Taliban Shoot Helicopter Killing BinLaden 'Death Team'

[Trumble]

The so called mighty united states and state of the art weaponry and technology, 10 years in war still not able to defeat taliban who fights with faith more and less with weapon. what has the united states achieved in 10 years? they have killed thousands of civilians there...

You do know that your Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together don't you? With 'faith' and not 'weapon'? Get a clue... you may live in fairytale land but the Taliban and their victims certainly don't.

SOURCE

 

[Ramadhan]

Not to mention the considerable political grief and loss of prestige when nothing was found after all.

I see no political grief or loss of prestige for the USA. They are still the world's only superpower. And I haven't seen any political repercussion for those who lied to get to Iraq either.

The other obvious question is; as 'outright lying' would have no less effective regarding Afghanistan, or anywhere/thing else, why 9/11 with - as before, the unavoidable possibility the 'truth' would be exposed?

You are truly delusional. "outright lying" wouldn't cut it as an excuse to invade Afghanistan.
"outright lying" was sufficient to go into Iraq because of 9/11.
9/11 has served multiple uses/excuses/purposes, and if you can't see it, you must have been living in another planet in the past 10 years.

 

[Ramadhan]

You do know that your Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together don't you? With 'faith' and not 'weapon'? Get a clue... you may live in fairytale land but the Taliban and their victims certainly don't.

SOURCE

You need to read your source more carefully so as to avoid appearing lying. In the source it says:

The Taliban and other anti-government elements have been blamed for 2,080 civilians who were killed in Afghanistan last year - a sharp rise of 28% on 2009. This accounted for 75% of all deaths whereas pro-government forces totalled 440 civilian killings.

Take notice at the words I highlighted and underlined.
First, it doesn't say Taliban alone killed three times as many civilians. (it says "taliban AND other anti government elements)
Second, it chooses to use the word "blamed" because the study does not have proof that it was actually the taliban or other anti-government elements that actually did the killings.

 

[جوري]

You do know that your Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together don't you? With 'faith' and not 'weapon'? Get a clue... you may live in fairytale land but the Taliban and their victims certainly don't.

SOURCE

:haha: at the taliban and anti-govt. sources blamed and love your source for info. be that as it may it has to be better than taking the blame for engaging in a senseless war time and time again isn't it? Perhaps if American & British turds withdrew there wouldn't be so many people trying to blow themselves up.. try some root cause analysis..

 

[جوري]

The one thought that goes through my mind when I hear 9/11 conspiracy theories is this

You call it a 'conspiracy theory' when what you're seeing with your eyes isn't in concert with what you're being told?
confidant criminals get brazen, they make the law to fit their criminality. So far the U.S and cockroach state are in violation of many international and U.N laws, they don't need to cross their T's and dot their I's when they can carpet bomb!

 

[Trumble]

You need to read your source more carefully so as to avoid appearing lying.

Still in denial on that as well? It's from a UN report. Obviously it would be impossible to provide 100% accurate information, but generally I think the relatives of the dead would know who gunned them down, and the IEDs are something of a giveaway. You need to keep your advice/opinion to yourself and use the word 'lying' with rather more care.

I see no political grief or loss of prestige for the USA.

Then try actually looking. Are you really saying that nobody actually cared, minded or noticed that no WMDs were found in Iraq? Really? REALLY?

You are truly delusional. "outright lying" wouldn't cut it as an excuse to invade Afghanistan.

Depends what the lie is. And of course, without 9/11 the Americans would have had no reason (note, reason, not excuse) to go anywhere near Afghanistan, but that's another fact ignored by real 'truly delusional' and your 'false flag' fairy stories. Still, fairy stories were never big on detail were they?

 

[Ramadhan]

Still in denial on that as well? It's from a UN report. Obviously it would be impossible to provide 100% accurate information, but generally I think the relatives of the dead would know who gunned them down, and the IEDs are something of a giveaway. You need to keep your advice/opinion to yourself and use the word 'lying' with rather more care.

Ok, since you are confident of the study, then:

1. Please point us where in your source it says "Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together"
2. Please point us where in your source it says all anti-government forces = taliban
3. Please point us where in your source it says that they collected the numbers by interviewing relatives of all those civilians killed.
4. Please point us where in your source it says that only talibans can make IEDs.

