Why can't atheists just be wrong?

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That's because they were unable to debunk hard math - which is factual enough to throw "chaos" theories out there into chaotic climes lol. The people of chaos, make no sense, and this is why they will hate - it's part and parcel of chaos, after all.

Scimi
 
Greetings,



This article is focussed on evolution, but the same argument effectively demonstrates the mistake being made by the presenter in the video.

Peace

Dude, none of us will take this guy seriously, with that one eye symbolism :D

Not to mention, he didn't actually debunk the creationists but only attempted to present a flawed argument himself, that if such a probability does occur, the chance of it occurring again are heightened lol, what nonsense.

Protein, Isomer and Peptide bonds do not form on their own by chance lol. Not even in a 1/2 chance.

Scimi
 
Greetings,

Not to mention, he didn't actually debunk the creationists but only attempted to present a flawed argument himself, that if such a probability does occur, the chance of it occurring again are heightened lol, what nonsense.

Where does he say this?

Peace
 
Greetings,

In between the lines he writes :)

So that's in your imagination then. If you're going to call his argument flawed, then at least come up with a criticism that has textual evidence to support it.

Peace
 
Greetings and peace be with you czgibson;



This article is focussed on evolution, but the same argument effectively demonstrates the mistake being made by the presenter in the video.

Peace.

I really don't like the deck of cards being used, to explain the probability of evolution happening. There are only 52 cards, all the cards are already produced, and if you shuffle them, it does not make any difference which order they appear. So when your article talks about shuffling a mere 52 cards in some kind of order, and coming up with odds of 1 chance in 10 to the 68th power. As large as that number sounds, it would appear microscopic; if you could find the true probability of chance.

Four billion years ago, there was no life, many species today have around 500 muscles, 200 bones, 500 ligaments and a 1000 tendons and thousands of other body parts and trillions of cells. So how do you justify explaining these odds with only 52 cards? All these parts have order, you can't just reshuffle a pile of bones, ligaments, muscles and tendons, if you come up with the wrong order, there are consequences.

Evolution is no big deal to me one way or the other, but if it did happen, then I firmly believe there is no way it could happen without God.

In the spirit of searching for God.

Eric
 
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Evolution is no big deal to me one way or the other, but if it did happen, then I firmly believe there is no way it could happen without God.



Eric

Well said,that's my only interpretation and understand of evolution..(even though there are people who prove evolution is false..)
 
How can anyone put so much faith in evolution as atheists do? Even the most ardent atheists accept that they have no idea when the various stages of human predecessors occurs, as the dating of bone fragments found can have differences in error of hundreds of thousands of years. Radioactive dating, which is often used, just isn't as accurate as one would like to think. On top of all that, bone fragments of hips have been taken to construct entire skeletons, how is that possible? It just isn't.

Evolution is the most insane scientific theory which is accepted by so many western "intellectuals".
 
Wow I can't believe I've actually read the whole thread. Seems like an accomplishment.

Atheism is a state of mind. Nothing can change this state of mind except by the will of God. After being a regular viewer of this forum for the last couple of years. I think I can confidently say there is no way out with atheists. Take Psygocelis(?) as an example, he's been here for nearly a decade and hasn't changed anything in the way of his thinking.

We can spend all our time debating and arguing but honestly it is a dead end. We shall see the trutg when we die but hopefully by then it is not too late for us.
 
Please forgive my not quoting by name, but I'm answering several posts at once and can't seem to get the multi-quote feature to work.

Four billion years ago, there was no life, many species today have around 500 muscles, 200 bones, 500 ligaments and a 1000 tendons and thousands of other body parts and trillions of cells. So how do you justify explaining these odds with only 52 cards? All these parts have order, you can't just reshuffle a pile of bones, ligaments, muscles and tendons, if you come up with the wrong order, there are consequences.
It was just an illustration of the general idea. Flawed, perhaps, but defeating the illustration doesn't necessarily defeat the argument.

