The sorry state of Muslim World

[g.singh]

This is completely fallacious. It was because of Muslim scientists we even have the scientific method - i.e. the corner stone of scientific study. Half of the utensils doctors use today are based on (or are actual) tools designed and created by Muslim scientists. The field of algebra was invented by Muslim mathematicians. The numbers you use to tell the time are based on Muslim designed numbers. The ranks in your military, again based on Muslim terminology. I could go on.

Sir, please read, muslims contribution in the "Modern World" and I also beg to differ on the scientific contribution as you said above.


Really? How many Muslims have you personally met in real life stating those claims? Would you say that number (if at all) is representative of 1.6(*) billion people?

Again actually a lot I wold say whom I have met. My only experience as follows:

1) Ex GF: She was a muslim but she hated every other religion and people idea that I use to feel bad for her a lot of times.
2) Working Muslims (From Pakistan): Always winge about how bad the conutry is and all thw white females are ******. I mean if you hate them so much then why come here. Live in your own country.

Good Experience: My boss , he is from Turkish background and a very liberate person. He says "Middle East and Arabs are idiots", well if you take them out of islamic histroy , there is not much to talk about.


That's because they ARE. Take a look at Afghanistan, Iraq, Palestine or just about any Muslim country and you'll see it for yourself. So what you're actually saying is Muslims should shut up about being oppressed because you don't want to here it? That's honestly the most douchiest thing I have ever read on the internet.

I am talking about West Mr Intelligent. U need to look at the sorry states of Non Muslims in muslim dominated areas and then talk about the word "Opperesion". I for once say again, I don't care whats written in Quran, I look at actions, when you don't allow another faith temple or church to be built in Islamic World and then say we respect everyone else then I c it as an ironic statement. Don't even think about saying "this is that country law and Islam has nothing to do with it". Islam is judged by what muslims do and not what they say.




This is an outright lie on both occasions. First of all: any mosque or Islamic centre is built entirely on donations because this country is secular and does not fund Islamic places of worship...Secondly, since when was the concept of wanting something in a Democracy a bad thing? Are you against freedom of speech now? I think you are, it seems to fit with everything you've said so far...hopefully I'm wrong.

Oooo, wanting sometime in Democracy is not a bad thing at all, its the consequences that comes with it. Are you telling me that you would actually like Sharia to be implemented across the world?

Again another outright lie.


This was a question

Because their own countries are not using Sharia Law. Just like how your "home" country is not using the Sikh Law system.


So then go and ask west to change to sharia?

I don't know why you are turning this into Muslim vs Jews....

No I am not, I am actually comparing it to Jews coz all Muslims leaders call for their head and say how bad they are. Jews are actually way smarter.


I'm sorry, are you actually saying he shouldn't educate uneducated people (such as yourself) on Islam's teachings? If you bothered to actually listen to any of his (and many other sheiks/imaams etc) vids you'd see he addresses all your issues and more.

Haha, Sir Have to ever watched his dvd's. I agree some of his answers on Islam are good to watch as they clear some doubts but some of his explanations on other religions are funny to watch. What happen to the saying that "You should check the message before you convey" philosiphy from Quran?

You want a discussion on all things Islamic? I'll welcome you with open arms. You want to vent your anger? Get lost.

NO I was wrong to think that you guys are liberal but some of your replies on this and other forums on Comparative religion is out of this world. Am I surprised , A big NO. This is exactly what I expected.


Muslims have more then half of the population in Africa, look at its state.
Muslims have more then 80% of the population in Middle east, look at its state.

The only respected muslims comes from West where there is diversity. So you are not telling me there is nothing wrong there. Don't say look at what USA doing or this and that. You look at Muslim rulers history, there is blood shed everywhere in name of Islam. Muslims kill each other for power. Mugul rulers were barbaric and so called Imams use to pray in Mecca before they come ot India and kill and rule.

Muslims did everything they cud have done to spread islam even though this mean killing innocent (This is history and don't even justify it with stupid excuses like others) when they were strong, why cry now as to what USA or west is doing it?

 

[جوري]

to think that you guys are liberal

You thought wrong.
which actually goes for the rest of that diatribe too
If you're into self-fulfilling prophecies & expectations why do you waste your time and worse yet ours?

best,

 

[crimsontide06]

This wont happen until Imam Mahdi appears.

who is that??

 

[Hulk]

If you want to measure success by one's worldly wealth then by all means you can have it all. Can't take it to the grave with you not matter how attached you are to them. If you want to measure freedom by how much you are able to satisfy your carnal desires then by all means. I have my portion in this world but the final destination is the hereafter.

