[Sunnih]

As it seems that Muslims and Christians differ a lot in their beliefs, I thought to open a thread also on what we agree.

So I will start that Muslims and Christians alike, agree that there is a God.

 

[Woodrow]

We do agree that Isa(as) was born of a virgin mother.

 

['Abd al-Baari]

We also belive in life after death and that the life lived in this life affects the life we will be given in the hereafter

Allah knows best

 

[Amadeus85]

We also agree that Jesus Christ will come at the end of the world-the Judgement Day.

 

[Balthasar21]

The same ( Prophet's )
Pilgrimage .
Jesus name in Qur'aan
2;81 , 2 ; 130 , 2; 254 ,
3 ; 40 . 3 ; 48 ; 3 ; 53 ,
4 ; 156 ; 4 ; 151 , 4 ; 169 ,
5 ; 50 . 5 ; 82 , 5 ; 109 ,
5 ; 112 , 5 ; 114 , 5 ; 116 ,
6; 85 , 19 ; 35 , 33 ; 7 , 42 ; 11
43 ; 63 ; 57 ; 27 , 61 ; 6 , 61 ; 14 .

Characters ( Genesis 17 ; 18 , Joshua 24 ; 4 , Matthew 17 ; 4 , Koran 2 ; 136
Creation ( Genesis 1 ; 31 , 1 ; 3 , 2 ; 4 , ) Koran 2; 117 , 7 ; 54 , 23 ; 12 , )
Idea of Hell and Heaven ( Genesis 8 ; 2 , Deuteronomy 32 ; 22 , ) ( Koran 2 ; 9 -11 , 15 ; 45 - 48 )
System of prayer ( Genesis 17 ; 3 , Koran 96 ; 19 ) .
Fasting ( Judge 20 ; 26 , Koran 2 ; 184 ) .
Dietary laws in relation to eating pig or not eating pig ( Leviticus 11; 7 , Koran 5 ; 4 )

Just to name few

 

[Keltoi]

We have more in common than we have differences. The list of things we share in common could go on for quite awhile.

 

[Woodrow]

We have more in common than we have differences. The list of things we share in common could go on for quite awhile.

That is true. In fact I can only think of one major difference, but that difference is sufficient to make us 2 different religions.

We need to all learn that we are all just one race of human beings and that our religious beliefs should not be a cause for hatred between us as humans.

I do believe that in the last days there will finaly be one religion. However, I doubt that will be in my life time.

 

[- Qatada -]

:salamext:


I love these verses from the Qur'an hope you like them too:

You will surely find the most intense of the people in animosity toward the believers [to be] the Jews and those who associate others with Allah ; and you will find the nearest of them in affection to the believers those who say, "We are Christians." That is because among them are priests and monks and because they are not arrogant.

And when they (who call themselves Christians) listen to what has been sent down to the Messenger (Muhammad, peace be upon him), you see their eyes overflowing with tears because of the truth they have recognised. They say: "Our Lord! We believe; so write us down among the witnesses.


"And why should we not believe in Allah and in that which has come to us of the truth (Islamic Monotheism)? And we wish that our Lord will admit us (in Paradise on the Day of Resurrection) along with the righteous people (Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him and his Companions رضى م)."


So because of what they said, Allah rewarded them Gardens under which rivers flow (in Paradise), they will abide therein forever. Such is the reward of good*doers.

But those who disbelieved and belied Our Ayat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.), they shall be the dwellers of the (Hell) Fire.


[Qur'an 5: 82-86]




​

Regards.

 

[August]

We both believe in charity for the poor.

 

[Philosopher]

Both are pre-Medieval superstitions.

 

[Chuck]

:salamext:


I love these verses from the Qur'an hope you like them too:

You will surely find the most intense of the people in animosity toward the believers [to be] the Jews and those who associate others with Allah ; and you will find the nearest of them in affection to the believers those who say, "We are Christians." That is because among them are priests and monks and because they are not arrogant.

And when they (who call themselves Christians) listen to what has been sent down to the Messenger (Muhammad, peace be upon him), you see their eyes overflowing with tears because of the truth they have recognised. They say: "Our Lord! We believe; so write us down among the witnesses.


"And why should we not believe in Allah and in that which has come to us of the truth (Islamic Monotheism)? And we wish that our Lord will admit us (in Paradise on the Day of Resurrection) along with the righteous people (Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him and his Companions رضى م)."


So because of what they said, Allah rewarded them Gardens under which rivers flow (in Paradise), they will abide therein forever. Such is the reward of good*doers.

