US Copter Down in Afghanistan

[mahdisoldier19]

If you hate the US so much, why do you live there? Quite hypocrytical isn't it? "I hate this country, but I sure love the benefits that come with living here."

And where did i say I Hate the US? Who is putting words in my mouth?

 

[Skillganon]

Taking into consideration the weapons the possess, it must be a Great Shot.

 

[Idris]

Mahdi;

Was this one of those anti-aircraft weapons that just happened to be firing into the air at a wedding ceremony?

Also, an observation. Is it really appropriate for you to be gloating over the death of American/Canadian/British soldiers on an Islamic Forum which has the stated purpose of improving understanding?

People might get the wrong idea. They might assume you are a juvenile, hate-filled cheerleader for the Taliban, too young or too old or to cowardly to do the fighting yourself.

Do you see any Westerners crowing here when a bunch of your taliban bros buy the farm?

Well if you come to another man country and bomb the crap out of him then I think it should be only right that Muslims should be happy then American/Canadian/British soldier’s die try to kill. Put it this what if someone is robbing your house and dies trying how you doing to feel? This is a war and the US started.

 

[Isaac]

Every human regardless of wether he be here in the west or across the ocean in the east has every right to defend himself, his family, his property and his land. Is this not the case which America used to illegally invade Iraq? So why do people get all heartbroken when the opressed repell against the agressor? Why do people get all heartbroken when the illegal military invasion in Iraq and elsewhere is being destroyed and its murderous troops are being slain?

I agree war is not a pretty sight and must be avoided at all costs, but to complain and blame those who fight back is just pathtic. I say those that are being illegally occupied, tortured, killed, raped and bombed by helicopter gunships have every right to defend themselves. And i fully support them, whether they are fighting British troops or Russian troops. Wether they are fighting Isralie troops or American troops.

Let me ask one question, what would you do if your country was invaded ILLEGALY, your people killed, raped, tortured? What would you do if your country was being split by sectarian violance and political intentions from outside? I know what I would do! And that is to die for the cause. And that cause is to fight opression and agression!

 

[Zulkiflim]

Salaam,

Well i am not sure if revealing that they have anti aircraft weapons is wise or not.

I mena how many helicopters is it now? 4 or 5?

And all due to maintainence issue?

I mena no matter what an objective investgator would try to cover all possible areas.

The US action in not revelaing the truth may be becasue
1) Troops morale
2) Troops safety
3) Public opinion
4) They are still investigating..

For the Iraqis to reveal their weaponry
1)Bolster morale in the current US escalation in Baghdad
2)A warning/propaganda drive
3)a diversionary so that the US will stop its operation.

Dont forget that the US rely on air power to protect/recover/attack .
So if these are nullified,the US wont do anything..

But it may be that it is a setup to blame Iran made weapons for destroying the copters and its losses.

 

[Keltoi]

Of course, to believe this is all about the "oppressed" and people just "fighting back" is simply naive and rather childish when compared to the reality of the situation. You have many groups of death squads, both Shia and Sunni, whose primary goal is now the death of each other. The U.S. is just the traffic cop at this point...albeit a traffic cop who took it upon himself to assume that role. More's the pity.

As for the death of soldiers or insurgents. Some people see war as a game they watch from the sidelines. Body counts are compared, and people choose sides and cheer when their side makes a goal, i.e. body counts. I notice there is silence, or blame, when Iraqis butcher each other by the hundreds every day. Yet there is some sort of deranged pride when a U.S. chopper goes down. I suppose it is a matter of maturity and knowledge of how horrible war is for both sides, but I cringe every time I read about war. Whether it is death on the enemy side or my side.

 

[Cognescenti]

Well if you come to another man country and bomb the crap out of him then I think it should be only right that Muslims should be happy then American/Canadian/British soldier’s die try to kill. Put it this what if someone is robbing your house and dies trying how you doing to feel? This is a war and the US started.

Completely vapid analogy, Idris.

What fraction of the US population do you think cared about Afghanistan before 9-11? A few thousand Afghani expatriots and some CIA types. Thats it.

When the Taliban blew up the Budhist statues, they got some press, uniformly negative, btw, but still, anyone proposing to send US troops would have been laughed off the scene. When they publicly sawed off people's hands in Kabul under sharia we rolled our eyes and went back to work. Banning music....yawn.

But when 2800 Americans were murdered and untold billions of dollars of damage were caused on 9-11....well now, that was different. The Taliban offered refuge to OBL. They shared a philosophical kindred. They were given the option of turning him over to the US. They told us to take a hike. We declined and mainly arrived by jet aircraft.

Don't give me that self-defence ****. You have it backward.

