The reason I started this thread is because in my opinion Roman Catholics, especially Roman Catholic Priests and Seminarians revert at a higher rate than any other Christian Denomination.
I will answer for myself as to why it was so easy for me to revert (although it took me a long time). It is because I believe Roman Catholicism to be the oldest Christian Denomination and is still the closest to what Christianity was supposed to be.
There are no prayers, practices or beliefs in Islam that a Roman Catholic would find to be strange or Alien. A Roman Catholic finds everything in Islam to be very familiar and not significantly different from what a practicing Roman Catholic does.
For a Roman Catholic to revert requires no changes of life style, it is a return to what a person was supposed to have been doing if they were a Practicing Roman Catholic. A Roman Catholic is well prepared to enter Islam, once they realize that what Islam teaches is inline with what Roman Catholicism originally taught. It only became separated from Islamic practices when the frills and rituals had been added by Popes and refomists.
I believe the more a Roman Catholic learns about Roman Catholicism the more receptive he becomes to Islam. This may be why it is so common for Priests and Seminarians to revert.
As a catholic, I'd say the reason is probably poor catechesis or religious instruction. Starting from the very beginning with the parents and God parents. Then through the church classes and yes even the Masses or Divine Liturgies if their not explained properly they can drive some away. Then you add the scandals within the church and the mistaken attitude that one form of Christianity is the same as another take the terms orthodoxy and heterodoxy. All of these can and probably do contribute to the exodus of some to Islam. I really don't understand revert though. To revert is to come back to a previous state from somewhere\something else. I think convert is the term most appropriate here.
peace be with you.
gmcbroom
Good thing we finally have this thread, as we've actually discussed the subject recently in another thread, I forget which. I wonder if maybe Islam often strikes Catholic apostates as the version or nearest equivalent of Catholicism that would be true if all the irrational and needless elements are removed from it.
Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
As a catholic, I'd say the reason is probably poor catechesis or religious instruction. Starting from the very beginning with the parents and God parents. Then through the church classes and yes even the Masses or Divine Liturgies if their not explained properly they can drive some away. Then you add the scandals within the church and the mistaken attitude that one form of Christianity is the same as another take the terms orthodoxy and heterodoxy. All of these can and probably do contribute to the exodus of some to Islam.
It may have something to do with that, as Catholic children are so famous for asking the obvious logical questions brought up by Catholic doctrine and simply having them hand-waved away. But then again most ex-Catholic Muslims are not children, are they?
I really don't understand revert though. To revert is to come back to a previous state from somewhere\something else. I think convert is the term most appropriate here.
It's an old semantic squabble you shouldn't concern yourself with. There is some grounds in our doctrine for calling yourself a revert but words are just words anyway.
Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
Now allow me to clarify something to my Christian brothers and sisters. For when I mean mistaken I don't mean it maliciously. The simple fact is there is almost a cafeteria pick and choose attitude to christian ecclesial communities each saying theirs is the way. Now when I say ecclesial communities its not meant to be derogatory. In Catholism there is only One Church. Now even the current Pope Benedict the 16th said previously, when he was head of the ,Doctrine for the faith,that he sees no reason why there can't be a sanctifying grace in the Lutheran supper.
If he said that for Lutherans, then it may even apply to other Christian ecclesial communities. So that could mean there is varying levels of truth in all of them.
As a catholic, I'd say the reason is probably poor catechesis or religious instruction. Starting from the very beginning with the parents and God parents. Then through the church classes and yes even the Masses or Divine Liturgies if their not explained properly they can drive some away. Then you add the scandals within the church and the mistaken attitude that one form of Christianity is the same as another take the terms orthodoxy and heterodoxy. All of these can and probably do contribute to the exodus of some to Islam.
I see.
So those ex nuns and ex priests didn't attend their church classes and masses and didn't study divine liturgies?
It wouldn't surprise me Yahya Sulaiman. It's amazing what growing up can do. Take me I was just baptised into the Catholic Church and I'm 36. I grew up in a protestant church but was never baptised. I saw the minister do something rather unchristian like. It affected me so much, I left that church and wandered through the various christian denominations and even read a condensed enligh translation of the Koran for awhile. However I was always curious about catholism. I credit my embracing catholism to my twin brother who never stopped praying for me even though he's never left the church my family has always gone too. I met a coworker who went to a Maronite Catholic church and she invited me there. After praying about it and going through catechesis it took over a year. I was baptised over Pentacost in 2010. I had to embrace and accept dogmas and doctrines, some of which were extremely difficult due to my protestant background. Yet, through prayer I did. I found where I belong and that's in the Catholic church.
