US attacks Syrian Army

format_quote Originally Posted by anatolian

America wants to invade Syria and have the control of all those oil pipe lines. Russia doesn't want to fall behind that too. And other countries either take one side or other side have the same issue. This is the reason why have all those pain in Syria. No one cares if children are dying because of phosphorus gases over there.

WW1 happened because the partitioning of oil lands. WW2 was a revenge of WW1. So WW3 seems to be on road because of the same thing. Oil..And it will start from Syria but will spread all over the world. If you follow the news you can see NATO (America) are shipping lots of weapons and personnel in Germany and Baltic countries belong to Nato. Russia is doing the same in the nearby countries nowadays.

So do explain what Turkey is doing in NATO? Why haven't the already left? If they are truthful. This dishonest behavior of Turkish government makes them no better than US itself.

@noraina

No,Ukht!

Read Ahadeeth on Khilafah of Mahdi!
It's coming-,so be hopeful!

Things will change&tyrants will be brought down!

Don't be so sad,it's going to be grand victory!

format_quote Originally Posted by anatolian

Turkey entered to it becuase of the "Soviet thread" long time ago. Turkey has a geostrategic importance. I am totally against it though. I have no idea why we are in it anymore. As you know nowadays Erdo tries to build good relations with Russia and bad with the US and EU.

Well don't look at it from that perspective, because it really doesn't seem like it and i am not saying it because i am a Kurd. Just a observer looking at how things are going.

Erdogan is trying to eat from both plates, however the longer he does that, the bigger the issue becomes. In other words this issue being Turkey becoming a failed state. As US and Russia both superpowers and both at the different end of the national interests, they will not tolerate if at the end he is choosing one side. It is like the letter "V". Erdogan right now is you could say half way down up. The further he eats from both parties, the further both parties split and Turkey also splitting. Erdogan's play has NOTHING to do with PKK or YPG. Let me give you what i base this on.

Turkey objects Iraqi Kurdistan’s plans to hold independence referendum: http://ekurd.net/turkey-objects-kurd...dum-2017-04-01
Turkey’s Erdogan warns Iraqi Kurd ties at risk over Kurdish flag in Kirkuk : http://ekurd.net/erdogan-warns-kurd-kirkuk-2017-04-04

Read both the articles and tell me what PKK or YPG has to do with KRG (Kurdistan Regional Government? The ONLY thing they both have in common one could say is they want both independence and both are Kurds. That's it. So if a people wants independence, what are you to say they cannot be independent from you? Do explain. Also about the second article, what has Turkey to do with Kirkuk? Just because some Turkmen live there? Well about 30 milion Kurds live in Turkey can we also object? So you see all i see is hypocrisy. His actions do NOT contain ANY Islam. All power, greed, control.

I believe Erdogan will be the case for Turkey to fall. Right now, Kurds are uniting more and more because of Erdogan and Turks are dividing more and more because of Erdogan. Nationalism isn't working anymore. It is becoming like Muslims now a days. Everybody is shouting Islam and saying my Islam is the right Islam while killing each other over it. Turks will do the same with nationalism. Gulen-supporter will attack Erdogan supporters and Kemalists will attack Erdogan supporters while Erdogan supporters will attack both of the group. Gulen-supporters don't like Kemalists and Kemalist don't like Erdogan nor Gulen. Not one of those groups likes the other. Then you also have the Armenians and also the Kurds. The Kurds a great part supported HDP and took distance from PKK. However those HDP-supporters ALSO saw that Turkish government doesn't want any way. Through politics ..well we see how HDP is being treated. So HDP-supporters will even more be heading towards PKK and supporting PKK more. If this happens, then you can see the fall of Turkey with support either from US or from Russia. If Turkey chooses Russia, US for SURE will support PKK with anti-air weapons and anti-tank weapons. If Turkey goes with US, Russia for sure will support PKK with anti-air weapons and anti-tank weapons. IF Turkey goes for Russia, IT IS EVEN in the interest of Russia that Turkey falls. Current Russia is heading more towards Orthodox Christianity so they have not forgotten about Constantinople and Hagia Sophia. Which Constantinople is also a very strategic point to have control over ..so they can have the door to the black sea.

