The following post in another thread spurs the question around which I hope we can focus discussion in this thread:
format_quote Originally Posted by Argamemnon
That depends on your definition of modernization of course. Islam has the ability to adapt to all ages and changes because it's the truth revealed by Allah. If modernization means changing the fundamentals of Islam (to please others or for whatever reason), then no. If modernization means correcting wrong beliefs and traditions, which were actually never part of Islam in the first place, but added later (which most Muslims are unaware of), then yes. But that's a seperate topic altogether.
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What do you think? Can Islam be modernized? Should it be? Is it wrong, and based on a false assumption, to suggest that it isn't already modernized?
Now to be clear, I'm not talking about technology or the difference between 1st and 3rd worlds. Nor am I focusing on politics nor any country's foreign policy, though I suspect some will see these things as tying in to the discussion. Rather, I am thinking in terms of ideas, especially those that emerged from what was known as the Age of Englightenment in Europe, such as: the rights of people to redress their government; the recognition of a public sphere in which discourse could take place, and the toleration of opposing views so as to allow for that discourse; democracy as a model for the adminstration of government.
One could expand this to include ideas that followed in what is less well-known as the Age of Modernity. Ideas such as the rights of workers to form together in unions; the equal status before the law of men and women; the equality of races; redistribution of both national wealth and political power to those who are without; education for the masses; that opportunity to advance one's self, to breathe clean air and drink clean water are also rights; that the natural world itself needs protecting from human exploitation.
My mistake I was thinking of Freyr (Fro Ingwe) is Freya's twin brother. He is the horned God of fertility, and has some similarities to the Celtic Cernunnos or Herne, although he is NOT the same being. He is known as King of the Alfs (elves). Both the Swedish and the English are said to be descendents of his. The Boar is his sacred symbol, which is both associated with war and with fertility. His golden boar, "Gullenbursti", is supposed to represent the daybreak. He is also considered to be the God of Success, and is wedded to Gerda, the Jotun, for whom he had to yield up his mighty sword. At Ragnarok, he is said to fight with the horn of an elk (much more suited to his nature rather than a sword.)
It's all very dungeons and dragons and very barbarically colourful. But my posts are getting deleted because I am not towing the line, so I should stick to Islam. Relatively speaking Islam is modern. The problem that the critics have is that Islam is not modern Western i.e. Zionist feminist Anglo American internationalist hegemony of warmongers and control freaks. In a nutshell The Beast. They do not want to destroy Islam but are trying to turn it to bow down to The Beast instead of Allah. Marxists have infiltrated the Catholic Church and the Marxist Pope has gone to Turkey to try to turn Islam the UN way.
Do you even know what a Marxist is? I of all people know this; anybody with 1 year of high school knows this.
If the Catholic Church was Marxist they would be giving food to the poor and ridding itself of the theistic elements. Why on earth would you bring up Greater Communism to a person who lives in a Lesser Communist country, Sweden.
You are making some really outrageous claims
Do you even know what a Marxist is? I of all people know this; anybody with 1 year of high school knows this.
If the Catholic Church was Marxist they would be giving food to the poor and ridding itself of the theistic elements. Why on earth would you bring up Greater Communism to a person who lives in a Lesser Communist country, Sweden.
You are making some really outrageous claims
Political systems evolve you know, like viruses. This Marxism is not the old textbook Marxism it is a New World Order Zionist form. The old form failed but the Reds had infiltrated the West. This form let's people do private business but the State is your master and controller and forever tightens the screws. You become a slave to a totalitarian global order.
Political systems evolve you know, like viruses. This Marxism is not the old textbook Marxism it is a New World Order Zionist form. The old form failed but the Reds had infiltrated the West. This form let's people do private business but the State is your master and controller and forever tightens the screws. You become a slave to a totalitarian global order.
Marxism has nothing to do with Zionism. I am a wishful Communist so I would know. You obviously have no clue of what Marxism is because in Sweden we have 3 Marxist parties and we have a bit of a reputation for Jew hating.
Karl Marx was a Jew. Most of the leaders of the communist movement and the atrocities perpetrated by the "Red Terror" were Jews. Sweden was a country ruled by pagan kings, later came Christianity and now it is a Zionist occupied government country. You are very mixed up as Norse pagans have kings not communism.
The Christian kings of Europe oppressed the Jews so they devised a plan to take it all down using this left wing madness, and it worked. Communism is anti kings and anti God. Hitler tried to liberate Europe from the Zionists but failed, so the Zionists have taken over the West. Now they are trying to take out Islam and the East.
The damage Adolf did brought down the British Empire and gave the world some breathing space.
Ignore Karl, he's a far-right conspiracy theorist. Some of the things he says are like right out of the Glenn Beck Conspiracy Generator.
I suppose you are another Scandinavian communist. How sad, once a land of great kings reduced to communist shills of the Zionist NWO. Are you a modern communist Muslim?
Really, in the same way as our science was perfect as stated in the science books 1400 years ago?
its not an accurate representation..
as always the answers are not so simple,
religion is not the same as observation and experimentation.. sure a person can use intellect and questioning to come to a conclusion about how the world works.
but religion is through revelation.
its based on something else.
the flip side of the argument is that gods will is always done and even though people blame the corrupt west, the west drives innovation and advancement that we all take for granted.
live in pain for a while and you wont mind taking the pills...
reality does make a person bitter... but it gives understanding.
it makes sure that a person grows from child to man... although not all men are created equal.
so i find it very difficult to label unbelief, especially when those that profess it bring much instability to the world and yet would not consider themselves wrong.
if they were to be given power, they would very much resemble the tyrants they oppose today...
they would become the wicked west that oppresses and conquers as it moves forward and only vests its interests into strengthening its own foundations...
they would be fools not to.
or would they be something that brings light and guidance to the world, selfless and merciful..
hands outstretched to be taken advantage of.
the world is not simple, but to claim naivety will just not work.
the truth is written on our faces and in our words.
if you were to have a perfect state for the masses,
it would include free healthcare.
subsidized living for the poor.
fair work treatment and minimum wage.
equal rights and representation.
in this respect, many western countries are way ahead of islamic countries... there may be exceptions, but not many.
BUT even if you did achieve a perfect islamic state, it would still not be heaven. there would always be conflict.. simply because it is the nature of man.
does religion improve with age as science does?
to be fair kkawohl1, islam is perfect.. seriously even with 1400 years of hindsight there is not much you could challenge of it, taken as a whole.
I suppose you are another Scandinavian communist. How sad, once a land of great kings reduced to communist shills of the Zionist NWO. Are you a modern communist Muslim?
I run over Zionists with my Communist giant missile parade.
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