Meanwhile, here's something that may help. The astronomer Carl Sagan came up with something called the Cosmic Calendar that condenses the history of the universe into a single 12-month earth year. In the Cosmic Calendar, Creation/The Big Bang occurs at the beginning of the first second of January 1st, and the end of the last second of December 31st is RIGHT NOW (whoops, you missed it ;D). On this scale, the Milky Way galaxy began to coalesce on March 13; the Solar System, including earth, began to form on September 1st; on September 29th the oldest form of life on earth, stromatolites, developed; and dinosaurs lasted from December 25th until December 30th. Then comes December 31st: at 1 AM the first primitive apes arrive; modern humans, Homo Sapiens, come along at 11:54 PM; the rise of Sumer is at 11:59.46 PM; finally, Moses leads the Hebrews out of Egypt 8/100s of a second ago. This Cosmic Calendar is a great tool for appreciating the incredible time spans we're dealing with, in both cosmology and evolution. I also think it would help the religious to understand the breadth and power of their God. It's not in the Quran, of course, but neither are most other tools we use.

Evolution is no big deal to me one way or the other, but if it did happen, then I firmly believe there is no way it could happen without God.
Fair enough.

How can anyone put so much faith in evolution as atheists do? Even the most ardent atheists accept that they have no idea when the various stages of human predecessors occurs, as the dating of bone fragments found can have differences in error of hundreds of thousands of years. Radioactive dating, which is often used, just isn't as accurate as one would like to think.
Why do you think precise timing is such a big deal? Given the time spans involved, an error of 10,000 years is miniscule.

Atheism is a state of mind.
For some, perhaps. Those are the ones who treat their disbelief as if it were a religion. In which case, why wonder at atheists and not at, say, Shiites? For others, atheism is a conclusion or a verdict, arrived at after an examination of evidence. For the skeptical atheist there are no final answers and everything is subject to revision pending additional evidence. It is only the religious who claim to have found The Answer, just like Blasphemy is an accusation that can only be made by the religious.
 
so sagans 12 months makes sense.. but you have a problem with gods 7 days?

:p

...but lets face it.. nobody can live on 10 commandments.
 
so sagans 12 months makes sense.. but you have a problem with gods 7 days?
Not at all. In fact, those seven (six, actually) days fit in nicely with the First Second.

About living on those 10 Commandments, I prefer them in pistachio.
 
lol maybe i meant that the creation of creation in 7 days is not to be taken as literally as you would like..

especially given your comprehension of sagans 12 months.

although im not even sure such a thing can be implied wrt the islamic understanding and literature.

as for pistachio.. ironically i have 30 flavours.. pistachio is one of them.

it bears no significants as of yet.. or maybe it does.

o_0 ...

0_0
 
Please forgive my not quoting by name, but I'm answering several posts at once and can't seem to get the multi-quote feature to work.


It was just an illustration of the general idea. Flawed, perhaps, but defeating the illustration doesn't necessarily defeat the argument.

Meanwhile, here's something that may help. The astronomer Carl Sagan came up with something called the Cosmic Calendar that condenses the history of the universe into a single 12-month earth year. In the Cosmic Calendar, Creation/The Big Bang occurs at the beginning of the first second of January 1st, and the end of the last second of December 31st is RIGHT NOW (whoops, you missed it ;D). On this scale, the Milky Way galaxy began to coalesce on March 13; the Solar System, including earth, began to form on September 1st; on September 29th the oldest form of life on earth, stromatolites, developed; and dinosaurs lasted from December 25th until December 30th. Then comes December 31st: at 1 AM the first primitive apes arrive; modern humans, Homo Sapiens, come along at 11:54 PM; the rise of Sumer is at 11:59.46 PM; finally, Moses leads the Hebrews out of Egypt 8/100s of a second ago. This Cosmic Calendar is a great tool for appreciating the incredible time spans we're dealing with, in both cosmology and evolution. I also think it would help the religious to understand the breadth and power of their God. It's not in the Quran, of course, but neither are most other tools we use.

Fair enough.

Why do you think precise timing is such a big deal? Given the time spans involved, an error of 10,000 years is miniscule.

For some, perhaps. Those are the ones who treat their disbelief as if it were a religion. In which case, why wonder at atheists and not at, say, Shiites? For others, atheism is a conclusion or a verdict, arrived at after an examination of evidence. For the skeptical atheist there are no final answers and everything is subject to revision pending additional evidence. It is only the religious who claim to have found The Answer, just like Blasphemy is an accusation that can only be made by the religious.

Are you seriously asking why a time frame, inaccurate by thousands upon thousands of years is unimportant to science?
 
Not at all. In fact, those seven (six, actually) days fit in nicely with the First Second.

About living on those 10 Commandments, I prefer them in pistachio.

my mistake, six days..

surah qaf, quran 50.
 

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