akulion
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nope it says Unicorns and im quoting Bible.com KJV
Why don't Muslims believe in the Trinity?
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nope it says Unicorns and im quoting Bible.com KJV
PRISONERofJOY12
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Salam Alaikum, and Peace:
Whoa, Jesus, pbuh, did not come to abolish the law, He came to fullfill it. What makes you think He came to change it. You are saying something completely opposite to the bible here.
Paul changed it, not Jesus, pbuh.
And, I forgot to mention you also said the trinity is confusing. Your entire salvation is based on something you can't explain and Jesus, pbuh, never taught. As I mentioned before, God said He was not the author of confusion. Does it make sense that he would make something as serious as your salvation totally confusing without any possibility of logical explanation?
Wasalam
Hana
in your eyes the trinity is confusing.. I did not say I was confused by it...
PRISONERofJOY12
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there is where you are off track I am qouting from the NIV.. each versions are each seperately translated from the original.
*Hana*
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Salam Alaikum and Peace:
Ohhh, ok, my mistake. I have been trying for many years to have it explained to me. If you understand it, please explain it to me. I would appreciate it very much.
Oh, and I should have posted this in my last reply and I didn't. I don't like to say things without showing the verses. I apologize for not posting it before but this should explain why I said you are going against what the bible says:
In Matthew 5:17-18, Jesus stated: “17 Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the [way of] the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them. 18For, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.”
However, Paul, who claimed to be a disciple of Jesus, systematically cancelled the laws. In his letter to the Romans, chapter 7:6, he stated, “But now we are discharged from the law, dead to that which held us captive, so that we serve not under the old written code but in the new life of the Spirit.”
Wasalam
Hana
Ohhh, ok, my mistake. I have been trying for many years to have it explained to me. If you understand it, please explain it to me. I would appreciate it very much.
Oh, and I should have posted this in my last reply and I didn't. I don't like to say things without showing the verses. I apologize for not posting it before but this should explain why I said you are going against what the bible says:
In Matthew 5:17-18, Jesus stated: “17 Think not that I have come to abolish the law and the [way of] the prophets; I have come not to abolish them but to fulfil them. 18For, I say to you, till heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the law until all is accomplished.”
However, Paul, who claimed to be a disciple of Jesus, systematically cancelled the laws. In his letter to the Romans, chapter 7:6, he stated, “But now we are discharged from the law, dead to that which held us captive, so that we serve not under the old written code but in the new life of the Spirit.”
Wasalam
Hana
PRISONERofJOY12
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MODERATOR'S COMMENT: THE TOPIC OF THIS THREAD IS THE TRINITY. COPY AND PASTING ALLEGATIONS AGAINST THE QUR'AN IS A CHEAP COP-OUT FROM A DEBATE. ALL YOUR ALLEGATIONS HAVE BEEN REFUTED HERE:
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/
http://www.islamic-awareness.org/Quran/Text/
Ghazi
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Salaam
PRISONERofJOY12 You asked about the errors in the bible and I've listed them so how come no reply
akulion
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I see you are not very well versed with History it seems.
You are the 1st person in History to be making these claims
There are no contradictions in the Quranic writings anywhere and I dont see you giving any evidence about your claims on these coins or anythig.
Also I think you need to watch the PBS documentary "Islam Empire of Faith" which is made by american non-muslim Historians and sociologists/anthropoligists and they tell the story of the Man who changed the world for the better And he is Mohammed (sa) not Jesus.
The Qibla was changed through the Quran - on one hand you can tell me Jesus abolished the old law and on the other hand you dont give me the comfort of saying "Quran aboloshid the Bible" ?
Thats double Standard..
Quite frankly with the advent of the Quran ... the bible became obselete
Oh and you completely failed to show me discrepencies IN the Quran
All you did was make claims ABOUT which you havent backed up with valid non-pro-christian / anti-Islamic sites or otherwise
You are the 1st person in History to be making these claims
There are no contradictions in the Quranic writings anywhere and I dont see you giving any evidence about your claims on these coins or anythig.
Also I think you need to watch the PBS documentary "Islam Empire of Faith" which is made by american non-muslim Historians and sociologists/anthropoligists and they tell the story of the Man who changed the world for the better And he is Mohammed (sa) not Jesus.
The Qibla was changed through the Quran - on one hand you can tell me Jesus abolished the old law and on the other hand you dont give me the comfort of saying "Quran aboloshid the Bible" ?