Peace be with you.
gmcbroom
Many people don't have a problem with the Catholic church. They have a problem, with what they see as the catholic church.
Naidamar I wasn't aware of any ex nuns or priests. The only case i'm aware of is that of a former Non denominational minister named Yusef. That's not quite the same thing. Now I'm aware that a few priests became atheists but thats generally a rejection of All faiths this would include Islam.
Peace be with you.
gmcbroom
Just speaking for myself I believe I received a very strong and accurate Catholic education in the 1940s. Being from typical old world stock and still during the days when the mass was still said in Latin, The Baltimore catechism was the only catechism of choice and the entire Parish had an active interest in seeing that at least one priest would come out of each generation. I was the family selection. went the whole 9 yards, Alter boy, CYO KofC etc and entered seminary with high aspirations. As a Seminarian I soon discovered I could not honestly ever take the vows so to the shame of my family and the Parish I left the Seminary and later left Catholicism,
Many years later when I embraced Islam I came to the opinion that Catholicism gave me sufficient background to prepare for Islam and I was always Muslim, Just searching for the way to practice Islam.
Naidamar I wasn't aware of any ex nuns or priests. The only case i'm aware of is that of a former Non denominational minister named Yusef. That's not quite the same thing. Now I'm aware that a few priests became atheists but thats generally a rejection of All faiths this would include Islam.
Peace be with you.
gmcbroom
I know there are several former seminarians, besides myself, as members here. I believe we also have a few ex-Priests that had taken their vows. But, I will wait for them to post instead of trying to remember who they are
Now I'm aware that a few priests became atheists but thats generally a rejection of All faiths this would include Islam.
Get aware then here are a few priests and missionaries and other types of folks!
Priests and missionaries
Prof. Abdul Ahad Dawud, Former Bishop of Uramiah, Formerly the Reverend David Benjamin Keldani, B.D.
Abdullah al-Faruq – Formerly Kenneth L. Jenkins, minister and elder of the Pentecostal Church
Abu Ishaq, Coptic Cardinal accepts Islam
Anonymous Female Missionary – Former Catholic missionary
Anselm Tormeeda – 14th century CE scholar and priest
Dr. Gary Miller (Abdul-Ahad Omar) – Former missionary
George Anthony – Former Catholic priest
Ibrahim Khalil – Former Egyptian Coptic priest
Dr. Jerald F. Dirks – Former minister (deacon) of the United Methodist Church.
Khadijah ‘Sue’ Watson – Former pastor, missionary, professor. Master’s degree in Divinity
Martin John Mwaipopo – Former Lutheran Archbishop
Muslima, The Former Catholic Missionary (Burundi) I understood that the church was being deceitful
Rabbi Moisha Krivitsky of Makhachkala synagogue. ‘I live in the mosque’.
Raphael Narbaez, Jr.- Former Jehovah’s Witness minister, Latino in Los Anodes.
Ruba Qewar, Jordanian Missionary revert to Islam
Selma A. Cook, , Australian Missionary’s Journey to Allah.
S.M. SULAYMAN, (Former Baptist Church Minister), U.S.A.
Viacheslav Polosin – Former Archpriest of the Russian Orthodox Church
Dr. Yahya A.R. Lehmann, Doctor of Theology, (Former Roman Catholic Priest Germany)
Famous Converts To Islam
Abdur-Raheem Greene (Formerly Anthony Greene) the well known caller to Islam
Abu Ameenah Bilal Philips, the great Muslim scholar
Dileep Kumar, Leaving Celebrity Status Behind
Lady Evelyn Zeinab Cobbold, I have always been a Muslim.
Hamza Yusuf (Mark Hanson), Destined for Greek Orthodox priesthood, turned to great Islamic preacher.
Lord Headley Al-Farooq (England), Peer, Statesman, and Author.
Hülya Kandemir, German Pop Singer Finds Destination in Islam.
Dr. Jeffrey Lang, Professor of Mathematics at the University of Kansas, and Author of Islamic books.
Jermaine Jackson, brother of world-famous star Michael Jackson.
Jemima Goldsmith, HEADLINE: Why I chose Islam.
Johann Wolfgang Von Goethe, the greatest writer of the German tradition.
Kareem Abdul-Jabbar, The greatest basketball player of all time.
Leo Tolstoy, A confession by the Russian giant in the world of literature.
Malcolm X – In His Own Words, USA, The famous Afro-American Muslim.
Michael Wolfe, Author and writer of Islamic documentaries.
Dr. Maurice Bucaille, Author of “The Bible, The Qur’an and Science”,
Muhammad Ali, The first three-time Heavy Weight Champion of the World.
Muhammad Asad (Austria), Statesman, Journalist, Author, and translator of the Quran.
