Re: Development of Theism?
czgibson said:
Thanks for the info, Khattab.
It's refreshed my memory on the details of the story. So, I now see that when you said the majority of Muslims believe this was a physical journey, you mean that they genuinely believe that Muhammad (pbuh) travelled to the heavens.
I do not believe this actually happened, for a number of reasons. The first is that the evidence for it actually occurring is very slight. It is mentioned (briefly) in the Qur'an, and also in the hadiths. In order to believe such an extraordinary story (in fact, for any "miraculous" story) I would need much more evidence than that.
Also, the story relies on belief in certain other concepts which I see no reason to believe in. Muhammad (pbuh) is said to have consulted with the spirits of previous prophets as well as angels. Now, since I see no reason to believe in an afterlife, or heaven and hell, I'm obviously not convinced by anecdotal evidence of this nature. Is there any independent evidence for the existence of angels, for example? Has even a single angel ever actually been observed by anybody?
In some traditions, scepticism of the kind I've just exhibited is seen as a failing, an indulgence, an error. However, in the fields of science and philosophy, such scepticism is a great advantage. We should not believe anything, unless we have good reasons for doing so. Similarly, if the reasons for believing or disbelieving something are weak on both sides, then the scientist's answer should be "I don't know."
So, was Muhammad (pbuh) crazy or a liar? My answer, at this stage, is "I don't know."
Peace
Peace,
Yes we believe he did physically travel through the heavens, all prophets in there time have been given miracles Jesus (PBUH) was able to give the dead life, cure those blind etc only through the permission of God alone, Moses (PBUH) was able to split the sea and his rod turned into a snake (I guess you know this story) , all by the permission of God.
The chances of someone travelling from Mekkah to Jerusalem in one night and returning was impossible in those days, the people of the time laughed when they heard what was said. and even some neo-muslims became apostates after hearing the news.
Because it is briefly mentioned in the Qur'an does that mean it is not true? 25 of the Sahabah (Companions) reported narratives regarding it in the hadeeths, including Umar Ibn Al Khattab (Second Khalifa) and Ali al-Murtada (Fourth Khalifa), may Allah be pleased with them.
Even the testimony of a non-muslim of the time Abu Sufyan, which can be found in Sahih Bukhari and Muslim, where the Prophet Muhammed (SWH) had a letter sent to the Roman Emperor of the time, once he recieved it he asked for all the arab traders who where there to be gathered, he then asked them regarding Muhammed (SWH). Abu Sufyan who was going to use this moment to speak ill of the Prophet (SWH) thought otherwise, as if it was found out he was lying about him he feared being looked down upon by the Emperor and his traders, and having the label of a liar. Instead he said as narrated " I shall describe before you what he claims to have happened to regarding which you yourself will realise that it was a lie. Heraclius asked "What event is that?" Abu Sufyan said: This claimant of prophethood say that, one night, he left Makkah, reached Masjid Al-Aqsa and retuned to us in Mekkah.
At that time the leading scholar of Elia (Jerusalem) was there and standing close to the emperor. He disclosed that he knew that night. The emperor turned to him and inquired as to how he came to know of it. He said that as a matter of habit he would not sleep until he had locked all the gates of Bayt Al Maqdus (Jerusalem). That night he habitually closed all gates except from one which would not shut, despite his efforts, he then called his staff they too could not close it. Rendered helpless the technicians and carpenters where called. They looked at the gate and decided that the weight of the building has come to rest on the panels of the gate. There was no way it could be closed before morning. They said when morning comes they would see how this could be fixed. As soon as it was morning he came back to the gate , where he noticed someone had made a hole in the rock close to the gate, of Al Aqsa which gave the impression some animal was tied down there. At that time he told his colleagues maybe Allah has caused this gate not to close because some prophet was to come here. And then he also stated that this blessed prophet has offered his prayers in Al Aqsa". After this further details are described.
A former Christian Scholar and priest, Rev. Abdul-Ahad Dawud who wrote the book "Muhammed In the Bible", in it he has described a prophecy in the Bible that talks about it. As I no longer have this book now I will try and get it back and hopefully post it up for you.
