Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina? (OP)
Hi guys, not sure if my type is welcome around these parts, but I thought I should ask:
Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina? I mean, from my limited knowledge of Islam, I understand that the Kaaba is located in Mecca, but I also understand that the Prophet spent a lot of his life in Medina, and even lived in Medina. So, is there any Quran verse that says it is more holier than Medina or Hadith?
15But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Crazy_Lady
^Allah doesn't live in a church or a house either, we also believe he's everywhere!
The main purpose of Makkah is so that people may worship Allah...
I didn't say God needed a house, I am just trying to point the flaws in his argument given the very nature of the god he worships and I'd love for him to explain the passage from his bible that I referenced!
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Supreme
... So, is there any Quran verse that says it is more holier than Medina or Hadith?...
Quran:3:96:The first house (of worship) appointed for men was that at Bakka (old name of Makkah): Full of blessing and of guidance for all kinds of beings
To Supreme,
u'll read in bible about "Abraham"/ "Abram" migrating with "Lot" when he was pointed by angels of a place... He came back later to build an "altar" at that place pointed by angels..... that's we believe was Kabbah in Makkah.... & Abraham re-built it on it's old long-lost foundations
= = = = =
[B]Genesis:12:.6:[/B] And Abram passed through the land unto the place of Sichem, unto the plain of Moreh. And the Canaanite was then in the land. 7 And the LORD appeared unto Abram, and said, Unto thy seed will I give this land: and there builded he an altar unto the LORD, who appeared unto him.
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Crazy_Lady
^Allah doesn't live in a church or a house either, we also believe he's everywhere!
The main purpose of Makkah is so that people may worship Allah...
I would like to add to this. Before the big bang, there was no time or space. After the big bang happened (out of no where a huge explosion that spread the matter...) the creation started to form. ..
Allah is separate from time and space. He is above it. His knowledge encompasses everything, that is how He is everywhere.
this is according to the true Ordhodox Islam:Evidence that Allaah is exalted high above His creation and that He is above the heavens
We don't know who God is or what God is. God revealed 99 names about Him( the most merciful, Fair etc..) The rest He hidd from us.
And I think I know what you are trying to accuse us of by turning to Kabba. It is just a direction in which we turn to pray. It forms a unity amongst the Muslims. The stone was stolen years ago, but still turned to that direction, that is a proof that the stone is not of much importance to us. As said by a hadeeth.
It would be very awkward for us to turn to our desired direction. When you go to chrch, don't you all turn to one direction?
I'd like to paste this by another forum: "what you should ask yourself is where did these beliefs come to the pagan Arabs from? As you know, both the Jews and the Arabs are descendants of Abraham. While the Jews were sent Prophets after Ibrahim AS (`Alayhis Salam - Upon Him Be Peace), the Arabs were not, until Muhammad PBUH (Peace Be Upon Him) came. In fact, the pagan Arabs knew about Ibrahim, and they considered him their father, and they claimed to follow Ibrahim's religion, but they had perverted the pure monotheism of Ibrahim with lots of idol worship and many other things.
Fasting, praying, and the Hajj were all done by Ibrahim in his true monotheistic faith. If you read the Quran, it tells us that it was Ibrahim and his son, who after building the Kaabah in Makkah, asked Allah to make it a House of Worship. Allah has answered Ibrahim's call magnificently, for today you see millions for Hajj, and billions praying facing the Kaabah around the world. (As a sidenote, the Kaabah was first actually built by Adam AS, but in recent history, it was rebuilt by Ibrahim).
As you know, all the Prophets were Muslims and they all followed Islam. When we fast during Ramadan, when we pray, when we do Hajj, we are doing and remembering the things that Ibrahim AS did.
So yes, of course there was a similarity between Arab pagan religion and the Islam that Muhammad PBUH brought. But this is not because Muhammad PBUH developed Islam from the paganism of the Arabs. It is because the Arabs developed their paganism out of the Islam of Ibrahim AS."
If you want to continue speaking about this, I can really refute you by the information I have from people who are very versed on this subject.
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Gossamer skye
Why do you have churches then and call them the house of God?
obviously your god not only needed a house but a womb and everything else that regular humans need or suffer!
all the best
Churches are congregations of people; indeed, church in its original meaning actually means the worlwide Christian congregation. The church 'building' is a place of worship, God has no home.