Nuh Ha Mim Keller, From an American Catholic to one of the leading contemporary scholars of Islam.
PROF. UMAR MITA, Economist, Social Worker and Preacher, (Japan).
Wilfried (Murad) Hofmann, German Diplomat And NATO Officer.
Yusuf Islam (Formerly Cat Stevens) Famous ex-Rock Star.
Yvonne Ridley In the Hands of the Taliban: From Captive to Convert
Sisters
Aminah Assilmi “I couldn’t be a Muslim! I was American and white!”
Asiya Abd al-Zahir,Australia, “..the only religion I have ever been completely sure of..”
Chahida Zanabi, Norway, “..i found [a belief that Jesus died] illogical and unjust”
Elizabeth Clarke, Palm Beach Post Religion Writer. Convert Finds Women’s Rights in Islam
Fareena Alam, 18 years old female convert, the author of the great Website: http://www.themodernreligion.com/index.h…
Haji Maryam Mohammed Ahmed, American Muslima, She lives only to talk about Islam
Karen’s Testimony. “If Jesus is God, then why did he have a conversation with God”
Dr. Kari Ann Owen.USA, Jewish, “I began to look .. to Islamic culture for moral guidance”
Madonna Johnson “..all of my turmoil and anxiety was gone..”
Maryam al-Mahdayah, There is no more conflict within, because I have come home”.
Maryam Jameelah, Converts’ Stories: Interview with Maryam (formerly Margaret Marcus)
Maureen McCormick, Life is good for Muslim women
Michelle, “I came from a Jewish family in New York.”
Nakata Khaula, A Japanese Woman’s Experience of Hijab.
Noor, UK, Insights into Women in Islam vs. Women in Hinduism.
Jocelyn Wiener, Times Staff Writer. Young, Female and Muslim
Rashida S. (Rachel Singer) daughter of a devout Roman Catholic mother/very devout Jewish father.
Rita, God works in mysterious ways
Somayyah, From a Bathing Suit to Hijab.
Tasha, I had been studying Islam ever since I was in 7th grade.
Um Luqman, “Jesus(AS) made sense to me as being a Prophet”.
Zainab’s Testimony. USA, “No a guy did not convert me”. An ex-Sunday School teacher
Brothers
Abdullah – My journey to Islam (Video) A must watch.
Abdul Malik Hamidullah, I discovered the logic and simplicity in Islam.
Abdul Malik LeBlanc tells how he discovered Islam within the pages of Bible
Abdus Salam Sipes, A former member of the KKK (Ku Klux Klan)
Adam Wilson, USA, “IF YOU ARE A CHRISTIAN READ THIS”
Ahmed Corpus (Formerly Marco Corpus), Philippines, Former Sunday School teacher & full-time ministry worker
Dr. ALI SELMAN BENOIST, Doctor of Medicine, and a descendant of a French Catholic family.
Christopher Patrick Nelson, Islam Saved My Mental Health and Returned My Soul .
FAUZUDDIN AHMAD OVERING, Preacher and Social Worker.
Giles Whittell, ‘Allah came knocking at my heart’, The Times UK, 7 January 2000,
Ihsan Chua Gim Sam, Singapore, “..the concept of Trinity was introduced in 325 A.D..”
Jameel William Aalim-Johnson, organizes the weekly Muslim congregational Friday prayer on Capitol Hill
Hussein Amin, My Conversion from Christianity to Islam,
John Kirch, USA, “I went on a 20-year-long search for the truth”
Mahir Abdal-Razzaaq, Native American, Have you ever wondered what the name Tallahassee means?
MAVIS B. JOLLY, The Qur’an, I found, works silently on the spirit.
Mike LoPrete, USA, 19 year old college student. “I didn’t get the idea of the trinity”
Phreddie, My Conversion to Islam, I am only 18, and that fact seems to astound most people.
Sherif Quinn Christianity: The Point of Departure.
Shive Prasad Demolished Babri Masjid, India, That Day – Seeks Forgiveness Today !
Steven Krauss (Abdul-Lateef Abdullah), A Martial Art Led Me to Islam,
TIM WEIS, I have European lineage. I am a Muslim. I am a Westerner
Walter ‘Abdul-Walee’ Gomez, Latino immigrant finds peace in Islam.
Yahya Donald W. Flood, USA, The Best Way to Live and Die
all the best
Text without context is pretext If your opponent is of choleric temperament, seek to irritate him
Naidamar I wasn't aware of any ex nuns or priests. The only case i'm aware of is that of a former Non denominational minister named Yusef. That's not quite the same thing. Now I'm aware that a few priests became atheists but thats generally a rejection of All faiths this would include Islam.
