first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil (OP)
[FONT="Verdana"][SIZE="2"]i think she is sooo amazing to stick to her guns and leave it on..allah will reward her for this..
32 mother , set to become first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
Refused to accept court sentence that she spend 15 days learning her civic duties
'Judges need citizenship lessons - not me'
Taking case to court of human rights
By PETER ALLEN
A 32-year-old mother from France is set to become the first woman ever to be sent to prison for wearing an Islamic veil.
Hind Ahmas refuses to accept the legitimacy of a Paris court which has ordered her to spend 15 days learning her civic duties.
She was sentenced by magistrates in Meaux, a Paris suburb, yesterday - after being arrested wearing an outlawed veil outside the Elysee Palace in the French capital on April 11.
Facing jail: Hind Ahmas, left, could be sentenced to two years in prison for wearing a banned Islamic head covering in France
That was shortly after Nicolas Sarkozy's government introduced a ban on all forms of Islamic head coverings, including the niqab and the burka.
Ahmas was not allowed into the hearing at Meaux Criminal Court because she refused to remove her face covering.
But prosecutors made it clear to her lawyer, Gilles Devers, that Ahmas now faces two years in prison and a £27,000 fine.
'There is no possibility of me removing the veil,' Ahmas said.
'I'm not taking it off. The judge needs citizenship lessons, not me.'
Ahmas, who has already refused to pay a fine of around £100 for wearing a veil on another occasion, intends to take her case to the European Court of Human Rights.
She has launched a pressure group, Do Not Touch My Constitution, along with Kenza Drider, another veil wearer who wants to run for president in the Spring.
New law: Ahmas, 32, pictured with would-be presidential candidate Kenza Drider, is taking her case to the European Court of Human Rights
If Ahmas does become the first woman in the world to go to prison for wearing a veil, then it will be seen as a huge propaganda coup for Islamic-rights campaigners.
Mr Sarkozy said the ban on head coverings was not aimed at persecuting Muslims, but merely to make France a more tolerant, inclusive society.
When it was introduced, he said the ban was aimed at stopping criminals – from terrorists to shoplifters – disguising their faces from security staff and CCTV.
But the sight of a young mother being led away to the cells merely because she refuses to take off her veil will cause outrage around the world.
Mr Devers said the veil ban was 'unconstitutional', while senior police officers have told judges that it is unenforceable without persecuting women.
France became the first country in Europe to outlaw the veil, while similar legislation has since been passed in Belgium and Holland.
One has been mooted in Britain by a number of politicians, including Conservative backbenchers, but there are no immediate plans to introduce one.
Ok thanks for the calm approach.
Yes the analogy was bad but my point is that you cannot simply go to a country and try to change the way of life there. If I was to go to a muslim country would you be happy with me trying to voice out my opinion to establish gambling, bars and brothels? of course not!
You are welcome,
Of course not, but have you tried understanding why? You see this is where we always conclude with a load of stuff that is a lie or make the other seem like they're completely messed up. why a certain country would not accept a city running with gambling, bars and brothels? The thing is we always fight and argue over such issues, but we never find a solution, if we only tried to listen to each other.
Here are a few reasons why such things would not be allowed, because they have no benefit to ones soul by gaining nothing, whereas there are permissible ways or alternatives. I'm sure one would argue, well it's 'fun', but what kind of fun is that? sleeping around with some stranger, getting drunk, waking up the next day and having no idea what you did the night before, or going around and wasting a load of money you could've spent on those who are in need, what benefit is there in wasting money? If you ask me I'd prefer to stick to the 'ban gambling' law rather 'permit gambling' into a society..
Here are alternatives, get married, give charity, do what's right for you and avoid the useless stuff, by benefiting yourself and those around you and much more.
Last edited by Ğħαrєєвαħ; 05-03-2012 at 06:58 PM.
"Allah! La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), Al-Hayyul-Qayyum (the Ever Living, the One Who sustains and protects all that exists).".."[Al Qur'aan 3:2]
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
Alrighty now I know how it is. I'm going to get banned because I'm voicing out my FREE opinion and you muslims hate it because I am a westerner. I am now assumed to be a troll because I have different beliefs, great can't wait to get banned.
It's not your country how would you like it if I came to your society and started drinking alcohol in public? Wouldn't like it would ya?
And we don't steal lands^.
Thats considered jaywalking in you country and is an arrestable offence... fail.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
It's not your country.
You presume much. Have you verified that no single member of this forum is a French citizen?
But let's presume for the sake of argument that none here is. Therefore?
Is there some cosmic law which states we are not allowed to have opinions or affect things going on in other countries? Does national sovereignty include being free to violate established basic human rights like freedom of religion?