 

[Signor]

who is that??

Assalamu Alaikum

Don't want to derail this thread,I've posted this for you.You can go further to read the whole thread but it will mess up things for you not required in the beginning.

Hope this helps.

 

[ardianto]

Muslims have more then half of the population in Africa, look at its state.
Muslims have more then 80% of the population in Middle east, look at its state.

The only respected muslims comes from West where there is diversity. So you are not telling me there is nothing wrong there. Don't say look at what USA doing or this and that. You look at Muslim rulers history, there is blood shed everywhere in name of Islam. Muslims kill each other for power. Mugul rulers were barbaric and so called Imams use to pray in Mecca before they come ot India and kill and rule.

Muslims did everything they cud have done to spread islam even though this mean killing innocent (This is history and don't even justify it with stupid excuses like others) when they were strong, why cry now as to what USA or west is doing it?

Dear mister Singh

Have you ever heard about people that called Malay?. They are not Arab or Indian, but mixed race between Mongoloid (major blood) and Austronesia (minor blood). They are living in Southeast Asia archipelago and peninsula.

They had their own golden age when Arab Muslim had it. They were Hindus, Buddhists, and animism believers. But when the Hadrami Arab from Yemen came to their islands when Arab started to lose their power in the West, mostly of them decided to embrace the new religion that introduced by those Hadramis traders. Yes, those Hadramis were trader, not conqueror who came with weapon. There's no violence, there's no killing when the Hadramis spread Islam to Malays.

Now mostly of them are living in country that named Indonesia, the rest are living in Malaysia, Brunei Darussalam, Singapore, southern Thailand, and southern Philippine.

Indonesia. This is the country where I am living. A country with six official religions. Islam, Protestant Christian, Catholic, Balinese Hindu, Buddha, and Confucianism. All of these religions have their own holiday that become public holiday. Yes, teachers in Indonesia teach the students about harmony and religious tolerance which believer in one religion should respect to other religions. Blasphemy toward other religion is against the law.

How about Sikhism?. Currently Sikhism is not official religion in Indonesia. Maybe because the number of its believer is very very small, and from what I know they did not make request to become official religion like Confucian who made this request in late of 20th century.

Sikh people in Indonesia are very very rare, and maybe only one man who known by public, Dr. Harbrinderjit Singh (HS) Dillon, special staff of President Yudhoyono.

Just for information.

Okay, Mr.Singh, next time when you talk about Muslim World, don't forget the Malays from Eastern Muslim World.

 

[aamirsaab]

Sir, please read, muslims contribution in the "Modern World" and I also beg to differ on the scientific contribution as you said above.

So Modern doctors using utensils invented by Muslims years ago doesn't count? Numbers used today invented years ago doesn't count? And you can beg to differ all you want, but the fact remains Ibn Haythm (A Muslim scientist) invented the Scientific methodology. Look it up.

Again actually a lot I wold say whom I have met. My only experience as follows:

1) Ex GF: She was a muslim but she hated every other religion and people idea that I use to feel bad for her a lot of times.

2) Working Muslims (From Pakistan): Always winge about how bad the conutry is and all thw white females are ******. I mean if you hate them so much then why come here. Live in your own country.

Good Experience: My boss , he is from Turkish background and a very liberate person. He says "Middle East and Arabs are idiots", well if you take them out of islamic histroy , there is not much to talk about.

So roughly less than 100? And you think that number represents 1.6 billion people....

I am talking about West Mr Intelligent. U need to look at the sorry states of Non Muslims in muslim dominated areas and then talk about the word "Opperesion".

In the West? Where exactly? Brick lane? Also, don't think I haven't noticed you have changed your original argument which was why do muslims always complain about oppression.

I for once say again, I don't care whats written in Quran, I look at actions, when you don't allow another faith temple or church to be built in Islamic World and then say we respect everyone else then I c it as an ironic statement. Don't even think about saying "this is that country law and Islam has nothing to do with it". Islam is judged by what muslims do and not what they say.

What the hell are you talking about? What oppression do non-muslims experience from Muslims living in the west? And that crap about not caring what is written in the Quran? That's the religion. If the followers are committing crimes, then the followers are to be blamed. Not the religion - especially if the religious teachings says do the complete opposite (i,e. do not oppress etc)

Oooo, wanting sometime in Democracy is not a bad thing at all, its the consequences that comes with it.

What consequences would those be? Change? Are you now saying you do not like the after effects of Democracy? Then maybe you should leave. Or are you one of those who think Muslims don't get a say in a Democracy?

Are you telling me that you would actually like Sharia to be implemented across the world?

