The Modernist Threat, and What YOU can do!

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Religions change over time. I see this as a good thing. My favourite book on this subject is "A History of God" by Karen Armstrong. I will encourage any reformers who seek to morph a religion into something more friendly and tolerant towards outsiders to itself and less interested in controlling others. I'll research these groups and depending on what I find maybe I'll make a donation.
 
Pygoscelis said:
Religions change over time. I see this as a good thing. My favourite book on this subject is "A History of God" by Karen Armstrong. I will encourage any reformers who seek to morph a religion into something more friendly and tolerant towards outsiders to itself and less interested in controlling others. I'll research these groups and depending on what I find maybe I'll make a donation.
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How has Islam changed?
 
Same old, same old. This struggle between 'moderates' and 'conservatives' is as old as religion itself. Different interpretations, same religion.

It's up to Muslim to decide who they want to follow I suppose.
 
Same old, same old. This struggle between 'moderates' and 'conservatives' is as old as religion itself. Different interpretations, same religion.

It's up to Muslim to decide who they want to follow I suppose.
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Its not about Moderates and conservatives its about Modernists. Even someone who can be defined as moderate can be conservative at the same time as Islam sees itself as the middle way.
 
Gossamer skye said:
What were you expecting honestly? some noetic resolution from a character who believes that doing charity means disseminating anti-religious rhetoric?

:w:
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If that is what he believes, then you're probably right.

On a separate note sister, I have to keep a dictionary open in another tab everytime I read one of your posts. Learned a new word today, noetic. :D
 
Zafran said:
Its not about Moderates and conservatives its about Modernists. Even someone who can be defined as moderate can be conservative at the same time as Islam sees itself as the middle way.
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I still don't quite understand what people mean by 'Modernists' though. Are these people secretly atheist, but don't they dare say it? Or are they Muslims who genuinely believe Islam does not teach what people like Qatada say it teaches?
 
KAding said:
I still don't quite understand what people mean by 'Modernists' though. Are these people secretly atheist, but don't they dare say it? Or are they Muslims who genuinely believe Islam does not teach what people like Qatada say it teaches?
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They are not atheists.. to be an atheist or a theist you have to put some thought into it..

they are born of something but don't practice it..they are concerned with mundane affairs no more no less!
 
I'd say a modernist is a person willing to compromise their belief (knowingly or unknowingly) in an attempt to conform to their current culture. Their practice is not based on scripture but rather their current culture and its set of standards.
 
KAding said:
I still don't quite understand what people mean by 'Modernists' though. Are these people secretly atheist, but don't they dare say it? Or are they Muslims who genuinely believe Islam does not teach what people like Qatada say it teaches?
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Yeah I think the other posters gave good replies - But dont get mixed about Modernists with Moderates and Conservatives - as they can mean the same thing.

AntiKarateKid said:
I'd say a modernist is a person willing to compromise their belief (knowingly or unknowingly) in an attempt to conform to their current culture. Their practice is not based on scripture but rather their current culture and its set of standards.
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Pygoscelis said:
Religions change over time. I see this as a good thing.
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care to elaborate on how this is a good thing? What is a religion: a custom food recipe whose ingredients change or should change from time to time and place to place to please the taste of people? Why should it change? Or if it changes what is evidence that it has changed for better?
 
I don't want to start a long discussion on how Islam in particular has changed over time, as I'm no expert in it. I did point you guys to a book "A history of God" by Karen Armstrong (who IS an expert in it). If you are interested in seeing how the 3 abrahamic religions have changed over time I highly recommend it.

As for things changing for the better, I suppose that depends entirely on perspective. I see religions changing to be less aggressive, less violent and less intolerant towards other religions and non-adherents. Christianity over the ages is a great case in point.
 
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islamiclife said:
care to elaborate on how this is a good thing? What is a religion: a custom food recipe whose ingredients change or should change from time to time and place to place to please the taste of people? Why should it change? Or if it changes what is evidence that it has changed for better?
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Religions should change as the times change, the world changes, and people change. Such change is quite possible even within a framework of divinely revealed scripture (although it is easier without it), and occurs on a small scale each and every time such scripture is 'interpreted'.

The absence of such change means stagnation and, ultimately, irrelevance.

Pygoscelis said:
As for things changing for the better, I suppose that depends entirely on perspective. I see religions changing to be less aggressive, less violent and less intolerant towards other religions and non-adherents. Christianity over the ages is a great case in point.
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Totally agree.
 
As for things changing for the better, I suppose that depends entirely on perspective. I see religions changing to be less aggressive, less violent and less intolerant towards other religions and non-adherents. Christianity over the ages is a great case in point.
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Thats because christainty got downplayed heavily - Now we have other systems that are creating the violence.
 
Trumble said:
Religions should change as the times change, the world changes, and people change. Such change is quite possible even within a framework of divinely revealed scripture (although it is easier without it), and occurs on a small scale each and every time such scripture is 'interpreted'.

The absence of such change means stagnation and, ultimately, irrelevance.
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Then soon it'll turn out like Christianity and other religions like it. When that happens, people will still be saying what you and the rest of those like you are saying. So no, I don't think so.

Stagnation and irrelevance because it won't be according to the whims of man. Wish as you may, but its ridiculous.
 
Pygoscelis said:
As for things changing for the better, I suppose that depends entirely on perspective. I see religions changing to be less aggressive, less violent and less intolerant towards other religions and non-adherents. Christianity over the ages is a great case in point.
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Islam has been at that tolerant, non-aggressive, non-violent etc stage since its inception and notably during Europe's Dark Ages (meanwhile, Muslim lands were full of scientific and mathematical advances, were protecting and gathering books etc). Islam does not need to change. Certain Muslims do.
 
Muezzin said:
Islam has been at that tolerant, non-aggressive, non-violent etc stage since its inception and notably during Europe's Dark Ages (meanwhile, Muslim lands were full of scientific and mathematical advances, were protecting and gathering books etc). Islam does not need to change. Certain Muslims do.
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salaam

well said - I agree.

I'll also like to add also in the Ottoman empire.

peace
 
Muezzin said:
Islam has been at that tolerant, non-aggressive, non-violent etc stage since its inception and notably during Europe's Dark Ages (meanwhile, Muslim lands were full of scientific and mathematical advances, were protecting and gathering books etc). Islam does not need to change. Certain Muslims do.
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So how Islam spread during Medieval ? By Islamicboard?
 
^^you can use the search feature.. The topic is covered quite extensively from Arabia, to Persia to southeast Asia and Spain!

all the best
 

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