Thats double Standard..
Quite frankly with the advent of the Quran ... the bible became obselete
Oh and you completely failed to show me discrepencies IN the Quran
All you did was make claims ABOUT which you havent backed up with valid non-pro-christian / anti-Islamic sites or otherwise
TO LEARN MORE ON THAT ISSUE &MORE CONCERNING WITH ISLAM AND CHIRSTIANITY WHAY DONT WE REFER TO THOSE SPECIALIST
PLEASE IF U WANT TO LEAN MORE LOG ON THE FOLLOWING WEBS
www.ahmed-deedat.co.za/frameset.asp THERE YOU CAN FIND ALL YOU NEED BUT quıkly go to www.jamaat.net/deedat.htm
PLEASE IF U WANT TO LEAN MORE LOG ON THE FOLLOWING WEBS
www.ahmed-deedat.co.za/frameset.asp THERE YOU CAN FIND ALL YOU NEED BUT quıkly go to www.jamaat.net/deedat.htm
Ghazi
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dsfas
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Also, let me clarify a few things.
Jesus is not GOD, Reason for saying this:
1. God Is All Knowing.....But Jesus Was Not
When speaking of the Day of Judgement, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a limitation on his knowledge when he said, "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the son, but the Father." (Mark 13:32 and Matt. 24:36) But God knows all. His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own admission, did not know when the Day of Judgement would be, is clear proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not God.
2. God Is All-Powerful.....But Jesus Was Not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said, "Verily, verily I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do..." (John 5:19). Again he said, "I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgement is just; because I seek not mine own will but the will of the Father which has sent me." (John 5:30) But God is not only All-Powerful, He is also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his own admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus is not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.
3. God Does Not Have A God.....But Jesus Did Have A God
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was One whom he worshipped and to Whom he prayed when he said, "I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." (John 20:17). He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Matt. 27:46). If Jesus were God, then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself, why hast thou forsaken me?". Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord's Prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of Gethsemane he prayed, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless, not as I will but as thou wilt." (Matt. 26:36). Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.
According to the Bible, God is an invisible spirit....
4. But Jesus Was Flesh And Blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that this could not be done with God when he said: "No man hath seen God at any time." (John 1:18). "Ye have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His shape." (John 5:37) He also said in John 4:24: "God is a spirit and they that worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth." That Jesus would say that no one had seen or heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is clear proof that Jesus was not God.
NO ONE IS GREATER THAN GOD AND NO ONE CAN DIRECT HIM...
BUT JESUS ACKNOWLEDGED
SOMEONE GREATER THAN HIMSELF WHOSE...
5. Will Was Distinct From His Own
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not equal, and therefore not one and the same, comes again from the mouth of Jesus himself who said in John 14:28: "My Father is greater than I." When someone referred to him as a good master in Luke 18:19, Jesus responded: "Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is God..." Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions between himself and God when he said, "I proceeded forth and came from God, neither came I of myself but He sent me." (John 8:42) Jesus gave clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his equality with God, when he said in Luke 22:42, "not my will but Thine be done" and in John 5:30, "I seek not mine own will but the will of the Father which has sent me." That Jesus would admit that he did not come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do so, that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself, and that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the will of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One and therefore Jesus is not God.
Jesus sits at the right hand side of God's throne in heaven. He is not God, but God's son.
And the Holy Spirit was sent down after Jesus rose from the dead to be with the Christians. The Holy Spirit is what tells you that what youre doing is wrong, even though you dont know why you feel that its wrong. That sort of thing. I'll explain in more detail if you would like.
Jesus is not GOD, Reason for saying this:
1. God Is All Knowing.....But Jesus Was Not
When speaking of the Day of Judgement, Jesus clearly gave evidence of a limitation on his knowledge when he said, "But of that day and hour knoweth no man, no, not the angels which are in Heaven, neither the son, but the Father." (Mark 13:32 and Matt. 24:36) But God knows all. His knowledge is without any limitations. That Jesus, of his own admission, did not know when the Day of Judgement would be, is clear proof that Jesus is not all-knowing, and that Jesus is therefore not God.
2. God Is All-Powerful.....But Jesus Was Not
While Jesus performed many miracles, he himself admitted that the power he had was not his own but was derived from God when he said, "Verily, verily I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do..." (John 5:19). Again he said, "I can of mine own self do nothing: as I hear I judge: and my judgement is just; because I seek not mine own will but the will of the Father which has sent me." (John 5:30) But God is not only All-Powerful, He is also the source of all power and authority. That Jesus, of his own admission, could do nothing on his own is clear proof that Jesus is not all-powerful, and that therefore Jesus is not God.