If you think so, then you will practice what you preach and take no issue with the fact that certain Islamic countries ban conversion from Islam to Christianity.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
Alrighty now I know how it is. I'm going to get banned because I'm voicing out my FREE opinion and you muslims hate it because I am a westerner.
Well, I'm a westerner too, and white enough to qualify as a poster boy for the SS. And I'm voicing out free opinions from time to time too, but I'm mostly liked. Try being less presuming, try listening before dictating. A little humble pie gets you a long way.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
It's not your country.
Hi,
Who does it belong to then?
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
Alrighty now I know how it is. I'm going to get banned because I'm voicing out my FREE opinion and you muslims hate it because I am a westerner. I am now assumed to be a troll because I have different beliefs, great can't wait to get banned.[
I personally do not hate your opinion and hope you do not get banned. I like the exposure the Internet provides with different views. It's interesting.
It's not your country how would you like it if I came to your society and started drinking alcohol in public? Wouldn't like it would ya?
And we don't steal lands^.
I was born in Britain. This makes me a British citizen who happens to practice Islam. I have rights to express myself. Therefore, I'm allowed to advocate that I do not approve of alcohol and that it drinking alcohol in public should be banned. In this case, I'm simply taking advantage over the rights that have been granted to me.
Last edited by GuestFellow; 05-04-2012 at 05:13 PM.
I was looking at myself talking to myself and I realized this conversation...I was having with myself looking at myself was a conversation with myself that I needed to have with myself.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by Ğħαrєєвαħ
Here are a few reasons why such things would not be allowed, because they have no benefit to ones soul by gaining nothing, whereas there are permissible ways or alternatives. I'm sure one would argue, well it's 'fun', but what kind of fun is that? sleeping around with some stranger, getting drunk, waking up the next day and having no idea what you did the night before, or going around and wasting a load of money you could've spent on those who are in need, what benefit is there in wasting money? If you ask me I'd prefer to stick to the 'ban gambling' law rather 'permit gambling' into a society..
Obviously this is a culture clash so I will try my best to avoid offending people here.
In the western society bars are generally seen as a means of relaxation and it's acceptable here in the west. I am aware that every now and then some attendants do consume too much alcohol but you cannot ban alcohol because of this. There are bound to be stupid people breaking the barrier. Honestly I have no idea why drinking alcohol can be seen as sinful so long as it is done in moderation.
Gambling and Brothels I cannot say much since I actually do not gamble or visit brothels myself however I do admit gambling addiction is a huge problem in our society and I definetely would not mind strict limitations to help people not gamble their future away.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa
You presume much. Have you verified that no single member of this forum is a French citizen?
No I thought all Muslims in Europe were immigrants.
format_quote Originally Posted by Futuwwa
Is there some cosmic law which states we are not allowed to have opinions or affect things going on in other countries? Does national sovereignty include being free to violate established basic human rights like freedom of religion?
Look at the culture clashes between Islam and the West.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
No I thought all Muslims in Europe were immigrants.
Then you've learned something new today. Congrats.
But beside that, immigrants tend to get citizenship eventually. After which an immigrant is legally a full and equal member of society, a shareholder in the state, not a guest under any obligation to give the hosts the right of way.
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
Look at the culture clashes between Islam and the West.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
Greetings of peace,
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
In the western society bars are generally seen as a means of relaxation and it's acceptable here in the west. I am aware that every now and then some attendants do consume too much alcohol but you cannot ban alcohol because of this. There are bound to be stupid people breaking the barrier. Honestly I have no idea why drinking alcohol can be seen as sinful so long as it is done in moderation.
I'm sure your aware that in the present day (and past) alcohol has caused numerous harms to the society.
Is that saying that there are no other ways of relaxation? I'm very sure you don't need alcohol to relax, as their are plenty of alternatives.
It's not a really a clash of cultures, probably religion and culture , it's people who drink it out of choice, a matter of choice, matter for individuals to decide upon for themselves.
One of the reasons it is sinful as it has more harm than good. By allowing alcohol, who's gonna stop the crazy ones? it's not gonna stop them is it? Or the amount of harm it causes to the body, here you have another reason to do so and maybe more.
Do you know the amount of harm that would be avoided if it ever was? Ever ponder upon that?
Fact is as we all know well, is that it has done more harm than good, otherwise there wouldn't be a limit to how much one should take, it still remains a drug and a great addiction at that.
However, this may just be an opinion of mine, so feel free to disagree all you want.
