Will economic development subdue Islam?

[Argamemnon]

Do you think that rapid economic development in the Muslim world will subdue Islam (to some extent) in the decades ahead? Or do you think we will (insha'Allah) be able to create a reasonable balance between worldly life and the Akhirah (Hereafter)?

I came across this claim in the following article:

"Visions of Europe in 2030

The Middle East will be integral to Europe's expanded sphere of influence in 2030. Though the Arab world will be more populous than Europe, its energy supply will be dwindling and its trade relationships ever more tied to European investment for large-scale production of manufactured goods from automobiles to solar-cells. Islam will remain a fractured faith, widely practiced, but also subdued by the impetus of economic development. Just as Europe bought off communism, it will purchase the reform of Islamism toward constructive, prosperous social democracy. North African Arab states will be ever more bound to Europe through natural gas pipelines, outsourced small-scale production, and agriculture. Sarkozy's present vision of a Mediterranean Union will indeed have blossomed into a resurrection of the Roman Empire -- with Brussels as its capital.

But this Europe of 2030 will not only be externally integrating its neighbors, but internally blending with them as well. The robust Ukrainian and Turkish populations will be ever more part of the European economic and social fabric, maintaining the empire's status as a manufacturing juggernaut. Arab migrants will remain a feature of Western European societies, but like the Turks of the late 20th century, become constructive diasporas advancing progressive social and micro-economic models through a free flow of capital and ideas with the West."

More: http://globalgovernance.newamerica....ions_europe_2030_postmodern_middle_ages_16153

 

[Lynx]

it's an interesting issue. A lot of economists and political philosophers would agree that the free-er the markets and trading the closer countries are to becoming like Europe/West. I personally think the more western culture is sold to these middle eastern countries, the less Islam will be able to thrive- as is happening now.

 

[Zafran]

Salaam

The free market doesnt realy help the majority - it actually helps the elites. Lets not forget about global warming and the problems of pollution which are effecting the planet thanks to the free market - this will definitly hinder the consumer based expansion of capitalism in the arab world. Are we also not forgetting about the reccession? how long will that last 5 years, 10 or 20?

so far Europe or even americas attempt in bringing there western views to the muslims has led to huge loss of life and trauma. They havent been trying to buy out the muslims - but bombing them to submission - it hasnt worked and I predict it wont in the future.

peace

 

[CosmicPathos]

Starting from colonization of Muslim lands by British, Dutch etc, the West has infiltrated into Muslim lands by using psychological tools. The youth back home has lost its mind and is obsessed with everything Western. Our generation and the oncoming generations dont give 2 cents to Islam ... its dying out slowly and slowly. Islam is suffocating in Muslim lands. The youth back home knows MORE about Western celebrities than I do while living in West .... They NOT only know more, they WANT to follow them. Not just celebrities but Tv hosts, fashions, trends, views, beliefs, life styles, dress

 

[Woodrow]

Economic development is a double edged sword. Used properly it can be a means to protect Islam. Misused it can become a false religion and lead the weak away from Islam.

We have to face the fact that economic development is now a fact and is here. We need to face that world governments are crumbling and rapidly being replaced by international Corporations. The corporate giants are now larger than most nations and because of their international structure, they are no longer the products of any nation, but are a separate entity. The entire Western civilization could disappear, and there will no change in terms of the threats and/or fitnah the Islamic world faces. The temptations of the Western world are not Western world temptations, they are the temptations offered by the international corporate structure and are alligned only with profit and not by nation.

Economic development is either a blessing or a curse, depending on if we use it or if we succumb to it.

 

[Lynx]

Salaam

The free market doesnt realy help the majority - it actually helps the elites. Lets not forget about global warming and the problems of pollution which are effecting the planet thanks to the free market - this will definitly hinder the consumer based expansion of capitalism in the arab world. Are we also not forgetting about the reccession? how long will that last 5 years, 10 or 20?

so far Europe or even americas attempt in bringing there western views to the muslims has led to huge loss of life and trauma. They havent been trying to buy out the muslims - but bombing them to submission - it hasnt worked and I predict it wont in the future.

peace

Well pollution is a little different because ownership and prices don't get really involved. Nevertheless I understand where the 'only elites benefit' sentiment comes from (though I disagree but that's off topic!). Why do you think Islam is not being bought out? The Western culture in conjunction with the spread of western goods on a global scale seem to me to be changing culture within Muslim countries to that of the Western culture and, though people may disagree, most people are Muslim (or followers of any religion) just because they are born into it; so imagine being born into a culture that's half American (where religion is largely on the sidelines)? I certainly believe that there are many righteous and devout Muslims who don't fall into this category but I am talking about the masses.