 

[Cognescenti]

Every human regardless of wether he be here in the west or across the ocean in the east has every right to defend himself, his family, his property and his land. Is this not the case which America used to illegally invade Iraq? So why do people get all heartbroken when the opressed repell against the agressor? Why do people get all heartbroken when the illegal military invasion in Iraq and elsewhere is being destroyed and its murderous troops are being slain?

I agree war is not a pretty sight and must be avoided at all costs, but to complain and blame those who fight back is just pathtic. I say those that are being illegally occupied, tortured, killed, raped and bombed by helicopter gunships have every right to defend themselves. And i fully support them, whether they are fighting British troops or Russian troops. Wether they are fighting Isralie troops or American troops.

Let me ask one question, what would you do if your country was invaded ILLEGALY, your people killed, raped, tortured? What would you do if your country was being split by sectarian violance and political intentions from outside? I know what I would do! And that is to die for the cause. And that cause is to fight opression and agression!

Isaac;

You do know we are talking about Afghanistan here?

Isaac, why not stop bloviating on the web and go "die for the cause" somewhere? Get to it, man. Time's a wasting. Go find a flag with some funny Arabic lettering, find a rock somewhere, climb atop it and wave the thing with your stubby little arms until your undersized heart can do more more.

Your are a mindless partisan. You are part of the problem. To say that you are lemming-like is to demean a whole species.

Do send us updates from the front, will you? Make sure you use lots of exclamation marks and stirring revolutionary phrases too.

 

[Idris]

You must be a big fool if you think this war started from 9-11.

Of course, to believe this is all about the "oppressed" and people just "fighting back" is simply naive and rather childish when compared to the reality of the situation. You have many groups of death squads, both Shia and Sunni, whose primary goal is now the death of each other. The U.S. is just the traffic cop at this point...albeit a traffic cop who took it upon himself to assume that role. More's the pity.

They sit in Armour cars watching or “green zone”. Did this happen b4 the war?
No...

When the Taliban blew up the Budhist statues, they got some press, uniformly negative, btw, but still, anyone proposing to send US troops would have been laughed off the scene. When they publicly sawed off people's hands in Kabul under sharia we rolled our eyes and went back to work. Banning music....yawn.

.... lol I really don't need to call names like you did to Isaac .... but there are many name for someone like you.

 

[Isaac]

Cognaseti, you seem somehwhat dilluded from what goes on outside your pretty little live in a democratic world. Remember afghanistan and iraq are not the usa.. Try to read my post and try not to get too personal. Its people like you that wish for wars, promote wars, vote for wars and just love seeing the bully take charge.

Let me ask you a question, do you think its is right for one to defend themselves against occuping forces. Do you think afghans have a right to defend themsleves?

You now what dont bother, becuase people like you just love seeing people die, as long as their not your own. And what was the point with the funny arabic letters. What has that got to do with anything? It seems that you imply that anything arabic is pro-war? Your true colours come out, as i have been reading your posts. The more and more i read your posts, the more and more i realise you have nothing constructive to add, but just looking for a confrontation.

Power to the people. Power to the opressed! Time and Time Again! Down with the agressors, down with the state terrorsit!

 

[sudais1]

Sounds great. How do we do that?

funny they way you phrased that.lol

 

[Cognescenti]

You must be a big fool if you think this war started from 9-11. .

Do tell us big fools, then. What do you think prompted the US to send thousands of troops to a backwater place like Afghanistan? Can't be oil. The rugs maybe? A new vacation resort, perhaps? Please correct our misunderstanding.

.... lol I really don't need to call names like you did to Isaac .... but there are many name for someone like you.

Don't be timid, sister. I can take it. You will need to back it up, though.

 

[wilberhum]

..........This is a war and the US started.

Is this another, "The CIA did 9-11"? Or the Jews did it?

 

[Cognescenti]

Cognaseti, you seem somehwhat dilluded from what goes on outside your pretty little live in a democratic world. Remember afghanistan and iraq are not the usa.. Try to read my post and try not to get too personal. Its people like you that wish for wars, promote wars, vote for wars and just love seeing the bully take charge.

Let me ask you a question, do you think its is right for one to defend themselves against occuping forces. Do you think afghans have a right to defend themsleves?

You now what dont bother, becuase people like you just love seeing people die, as long as their not your own. And what was the point with the funny arabic letters. What has that got to do with anything? It seems that you imply that anything arabic is pro-war? Your true colours come out, as i have been reading your posts. The more and more i read your posts, the more and more i realise you have nothing constructive to add, but just looking for a confrontation.

Power to the people. Power to the opressed! Time and Time Again! Down with the agressors, down with the state terrorsit!

Isaac;

Try not being so one-dimensional. Not everyone in Afghanistan supports to Taliban...and let's dispense with the artifice that the Taliban are peasant farmers who took up arms to defend their soil. Every single NATO troop in Afghanistan wants to go home. There is nothing there of the slightest interest to us...save to insure it doesn't become another haven for terror.


