Already we are starting to see people despair over the supposed defeat of the Islamic forces in Somalia and their retreat to the Countryside to prevent the Ethiopians indiscriminately bombing Mogadishu and killing many civilians like they did in other towns they attacked.
The Islamic forces have disbanded much of their army yes, but they do not need so many for the guerrilla war that will now come to attack the Ethiopian supply lines and attack the Warlords and their now looting, raping, celebrating bandit soldiers.
Once the Ethiopians are forced to withdraw the Clan Warlords will not be strong enough to stop Islam rising again on their own. It is just a matter of time to attrition to force the Ethiopians out and then it is the end game for this latest Secular government ruling by Kufr in the Muslim lands. It will take years longer with the Ethiopian and US government helping them but the eventual victory will belong to Allah not to the Kufr.
Remember how the Unbelievers plotted against thee, to keep thee in bonds, or slay thee, or get thee out (of thy home). They plot and plan, and Allah too plans; but the best of planners is Allah. (Quran 8.30)
So why are you despairing? Are you not confident in the promise of Allah of the fact that he promises victory to those who are sincere? That a true Islamic state will rise again either in Somalia or elsewhere but first we must be tested and tried?
Do men think that they will be left alone on saying, "We believe", and that they will not be tested? We did test those before them, and Allah will certainly know those who are true from those who are false. (Quran 29: 2-3)
Where is your faith in Allah and his promise? Our tests will come and many great Brothers and Sisters will die just like many great Sahabah like Hamza died before seeing the eventual victory, this doesn’t mean we will lose after one victory, only that Allah wishes to test us and purify us before he will let victory and Ruling of the land come our way again.
You put it very well and I couldn't agree more. An Islamic state in that region is still in my prayers.
"This world is a blank price tag, and whatever value you put on it, is what its worth to you. I have made this world priceless and worthless, so therefore I have placed my value in the afterlife."
Sadly, it is going to take the work of all of the people in Somalia to make Somalia an Islamic nation. Much of Somalia does not seem to be in favor of Sharia. That appears to be supported only by the Islamic Courts.
At the moment the Islamic Courts are facing a severe set back.
The sudden reversal left it unclear whether a war that had threatened to consume the Horn of Africa had quickly ended, or the Islamists had merely gone underground, preparing to wage a guerrilla insurgency, as some leaders had threatened.
“The whole city is just waiting,” said Sheik Ahmed Shiro, a Koranic teacher in Mogadishu.
At 10 p.m. on Wednesday, several Islamist leaders emerged to hold a news conference at their headquarters in Mogadishu. They did not explicitly concede defeat to the transitional government, but seemed to be preparing their forces for such an eventuality. “We need our soldiers to return to their positions for the sake of the people,” said Sheik Sharif Sheik Ahmed, one of the leaders. “Even if your positions are transferred to the government, you must stay where you are and make sure Mogadishu is as safe as it was before.”
As he spoke, Mogadishu was rapidly descending back into the clan-based anarchy that had been its hallmark for most of the past 15 years, before the Islamists came to power and pacified the city.
Witnesses said bands of armed thugs swept through the markets, smashing and stealing at will. Gunfire rattled from neighborhood to neighborhood as the disparate clan-based militias that had joined forces to form the Islamist movement began to fragment and turn on one another.
One of the first things the Islamists did after the fighting started was to close all schools in Mogadishu in order to send more young people to the front. “They’ve misled our children to their deaths,” Mr. Bilal said.
Somali Government Troops Enter Mogadishu Outskirts (December 28, 2006) Residents said that crowds in one slum threw rocks at the Islamists’ pickup trucks as they drove by on Wednesday. Some people openly celebrated in the streets by hoisting up pictures of the transitional government’s leaders and gleefully chewing khat, a mildly narcotic plant the Islamists had outlawed.
The demonstrations helped prompt the clan elders, who are regarded as the pillars of Somali society, to act. According to residents in Mogadishu, the leaders of several major clans — and some businesspeople who had been financing the Islamists — demanded that the Islamist leaders return the armed pickup trucks that had been lent to the movement.
Faced with the loss of support from their counterparts, other clan leaders saw the coalition begin to crumble and withdrew their trucks as well, leaving little of the organized force that once lent the Islamists their power.