 

[Trumble]

It depends on what economic and social structure this 'rapid economic development' comes about in. Capitalism works so 'well', because it embraces and thrives on human greed and desire for material things, which are directly contrary to most religious values that are worth anything. Somehow, religion must overcome that, or a different social model be adopted.

 

[Argamemnon]

Starting from colonization of Muslim lands by British, Dutch etc, the West has infiltrated into Muslim lands by using psychological tools. The youth back home has lost its mind and is obsessed with everything Western. Our generation and the oncoming generations dont give 2 cents to Islam ... its dying out slowly and slowly. Islam is suffocating in Muslim lands. The youth back home knows MORE about Western celebrities than I do while living in West .... They NOT only know more, they WANT to follow them. Not just celebrities but Tv hosts, fashions, trends, views, beliefs, life styles, dress

Unfortunately you are right. There are hijabis in Turkey who celebrate Valentine's Day and have boyfriends. And people are obsessed with buying bigger homes and other stuff. I think eventually Islam will become like other religions, people will call themselves 'Muslim' while not knowing or practicing the very basics. But the good news is that we are only responsible for ourselves.

 

[Argamemnon]

The youth back home has lost its mind and is obsessed with everything Western. Our generation and the oncoming generations dont give 2 cents to Islam ... its dying out slowly and slowly. Islam is suffocating in Muslim lands. The youth back home knows MORE about Western celebrities than I do while living in West .... They NOT only know more, they WANT to follow them. Not just celebrities but Tv hosts, fashions, trends, views, beliefs, life styles, dress

I assume you are Pakistani (correct me if I'm wrong). I've always heard that Pakistanis are deeply attached to Islam. A Turkish journalist who had visitied Pakistan called it a "perfect Muslim country like Turkey used to be in the distant past". I guess he was a little too optimistic.

 

[FS123]

Economic development is a double edged sword. Used properly it can be a means to protect Islam. Misused it can become a false religion and lead the weak away from Islam.

We have to face the fact that economic development is now a fact and is here. We need to face that world governments are crumbling and rapidly being replaced by international Corporations. The corporate giants are now larger than most nations and because of their international structure, they are no longer the products of any nation, but are a separate entity. The entire Western civilization could disappear, and there will no change in terms of the threats and/or fitnah the Islamic world faces. The temptations of the Western world are not Western world temptations, they are the temptations offered by the international corporate structure and are alligned only with profit and not by nation.

Economic development is either a blessing or a curse, depending on if we use it or if we succumb to it.

Exactly my thoughts... well said uncle Woodrow... btw, I'm 28

 

[FS123]

Imo, it depends. In the past economic development helped Islam. But there are other trends that can come with it, I don't think it is directly related.

 

[Woodrow]

Exactly my thoughts... well said uncle Woodrow... btw, I'm 28

I am flattered to have you call me Uncle. Makes me feel young. I have 3 Grand Children about your age. All of my blood nephews are over 50 years old.

 

[Zafran]

Well pollution is a little different because ownership and prices don't get really involved. Nevertheless I understand where the 'only elites benefit' sentiment comes from (though I disagree but that's off topic!). Why do you think Islam is not being bought out? The Western culture in conjunction with the spread of western goods on a global scale seem to me to be changing culture within Muslim countries to that of the Western culture and, though people may disagree, most people are Muslim (or followers of any religion) just because they are born into it; so imagine being born into a culture that's half American (where religion is largely on the sidelines)? I certainly believe that there are many righteous and devout Muslims who don't fall into this category but I am talking about the masses.

A culture can be brought out - but Islam clearly isnt a culture - its much more then that - what makes us thing that western culture which is heavily materialistsic is actually going to "buy out Islam"? Buying western product doesnt mean that Islam is brought out.

I also made the elite argument because it has everything to do with this topic - If you look at who the west actually helps in the muslim world its the upper classes that share there views - nothing goes to the bottom guys or the majoirty.

 

[CosmicPathos]

Unfortunately you are right. There are hijabis in Turkey who celebrate Valentine's Day and have boyfriends. And people are obsessed with buying bigger homes and other stuff. I think eventually Islam will become like other religions, people will call themselves 'Muslim' while not knowing or practicing the very basics. But the good news is that we are only responsible for ourselves.

yes I am Punjabi Pakistani.