Below is Sahih Bukhari 3322 that is of some relevance to the previously narrated story I have just found:
Abu Sufyan, may Allah be pleased with him, said:
I went out (on a mercantile venture) during the period (of truce) between me and the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him). While I was in Syria, the letter of the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) was handed over to Heraclius (Caesar), the Emperor of Rome (who was on a visit to Jerusalem at that time). The letter was brought by Dihyah Al-Kalbi who delivered it to the governor of Busra. The governor of Busra passed it on to Heraclius, (On receiving the letter), he (Heraclius) said: Is there anyone from the people of this man who claims that he is a prophet? People said: Yes. So, I was called along with a few others from the Quraish. We were admitted to Heraclius and he seated us before him. He asked: Which of you has closer kinship with the man who claims that he is a prophet? Abu Sufyan said: I said: I. So they seated me in front of him and seated my companions behind me. Then he called his interpreter and said to him: Tell them that I am going to ask this fellow (i.e. Abu Sufyan) about the man who claims that he is a prophet. If he tells me a lie, then refute him. Abu Sufyan told (the narrator): By Allah, if there was not the fear that falsehood would be imputed to me I would have lied. (Then) Heraclius said to his interpreter: Inquire from him about his ancestry. I said: He is of good ancestry among us. He asked: Has there been a king among his ancestors? I said: No. He asked: Did you accuse him of falsehood before he proclaimed his prophethood? I said: No. He asked: Who are his followers, people of high status or low status? I said: (They are) of low status. He asked: Are they increasing in number or decreasing? I said: No, they are rather increasing. He asked: Does anyone give up his religion, being dissatisfied with it, after having embraced it? I said: No. He asked: Have you been at war with him? I said: Yes. He asked: How did you fare in that war? I said: The war between us and him has been wavering like a bucket, up at one turn and down at the other (i.e. the victory has been shared between us and him by turns). Sometimes he suffered loss at our hands and sometimes we suffered loss at his (hand). He asked: Has he (ever) violated his covenant? I said: No, but we have recently concluded a peace treaty with him for a period and we do not know what he is going to do about it. (Abu Sufyan said on oath that he could not interpolate in this dialogue anything from himself more than these words). He asked: Did anyone make the proclamation (of prophethood) before him? I said: No. He (now) said to his interpreter: Tell him, I asked him about his ancestry and he had replied that he had the best ancestry. This is the case with Prophets; they are the descendants of the noblest among their people (Addressing Abu Sufyan), he continued: I asked you if there had been a king among his ancestors. You said that there had been none. If there had been a king among his ancestors, I would have said that he was a man demanding his ancestral kingdom. I asked you about his followers whether they were people of high or low status, and you said that they were of rather low status. Such are the followers of the Prophets. I asked you whether you used to accuse him of falsehood before he proclaimed his prophethood, and you said that you did not. So I have understood that when he did not allow himself to tell a lie about the people, he would never go to the length of forging a falsehood about Allah. I asked you whether anyone renounced his religion being dissatisfied with it after he had embraced it, and you replied in the negative. Faith is like this when it enters the depth of the heart (it perpetuates them). I asked you whether his followers were increasing or decreasing. You said they were increasing. Faith is like this until it reaches its consummation. I asked you whether you had been at war with him, and you replied that you had been and that the victory between you and him had been shared by turns, sometimes he suffered loss at your hand and sometimes you suffering loss at his. This is how the Prophets are tried before the final victory is theirs. I asked you whether he (ever) violated his covenant, and you said that he did not. This is how the Prophets behave. They never violate (their covenants). I asked you whether anyone before him had proclaimed the same thing, and you replied in the negative. I said: If anyone had made the same proclamation before, I would have thought that he was a man following what had been proclaimed before. (Then) he asked: What does he enjoin upon you? I said: He exhorts us to offer Salah, to pay Zakah, to show due regard to kinship and to practice chastity. He said: If what you have told about him is true, he is certainly a Prophet. I knew that he was to appear but I did not think that he would be from among you. If I knew that I would be able to reach him, I would love to meet him; and if I had been with him, I would have washed his feet (out of reverence). His dominion would certainly extend to this place which is under my feet. Then he called for the letter of the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) and read it. The letter ran as follows: In the name of Allah, Most Gracious and Most Merciful. From Muhammad, the Messenger of Allah, to Heraclius, the Emperor of the Romans. Peace be upon him who follows the guidance. After this, I extend to you the invitation to accept Islam. Embrace Islam and you will be safe. Accept Islam, and Allah will give you double the reward. And if you turn away, upon you will be the sin of your subjects. Say (O Muhammad SAW): "O people of the Scripture (Jews and Christians): Come to a word that is just between us and you, that we worship none but Allâh, and that we associate no partners with Him, and that none of us shall take others as lords besides Allâh Then, if they turn away, say: "Bear witness that we are Muslims" When he had finished reading the letter, noise and confused clamor was raised around him, and he ordered us to leave. Accordingly, we left. (Addressing my companions) while we were coming out (of the palace), I said: Ibn Abu Kabshah (referring sarcastically to the Holy Prophet) has come to wield a great power. Lo! (even) the king of Banu Al-Asfar (the Romans) is afraid of him. I continued to believe that the authority of the Messenger of Allah (may peace be upon him) would triumph until Allah imbued me with (the spirit of) Islam.
There is also he story of the 3 eye witness's who saw Muhammed (SWH), hopefully Ansar or one of the others could post this up as I cant find it.
Has anyone ever seen oxygen? Yet we believe it. The angel Gabrial appeared to the prophets as well as to the companions, but he came in human form, in a very famous hadeeth. This all part of the unseen, such as the world of the jinns.
"Such as fear not the meeting with Us (for Judgment) say: "Why are not the angels sent down to us, or (why) do we not see our Lord?" Indeed they have an arrogant conceit of themselves, and mighty is the insolence of their impiety!" (25:21)
Sorry for such a long post :-[
Peace :thumbs_up
