The Feminists

However, in modern times these labor divisions aren't as logical or as necessary. Yes, men will still do most of the fighting and hard physical labor, but women are on a mostly equal footing as far as bringing home an income. That means women don't "need" men as they once did, and this creates its own set of cultural problems...or progressions, depending on your point of view.
And yet, modern psychology reports still suggest a natural tendency in males towards dominant roles, and a natural tendency in females to value men who occupy such roles. What do you think about this quote:

"Males are [...] more willing to endure pain, frustration, and the like, to learn what they must and do what they must for [...] dominance, while females... are more willing to endure such pain, frustration, and the like for familial reasons, for children, for love [...] but not so much for dominance."

Regards
 
^ hehe Ansar that dominance thing does not apply right when it comes to feminists.and yes I have met a lot of western people who hates feminists,okay?

I heard they(feminists) were really pleased when Bush attacked Iraq.said it will help a lot to fight the "Islamic oppression" for women,in the region.

are all feminists are against Islam only,or just staunch supporters of secularism?
 
^ hehe Ansar that dominance thing does not apply right when it comes to feminists.and yes I have met a lot of western people who hates feminists,okay?

I heard they(feminists) were really pleased when Bush attacked Iraq.said it will help a lot to fight the "Islamic oppression" for women,in the region.

are all feminists are against Islam only,or just staunch supporters of secularism?
I think we should make a difference between religion and the way in which the men are using the religious knowledge.
 
http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,1925547,00.html

and there is another feminist heroine launching a crusade against the Muslim veil in Italy.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/religion/Story/0,,1933269,00.html

I pity the Non-Muslims here who say removing the veil is right(against the will of women).
and yes I don't like what this Italian said about Muslim males.

is this veil banning thing going to be contained within Europe?I am asking this since Morocco thought about banning the veil.I don't want Islamic countries baning the veil.
 
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And yet, modern psychology reports still suggest a natural tendency in males towards dominant roles, and a natural tendency in females to value men who occupy such roles. What do you think about this quote:

"Males are [...] more willing to endure pain, frustration, and the like, to learn what they must and do what they must for [...] dominance, while females... are more willing to endure such pain, frustration, and the like for familial reasons, for children, for love [...] but not so much for dominance."

So you believe a male is better suited to become a leader of a certain country because he is willing to take pain for the sake of dominance, while a female is to do the same for love?

That makes no sense, that is a generalization in its self, although you accuse people of making generalizations. All males are not alpha males who wish to dominate, and all females are not nurturing parents who love children. A female is just a suitable to lead a country as a male is, and they can be just as strong willed and decisive in making designs.
 
So you believe a male is better suited to become a leader of a certain country because he is willing to take pain for the sake of dominance, while a female is to do the same for love?

That makes no sense, that is a generalization in its self, although you accuse people of making generalizations. All males are not alpha males who wish to dominate, and all females are not nurturing parents who love children. A female is just a suitable to lead a country as a male is, and they can be just as strong willed and decisive in making designs.

Remember Margaret Thatcher?
 
All males are not alpha males who wish to dominate, and all females are not nurturing parents who love children. A female is just a suitable to lead a country as a male is, and they can be just as strong willed and decisive in making designs.

Quite right... a 'tendency' is only that, and no excuse for sexist stereotyping. In this case even the tendency is partlially, if not wholly, the result of cultural conditioning that is the result of such stereotyping.
 
:sl: There are different types of feminist lets not forget that. Again I dont really agree with them, over the top and silly.
However having said that In the west when women had no right they made a difference..but now many dont even want equal rights some believe their better. :w:
 
Let us look at the definitions of two words:

feminism
–noun 1.the doctrine advocating social, political, and all other rights of women equal to those of men.

Islam
–noun 1.the religious faith of Muslims, based on the words and religious system founded by the prophet Muhammad and taught by the Koran, the basic principle of which is absolute submission to a unique and personal god, Allah.

http://dictionary.reference.com/


Both of these groups advocate what the definition says. To generalize all of them because of the actions of few is something I would least expect from people on this board.
 
look all of you.My country has been ruled by women for the last 15 years okay.we made great economic progress.but our country is bad as ever.

I don't have a problem with women being country leaders.Its secularism and feminist extremism I have a problem with.
 