The Turks have already become divided in to three groups, so the Kemalists will not mind and the Gulen-supporters will not mind if Erdogans version of Turkey falls. However when it falls, it will not flourish again. If we look at all of this and all we can see is for sure Turkey will fall, just matter of time, it also fits the picture of Islamic Eschatology(end times). We know of hadith that Turkey will also be part of the chaos with malhama (the big war). If you disagree, i would for sure want to know what i have missed or wrongly analyzed. Please don't bring nationalism in and the believe of "Turkey will never fall" based on nationalistic tendencies. I follow logic, rationality and reason.

Most of what people say are out of mere assumption.

Allah is the best of planners and none can override his will.

We are all in his need and we should seek his guidance

Can you guys chill out everything on your television is propaganda and you should avoid the big propaganda (the news) and you can move into small propaganda and just watch that (spongebob square pants) yes I am saying spongebob has propaganda in it everything does because humans naturally copy what they see so if you watch some show or the news your gonna agree since your not right next to them and don't have the freedom to disagree only watch stuff on the tv if you know your not gonna get brain washed and I honestly suggest just getting rid of it and I guess if you really need it then watch movies somtimes not too often but don't get attached to television I'm not saying everything is bad for you it's just telivsion you don't have control over what they feed you you don't right the script and the script may Contain things like promoting zina after I stopped watching tv my ego has became smaller and it takes less to make me laugh and I'm just happier my suggestion is stay out of the news and if you like politics than don't base your opinion on one side research both sides and then what ever is best join that opinion and never get angry during debates listen to the other side and if they're wrong prove them wrong and if you think they're wrong but you don't have any proof just say somthing like hmm interesting but most likely If you don't have proof behind your own logic but the other person has proof behind his then he's most likely right

format_quote Originally Posted by Bobbyflay23

Can you guys chill out everything on your television is propaganda and you should avoid the big propaganda (the news) and you can move into small propaganda and just watch that (spongebob square pants) yes I am saying spongebob has propaganda in it everything does because humans naturally copy what they see so if you watch some show or the news your gonna agree since your not right next to them and don't have the freedom to disagree only watch stuff on the tv if you know your not gonna get brain washed and I honestly suggest just getting rid of it and I guess if you really need it then watch movies somtimes not too often but don't get attached to television I'm not saying everything is bad for you it's just telivsion you don't have control over what they feed you you don't right the script and the script may Contain things like promoting zina after I stopped watching tv my ego has became smaller and it takes less to make me laugh and I'm just happier my suggestion is stay out of the news and if you like politics than don't base your opinion on one side research both sides and then what ever is best join that opinion and never get angry during debates listen to the other side and if they're wrong prove them wrong and if you think they're wrong but you don't have any proof just say somthing like hmm interesting but most likely If you don't have proof behind your own logic but the other person has proof behind his then he's most likely right

I have stopped watching tv since 2013. Now almost 4 years later to even observe myself I see things and I see connections that I would usually not see. Not based because I want that to be the truth but based on logical explanation. TV prevents you to stop for a second and digest what has happened.

To give you a better example. When TV is reporting something it takes about let's say 10 minutes for the news to end. During those 10 minutes certain different topics are being discussed. You listen to all those topics before going an trying to analyze the new information. When you read a news article..somewhere even in the middle of the news article you can stop and digest what you have learned..ponder a bit then read it again and read the whole article again..read sometimes the comments of somebody has information that can further analyze the article based on logic, rationality and reason. This I have found with many things even movies or even a lecture..reading a book about the same stuff is much more beneficial than listening only to lectures. As book might contain more information and don't contain useless information such as the one talking making a joke to keep your attention.

So my argument would rather be even if you follow propaganda read it instead of listening it or watching it. That way more can be analyzed. Although the essential thing is to think for yourself and question things..why this and why that.

format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya.

That's the logical side of it, like you've already stated. (1) But if there is already evidence of the Assad regime being responsible for this, we don't have to further discuss this. (2) Many media outlets and investigation organizations hold them from being responsible. So, (3) you must have a counter-evidence/fact to this, in order to deny their involvement, right?

(1) This evidence that they are responsible for this, i haven't seen this or even presented to me. I would love to go through, it. However till now the SAME reaction has been given by US like US did with Iraq and WMD. I DON'T go by ..well X has evidence and i just have to trust him telling me the truth, while not showing it to me. Again, is Assad a dicator? Without a doubt. Do i defend him? Absolutely not. Why am i saying this? Truth is truth, no matter who says it..that is why i bring up this argument. We also know of a hadith that Rasullah(saws) replied about a man appearing trying to do something to a shahabi (very bad with names), later on being iblies. In that reply Rasullah(saws) said, although he is a liar, he spoke the truth. In other words, just because X has said this or done this, you do not involve the history in to this. Every case is independently analyzed. One might say..well i did bring up US with 2003 and Iraq and WMD. Well the SAME attidute is being applied right now. In other words, we do not need to investigate, just immediately retaliate..