3. God Does Not Have A God.....But Jesus Did Have A God
God is the ultimate judge and refuge for all, and He does not call upon nor pray to any others. But Jesus acknowledged that there was One whom he worshipped and to Whom he prayed when he said, "I ascend unto my Father and your Father, and to my God and your God." (John 20:17). He is also reported to have cried out while on the cross, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" (Matt. 27:46). If Jesus were God, then couldn't this be read, "Myself, myself, why hast thou forsaken me?". Would that not be pure nonsense? When Jesus prayed the Lord's Prayer (Luke 11:2-4), was he praying to himself? When in the garden of Gethsemane he prayed, "O my Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me: nevertheless, not as I will but as thou wilt." (Matt. 26:36). Was Jesus praying to himself? That Jesus, of his own admission and by his own actions, acknowledged, worshipped, and prayed to another being as God is clear proof that Jesus himself is not God.
According to the Bible, God is an invisible spirit....
4. But Jesus Was Flesh And Blood
While thousands saw Jesus and heard his voice, Jesus himself said that this could not be done with God when he said: "No man hath seen God at any time." (John 1:18). "Ye have neither heard His voice at any time nor seen His shape." (John 5:37) He also said in John 4:24: "God is a spirit and they that worship Him must worship Him in spirit and in truth." That Jesus would say that no one had seen or heard God at any time, while his followers both saw and heard him, is clear proof that Jesus was not God.
NO ONE IS GREATER THAN GOD AND NO ONE CAN DIRECT HIM...
BUT JESUS ACKNOWLEDGED
SOMEONE GREATER THAN HIMSELF WHOSE...
5. Will Was Distinct From His Own
Perhaps the clearest indication we have that Jesus and God are not equal, and therefore not one and the same, comes again from the mouth of Jesus himself who said in John 14:28: "My Father is greater than I." When someone referred to him as a good master in Luke 18:19, Jesus responded: "Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is God..." Furthermore, Jesus drew clear distinctions between himself and God when he said, "I proceeded forth and came from God, neither came I of myself but He sent me." (John 8:42) Jesus gave clear evidence of his subordination to God, rather than his equality with God, when he said in Luke 22:42, "not my will but Thine be done" and in John 5:30, "I seek not mine own will but the will of the Father which has sent me." That Jesus would admit that he did not come into the world on his own initiative but was directed to do so, that he would acknowledge another being as greater than himself, and that he would negate his own will in deference to affirming the will of another, give clear proof that Jesus is not the Supreme One and therefore Jesus is not God.
Jesus sits at the right hand side of God's throne in heaven. He is not God, but God's son.
And the Holy Spirit was sent down after Jesus rose from the dead to be with the Christians. The Holy Spirit is what tells you that what youre doing is wrong, even though you dont know why you feel that its wrong. That sort of thing. I'll explain in more detail if you would like.
Ghazi
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I agree he shouldn't have been banned we musn't give up on Dawa the phophet was assulted but yet he never gave up on people.
The prophet Mohammed had a neighbor who was a Jewish merchant and the Jew would throw his garbage on Mohammed's land every day, but Mohammed was patient and behaved well with him. One day the Jew did not throw his garbage in Mohammed's land so Mohammed went to see what was wrong and found the Jew with his son, who was sick and dying. So Mohammed told him, say 'there is no god but Allah'. So the son looked at his father, he is a Jew, what should he do? The father told his son to obey Mohammed."
I agree he shouldn't have been banned we musn't give up on Dawa the phophet was assulted but yet he never gave up on people.
The prophet Mohammed had a neighbor who was a Jewish merchant and the Jew would throw his garbage on Mohammed's land every day, but Mohammed was patient and behaved well with him. One day the Jew did not throw his garbage in Mohammed's land so Mohammed went to see what was wrong and found the Jew with his son, who was sick and dying. So Mohammed told him, say 'there is no god but Allah'. So the son looked at his father, he is a Jew, what should he do? The father told his son to obey Mohammed."
akulion
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I think that other guy got banned cos he was plagarizing from some site and just copying and pasting all the things
but dont know for sure
Copying and pasting things from anti-Islamic sites is against the rules of the board I believe
too many people keep doing it in the past
PLUS all of those areguments are already refuted in the refutations thread
but dont know for sure
Copying and pasting things from anti-Islamic sites is against the rules of the board I believe
too many people keep doing it in the past
PLUS all of those areguments are already refuted in the refutations thread
Last edited:
dsfas
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Was it in quotes or did he just copy/paste?
