Britain has been labelled an "endemic surveillance" society by a new report that ranks the country along aside Russia and China in terms of state and commercial intrusion into people's lives.
Richard Thomas, the UK's independent information commissioner, said on Thursday that clear lines had to be drawn about how much information on people, such as their everyday movements or spending habits, government agencies and businesses are allowed to possess.
"Two years ago I warned that we were in danger of sleepwalking into a surveillance society. Today I fear that we are in fact waking up to a surveillance society that is already all around us," Thomas said.
A survey of 37 countries released by Privacy International, a civil liberties group, ranked Britain alongside Russia, China, Malaysia and Singapore as countries practising "endemic" surveillance against the individual.
Britain has up to 4.2 million CCTV cameras, or about one for every 14 people and the average Briton is captured about 300 times a day on film.
Terror excuse
The government is pushing ahead with controversial plans to introduce biometric identity cards while Tony Blair, the British prime minister, has said he wants an expansion of the police's DNA database to cover even people released without charge.
Rights groups say governments around the world have used the so-called "war on terrorism" as a justification for increased snooping into the lives of citizens.
Thomas said that while some forms of surveillance could help combat crime and terrorism, others risked undermining trust and fostering a climate of suspicion.
He voiced concern about commercial, as well as government, intrusion.
"Every time we use a mobile phone, use our credit cards, go online to search on the Internet, go electronic shopping, drive our cars, more and more information is being collected," he told the BBC. "Humans must dictate our future, not machines."
A report that was compiled for a conference in London of international data protection and privacy commissioners hosted by Thomas predicted surveillance would be ramped up even more in the next 10 years.
Canada top
Among its forecasts are satellite navigation devices in cars that would help police to monitor speed and track selected vehicles.
Further predictions were screening employees for future health problems and their impact on productivity and that monitoring of people's movements would intensify, with the use of unmanned aircraft and street-level security cameras with facial recognition technology.
The Privacy International survey, conducted jointly with the US-based Electronic Privacy Information Centre, was conducted using 13 criteria ranging from constitutional protections to visual surveillance and phone-tapping.
Germany and Canada scored the best marks for civil liberties safeguards.
The UK is not the only country where people are spied upon...
As a British citizen, that's not much consolation.
I dunno. It's scary when people give up or curtail their civil liberties willingly. Certain elements in the government tend to confuse 'privacy' with 'having something to hide'. Nosy gits hiding behind 'national security'...
format_quote Originally Posted by Emir Aziz
I support all the spying ,interrogation(not torture), detaining for a short time,as long as they are protecting their OWN interests.
So how does knowing what we bought for lunch with our credit or debit cards help to protect British interests?
Speaking of surveillance; I read a newstory about an American who was watching a live webcam from London U.K. He saw two men breaking into a store and called his local police to explain the situation, they called the London police who arrived on the scene in time to catch the two robbers.
The developments in the UK are somewhat worrying. They have some of the toughest anti-terrorism laws in the Western world. They have quazillion camera's on virtually every street corner. They are already planning all kinds of laws that undermine freedom of speech in the name of 'stability'.
It's time for a libertarian revolution in the UK! Maybe they should start with implementing a real constitution, which can protect the citizens against the government. No doubt, they have good intentions, but that alone is not enough.
No doubt, they have good intentions, but that alone is not enough.
no doubt. I cant help but feel that its mainly muslims who are being targetted by all this "surveillance" and can you really blame me? I mean, look at those BNP members who had all those weopens and yet were quite easily let off the hook with the tiniest attention from the media yet a father ends up on front page for being dismissed from guard duty because his two extremely young sons went to a mosque which is suspected NOT PROVEN but suspected to have links with terrorists?
I have a lot of doubts, the intention seems bad, A LOT !
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My tears testify that i have a heart
yet i feel me and shaytan never part
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no doubt. I cant help but feel that its mainly muslims who are being targetted by all this "surveillance" and can you really blame me? I mean, look at those BNP members who had all those weopens and yet were quite easily let off the hook with the tiniest attention from the media yet a father ends up on front page for being dismissed from guard duty because his two extremely young sons went to a mosque which is suspected NOT PROVEN but suspected to have links with terrorists?
Well, CCTV isn't there because of Muslims. Many of the new anti-terror laws are. Thats because some groups of Muslims are at war with the UK.
I have a lot of doubts, the intention seems bad, A LOT !
It depends how you identify yourself. If you follow orthodox/radical/fundamentalist Islam, then yes, I think they are out to get you.
It depends how you identify yourself. If you follow orthodox/radical/fundamentalist Islam, then yes, I think they are out to get you.
Whats a muslim if his not a fundamentalist? Can you be a mathemitician if you dont know the fundamentals of maths? Do you not have to go through the fundamentals to excel in anything? Isnt it obvious that they are simply out to get anyone who sincerely believes in islam?
Last edited by IbnAbdulHakim; 11-11-2006 at 10:00 PM.