(2) According to media, you are a ISIS supporter, because you say you are a Muslim. According to media, you are going to blow yourself up. So i guess according to YOUR perspective of "many media outlets" police should put you in jail . I do not go by what media tells me. I go by facts and facts tell me something else. Also "investigation organizations", well bro..right now US shot first before asking questions..where is this investigation organization? A investigation as shallow as based on hours..that is rather one sided and not making sense, you hold that in very high regard. That is very illogical by it self isn't it?

(3) Point 1 and point 2 you tried to make are based on subjectivity with very strange way of handling things. To say X has done this a certain investigation needs to take place before firmly confirming it. To give you a easy example. Gulen is being branded as the one behind the coup of Turkey. However within such a small time scale he was branded as being the one behind the coup. Within a week or so A LARGE amount of people belonging to Gulen organization were suddenly being gathered. Sorry bro, but such a list, needs time to be worked out and it all points out as if this has been done before the coup in other words coup being a false flag to have "reason" to remove gulen supporters from high places. So again, bring your proof first, before we can say ..look at this counter-evidence. Btw, i don't like Gulen, Gulen or Erdogan or Kemalist..all just nationalistic people. Don't care about Islam, rather are using it to gain power. So i am not defending Gulen based on that i like him, because i don't. But truth is truth, no matter what.

format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya.

If, let's say, there is no clear evidence and we have to discuss it logically; the strategy of the Assad regime and Russia is to make pressure on the rebels to give up the war, by causing maximal damage on civilians, and and thus breaking their will to support the revolution. And this may also intend to increase the international contra-war (revolution) stance -instead of emphasizing on the crimes of the Assad regime- and in this way try to force the rebels to hand over their weapons and accept a peace treaty (compromise) with the regime, the goals of revolution and jihad being unfulfilled. As they had already used chemical weapons in Ghouta in 2013, and not much was undertaken against Assad since then. And this one-time US strike on one Assad had no impacts on deterring Assad either.

The war has been going on for about 6 years. There is no end to it. Even peace talks that were suppose to be the road to peace and surrender or whatever you call it, did not show any results. The question is why? Do the rebels want to keep on going this fight? Based on humanity and psychology i think MANY have grown tired of war. Again based on human psychology that many would rather want the country to separate in different parts instead of let the war going on. Human psychology does not permit to live under oppression when actively fighting against it has started. In this case it has. So two ways out of it, Assad gone, or let Assad have it's own land and divide Syria. However again, WHY isn't this being applied? Well in case of Assad being removed, Russia and Iran clearly object to this. As their interests would be compromised. So another reason would be, why not divide it then? Well all i can conclude so far is that Gulf states, Turkey and NATO don't want that. However this would be peace for the people living there right? I mean no Assad ruling over them, so what do they more want?

Btw, i have never heard or somebody concluded to me that back in 2013 Syrian Army has used those chemical weapons. I may be wrong, but till this day i have had no evidence that pointed out that Assad was the one doing that. Also US has already said there is a possibility they will keep on going attacking Syrian Army.

format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya.

(4) And b.t.w. the naval base is in Tartus, brother, not Tartar I respect your opinions, as you just have different perspective, but don't support the Assad regime in general. (5) But just be (particularly) careful when watching RT, as they are doing nothing else than spreading Russian propaganda, just like Sputnik. I can't stand their provocative language and news-reporting, but it's good to be aware of the counter-opinion.

(4), thanks for correcting me. I am very bad with names in general. Being peoples names or names of certain places that i do not use often.

(5), RT and Sputnik give certain news that i think about and ask questions. Their objective is to show as much as possible anti-western news. So WHY do i watch these news outlets? Because i want to know what THOSE governments are up to, as often what is going on in the west is NOT being showing in media in general. I have watched western media, but all they tell you is that some old grandma hit another car with her car in city X. Is this for real? I mean seriously is this so news worthy to know? The day i woke up to this was that seriously during morning news they said in Miami as police boat turned the boat so quick that it hit another boat when turning...and this news channel is one in Europe. So you see..what in the world would benefit me ..living in Europe that a police boat in Miami hit another boat when turning. That was the day that i started asking question of what is going on.