15But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth
Such is a metaphor; a church is referenced as a 'house' of God as it is believed His Spirit is amongst the worshippers in the church. Jesus Himself said: 20For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them."
Matthew 18:20
Therefore, it is not a house in the traditional sense of the word; rather, a confirmation that God lives wherever His followers worship Him.
u'll read in bible about "Abraham"/ "Abram" migrating with "Lot" when he was pointed by angels of a place... He came back later to build an "altar" at that place pointed by angels..... that's we believe was Kabbah in Makkah.... & Abraham re-built it on it's old long-lost foundations
I understand that Muslim belief places the Kaaba as an altar created by Abram; what I cannot concieve is how it is the 'house' of God.
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Supreme
Churches are congregations of people; indeed, church in its original meaning actually means the worlwide Christian congregation. The church 'building' is a place of worship, God has no home.
Are you a concrete thinker? Do you know what a metaphor is?
Such is a metaphor; a church is referenced as a 'house' of God as it is believed His Spirit is amongst the worshippers in the church. Jesus Himself said: 20For where two or three come together in my name, there am I with them."
Matthew 18:20
Oh so you do know what a metaphor is after all, or is this hypocrisy as you seem to be so ill read of your own good book?
Therefore, it is not a house in the traditional sense of the word; rather, a confirmation that God lives wherever His followers worship Him.
Your bible seems to suggest otherwise-- unless of course you'd like to take aspects of it that are incongruous with others out for it to have some semblance of sense and fluidity?
I understand that Muslim belief places the Kaaba as an altar created by Abram; what I cannot concieve is how it is the 'house' of God.
It can't be that difficult to conceive a metaphor, given what your mind has to make literal of the very nature of god, his life, birth and death..
all the best
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Supreme
Now my simple question is this: why does Allah need a house in the first place? In Christianity, we believe God to be everywhere. He doesn't need a church or a 'house' to live in, such an idea is blasphemous.
The Ka'bah, in Makkah, is a house that Allah ordered to be built dedicated to His worship.
Verily, the first House (of worship) appointed for mankind was that at Bakkah (Makkah), full of blessing, and a guidance for Al-'Alamin (mankind and jinn).
3:96
And when We made the House a pilgrimage for men and a (place of) security, and: Appoint for yourselves a place of prayer on the standing-place of Ibrahim. And We enjoined Ibrahim and Ismail saying: Purify My House for those who visit (it) and those who abide (in it) for devotion and those who bow down (and) those who prostrate themselves.
2:125
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by sur
Just to add to above...
We call all mosques/masjids as House of ALLAH... It's metaphorical.... NOT Literal....
It implies a place where we worship ALLAH...
& importance of KABBA is that it'a a place ALLAH has ordered us to face towards, when offering prayers...& to pay visit (pilgrimage) etc...
I understand, but the poster I was responding to said Medina was the house of Muhammed and Mecca was the house of Allah. Seeing as Medina is the literal house of the Prophet, one would assume by way of logic, seeing as the poster said Medina was the literal house of Muhammed, Mecca would also be the literal house of Allah. This is nothing but a gross misunderstanding, but seeing as the point of thie thread is to learn, not to get into pointless arguments, may I ask why Muslims face the Kaaba in prayer? I mean, I know the significance of the place, but I just don't understand why God only accepts prayers when the prayer is made facing a certain direction. I understand Judaism and Bahais have similar ideas of a Qibla, could anyone explain to me the thinking behind this? Thanks.
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Supreme
........may I ask why Muslims face the Kaaba in prayer? I mean, I know the significance of the place, but I just don't understand why God only accepts prayers when the prayer is made facing a certain direction. I understand Judaism and Bahais have similar ideas of a Qibla, could anyone explain to me the thinking behind this? Thanks.
We face towards KABBA because ALLAH has ordered us to do so...
In early days, Temporarily, ALLAH ordered Prophet Muhammad(pbuh) to face Masjid-e-Aqsa in Jerusalem, Palestine.... So muslims used to face in that direction...... KABBAH has been Kiblabefore -&- after this temporary Kibla....
While praying once... Prophet had revelation to turn his face towards KABBAh.... so he & companions turned towards KABBAh during prayer.....
===============================
At least one reason behind facing in one particular direction is "UNITY".....
just don't understand why God only accepts prayers when the prayer is made facing a certain direction
That's WRONG.... GOD accepts prayers irrespective of direction...