"Allah! La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), Al-Hayyul-Qayyum (the Ever Living, the One Who sustains and protects all that exists).".."[Al Qur'aan 3:2]
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by UnitedStates#1
In the western society bars are generally seen as a means of relaxation and it's acceptable here in the west. I am aware that every now and then some attendants do consume too much alcohol but you cannot ban alcohol because of this. There are bound to be stupid people breaking the barrier. Honestly I have no idea why drinking alcohol can be seen as sinful so long as it is done in moderation.
Alcohol is the main reason why there is a high crime rate in Britain.
I was looking at myself talking to myself and I realized this conversation...I was having with myself looking at myself was a conversation with myself that I needed to have with myself.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
We must remember France has put a ban on all religious symbols, not just the hijab, but the hijab has recieved the most publicity. I can understand the country's antipathy towards religion and they've had issues with it since the revolution, but how does banning people from expressing their religion make you any better? Let's hope something is done for this woman.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by LauraS
We must remember France has put a ban on all religious symbols, not just the hijab, but the hijab has recieved the most publicity. I can understand the country's antipathy towards religion and they've had issues with it since the revolution, but how does banning people from expressing their religion make you any better? Let's hope something is done for this woman.
So I can't go into a bank with a motorcycle helmet but a woman with a burqa can?
If a police officer is trying to identify who I am I can simply put on a Burqa and claim that it would be "racist" to be pulling it off?
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
what happened to the wests claim that they give freedom to people??? where's the freedom? truly this is an attack on all civilized people and all civilized people regardless of religion should protest against this. In the West women are supposed to have the right to wear what they want !
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by Haafizah
She is the daftest woman I have ever seen. Seriously. When the hijab is banned, why wear it and put yourself in Jail?! How dumb.
AsSalaamu Alaaykum sis,
So sister's should stop wearing hijaab?
"Allah! La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), Al-Hayyul-Qayyum (the Ever Living, the One Who sustains and protects all that exists).".."[Al Qur'aan 3:2]
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by Ğħαrєєвαħ
AsSalaamu Alaaykum sis,
So sister's should stop wearing hijaab?
I think sister Hafizah is talking about niqab not hijab.
format_quote Originally Posted by Haafizah
She is the daftest woman I have ever seen. Seriously. When the hijab is banned, why wear it and put yourself in Jail?! How dumb.
My sister Haafizah, I hope you don't mind if I had a slightly different opinion here :
being jailed for your religion is not dumb.
Such people who face trials are the only front of defense of Islam.
If every muslim thinks only about his personal safety and doesn't make sacrifice for this religion, then nothing will remain, because the enemies of Islam think and also want us to think that every part of Islam is not necessary and is not the "basics of Islam", until we abandon all the deen.
We have the right to personally seek our safety. But if we see someone sacrifice for his deen, we should honor him and encourage him. Because he is defending all of us.
Personally I think this women is more courageous than a lot of men. And if there is only one beneficial thing about what she did, it would be that she let all the world know about this unjustice in Europe (political and intellectual unjustice).
Now about the full face veil, let us remember that, no matter anti-muslims make stupid arguments about how it is not practical and dangerous, let us keep in mind that it's part of Islam. Not a fundamental, but defending niqab means defending islam against future agressions.
From an Islamic perspective, some Ulama' see niqab/burka (full veil) as Wajib(obligatory) and they have their respectable daleels and arguments, other Ulama' see it's not Wajib. But ALL OF THEM see it as Mustahab(recommanded). Some sisters chose niqab and they understood that it's obligatory for them to do. That's their personal freedom, and their legal understanding of hijab that no one can affirm they are wrong or doing something unnecessary, because they took a strong opinion supported by a lot of Ulama'. Therefore, no one can prevent them from practicing their religion the way they do.
Re: first woman to be jailed for wearing banned Islamic veil
format_quote Originally Posted by WRITER
In the West women are supposed to have the right to wear what they want !
Supposedly, but not if you're a Muslim it seems.
format_quote Originally Posted by Haafizah
She is the daftest woman I have ever seen. Seriously. When the hijab is banned, why wear it and put yourself in Jail?!
To stand up for what you think is right, to show that you will not be oppressed, will not give in, will not stop practising what some deem to be a necessary practice of our faith just because they say it's wrong, to expose their so-called freedom that cannot tolerate a piece of cloth, to show that we will fight to wear it and so we are not forced to wear it.. etc...
Stunningly beautiful adhaan from the Dome of the Rock in Masjid ul Aqsa Download (right click and choose "save target/link as").
This is a clear message for mankind in order that they may be warned thereby, and that they may know that He is only One God, and that those of understanding may take heed (14:52)
Indeed Allah knows, and you know not (16: 74, part)
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