Subanahllah that was great inshallah Allah will bring back the Islamic State. As for people thinking Islam will be defeated,that will never happen.
Islam will never be defeated. But, we do face many trials on this path for enough people in any nation to accept it, in order for any of us to have a true Islamic nation.
i do not understand this conflict so maybe somebody can explain to me what is going on... i looked up "islamic court union" in wikipedia and it seems like everything they have done is good except for the actions of the youth group called "The Shabab" which is described as kind of radical youths that the ICU is trying to control because of their behavior... but basically everything they have done is good... like opening ports and schools and keeping order...
...and the opposition is described as "warlords" so why does the international community support the warlords...?
...and the opposition is described as "warlords" so why does the international community support the warlords...?
gracias
Generally the International community priority is not based out of goodness but rather Politics (which nearly always equate to serving their own interest).
...and the opposition is described as "warlords" so why does the international community support the warlords...?
In general, it doesn't. The primary 'opposition' is actually the provisional Somali government, although most of their military clout is provided by their Ethiopian allies. It is that government which is is 'backed' by the international community. The warlords are essentially local leaders, based around a clan system, with varying degrees of influence. They lost power that to the ICU and want it back. The question is how far the provisional government will accommodate them; at the moment they are useful allies but in time they will need to destroy the warlords' influence too.. the question is how successful they are likely to be. The smart money is on 'not very'.
islamic or not islamic, i hope the suffering of the somalis soon comes to an end and that their country will finally know peace and stability as soon as possible.
each man thinks of his own fleas as gazelles
question authority
islamic or not islamic, i hope the suffering of the somalis soon comes to an end and that their country will finally know peace and stability as soon as possible.
In general, it doesn't. The primary 'opposition' is actually the provisional Somali government, although most of their military clout is provided by their Ethiopian allies. It is that government which is is 'backed' by the international community. The warlords are essentially local leaders, based around a clan system, with varying degrees of influence. They lost power that to the ICU and want it back. The question is how far the provisional government will accommodate them; at the moment they are useful allies but in time they will need to destroy the warlords' influence too.. the question is how successful they are likely to be. The smart money is on 'not very'.
hola trumble...
this is not ethical at all... from what i read in the wikipedia article the ICU have done very many good things for the somolian people and just want something resembling peaceful and successful government... the only reason they are being opposed by the international community is that they are muslims and there is a tentative connection to terrorism because of something president bush said...
how far can americas desire for revenge go... i do not like talking about politics but i think we have been struck by a knife in the night... and we will never know how to strike back because we do not know where the knife came from... and we have to know that the knife struck us because of things we have done... and we also have to know that we will never find the knife and punching our fists around in the dark will only hurt other people... we will never satisfy our revenge, we can only overcome it and promote justice in the world, what i see in the War on Terror which i think our support of these warlords includes is injust and immoral... other people are suffering because we have suffered and that is immoral...
i will pray the world stops its war against these people...
In general, it doesn't. The primary 'opposition' is actually the provisional Somali government, although most of their military clout is provided by their Ethiopian allies. It is that government which is is 'backed' by the international community. The warlords are essentially local leaders, based around a clan system, with varying degrees of influence. They lost power that to the ICU and want it back. The question is how far the provisional government will accommodate them; at the moment they are useful allies but in time they will need to destroy the warlords' influence too.. the question is how successful they are likely to be. The smart money is on 'not very'.
trumble,
the govt there are the warlords, the warlords are the govt.
Abdullahi Yusuf is the biggest warlord in the country, that is how he got given the job and because he was a secularist who had support from ethiopia.
check your facts please before posting out of ignorance.
the only reason they are being opposed by the international community is that they are muslims and there is a tentative connection to terrorism because of something president bush said...
Again, what makes you believe they are 'opposed' by the international community (which is rather broader than just the United States!), particularly for that reason? As I said, that community (including most Islamic elements of it at the time) backed the provisional government because both because it was the only government and because, amazingly, it wanted to do nice things too. You are so concerned about the ethics.. ICU influence was expanded not by being 'nice', or by diplomacy, but by fighting.