There is this:

You now what dont bother, becuase people like you just love seeing people die, as long as their not your own.

Hmmm? Aren't you the one strutting about, crowing about the death of NATO soldiers. There is a psychoanalytical term for what you just did....it called "projection". Look it up.

Good work on the slogans. Nice exclamation marks too. Post some picks when you get to the training camp.

 

[mahdisoldier19]

Completely vapid analogy, Idris.

What fraction of the US population do you think cared about Afghanistan before 9-11? A few thousand Afghani expatriots and some CIA types. Thats it.

When the Taliban blew up the Budhist statues, they got some press, uniformly negative, btw, but still, anyone proposing to send US troops would have been laughed off the scene. When they publicly sawed off people's hands in Kabul under sharia we rolled our eyes and went back to work. Banning music....yawn.

But when 2800 Americans were murdered and untold billions of dollars of damage were caused on 9-11....well now, that was different. The Taliban offered refuge to OBL. They shared a philosophical kindred. They were given the option of turning him over to the US. They told us to take a hike. We declined and mainly arrived by jet aircraft.

Don't give me that self-defence ****. You have it backward.

Actually to prove your Incorrect,

Bush rejects Taliban offer to hand Bin Laden over


9.30pm update: * Taliban demand evidence of Bin Laden's guilt
* Second week of airstrikes starts
* Taliban urges US to halt bombing

Staff and agencies
Sunday October 14, 2001
Guardian Unlimited

President George Bush rejected as "non-negotiable" an offer by the Taliban to discuss turning over Osama bin Laden if the United States ended the bombing in Afghanistan.

Returning to the White House after a weekend at Camp David, the president said the bombing would not stop, unless the ruling Taliban "turn [bin Laden] over, turn his cohorts over, turn any hostages they hold over." He added, "There's no need to discuss innocence or guilt. We know he's guilty". In Jalalabad, deputy prime minister Haji Abdul Kabir - the third most powerful figure in the ruling Taliban regime - told reporters that the Taliban would require evidence that Bin Laden was behind the September 11 terrorist attacks in the US, but added: "we would be ready to hand him over to a third country".

Article continues
The offer came a day after the Taliban's supreme leader rebuffed Bush's "second chance" for the Islamic militia to surrender Bin Laden to the US.

Mullah Mohammed Omar said there was no move to "hand anyone over".

Taliban 'ready to discuss' Bin Laden handover if bombing halts
The Taliban would be ready to discuss handing over Osama bin Laden to a neutral country if the US halted the bombing of Afghanistan, a senior Taliban official said today.

Afghanistan's deputy prime minister, Haji Abdul Kabir, told reporters that the Taliban would require evidence that Bin Laden was behind the September 11 terrorist attacks in the US.

"If the Taliban is given evidence that Osama bin Laden is involved" and the bombing campaign stopped, "we would be ready to hand him over to a third country", Mr Kabir added.

But it would have to be a state that would never "come under pressure from the United States", he said.

Mr Kabir urged America to halt its air campaign, now in its eighth day, and open negotiations. "If America were to step back from the current policy, then we could negotiate," he said. "Then we could discuss which third country."

Large explosions caused by American bombs and missiles have been reported to the south and east of the Afghan capital, Kabul, this evening.

The sky above the city has been filled with tracer fire from Taliban anti-aircraft guns once again.

Before the start of the air campaign, the Taliban had demanded evidence of Bin Laden's involvement in the attack and had offered to try him before an Islamic court inside Afghanistan - proposals that the US promptly rejected.

Al-Qaida warning an 'admission of guilt'
Threats of new terrorist strikes against Britain and the US from Osama bin Laden's al-Qaida group amount to an admission of guilt for the September 11 attacks, the deputy prime minister, John Prescott, said today.

Mr Prescott, speaking while on a diplomatic mission in Moscow, argued that the latest statement from al-Qaida strongly suggested Bin Laden's culpability for last month's attacks on New York and Washington.

"What I have heard about the message given ... is basically confirming, I think, the guilt of Bin Laden, who has made it clear that he wants to continue these actions," he told BBC1's Breakfast with Frost programme this morning.

The new threats from al-Qaida came from spokesman Sulaiman Abu Ghaith, in a video-taped statement broadcast on Qatar's Al-Jazeera Arabic TV news network.

He said Muslims in the US and Britain "should avoid travelling by air or living in high buildings or towers".

Americans and Britons were also warned to leave the Arabian Peninsula "because the land will burn with fire under their feet".

Washington dismissed the comments as "propaganda", while a Downing Street spokeswoman echoed Mr Prescott's comment that the threats amounted to an admission of guilt.
(Full story)

Anti-US protests engulf Pakistani town
Thousands of anti-US protesters today converged on a southern Pakistani town, fighting pitched battles with police and paramilitary troops.

One person was killed and 24 were injured in the battles around Jacobabad, police said.