In fact, here's the fact from your source: In this year alone (2008), for every occupation soldier killed, at least three Afghan civilians have died at the hands of occupation forces. http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2008/oct/16/afghanistan-nato

As for using the word "lying", I think I use it with care, don't you think? I have not accused anyone of lying in this thread (except for the US government).
I was thinking that you may have problem with reading comprehension because how was it possible that your statement is not supported at all by your own source, but naah, you cannot possibly have reading comprehensions because you're english and you seem to have decent education.

Then try actually looking. Are you really saying that nobody actually cared, minded or noticed that no WMDs were found in Iraq? Really? REALLY?

Sure people cared, but if you have not actually noticed, let me tell you this:
1. USA invaded Iraq anyway
2. Even when every excuse used to invade Iraq have been proven to be such lies, USA is still occupying Iraq anyway
3. There is no international political sanction against the US for illegally invading and occupying Iraq.

So, please tell me, what political grief and repercussions?

Depends what the lie is. And of course, without 9/11 the Americans would have had no reason (note, reason, not excuse) to go anywhere near Afghanistan, but that's another fact ignored by real 'truly delusional' and your 'false flag' fairy stories. Still, fairy stories were never big on detail were they?

You actually have ignored so many implausibilites regarding 9/11 and its follow up actions.
If 9/11 were the actual reason to invade Afghanistan, why is the USA still occupying Afghanistan?
And If you really believe that it was OBL that the marines captured and killed and thrown at sea, I have a bridge for you to sell. Since you are not big on detail, I assume you are fond of fairy stories.

 

[Trumble]

1. Please point us where in your source it says "Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together"

It doesn't say that. I said that. Spot the absence of quotation marks in my post and their appearance in yours. I am however capable of a little simple mathematics, although it appears you are not. The figure is actually rather generous as it assigns all the n/k's to Government/NATO.

2. Please point us where in your source it says all anti-government forces = taliban

Granted, it doesn't say that. Perhaps you could enlighten us as the identity of the people killing civilians who are neither Taliban nor Afghan Government/NATO?

3. Please point us where in your source it says that they collected the numbers by interviewing relatives of all those civilians killed.

I did assume they had some method of doing it other than drawing numbers from a Bingo machine, and simply asking peoplke is by far the most obvious. If you have any evidence to the contrary, please produce it.

4. Please point us where in your source it says that only talibans can make IEDs.

I'm sure those mysterious other anti-government forces can make them just as well. Don't tell me - they are all one bif 'false flag' operation in fantasy land? :hiding:

As for using the word "lying", I think I use it with care, don't you think?

No. It was about as subtle as a brick.

Sure people cared, but if you have not actually noticed, let me tell you this:
1. USA invaded Iraq anyway
2. Even when every excuse used to invade Iraq have been proven to be such lies, USA is still occupying Iraq anyway
3. There is no international political sanction against the US for illegally invading and occupying Iraq.

So, please tell me, what political grief and repercussions?

And, inevitably we end up with desperation.

1. Who was going to stop them? Incidently, as I recall most Iraqis were far from upset at the time.

2. US troops are there at the inivitation of the democratically elected Iraqi government. They don't like them there, of course, but their presence has prevented a significantly worse alternative. US troops are committed to leave by the end of the year.

3. Amazingly enough, nobody felt like sticking their head over the parapet to criticize getting rid of a mass murdering psychopath responsible for the deaths of millions of muslims. Not to mention probable economic suicide.

All that aside, the failure to actually find any WMDs knocked huge holes in America's reputation. And thousands of body bags always cause significant political grief - amazingly enough.

You actually have ignored so many implausibilites regarding 9/11 and its follow up actions.

I can only LOL, I'm afraid.

If 9/11 were the actual reason to invade Afghanistan, why is the USA still occupying Afghanistan?

They are not 'occupying' it. There is, however a necessity not to leave Afghanistan and the Afghan people in a worse mess than they are in already. There is no other reason to be there. If you believe there is some reason the Americans should be so desperate for that particular piece of low-value real estate - what is it?

And If you really believe that it was OBL that the marines captured and killed and thrown at sea, I have a bridge for you to sell.

Actually, I do. I'll skip the bridge, though, if you don't mind. Maybe you can find a place for it in fairyland?

 

[GuestFellow]

Salaam,

You call it a 'conspiracy theory' when what you're seeing with your eyes isn't in concert with what you're being told?
confidant criminals get brazen, they make the law to fit their criminality. So far the U.S and cockroach state are in violation of many international and U.N laws, they don't need to cross their T's and dot their I's when they can carpet bomb!