Direction is fixed ONLY for formal prayers that are offered 5 times a day.... other than those 5 formal prayers we can pray any time anywhere facing any direction....
Again keep in mind the difference b/w offering formal prayers (direction specified) & praying(direction non-specified)....
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by sur
We face towards KABBA because ALLAH has ordered us to do so...
In early days, Temporarily, ALLAH ordered Prophet Muhammad(pbuh) to face Masjid-e-Aqsa in Jerusalem, Palestine.... So muslims used to face in that direction...... KABBAH has been Kiblabefore -&- after this temporary Kibla....
While praying once... Prophet had revelation to turn his face towards KABBAh.... so he & companions turned towards KABBAh during prayer.....
===============================
At least one reason behind facing in one particular direction is "UNITY".....
That's WRONG.... GOD accepts prayers irrespective of direction...
Direction is fixed ONLY for formal prayers that are offered 5 times a day.... other than those 5 formal prayers we can pray any time anywhere facing any direction....
Again keep in mind the difference b/w offering formal prayers (direction specified) & praying(direction non-specified)....
Thank you very much for this answer. So it's unity. Another question- which is your personal favourite city out of Jerusalem, Mecca and Medina? I mean, I know how each ranks in holiness, but if you had a choice to become imam at either the mosque in Mecca, the Prophet's mosque and the al Asqa mosque, which would you choose and why?
Another question (for it is obvious this is a subject I have vested interest in)- you know the Cave of Hira where Muhammed first recieved the Quran- is that a Muslim holy place and is there a mosque on it/near it and do Muslims consider it especially holy?
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
Thank you very much for this answer. So it's unity. Another question- which is your personal favourite city out of Jerusalem, Mecca and Medina? I mean, I know how each ranks in holiness, but if you had a choice to become imam at either the mosque in Mecca, the Prophet's mosque and the al Asqa mosque, which would you choose and why?
Another question (for it is obvious this is a subject I have vested interest in)- you know the Cave of Hira where Muhammed first recieved the Quran- is that a Muslim holy place and is there a mosque on it/near it and do Muslims consider it especially holy?
For me its obivously mecca , its where i long to go . Yes cave hira is still there and many people visit that place. Well do muslims consider it holy ? no we consider it to be a precious place but not holy.As in we don't go there for pilgrimage.
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
Now my simple question is this: why does Allah need a house in the first place? In Christianity, we believe God to be everywhere. He doesn't need a church or a 'house' to live in, such an idea is blasphemous.
Yup.Exactly.Agreed(AboVE).We call it house of Allah because it is the place towards which we prostrate; Kaabah not because Allah lives.
And the house of Prophet means that its the central place of Prophet and he is also buried there.
Why would Allah live on earth when he is the Creator of Universe?
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
assalamalikum
allah does not need a house to live but as you see that if allah had not ordered hazrat ibrahim(a.s) then allah"s house would not have been built and we muslims would always face the bait-ul-muqadis and pray facing bait-ul_muqadis .allah only ordered his house to be built so that the muslims would be able to pray facing 1 direction not many directions .and making makkah the sacred city.he does not live in that house it is only and direction for us muslims
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
the cave of hira is a place where the prophet used to meditate and pray but as far as the holiness in considered and as far as the question of mosque arises.we may take few things into note.the cave is high up the mountain and not everybody is able to climb there and the cave only has a small place of not more then 2 people to stand .the mosque is not there but ofering two rakats naffil is optional and can be done .the place is an attraction for muslims and can be seen only for knowing the simplicity of the holy prophet .that place is not more then this..we respect that place and its nnot necessary to clim as u may hurt urself and hurting ur self could face u serious injuries so its optional.nothuing more then that
Re: Why is Mecca considered more sacred than Medina?
format_quote Originally Posted by Supreme
Another question- which is your personal favourite city out of Jerusalem, Mecca and Medina? I mean, I know how each ranks in holiness, but if you had a choice to become imam at either the mosque in Mecca, the Prophet's mosque and the al Asqa mosque, which would you choose and why?
Makkah - Peace felt there is like no other place
Another question (for it is obvious this is a subject I have vested interest in)- you know the Cave of Hira where Muhammed first recieved the Quran- is that a Muslim holy place and is there a mosque on it/near it and do Muslims consider it especially holy?
This is Cave Hira, It's on top of a massive mountain, therefore there are no mosques near it. It is considered holy, yes.
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