So you believe a male is better suited to become a leader of a certain country because he is willing to take pain for the sake of dominance, while a female is to do the same for love?
You seem to have a fetish for habitually neglecting the context of my posts *. The quote followed a question specifically directed at Keltoi which asked, "What do you think about this quote". If you want to see what I believe by all means take a look at the arguments I have provided in my article Muslim Women: Concept of Equality. Scientific research has clearly established a distinction between men and women physiologically and psychologically. From the article:
Ansar Al-'Adl said:
Concerning the pyschological differences between men and women, an article entitled Men and Women Really Do Think Differently quotes a recent neurological study:
Psychology professor Richard Haier of the University of California, Irvine led the research along with colleagues from the University of New Mexico. Their findings show that in general, men have nearly 6.5 times the amount of gray matter related to general intelligence compared with women, whereas women have nearly 10 times the amount of white matter related to intelligence compared to men. [...]In human brains, gray matter represents information processing centers, whereas white matter works to network these processing centers.
The results from this study may help explain why men and women excel at different types of tasks, said co-author and neuropsychologist Rex Jung of the University of New Mexico. For example, men tend to do better with tasks requiring more localized processing, such as mathematics, Jung said, while women are better at integrating and assimilating information from distributed gray-matter regions of the brain, which aids language skills. (SOURCE)

Another article published in Psychology Today describes the differences between men and women as 'insecapable':
When it comes to speaking and making hand movements that contribute to motor skill, the brain seems to be very focally organized in women compared with men. This may relate to the fact that girls generally speak earlier, articulate better and also have better fine motor control of the hands. Also, a larger proportion of women than men are right-handed, and unequivocally so. But when it comes to certain, more-abstract tasks, such as defining words, women's brains are more diffusely organized than men's, although men and women don't differ in overall vocabulary ability.
[...]Neuropsychologist Marian Diamond of the University of California at Berkeley, comparing cortical thickness in male and female rats, did find that the right cortex is thicker in males at most ages, while the left cortex is thicker in females but only at some ages (see "A Love Affair with the brain," Psychology Today, November 1984). [...]The fact seems inescapable that men and women do differ genetically, physiologically and in many important ways psychologically. (SOURCE)
Modern psychological research continues to unveil differences in men and women from the most obvious in behavioural patterns to those as trivial as picking out an angry face in in a crowd. In light of such manifest differences between the two genders, it is unsuitable for men and women to assume identical roles. As mentioned in a NY times article on Women's helath:
In contrast to the feminist premise that women can do anything men can do, science is demonstrating that women can do some things better, that they have many biological and cognitive advantages over men. Then again, there are some things that women don't do as well. (SOURCE)
God created us with different but complementary strengths and capabilities. A man does not need to become a woman nor vice versa in order to be successful.

Now with regard to the quote I posted, you write:
That makes no sense,
If by this you intend that the statement is logically incoherent, you will have to substantiate such a claim. The fact that it speaks of general trends does not make it logically incoherent or the entire field of psychology could be classified as such.
that is a generalization in its self, although you accuse people of making generalizations.
Let us try to maintain at least some degree of accuracy here. I told wilberhum, "Making generalizations only prompts genarlizations in response". This was my comment on his statement, "I wonder how many stats I could gather showing that men are more violent than women. But then you already know that." As such, it was a disclaimer for the subsequent generalization I provided.
All males are not alpha males who wish to dominate, and all females are not nurturing parents who love children.
Since no one here has been making absolute claims, you're attacking a strawman. The argument is not that all females are unsuitable for such leaderships roles or that all males are suitable for such leadership roles. Rather, the argument is that the inherent psychological and physiological differences in men and women account for a much greater portion of the traditional roles assumed, as opposed to gender discrimination or cultural conditioning. I don't think anyone claims that gender discrimination accounts for ratios of 3993:19 business executives (Fortune). And as for cultural conditioning, it is only that - cultural. Thus, had such traditional roles of male leadership been only the result of culture, we would not have expected such roles to transcend all cultural boundaries.
A female is just a suitable to lead a country as a male is
Of course, there are such possibility. But they do not negate the norm which is substantiated psychologically, historically and most of all - intuitively.

Peace!
 
Of course, there are such possibility. But they do not negate the norm which is substantiated psychologically, historically and most of all - intuitively.

I'm rather confused as to how you can attempt to set out a logical argument to support your position and then end it with that last phrase. 'Intuitively' for who?