American citizens that still trust their government should read this:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

:haha: Perhaps if American & British turds withdrew there wouldn't be so many people trying to blow themselves up.. try some root cause analysis..

I agree.

 

[Who Am I?]

Salaam,

American citizens that still trust their government should read this:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

I don't trust the government, but I read it anyway. Three words come to mind after reading that.

"Remember the Maine!"

 

[Ramadhan]

It doesn't say that. I said that. Spot the absence of quotation marks in my post and their appearance in yours. I am however capable of a little simple mathematics, although it appears you are not. The figure is actually rather generous as it assigns all the n/k's to Government/NATO.

I know you said that, but you gave the source to back up your statement.
And I cannot see anywhere in that source of yours that support your statement ""Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together"

So again, can you please show us where in your source that claim Talibans have killed three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together?
If you can't, then we can just dismiss it as a statement you made up on your own.

Granted, it doesn't say that. Perhaps you could enlighten us as the identity of the people killing civilians who are neither Taliban nor Afghan Government/NATO?

No, I don't know who they are and I never claimed to know, but you did, that's why I asked you, because in the UN study, it makes a distinction between taliban and anti-government forces.

You know, I don't believe in fairy stories, that's why details like this are very important to me.
I am also for the truth, and people who are for the truth just don't brush aside facts and evidence.

I did assume they had some method of doing it other than drawing numbers from a Bingo machine, and simply asking peoplke is by far the most obvious. If you have any evidence to the contrary, please produce it.

So "you did assume". You certainly makes a lot of assumptions in this little thread alone ;D
Ah, again, I never made the claim to know how they gathered the data, but they certainly does not state that they asked every relatives of those killed.

I am surprised that details like this escaped you.
Are you not for the truth?

I'm sure those mysterious other anti-government forces can make them just as well. Don't tell me - they are all one bif 'false flag' operation in fantasy land?

Did I ever say that?
Really Trumble, your analytical skills have gone downhill so much.
You presented the case where since the killings were done by IEDs then it must have been the talibans, and hence I asked you the questions.

Again, details... details...

No. It was about as subtle as a brick.

Are you accusing me of calling you lying? You owe an apology to me.

1. Who was going to stop them? Incidently, as I recall most Iraqis were far from upset at the time.
2. US troops are there at the inivitation of the democratically elected Iraqi government. They don't like them there, of course, but their presence has prevented a significantly worse alternative. US troops are committed to leave by the end of the year.
3. Amazingly enough, nobody felt like sticking their head over the parapet to criticize getting rid of a mass murdering psychopath responsible for the deaths of millions of muslims. Not to mention probable economic suicide.

First of all, those three points do not in any way negate my statement that "outright lying was sufficient as an excuse to invade Iraq since 9/11 has already served as foundation for that"

Second,
1. Incidently, there is no evidence that "most Iraqis are not upset that their country is invaded". Unless you have evidence that all of us do not know.
2. Are you serious? Who set up this "democratically elected Iraqi government"?
Also, they don't like them there but they cannot leave because the situation will get worse otherwise? LOL. Are you a 5 yo child or are you that naive? The US certainly left Somalia, didn't they?
I have heard that US troops are committed to leave by end of the year since 2003. And If you believe that, I have a bridge to sell to you in northern Alaska, wanna buy for a very discounted price?
3. "Nobody felt like sticking their head over the parapet to criticize getting rid of a mass murdering psychopath" ?
Not sure if you only started following world news and politics since 2003, but it was the US govt who supported Saddam Hussein in the late 70s and throughout all 80s to exact revenge on Iran and thus destabilizing the region. It was through US govt political support that made Saddam got away with murders of the kurds population and killed many more shiites. Guess again who supplied chemical weapons to Iraq?
Also, did the US ever stick their head over the parapet to criticize or getting rid of a mass murdering psychopath such as Stalin, Khmer Rouge, all those dictators in latin america (the opposite happened, in fact), all those dictators in africa and asia (again, the opposites happened, in fact).

All that aside, the failure to actually find any WMDs knocked huge holes in America's reputation. And thousands of body bags always cause significant political grief - amazingly enough.

You keep making this statement, which is hollow without evidence.
As far as the world can see, the US government is still operating as usual, still has hundreds of thousands of troops in Iraq and Afghanistan without any sanction whatsoever, and still killing thousands of civilians in those illegally occupied countries.
What is this political grief you keep saying?