I have even tried to have RT + sputnik + BBC + Reuter and other news outlets. However you see a HUGE difference between them. RT for example gives you direct sources where they have based their news on. I had NEVER experienced this in my entire life. Sputnik does something similar. Reuter tells you a story. Person X met Person Y and he said hello. No references to it..no video evidence..no nothing. BBC and other news outlets..well they just by majority tell you stories like a cat in city X has been rescued by the fire department. I mean seriously if this isn't trying to get your attention away of what is going on..then i don't know anymore. So there is a reason i follow RT and Sputnik. Maybe if you have some similar news outlet that CLEARLY give their sources they used in their news article. I have also seen lately that US government more wants to restrict RT and Sputnik. This even MORE confirms to me, that they are afraid. I mean there are tabloids they are saying what they want to say. Nobody is trying to stop them. However if US governments is trying to restrict RT and Sputnik while shouting free speech, this even MORE confirms to me that i should watch RT and Sputnik as clearly some of the things are being revealed that they don't want you to know. This logic for example can be applied how media is attacking Islam. Clearly they don't want people to start investigating Islam and becoming Muslim. So do share what you use and i will in'sha'Allah react based on logic, rationality and reason if it is a good news outlet or not.

format_quote Originally Posted by Yahya.

It would be of benefit if Turkey made an offensive against the left-extremist, communist, nationalist YPG, but all over the Euphrates Shield operation, they exclusively conquered territory from IS. You may be right in saying that Turkey is nationalist and secular, but I don't think they are expansionist, as they leave great authority by handing over the administration to rebels, who then allow local councils elected by the people to rule the liberated areas.

They are not expansionist? Hmm.. according to UN international law..if you believe in it..although i myself see it as a criminal aka mafia organization. Forgotten about Cyprus? According to those rulings, Turkey has illegally settled there. Another thing, ISIS has had been there since mid-2014 one could say. However suddenly when YPG conquered the territory that ISIS was having borders with Turkey. Turkey had to intervene. So ISIS is oke..but YPG is not oke? What happened to Islam? YPG, although i am a Kurd myself, i say i 100% agree with you nationalistic group NOTHING to do with Islam. However all i see is Turkey EXACTLY doing the same. So i say A(YPG nationalistic people and should not be supported) and after that i say B (Turks nationalistic people and should not be supported). Are you willing to also say the same? This is the cross roads of hypocrisy if you do not willing to say the same.

I am proud to say i have never had a TV since the 80s when i left home at 17, i have lived in houses with a TV for short enough periods in my life..

One of these times was when Syria was accused of assassinating a Lebanese politician with a bomb in Lebanon, there was no investigation just condemnation, It was major head lines for a few days, five or ten minuets dedicated to this story alone for a few days, this 'huge' demonstration against the Syrian army 'occupying' Lebanon, there were a good few thousand people waving identical flags refusing to leave until Assads army left Lebanon..
A few days later there was a Pro Syrian demo in the same Square, hundreds of thousands, the biggest demo in Lebanon's history completely dwarfing the other demo..It got a minuets mention at the end of the main newsAnd we know why, because the Syrian army kept Israel at bay.

Within a year of this Israel invaded Lebanon and destroyed Gaza..

Its obvious enough Assad is bad (as are all governments), and the revolution started as quite a popular movement, but soon enough i think Syrians realized the Zionist backed alternative was going to be much worst..There is good reason peaceful democratic solutions are not pushed for here by the international community..The people of the region hate the Zionists more than Assad.

Regarding the YPG, is it fair to say they are nationalists? they are claiming to want stateless society with local democratic autonomy, not the same as traditional Nationalism is it? Complete opposite.

format_quote Originally Posted by beleiver

I am proud to say i have never had a TV since the 80s when i left home at 17, i have lived in houses with a TV for short enough periods in my life..

One of these times was when Syria was accused of assassinating a Lebanese politician with a bomb in Lebanon, there was no investigation just condemnation, It was major head lines for a few days, five or ten minuets dedicated to this story alone for a few days, this 'huge' demonstration against the Syrian army 'occupying' Lebanon, there were a good few thousand people waving identical flags refusing to leave until Assads army left Lebanon..
A few days later there was a Pro Syrian demo in the same Square, hundreds of thousands, the biggest demo in Lebanon's history completely dwarfing the other demo..It got a minuets mention at the end of the main newsAnd we know why, because the Syrian army kept Israel at bay.