Rather, the argument is that the inherent psychological and physiological differences in men and women account for a much greater portion of the traditional roles assumed, as opposed to gender discrimination or cultural conditioning

If that is your argument, you provide no evidence to support it at all, at least applied to the 21st century. If you accept the psychology, which I'm happy enough to do, all you have shown is that (to an unestablished extent) men might be better at some tasks than women, and vice versa. Nowhere is that even equated directly to roles as such (*), let alone leading to the conclusion that psychological and physiological differences are more significant than gender discrimination or cultural conditioning. Indeed, the empirical evidence was to the contrary.. it is as that discrimination and cultural conditioning was removed, at least in part, that the (non-heriditary)female leaders began to appear. There is a direct correlation, not intuition, and history by definition belongs in the past.

(*) I can accept there are such roles, particularly where physiology is the significant factor, but there is absolutely nothing showing modern politician and statesman is one of them... the likes of Golda Meir and Margaret Thatcher and, indeed, Elizabeth I provide strong empirical evidence to the contrary
 
look all of you.My country has been ruled by women for the last 15 years okay.we made great economic progress.but our country is bad as ever.

I don't have a problem with women being country leaders.Its secularism and feminist extremism I have a problem with.

Hmm,

:rollseyes

imsad can't be that bad? lol
 
Feminism has been a rite of passage for very many young females in Australia, and it is a rite of passage in which younger persons are encouraged by older persons to hold their own in the company of men. This is a natural compliment to our usual way in which men are very dominant. In the real tradition of course there are very valuable rites of passage for women into womanhood and into the women's business of senior elders. Yet this is replicated effectively by the feminist movement. Feminists provided my self with essential work place training which I would never otherwise have received. The YWCA fast tracked me into a managerial position in between having my second and my third baby, because the support a policy of positive discrimination for women in aspects of education so as that childraising is never able to be regarded as a lesser persons role.

However, all too often what has been happening is that women in the west have become over educated. Many women whom get thoroughly educated and have careers before babies are more likely to develop a post-natal depression etc, because they have placed upon them self the expectations of fulfillment from the world of men. Many of these are nevertheless enabled to raise happy children, but it is much harder for them than for younger women.

At heart I believe that it is a positive move to regard the centre everything real, in and about feminism, as a method of ensuring that women are educated, and thereby it is supportive of Islam.

The real weakness in feminism is that of the failures which occassionally manifest of truly valuing the labour of women as mothers and wives. Although feminists campaign on the platform of valuation of women's labour, there are many among whom are ignorant of much of the women's labour occuring around them every day, and only because they ignore the real worth of ordinary housewives and canteen ladies and other women whom are happy in their lot.

It is important to distinguish between issues around those whom want to use feminism as a platform to promote lesbianism, and the real worth of work that is oriented to sustaining women in the real biologically based educational needs. This difference is at its most difficult to discern in instances such as with feminist rape counsellors. They educate well in the law and psychology of rape, but among there are those whom are often themselves only using their work to access the minds and memories of sexual history of women whom are in a vulnerable time.

Essentially there is a real need for women to sustain women's only education processes because in Jihad it is men whom are likely to fail children, and then women are those whom become primarily burdened with the tasks of rebuilding family bonds of faith. Because of this women must support each other to prevent any violence from men, and to prevent children being exposed to any wrongful attitude in fathers towards mothers.

If the feminists were not doing the job of watching out for the rights of vulnerable women, would you be? Perhaps more believers should be attending to such tasks rather than leaving them only to a minority of women whom want to be loud about being female.

waram
 
we dont need these 'femminist' we've got islam alhamdullila it gave us our freedom 1400 yrs ago. follow islam properly no problem arises!
 
I dont like feminists to be honest. Feminists, especially the radical ones, are on the opposite of my own attitudes. Feminists are against families, they call it a death camp for women, they support same sex relationships, abortion. They think that all men are drunk brainless *******s who just want to use woman and then leave her. In my opinion they have something wrong with head.
 
By the way, maybe you dont know that a woman who created modern feminist movement in USA was actually a soviet agent, communist. ANd it is not a conspiracy theory.
 
By the way, maybe you dont know that a woman who created modern feminist movement in USA was actually a soviet agent, communist. ANd it is not a conspiracy theory.
Do you mean to imply all Communists are evil and every idea created by a Communists is evil? :muddlehea
Do you think it was better when women had few rights? :thumbs_do
Do you think women are inferior? :mad:
 

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