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My tears testify that i have a heart
yet i feel me and shaytan never part
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It is not Al-Birr (piety, righteousness, and obedience to Allâh, etc.) that you turn your faces towards east and (or) west (in prayers); but Al-Birr is (the quality of) the one who believes in Allâh, the Last Day, the Angels, the Book, the Prophets and gives his wealth, in spite of love for it, to the kinsfolk, to the orphans, and to Al-Masâkîn (the poor), and to the wayfarer, and to those who ask, and to set slaves free, performs As-Salât, and gives the Zakât, and keep their word whenever they make a promise, and who are patient in extreme poverty and ailment (disease) and at the time of persecution, hardship, and war. Such are the people of the truth and they are Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).
I mean surveillance or no surveillance doesn't really matter. How surveillance in public places change things for a person? Not much imo.
It is not Al-Birr (piety, righteousness, and obedience to Allâh, etc.) that you turn your faces towards east and (or) west (in prayers); but Al-Birr is (the quality of) the one who believes in Allâh, the Last Day, the Angels, the Book, the Prophets and gives his wealth, in spite of love for it, to the kinsfolk, to the orphans, and to Al-Masâkîn (the poor), and to the wayfarer, and to those who ask, and to set slaves free, performs As-Salât, and gives the Zakât, and keep their word whenever they make a promise, and who are patient in extreme poverty and ailment (disease) and at the time of persecution, hardship, and war. Such are the people of the truth and they are Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).
I mean surveillance or no surveillance doesn't really matter. How surveillance in public places change things for a person? Not much imo.
Taking that logic to its conclusion means we shouldn't care about say, world poverty or people dying in other countries, because hey, it doesn't affect our daily lives.
I'm concerned about the principle of just being watched. I've not got anything to hide (as the tapes of countless surveillance cameras dotted around the city recording everyone who passes them will attest), I just value my privacy.
Taking that logic to its conclusion means we shouldn't care about say, world poverty or people dying in other countries, because hey, it doesn't affect our daily lives
You are taking my comment out of context.
I'm concerned about the principle of just being watched. I've not got anything to hide (as the tapes of countless surveillance cameras dotted around the city recording everyone who passes them will attest), I just value my privacy.
There is no such thing as privacy in public places. This not an important issue for muslims in my opinion. Actually, surveillance of public places may reduce display of indecent behavior in public place, theft, etc...
For muslims there are more important issues that may actually help muslims societies living in non-muslims countries against hate crimes, abuse, stereotypes, etc...
It is not Al-Birr (piety, righteousness, and obedience to Allâh, etc.) that you turn your faces towards east and (or) west (in prayers); but Al-Birr is (the quality of) the one who believes in Allâh, the Last Day, the Angels, the Book, the Prophets and gives his wealth, in spite of love for it, to the kinsfolk, to the orphans, and to Al-Masâkîn (the poor), and to the wayfarer, and to those who ask, and to set slaves free, performs As-Salât, and gives the Zakât, and keep their word whenever they make a promise, and who are patient in extreme poverty and ailment (disease) and at the time of persecution, hardship, and war. Such are the people of the truth and they are Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).
I meant only to show you the absurdity of the logic you were using.
There is no such thing as privacy in public places.
I beg to differ. If that were true, public toilets wouldn't have doors.
This not an important issue for muslims in my opinion. Actually, surveillance of public places may reduce display of indecent behavior in public place, theft, etc...
Has it? An increased police presence would do the same thing.
For muslims there are more important issues that may actually help muslims societies living in non-muslims countries against hate crimes, abuse, stereotypes, etc...
And have they? Does anyone have any data to back up this point?
I'm only comfortable with God watching everything I do, not some security guard. In buildings, I'm fine with security cameras. Out in many, many streets? That's going too far.
I meant only to show you the absurdity of the logic you were using.
Well, my comment was taken out of context. It was a sarcastic comment nothing to do with the issue of caring for others.
I beg to differ. If that were true, public toilets wouldn't have doors.
You are comparing oranges with apples. By above logic, it would be alright to do potty or uncover private body parts on sidewalks (no pun intended) since privacy on sidewalks would be like public toilets. Public toilets are in public places for public use, but they are not open to public when a person is inside a toilet unlike sidewalks, parks, etc.
Has it? An increased police presence would do the same thing.
Why increased presence of police would be an issue? A govt. has the right to increase police presence in any public place any time it wants.
And have they? Does anyone have any data to back up this point?
I don't know what you are asking here. I meant muslims should focus on important issue rather than petty issues like these.
I'm only comfortable with God watching everything I do, not some security guard.
This is unpractical from an Islamic point of view, otherwise, their would have no need for shariah.
In buildings, I'm fine with security cameras. Out in many, many streets? That's going too far.
Going too far or not is subjective. However, a camera in a building or a street is not really different.
Last edited by Chuck; 11-12-2006 at 07:11 PM.
It is not Al-Birr (piety, righteousness, and obedience to Allâh, etc.) that you turn your faces towards east and (or) west (in prayers); but Al-Birr is (the quality of) the one who believes in Allâh, the Last Day, the Angels, the Book, the Prophets and gives his wealth, in spite of love for it, to the kinsfolk, to the orphans, and to Al-Masâkîn (the poor), and to the wayfarer, and to those who ask, and to set slaves free, performs As-Salât, and gives the Zakât, and keep their word whenever they make a promise, and who are patient in extreme poverty and ailment (disease) and at the time of persecution, hardship, and war. Such are the people of the truth and they are Al-Muttaqûn (the pious).
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