But those who disbelieved and belied Our Ayat (proofs, evidences, verses, lessons, signs, revelations, etc.), they shall be the dwellers of the (Hell) Fire.


[Qur'an 5: 82-86]




​

Regards.

That is not general to all Christians imo. It is specifically directed to some Christian groups that came to the prophet (pbuh) and then it list the qualities why they were closer to us -- "That is because among them are priests and monks and because they are not arrogant". I guess it would apply to Christians in this day too who posses these qualities. But it is difficult to say who they are. Only Allah knows.

Read on the Nazarenes, something weird about them is that not much historical record available after prophet Muhammad (p). It appears either they disappeared or integrated into Islam.

Epiphanius (published in 370), gave this description of the Nazarenes:

"But these sectarians... did not call themselves Christians--but "Nazarenes," ... However they are simply complete Jews. They use not only the New Testament but the Old Testament as well, as the Jews do... They have no different ideas, but confess everything exactly as the Law proclaims it and in the Jewish fashion-- except for their belief in Messiah, if you please! For they acknowledge both the resurrection of the dead and the divine creation of all things, and declare that G-d is one, and that his son is Jesus the Messiah. They are trained to a nicety in Hebrew. For among them the entire Law, the Prophets, and the... Writings... are read in Hebrew, as they surely are by the Jews. They are different from the Jews, and different from Christians, only in the following. They disagree with Jews because they have come to faith in Messiah; but since they are still fettered by the Law--circumcision, the Sabbath, and the rest-- they are not in accord with Christians.... they are nothing but Jews.... They have the Good News according to Matthew in its entirety in Hebrew. For it is clear that they still preserve this, in the Hebrew alphabet, as it was originally written. (Epiphanius; Panarion 29)"
​

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazarene_(sect)#Patristic_references_to_.22Nazarenes.22

********************
but there's little further evidence of these groups' existence, beliefs or activities, after the onset of Islam.

http://nazarenes.totallyexplained.com/

 

[Chuck]

Both are pre-Medieval superstitions.

That was hilarious :giggling:

 

[Strzelecki]

That was hilarious :giggling:

I too laughed.

 

[Woodrow]

That was hilarious :giggling:

Another point in common. I also believe that was hilarious.

 

[zoro]

Well, sorry to douse the merriment, but there a host of more serious similarities:

• Both “believe” more strongly than relevant evidence warrants
• Both “believe” what they want to believe, in spite of evidence
• Both wallow in the delusion that they’ll live forever
• Both display less scientific competence than children
• Both cling to their “holy books” like children cling to comic books
• Both accept ideas about “the supernatural” when no data supports such speculations
• Both have the astounding arrogance to assume that some supernatural entity (which they claim created this universe) has any concern for ant-like humans
• Both now laugh at those of us who say “Show me the data” – whereas, in the past,
• Both murdered thousands if not millions of us who said to the believers “Get real!”
• Both put up huge blockades that inhibit progress toward solving the many real problems of the world, and
• Both are destined for oblivion – the sooner, the better.

 

[Woodrow]

Quite strong statements. Oddly I will agree with you that they are all true.

Well, sorry to douse the merriment, but there a host of more serious similarities:

• Both “believe” more strongly than relevant evidence warrants
• Both “believe” what they want to believe, in spite of evidence
• Both wallow in the delusion that they’ll live forever
• Both display less scientific competence than children
• Both cling to their “holy books” like children cling to comic books
• Both accept ideas about “the supernatural” when no data supports such speculations
• Both have the astounding arrogance to assume that some supernatural entity (which they claim created this universe) has any concern for ant-like humans
• Both now laugh at those of us who say “Show me the data” – whereas, in the past,
• Both murdered thousands if not millions of us who said to the believers “Get real!”
• Both put up huge blockades that inhibit progress toward solving the many real problems of the world, and
• Both are destined for oblivion – the sooner, the better.

However, I will add the qualifier. those are not the result of religious belief. they are things we share in common as human beings. Those very same "facts" are also applicable to atheists and agnostics. So to be fair you should say "These are things in common between, Muslims, Jews, Christians, Buddhists, Hindus, Sikhs, Atheists, Agnostic, etc" Your statement would be even more valid if written as:

• All “believe” more strongly than relevant evidence warrants
(although the believe may also be in the material, scientific world)

• All “believe” what they want to believe, in spite of evidence
(The scientist believes that all things can be measured)


• All wallow in the delusion that they’ll live forever(see note below)

• All display less scientific competence than children
(The Scientist, fails to accept the fact that because he can not measure something, only means he lacks the tools for measurement)

• All cling to their “holy books” like children cling to comic books

• All accept ideas about “the supernatural” when no data supports such speculations
(What is scientific to some is suoernatural to others and vice versa)


• All have the astounding arrogance to assume that some supernatural entity (which they claim created this universe) has any concern for ant-like humans

• All now laugh at those of us who say “Show me the data” – whereas, in the past,

• All murdered thousands if not millions of us who said to the believers “Get real!”