Does the website he copied it from have a copyright policy?
Plagarizing isnt that big a deal is it?
Will I get banned for hotlinking images?
Heres a hotlinked bible:
And also, just so I know, could someone please put up a list of all the anti-islamic websites? Okay, thanks.
:rant:
akulion
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lol no i believe the last post he made was edited by a mod i large red text
I and some other members had asked him to show us the errors in the Quran which he was claiming
And I came too late the post had already been edited but I think he just copied the whole --------- ----- website or something there lol
its crazy man!
I say always as Solomon(pbuh) said once:
Speech should be simple and silence is golden
The longer posts put me to sleepo
I and some other members had asked him to show us the errors in the Quran which he was claiming
And I came too late the post had already been edited but I think he just copied the whole --------- ----- website or something there lol
its crazy man!
I say always as Solomon(pbuh) said once:
Speech should be simple and silence is golden
The longer posts put me to sleepo
*Hana*
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Salam Alaikum:
Dsfas...what is with the attitude? Had you been part of this thread earlier you would realize this member was banned AFTER Islam-truth made his post. There is no need to call a brother an idiot.....especially when it comes back to bite you. Please show a little more respect and tact when you're posting.
Also, had you seen PrisonerofJoy's post, which you didn't because it was edited long ago, you would have understood what akulion was saying.
If you're looking for the most common anti-Islamic sites, I can only recommend you do what most of us have already done to be better prepared to respond to such comments.....research the net.
Since the originator of this topic has been banned, which I personally think was not the best option, this thread is now closed anyway.
I apologize if I offended anyone.
May Allah, swt, continue to guide us all. Ameen
Wa'alaikum salam
Hana
Dsfas...what is with the attitude? Had you been part of this thread earlier you would realize this member was banned AFTER Islam-truth made his post. There is no need to call a brother an idiot.....especially when it comes back to bite you. Please show a little more respect and tact when you're posting.
Also, had you seen PrisonerofJoy's post, which you didn't because it was edited long ago, you would have understood what akulion was saying.
If you're looking for the most common anti-Islamic sites, I can only recommend you do what most of us have already done to be better prepared to respond to such comments.....research the net.
Since the originator of this topic has been banned, which I personally think was not the best option, this thread is now closed anyway.
I apologize if I offended anyone.
May Allah, swt, continue to guide us all. Ameen
Wa'alaikum salam
Hana
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Erm, yes actually, it is.
Nope, because one can see the source of the image. It's not plagiarism if you cite the source - it's a reference. Plagiarism is where you try to pass off someone else's work as your own.
Try Private messaging a mod since posting links to such sites are against the forum rules.
dsfas
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I know what plagiarism is. I'm talking about hotlinking. Why isn't that against the rules?
Hotlinking could possibly land you in more trouble than copying and pasting content from the internet.
Hotlinking an image can/is considered bandwidth theft. Now this website (islamicboard.com) is stealing bandwidth from another website (cleanstream.net)
Not only is this bandwidth theft, but if the hotlinked site (cleanstream.net) were to run out of bandwidth, the owner of that website could simply check to see where his bandwidth went. This website would show up as stealing bandwidth.
If that situation were to arise, the owner of this website (islamicboard.com) is subject to theft charges and Denial of Service, which is very very serious. Denial of Service violations such as this one could result in up to six months in prison or up to a 10,000 dollar fine.
So, hotlinking is allowed, but copy/paste isnt? Funny.
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Yup - but thats a totally different topic.
Plus thats a rule on the site, so if you find some sort of rule which doesn't allow this site, from the cleanstream.net servers - then please tell us about it.
Now lets stick to the topic.
Plus thats a rule on the site, so if you find some sort of rule which doesn't allow this site, from the cleanstream.net servers - then please tell us about it.
Now lets stick to the topic.
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PrisonerofJoy has only been temporarily banned for 3 days, after which he will be allowed back on to this site. The reason for this was his constant evasion of debate by copying articles from other websites.
Seeing as we do not seem to have anything beneficial to discuss in his absence, this thread shall be closed until there is a need for its re-opening, Insha'Allaah.
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