler who dominates the universe.
4. Called God, God Almighty, Jehovah, God of Abraham, Allah or whatever.
It doesn't matter to God whether we:
1. Think that Jesus is God or a prophet.
2. Believe that the Bible or the Qur'an is the word of God or man.
3. Eat pork, dress or pray a certain way.
4. Are straight, gay, white, black, or whatever.
It is of no importance during our physical life whether God exists or not if one so chooses. Whether or not one believes in a spirit or God really makes no difference to God. Righteous living will determine the continuance and destiny of our spirit/soul.
Our life on earth is to prepare us and to give us examples of the hereafter. Everything is progressive and accumulative. We are here to accumulate experiences of feelings, the beauty of every organism that surrounds us, the landscape that adds to our perception; then we can begin our next journey. We should live our life to its fullest. One hundred years from now, almost every single person alive today will have died. Several billion people wiped off the face of this earth. Our life is but a blip on the radar screen of time.
Insaanah
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Greetings kkawohl1
I'd just like to draw your attention to the forum rules, which state:
http://www.islamicboard.com/faq.php?faq=islamic_forum_rules#faq_liforum_rules
At the moment, there is a lot of promoting your own theories as the truth, and anything contrary to that, as being wrong. You are welcome to ask questions on Islam to help you understand Islam better, but I would request you from hereon to refrain from promoting your own theories. Thanking you for your understanding.
I'd just like to draw your attention to the forum rules, which state:
http://www.islamicboard.com/faq.php?faq=islamic_forum_rules#faq_liforum_rules
At the moment, there is a lot of promoting your own theories as the truth, and anything contrary to that, as being wrong. You are welcome to ask questions on Islam to help you understand Islam better, but I would request you from hereon to refrain from promoting your own theories. Thanking you for your understanding.
Greetings Insaanah,
I have always attemted to keep the subject of my postings about “Taking scripture literally” and have never promoted any religion other than Islam.
Is it against your policy for anyone to question whether the Qu’ran should be taken literally? If that is the case and you wish me to move on to other discussion boards on the Web, even though I truly enjoyed the interaction here, I will oblige and wish to thank everyone for their courtesy. Peace.
I have always attemted to keep the subject of my postings about “Taking scripture literally” and have never promoted any religion other than Islam.
Is it against your policy for anyone to question whether the Qu’ran should be taken literally? If that is the case and you wish me to move on to other discussion boards on the Web, even though I truly enjoyed the interaction here, I will oblige and wish to thank everyone for their courtesy. Peace.
Eshai
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User Insaanah was not telling you to leave. She was saying you are not welcomed to push your beliefs on those here. In your posts, kkawohl1, you are asking very few questions (if any) and simply making your own proclamations (this is proselytizing). I would urge you to re-read your posts and consider the perspective of those who read it who may not agree with you.
Consider what is "right" and what is "wrong" from the individual perspective. The fact that we, as individuals, may like something does not make it good for us. For instance, indulging in mind altering drugs, so I have been told, is a very pleasurable experience. But they are not good for the body. So however "right" something may feel, or seem, it is not necessarily good, and may be entirely wrong.
I agree with Hulk. You are not being logical or rational in the slightest.
If you have interest in speaking about the subject of taking certain things in the Qur'an literally/figuratively, then perhaps you should ask questions concerning the verses you have questions about.
Consider what is "right" and what is "wrong" from the individual perspective. The fact that we, as individuals, may like something does not make it good for us. For instance, indulging in mind altering drugs, so I have been told, is a very pleasurable experience. But they are not good for the body. So however "right" something may feel, or seem, it is not necessarily good, and may be entirely wrong.
And yet you speak as though you truly understand what God wants, and what God does and does not care about. Yet you are as a 2 year old child, who cannot understand the greater implications of God's commands. And your situation may be even more precarious, as you appear to have no interest in heeding any command God would give, and instead rely on your own 2 year-old judgement which you mistakenly think to be right because... it feels right.
I agree with Hulk. You are not being logical or rational in the slightest.
If you have interest in speaking about the subject of taking certain things in the Qur'an literally/figuratively, then perhaps you should ask questions concerning the verses you have questions about.
Insaanah
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kkawohl1,
It is entirely possible to have fruitful and beneficial discussions without repeatedly asserting one's own beliefs as being correct. Nobody here wants you to leave. I suspected you may not have seen the rules so thought it might be beneficial for attention to be drawn to them.
Peace.
It is entirely possible to have fruitful and beneficial discussions without repeatedly asserting one's own beliefs as being correct. Nobody here wants you to leave. I suspected you may not have seen the rules so thought it might be beneficial for attention to be drawn to them.
Peace.
I love Muslims and their beliefs; I despise the leaders who hi-jack this religion to further their own needs and desires. It’s time the Muslim populations take a look at the real teachings of Islam and then ask themselves, who is the real enemy of Mohammad’s’ teachings? Do I believe that certain things in the Qur'an should not be taken literally/figuratively? Can any rational being really believe that a peace-loving Allah would condone killings?
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Eshai
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While I am interested in what some of the more learned members here have to say about these verses, I have a feeling that in some of these verses were written in a specific historical context. This is certainly something that I plan on studying in detail before making any conclusive statements.
ANYONE can have his or her spirit interact with the Spirit of Allah/God if that is his or her greatest desire to the exclusion of everything else. They must first prepare their mind via intense meditation by placing it in a state of stasis.
All “Holy Books” were written about someone whose spirit interacted with the spirit of God. The mind translation of this spiritual interaction depended on the prior conditioning of that person; hence you have various religions all claiming to live by the Word of God. In reality, it’s the word of fallible men attempting to interpreting the mind of God.
Spiritual interactions are dumbfounding and immensely puzzling. After the spirit of God interacted with the spirit of Jesus during his baptism, it took Jesus 40 days to analyze and interpret its meaning.
My own spiritual journey has revealed to me that God is the ultimate pure love and wants only the best for mankind. Everyone is personally responsible for the survival of his own soul and this is assured by attempting to live righteously. Evil anesthetizes the conscience/soul and continued evil eventually kills the conscience/soul.
Is it the power of persuasion or human power how world peace will eventually be attained? Will mankind awaken before it destroys itself?
Namaste
All “Holy Books” were written about someone whose spirit interacted with the spirit of God. The mind translation of this spiritual interaction depended on the prior conditioning of that person; hence you have various religions all claiming to live by the Word of God. In reality, it’s the word of fallible men attempting to interpreting the mind of God.
Spiritual interactions are dumbfounding and immensely puzzling. After the spirit of God interacted with the spirit of Jesus during his baptism, it took Jesus 40 days to analyze and interpret its meaning.
My own spiritual journey has revealed to me that God is the ultimate pure love and wants only the best for mankind. Everyone is personally responsible for the survival of his own soul and this is assured by attempting to live righteously. Evil anesthetizes the conscience/soul and continued evil eventually kills the conscience/soul.
Is it the power of persuasion or human power how world peace will eventually be attained? Will mankind awaken before it destroys itself?
Namaste
Negative, I am not affiliated with any religion...I am a simple Transcendologist who had a spiritual journey.
Hulk
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The concept of transcendental unity of religions is not in line with the beliefs of Islam, you are free to believe whatever you want but promoting such ideas is against forum rules and I hope that you will respect that.