• All put up huge blockades that inhibit progress toward solving the many real problems of the world, and

• All are destined for oblivion – the sooner, the better.
(We will all face death, oblivion is simply a personal opinion as to how we will face it)

NOTE: For the benefit of atheists This would be more accurate as "All wallow in the delusion that they’ll either cease to exist or live forever, but either way eternity will be there"

 

[zoro]

Well, Woodrow, as per usual you make good points – yet, as per usual, we have differences in opinions – and definitions! Point by point (with your wording):

• All “believe” more strongly than relevant evidence warrants
(although the belief may also be in the material, scientific world)

Here, I would want an exposition on the word “belief”. Thus, as a scientist, rather than stating that I “believe” in an objective, material reality external to my mind, I would say that there is a 99.999999999…% probability [to a total of about 25 nines] that it exists. Thus, I base that “belief” on evidence.

• All “believe” what they want to believe, in spite of evidence
(The scientist believes that all things can be measured)

Again in my case, rather than say I believe that all things can be measured, I would say that evidence suggests that there’s a 99.99 % chance (I won’t push that much higher, cause I’m worried about “dark matter”) that things external to my mind can be measured. And again, evidence supports the estimate (i.e., supports the “belief”).

• All wallow in the delusion that they’ll live forever
Note: For the benefit of atheists This would be more accurate as "All wallow in the delusion that they’ll either cease to exist or live forever, but either way eternity will be there"

Yes, but one would be hard pressed to defend that they “wallow” in such a delusion; I, for one, rather wish that I wouldn’t die, but “c’est la vie” – even if that does stretch the meaning of the French!

• All display less scientific competence than children
(The Scientist fails to accept the fact that because he can not measure something, only means he lacks the tools for measurement)

Ah but you’re taking this one too far! My point was (and is): if you inform a child that you can jump over the moon, then in her appropriate terminology, she’ll say: “Please provide an experimental confirmation of the predictions of your hypothesis”, e.g., “betcha can’t!” On the other hand, once a child is indoctrinated (by those she trusts, such as her parents) that she can live forever in paradise, she loses the natural skepticism that challenged your ability to jump over the moon.

• All cling to their “holy books” like children cling to comic books

• All accept ideas about “the supernatural” when no data support such speculations
(What is scientific to some is supernatural to others and vice versa)

Ah, come on now, you’ve just slipped that one in – hoping I wouldn’t notice?! Science has nothing to do with anything supernatural! Meanwhile, anyone who suggests that there’s something “scientific” about the supernatural doesn’t understand science.

• All have the astounding arrogance to assume that some supernatural entity (which they claim created this universe) has any concern for ant-like humans

Well, that’s silly! Those of us who reject ideas about “the supernatural” certainly don’t then (inconsistently) make any assumption about such things!

• All now laugh at those of us who say “Show me the data” – whereas, in the past,

• All murdered thousands if not millions of us who said to the believers “Get real!”

• All put up huge blockades that inhibit progress toward solving the many real problems of the world, and

• All are destined for oblivion – the sooner, the better.
(We will all face death, oblivion is simply a personal opinion as to how we will face it)

Well, with those expansions to “all”, I can see some justification for such generalizations (thinking of the Nazis, Stalinists, Maoists, etc.); yet, as far as I know, they’re inappropriate for humanists – so maybe better: “All except humanists…” etc.

And yes: maybe oblivion for all, since even though we may live through our collision with the Andromeda galaxy (in a few billion years), Earth will be swallowed up by the sun in about 5 billion years. But then, surely by that time, humans will make it to other star systems – and maybe even to other galaxies. Moreover, as for “oblivion” with death: so long as we leave something that benefits future generations, then in a sense, we live on.

 

[- Qatada -]

I thought this was supposed to be about the similarities between muslims and christians?

 

[August]

I thought this was supposed to be about the similarities between muslims and christians?

Yeah, we've gotten sidetracked by a rude atheist. I used to be one btw.

Here's what I see as the largest similarity: we are both doing our best to love and honor our Creator.

 

[جوري]

I thought this was supposed to be about the similarities between muslims and christians?

it was but then we fell prey to the highly anticipated feedback from