The desert city is the home of one of two air bases made available to US forces to support the air campaign against Osama bin Laden and his al-Qaida network.

As rage grew over US-led air strikes on Afghanistan, one militant leader exhorted followers to set Shabaz airbase in Jacobabad on fire "at any cost", and another called on Pakistan's generals to overthrow the country's military ruler, General Pervez Musharraf.
(Full story)

Cathedral cleared in 'powder' scare
Firefighters wearing protective suits were this afternoon attempting to clear up white powder dropped in Canterbury Cathedral by a man reported to be of Arab appearance.

The cathedral was evacuated at around 2.30pm today after the man was seen dropping the powder in one of its chapels.

The fire brigade was called in to clear up the powder and take samples for analysis, amid heightened concerns about biological warfare attacks in Britain.

It is understood the powder is not thought to be a biological agent, such as anthrax, but the cathedral remains closed tonight as tests are carried out.
(Full story)

UN commissioner warns of Afghan starvation threat
United Nations human rights commissioner Mary Robinson has called for a pause in the US-led bombing of Afghanistan to allow food aid into the country and prevent a "Rwanda-style" humanitarian disaster.

The former Irish president said that otherwise America and its allies could preside over the deaths from starvation of millions of people in Afghanistan.

Mrs Robinson, speaking to BBC1's Breakfast with Frost programme from Geneva, said helping Afghanistan's civilian population through the winter had to be a top priority.
(Full story)

Source: http://www.guardian.co.uk/waronterror/story/0,1361,573975,00.html

They offered refuge on the act that Osama bin laden would not commit Any Acts from Afghan Soil, Also there is no evidence provided that OBL was responsible for 9/11, thats why the Taliban never handed him Over.

Get your facts straight, even including International Law of the UN Charter, the US had no right in Afghanistan and Iraq.

 

[mahdisoldier19]

Isaac;

Try not being so one-dimensional. Not everyone in Afghanistan supports to Taliban...and let's dispense with the artifice that the Taliban are peasant farmers who took up arms to defend their soil. Every single NATO troop in Afghanistan wants to go home. There is nothing there of the slightest interest to us...save to insure it doesn't become another haven for terror.


There is this:

You now what dont bother, becuase people like you just love seeing people die, as long as their not your own.

Hmmm? Aren't you the one strutting about, crowing about the death of NATO soldiers. There is a psychoanalytical term for what you just did....it called "projection". Look it up.

Good work on the slogans. Nice exclamation marks too. Post some picks when you get to the training camp.

So What about the Millions of Children that were killed due to Depleted Uranium given by the United States? So who gets the blame?

Come on who? The United States? And what did they United States Government, not the people, the ignorant government do? They returned back to Iraq in now over 655,000 killed again.

So you explain to me whats going on.

 

[wilberhum]

mahdisoldier19

Obviously you think the US has no right to attack those that declear war against them and commit numerious acts of war.

 

[Skillganon]

mahdisoldier19

Obviously you think the US has no right to attack those that declear war against them and commit numerious acts of war.

I thought it was US bombing other countries & interfering heavily, that is why they got attack by some people.
US does not need anyone to declare war on them to attack anyone. They have shown that quite brutally in Iraq, afghan and other countries.

Going back to the topic. They must been a funny funerals, what a way to die. Well the battle is not over.

 

[Cognescenti]

Actually to prove your Incorrect,

Bush rejects Taliban offer to hand Bin Laden over


9.30pm update: * Taliban demand evidence of Bin Laden's guilt
* Second week of airstrikes starts
* Taliban urges US to halt bombing

Staff and agencies
Sunday October 14, 2001
Guardian Unlimited

President George Bush rejected as "non-negotiable" an offer by the Taliban to discuss turning over Osama bin Laden if the United States ended the bombing in Afghanistan.

Returning to the White House after a weekend at Camp David, the president said the bombing would not stop, unless the ruling Taliban "turn [bin Laden] over, turn his cohorts over, turn any hostages they hold over." He added, "There's no need to discuss innocence or guilt. We know he's guilty". In Jalalabad, deputy prime minister Haji Abdul Kabir - the third most powerful figure in the ruling Taliban regime - told reporters that the Taliban would require evidence that Bin Laden was behind the September 11 terrorist attacks in the US, but added: "we would be ready to hand him over to a third country".....

Yeah...that's it Mahdisoldier The war starts after plenty of warning.....then Omar et. al. decide the US wasn't bluffing, but, in order to save face, and stall for time, they offer to hand him over to a third party after they see the evidence

 

[Cognescenti]

So What about the Millions of Children that were killed due to Depleted Uranium given by the United States? So who gets the blame?

Do you mean who gets the blame for making up such a preposterous claim?

"Millions of Children"? "Depleted Uranium"....huh? What the heck are you going on about?