Personally, I think this is pretty dire news for Mogadishu as I simply can't see the government managing to wrest control from the warlords in the same way the ICU did. There is no doubt that the ICU brought order to anarchy in a place that very much needed it, BUT that should not blind us into seeing the ICU as any sort of 'victim' here.. they are paying the price for their own stupidity. They pushed too far into somebody else's patch, gambling on the fact that that somebody's powerful friend would do nothing they couldn't handle. They lost the bet.
format_quote Originally Posted by Dawud_uk
the govt there are the warlords, the warlords are the govt.
Abdullahi Yusuf is the biggest warlord in the country, that is how he got given the job and because he was a secularist who had support from ethiopia.
check your facts please before posting out of ignorance.
I suggest you both follow your own advice and pay closer attention to what is being discussed. The situation in Puntland was very different from that in Mogadishu... Yusuf has no desire for the former Mogadishu warlords to gain control there again. He gained the job because he was the only credible candidate, being the only one with a power base sufficient to suggest he might keep it. Needless to say, his secularism or otherwise was irrelevant.
One of the things that both the west and the islamist leaders seem to be missing is, what the people want.
Way of life, and tradition are powerful forces. If the people of Somalia are used to clan type systems, with clan elders, neither the transistional government, or the islamist government will work very well. The people are not used to a central government.
The demonstrations helped prompt the clan elders, who are regarded as the pillars of Somali society
One of the things that both the west and the islamist leaders seem to be missing is, what the people want.
Way of life, and tradition are powerful forces. If the people of Somalia are used to clan type systems, with clan elders, neither the transistional government, or the islamist government will work very well. The people are not used to a central government.
True, but I suspect what they want most is order and stability. You are in very dangerous territory when you talk about what people should really want, rather than what they actually do want, I know, but in this instance a central government of some sort is desperately required, of whichever flavour.
True, but I suspect what they want most is order and stability. You are in very dangerous territory when you talk about what people should really want, rather than what they actually do want, I know, but in this instance a central government of some sort is desperately required, of whichever flavour.
this might sound strange to you two as democrats but as muslims we are not too concerned with what people want, it is better you carry the people but not necessary to get shariah law and government.
now i am sure you will call me an islamo-fascist or islamist or whatever the latest term is but really your democracy means nothing to me, islam is the ruling system i prefer and that does what is right for the people not what is popular.
so in a muslim state the people could never choose to drink alcohol or chew qat, it is wrong and therefore forbidden. simularly the government cannot impose unjust and evil taxes as that is wrong and forbidden and if people do these things they are sinful in that.
islam will triumph and an islamic state will come back again soon and when it does muslims like myself will flock to it and strengthen it and it will expand into other muslim areas insha'allah (God willing) with the will of the people and rulers but if not it doesnt matter.
like i said you might find this alarming, but really i just being honest with you. i dont lie and sugar coat it for you, and what else might alarm is that more and more muslims each year follow the same teachings because they go directly back to Muhammad saws and his companions.
this might sound strange to you two as democrats but as muslims we are not too concerned with what people want, it is better you carry the people but not necessary to get shariah law and government.
now i am sure you will call me an islamo-fascist or islamist or whatever the latest term is but really your democracy means nothing to me, islam is the ruling system i prefer and that does what is right for the people not what is popular.
so in a muslim state the people could never choose to drink alcohol or chew qat, it is wrong and therefore forbidden. simularly the government cannot impose unjust and evil taxes as that is wrong and forbidden and if people do these things they are sinful in that.
islam will triumph and an islamic state will come back again soon and when it does muslims like myself will flock to it and strengthen it and it will expand into other muslim areas insha'allah (God willing) with the will of the people and rulers but if not it doesnt matter.
like i said you might find this alarming, but really i just being honest with you. i dont lie and sugar coat it for you, and what else might alarm is that more and more muslims each year follow the same teachings because they go directly back to Muhammad saws and his companions.
Abu Abdullah
as muslims we are not too concerned with what people want
That is obvious, and I already knew that. Thing is, while you are not concerned with what they want, they may very well run your butt out of town.
like i said you might find this alarming, but really i just being honest with you. i dont lie and sugar coat it for you
LOL! Nothing to be alarmed about. It's ok, I don't have much of a sweet tooth anyway.
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