I said no such thing. But whilst we're on the topic, Sharia Law as a legal system cannot enter non-muslim lands. And even if it were to be implemented, it would only affect Muslim criminals anyway because the punishments cannot be handed to Non-muslims.

No I am not, I am actually comparing it to Jews coz all Muslims leaders call for their head and say how bad they are. Jews are actually way smarter.

Yes you did and you have done again in your example.

Haha, Sir Have to ever watched his dvd's. I agree some of his answers on Islam are good to watch as they clear some doubts but some of his explanations on other religions are funny to watch. What happen to the saying that "You should check the message before you convey" philosiphy from Quran?

Now you have changed your original argument. Again.

NO I was wrong to think that you guys are liberal but some of your replies on this and other forums on Comparative religion is out of this world. Am I surprised , A big NO. This is exactly what I expected.

I find that very funny actually. First off most of my friends are non-muslims (quite a few of them are Sikh too) - I have no problem with anyone or any religion - so nice assumption. Secondly, you come in here mouthing off with all your misconceptions and outright lies and then cry foul play when we don't bend over and kiss your ass?

Muslims have more then half of the population in Africa, look at its state.
Muslims have more then 80% of the population in Middle east, look at its state.

Correlation not causation. I did statistics, I'm educated to degree level. This crap does not work on me.

The only respected muslims comes from West where there is diversity. So you are not telling me there is nothing wrong there. Don't say look at what USA doing or this and that. You look at Muslim rulers history, there is blood shed everywhere in name of Islam. Muslims kill each other for power. Mugul rulers were barbaric and so called Imams use to pray in Mecca before they come ot India and kill and rule.

You asked why Muslims keep complaining about oppression. Now you are turning it into well they oppressed too! You've also not backed any statements up so I have no idea what you are talking about but oh well.

Muslims did everything they cud have done to spread islam even though this mean killing innocent (This is history and don't even justify it with stupid excuses like others) when they were strong,

Do you have the backing for those statements? I'd like to know what specific events you are talking about.

why cry now as to what USA or west is doing it?

Oppression is Oppression - it doesn't matter who is the oppressor and who is the oppressed.

You say you came here to expel misconceptions of Sikhism, yet you bring with you misconceptions of Islam. You contradict everything I say and you change your arguments whenever you please to score meaningless points and you clearly love the sound of your own voice. It is clear, you are here to vent. Come back when you want to learn.

 

[Ali_008]

Mr. Singh, the problem with you and most haters of Islam is the generalized view they have of the great religion. Most people just say Islam did this, Islam did that, but they fail to realize that one point or the other every major religion of the world was involved in some war or the other. Islam, in particular, gets highlighted and criticized because it is the only one who not just won the war, but won the people as well and that's just too difficult to fathom for eyes that have been blurred by hatred for Islam. There were actual established kingdoms after conquests by Muslims. In comparison to that, when other conquests took place, the empires dissolved either because the entire populations would get persecuted for showing opposition to the ruler, or there would be migrations by either or both rulers and citizens for the exact same reason.

In addition to that, the conquests of Islam are a matter of such huge discussion solely because even history attests that after Muslim conquests, the citizens would show resistance to any power that would try to overthrow the Muslim king. There is so much documented evidence of Muslims conquests because of the fact that those were successful conquests, and were commemorated onto inscriptions and scriptures as a sign of respect for the prosperity brought forward by Islamic rule.

Apart from the above, you have so much to speak about Islamic history only because of the double standards that the world media has for Islam. When a Muslim does something bad, the news instantly reports him as "Muslim criminal", whereas if that person had been non-Muslim then he would be called by his place of his origin/occurrence such as "resident of New York" or "Accountant from Tokyo" or "Brazilian emigrant". There's a new favorite word for non-Muslim criminals adopted by the great minds of CNN, BBC, and ABC these days as well called "mad man." On the other hand, if a Muslim does something good, the credit goes to anything but Islam such "Indian doctor", "23 year old junkie", "the guy from 7th street", "my neighbor." The double standards are not exclusive to contemporary affairs either as it has been proven by your attack on history of Islam and Muslim rulers. In case you don't know, most deaths in history reported in the name of religion belong to Christianity, not Islam.

Even right now, the so called "terrorists" seem to be predominantly targeting countries like Pakistan, Afghanistan, Somalia, Iraq, Syria, Mali and other such countries which to the surprise of all of us happen to be Muslim countries, mg: because according to you Muslims are killing innocent non-Muslim civilians. We had enough trouble already with Israel attacking Palestine, America attacking Iraq and Afghanistan, and uninvited rehabilitation forces entering countries like Libya, Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon and others.