They are not 'occupying' it. There is, however a necessity not to leave Afghanistan and the Afghan people in a worse mess than they are in already. There is no other reason to be there. If you believe there is some reason the Americans should be so desperate for that particular piece of low-value real estate - what is it?

Right.
The Dutch also never claimed that they "occupied" Indonesia for 3.5 centuries, and in fact asked the brits for help to send troops to Indonesia in 1945 to help "reclaimed" Indonesia after Japan was defeated because the Dutch saw a necessity not to leave Indonesia and the Indonesian people in a worse mess than they were in already.
FYI, The Dutch has never officially acknowledged Indonesia's 1945 proclamation of Independence, but who cares, we kicked them out of our country anyway ;D
And I hope the Afghans will soon also kick the hell out the occupying forces from their country.

By the way, unlike you, I don't assume things, I look at and evaluate evidence and facts.

Actually, I do.

So where is the proof that OBL was captured and killed?
You are an atheist who ask for God's material evidence, and I am so thoroughly disappointed with you when you eat up everything a group of people told you without any evidence to back up.

 

[Ramadhan]

American citizens that still trust their government should read this:

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=92662&page=1

Trumble is not an american citizen, but judging by what he has said in this thread (trusting what The US govt says), he has faith in them.

 

[Trumble]

I know you said that, but you gave the source to back up your statement.
And I cannot see anywhere in that source of yours that support your statement "Taliban heroes have killed something like three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together"

So again, can you please show us where in your source that claim Talibans have killed three times as many civilians as US, allied and Afghan Government forces put together?
If you can't, then we can just dismiss it as a statement you made up on your own.

So, again. DO THE MATH. The numbers are all in the pie charts. If by 'we' you mean posters in general, I really wouldn't speak on their behalf as I'm sure they can understand simple diagrams and numbers even if you cannot.

I am also for the truth, and people who are for the truth just don't brush aside facts and evidence.

So you don't have a clue who they might be, then? Space aliens maybe? The last hiding place of ex-WW2 Nazis? Put up or shut up.

Ah, again, I never made the claim to know how they gathered the data, but they certainly does not state that they asked every relatives of those killed. I am surprised that details like this escaped you. Are you not for the truth?

I am, and nothing 'escaped me' that I am aware of. AGAIN, if you have evidence the methodology and hence the results was/were unsound it really is up to you to produce it. Instead, as always, just waffle.

Did I ever say that?
Really Trumble, your analytical skills have gone downhill so much.
You presented the case where since the killings were done by IEDs then it must have been the talibans, and hence I asked you the questions.
Again, details... details...

Again, no answer and just waffle. I repeat, who else do you claim was building them? Who else has ANYBODY claimed was building them?

Are you accusing me of calling you lying? You owe an apology to me.

LOL... how do you actually function in the real-world when you get called on being a smarta$$? Stop wasting my time.

 

[Abz2000]

trumble - stop drinking fluoride - it damages your brain - and so does mercury - (which the government told you was safe - until it came out)
just avoid it - it messes with your head.

look at the facts regarding 9/11 and look at the answers the government gave - or didn't give.

also you made a comment about the us government only being in afghanistan due to 9/11,
and that there is no other real estate there.

firstly,
the us government was amassing troops in the region for months, and there was a plan on bush's desk regarding the invasion of Afghanistan on september 10 2001 - the day before 9/11
the us government invaded afghanistan with no independent investigation into the events on 9/11 and without determining who was responsible.
that is an illegal, and a criminal act.

here's what the quran tells us:

O ye who believe!
If a wicked person comes to you with any news,
ascertain the truth,
lest ye harm people unwittingly,
and afterwards become full of repentance for what ye have done.
Quran 49:6

when ahmadinejad requested an independent investigation into the events in his un speech - they walked out.
they then blamed iran for being involved in 9/11 and harbouring obl!

also obl was never wanted for the 9/11 attacks since they had no evidence, you would have seen that on the fbi website.

secondly you said that they were only there now because they couldn't leave it in the current state -
if a murdering raping thief goes into your house with his thugs and attacks your family illegally, would you like that people say he must stay in there to maintain peace so that there are no revenge attacks or "instability"???

thirdly - there are a lot of resources in afghanistan - the most famous being opium which is now openly grown, and protected by us and british soldiers

http://abz2000.com/criminalwarsofagression.aspx

also research british east india company and - opium wars

look at the facts without resorting to labelling and ridicule - as you can see we are all capable of it.

peace