Within a year of this Israel invaded Lebanon and destroyed Gaza..

Its obvious enough Assad is bad (as are all governments), and the revolution started as quite a popular movement, but soon enough i think Syrians realized the Zionist backed alternative was going to be much worst..There is good reason peaceful democratic solutions are not pushed for here by the international community..The people of the region hate the Zionists more than Assad.

Regarding the YPG, is it fair to say they are nationalists? they are claiming to want stateless society with local democratic autonomy, not the same as traditional Nationalism is it? Complete opposite.

Well again as a Kurd myself and see YPG, or PKK or PDK or PUk or PJAK or Gorran..whatever party do something, i follow Islamic way of living. However also as a Kurd, what i have seen is oppression. So the parts that Kurds live, i will NEVER say YPG must not conquer those parts. Those part simply belong to the Kurds and if Kurds living there agree that YPG in THEIR name can represent those place, i say i'm all good. Am i pro YPG? absolutely not, as they represent rather no Islamic way of life. However if they let people practice what they want to practice, better that than living under a dictator.

If there is another group that tries to occupy certain territories that Kurds live and the Kurds are also happy with that group, i say again, i am all good. So if let's say Syrian Army or Free Syrian Army would represent certain part and it is full of Kurds but the Kurds are happy and satisfied and don't feel oppressed. Well it is THEIR choice and i have NOTHING to do with it. So i am all good.

However right now Turkey isn't doing that. Among Kurdish regions in Northern Syria, there are people that are happy that YPG or SDF is representing them, while being Arab or Turkmen. Who am i to say..no i object to that? The people are happy with who is controlling the territory so i have NOTHING to say about it.

An example to this is in Cyprus. I was watching a documentary a few years ago and the Turkish Cypriots they saw Greek Cypriots as their brothers and NOT the Turks going there and inhabiting the place. I was kind of shocked. One of the Turkish Cypriots said, all we have in common with the Turks is the language, NOTHING else besides that. So if those people themselves are NOT happy with Turks being there, who am i or whoever it might be to say well not Turkey must occupy those territories.

That is why Islamic law cannot be applied to ANY place if the people themselves don't want it even though by majority saying they are Muslims. The hearts of the people need to be conquered first, before the people wanting you to represent them. This till now i have seen with parts of northern Syria that they are happy with YPG representing them.

Turkey however objects this. Why? Again..NOTHING has to do with YPG being part of PKK or so. They hate the Kurds to the core, as they even object Kurds (KRG - Kurdistan Regional Government) in northern Iraq to go their own in referendum for independence. Even just recently the Turks were FIERCELY against Kurdish flag being hung on Ataturk airport. What have those Kurds to do with PKK or YPG? Absolutely NOTHING. This rather being a confirmation that they hate my very being as a Kurd. In other words, for me is rather a sign..don't take these people as my friends and allies. Among Turks there are those that would see secular and nationalistic Turkey fall even today to make place for a REAL Islamic Caliphate that is ruled according to justice. However many because their center is Turkish nationalism, they cannot utter those words. In your heart only exists Islam and everything else circles around OR nationalism and everything else circles around. When you die..nationalism will not benefit you even one bit. However the person who is blind, will not understand these words.

format_quote Originally Posted by anatolian

Were Kurds opressed in Iran?

"were"? Still are would be better to say. The majority of the Kurds in general in all the 4 parts are sunni-Muslims so also in Rojhelat (Eastern-Kurdistan aka Kurdistan Iran), while Iran in general consists of of majority of shia-Muslims. So besides religion the Kurds differ and besides ethnicity. Although i just recently i have found proof that Persians are also Kurds. Persians are not Persians as a people, it is a job-title.

This last piece had bothered me for a long time. I knew where the Arabs orinated from, i knew where the Original Ottomans orginated from, however i was always puzzled with the Persians. As we both for example have newroz.

http://ekurd.net/who-are-persian-part-i-2017-02-27

Language is a fascinating thing. One can take away your history, take away ones cultural habits like music, clothing, food etc. However language sub'han'Allah it is impossible to take away. Through ones language you can see similarities and thus see your origins.