That journalist is being too optimistic. Pakistan is no where near Islamic. Rather, people are leaving Islam. Islam is more of a cultural thing for Pakistanis. That is why you will see in general that Pakistani youth criticize "wahhabis" and 'Salafis' as backwards. Moreover, the Pakistani youth is culturally Muslim. They pray Jummah but they have all the DVDs of all American TV shows such as Sex and the City, Lost, Prison Break, Friends. you just name it. Valentine is celebrated with great pomp and show. Pakistani educated youth (doctors, engineers) etc who have access to Western countries are ok with calling atheists, kaafirs, jews and christians "brothers and sisters." Pakistani ppl are okay with watching Hindu/Indian singers on tv. Pakistani ppl are OK with making "friendship with India." They are ok with giving message of "peace to India" while they know that Indian government has screwed them up time and time again.

Pakistani Muslim youth listens to Led Zeppelin, Pink FLoyd, Metallica, and all that. Pakistan has its own "Sufi rock" bands such as Junoon. Pakistan is big on ghazals and qawwalis.

yes some Pakistanis are really good Muslims. Note the word "some." We have the highest number of Muslim sects per capita. Deobandi, Sufi, Barelvi, Qadiani, Shia, Ahl e hadees, tableegi, Qurani etc etc

 

[Lynx]

Buying western product doesnt mean that Islam is brought out.

You aren't just buying products; you're buying a culture. That culture is replacing the Islamic culture. Don't underestimate how much religion is tied to culture. For many people they're one & the same. You don't actually think 1.5 billion Muslims around the world all sit there and study comparative religion...right? What do you think happens to newer generations of Muslims when they are born into western culture? Islam fades away.

 

[جوري]

You aren't just buying products; you're buying a culture. That culture is replacing the Islamic culture. Don't underestimate how much religion is tied to culture. For many people they're one & the same. You don't actually think 1.5 billion Muslims around the world all sit there and study comparative religion...right? What do you think happens to newer generations of Muslims when they are born into western culture? Islam fades away.

It depends.. people in my old country are more westernized than Muslims in the U.S.. I am not sure why this strange phenomenon is currently happening.. but do know that there was such a prophecy .. it is saddening that they seem to only pursue the worst of the west rather than the best of it.. subscribe to ART sometimes:
http://www.artonline.tv/eng_home/

it is very disappointing really and at times infuriating to watch..

all the best

 

[Zafran]

You aren't just buying products; you're buying a culture. That culture is replacing the Islamic culture. Don't underestimate how much religion is tied to culture. For many people they're one & the same. You don't actually think 1.5 billion Muslims around the world all sit there and study comparative religion...right? What do you think happens to newer generations of Muslims when they are born into western culture? Islam fades away.

again your trying to reduce Islam to a culture - as if Muslims have a homogenous culture around the world? and all of these cultures are being brought out by the west???

Muslims being born into a western culture are a minority anyway campared to the rest of the Islamic world - so your giving a minority example and applying it to the rest.

Muslims buy products made from China and Japan as well - are they know being effected by Chinese and Japanese Culture - last time I checked they Weren’t .

 

[Woodrow]

again your trying to reduce Islam to a culture - as if Muslims have a homogenous culture around the world? and all of these cultures are being brought out by the west???

Muslims being born into a western culture are a minority anyway campared to the rest of the Islamic world - so your giving a minority example and applying it to the rest.

Muslims buy products made from China and Japan as well - are they know being effected by Chinese and Japanese Culture - last time I checked they Weren’t .

America is very much affected by Chinese economics these days, nearly 1/3 of all American businesses are now owned by chinese and virtually everything bought in or exported from America is either made in china or has some Chinese made components. Many american products are are made from Chinese components and Assembled in Mexico, India or Pakistan

It is very rare to find any product actually fully made in the USA

 

[Zafran]

America is very much affected by Chinese economics these days, nearly 1/3 of all American businesses are now owned by chinese and virtually everything bought in or exported from America is either made in china or has some Chinese made components. Many american products are are made from Chinese components and Assembled in Mexico, India or Pakistan

It is very rare to find any product actually fully made in the USA

China also has the most dollers in reserve - its a very impoartant country now in the economic sphere. How much has this effected american culture?

 

[FS123]

I am flattered to have you call me Uncle. Makes me feel young. I have 3 Grand Children about your age. All of my blood nephews are over 50 years old.

Nice to know