You mean Yusuf estes? Yes, he is among the most famous ones. then forgive me for doubting your ignorance.
Here's a sample list you can start reading or watching about former catholic priests and nuns who reverted to Islam. Feel free to discuss.
It wouldn't surprise me Yahya Sulaiman. It's amazing what growing up can do. Take me I was just baptised into the Catholic Church and I'm 36. I grew up in a protestant church but was never baptised. I saw the minister do something rather unchristian like. It affected me so much, I left that church and wandered through the various christian denominations and even read a condensed enligh translation of the Koran for awhile. However I was always curious about catholism. I credit my embracing catholism to my twin brother who never stopped praying for me even though he's never left the church my family has always gone too. I met a coworker who went to a Maronite Catholic church and she invited me there. After praying about it and going through catechesis it took over a year. I was baptised over Pentacost in 2010. I had to embrace and accept dogmas and doctrines, some of which were extremely difficult due to my protestant background. Yet, through prayer I did. I found where I belong and that's in the Catholic church.
Peace be with you.
gmcbroom
Many people don't have a problem with the Catholic church. They have a problem, with what they see as the catholic church.
I am curious as to which condensed English translation of the Koran you read?
Peace be to any prophets I may have mentioned above. Praised and exalted be my Maker, if I have mentioned Him. (Come to think of it praise Him anyway.)
Yahya Sulaiman, I can't remember the actually title of it. It was a small Dark Blue book etched in gold with Arabic script on the front. It was extremely thick with one side of each page in arabic and the other side in english. I gave it to my brother because he was curious about islam. He was the one who told me it wasn't the full book but condensed (i'd read it but not all the way through.. he on the other hand did.). Still, it wet his appetite to get the Koran. He reads it from time to time. I ocassionally ask him if he's thinking of embracing Islam. So far he's not interested in that. It's no surprise really he just finished college and is finally making the money he's been desiring for years. Religion isn't number one on his list right now. Who know's perhaps he'll join you one day.
Naidamar and Vale's lily, those are impressive lists and conversion accounts I watched a few of them. I wish each of them well in their travels.
Peace be with you.
gmcbroom
gmcbroom
There are no prayers, practices or beliefs in Islam that a Roman Catholic would find to be strange or Alien. A Roman Catholic finds everything in Islam to be very familiar and not significantly different from what a practicing Roman Catholic does.
As a Roman Catholic who is considering Islam, I'd observe that there are several reasons.
First, many Roman Catholics were reared in traditions that go back thousands of years. However, all of this was turned over by the changes in the 1960s. These changes have taken a long time to play out but now there are a lot of old Churches which are closing or being "renovated" into modern art monstrosities. The Latin Mass is gone, folk music has replaced the old hymns, etc. It's really hard to feel a sense of the sacred in many modern churches. I find it very interesting that the parts of Catholicism that are the most vibrant (in terms of numbers and participation) are the most conservative parishes and organizations!
Second, I think Catholicism has long been the denomination of scholarship. Once one begins to read about Islam, it's like a whole new world of study opens up. This appeals to many intellectual Catholics (such as myself).
One thing that is very different is that Islam is not a sacramental religion. Catholicism is intensely sacramental (baptism, the Eucharist, penance, etc.)
Overall, I think the main reason is that Catholicism is primarily a religion in which God is emphasized over reason. Islam is the same way - while Islam encourages the use of religion, ultimately the key ingredient is faith. In many protestant, reform Jewish, etc. traditions, there is almost an apology for faith and an attempt to justify things based on reason alone. This leads to spiritual poverty in my opinion.
As a Roman Catholic who is considering Islam, I'd observe that there are several reasons.
First, many Roman Catholics were reared in traditions that go back thousands of years. However, all of this was turned over by the changes in the 1960s. These changes have taken a long time to play out but now there are a lot of old Churches which are closing or being "renovated" into modern art monstrosities. The Latin Mass is gone, folk music has replaced the old hymns, etc. It's really hard to feel a sense of the sacred in many modern churches. I find it very interesting that the parts of Catholicism that are the most vibrant (in terms of numbers and participation) are the most conservative parishes and organizations!
Second, I think Catholicism has long been the denomination of scholarship. Once one begins to read about Islam, it's like a whole new world of study opens up. This appeals to many intellectual Catholics (such as myself).
One thing that is very different is that Islam is not a sacramental religion. Catholicism is intensely sacramental (baptism, the Eucharist, penance, etc.)
Overall, I think the main reason is that Catholicism is primarily a religion in which God is emphasized over reason. Islam is the same way - while Islam encourages the use of religion, ultimately the key ingredient is faith. In many protestant, reform Jewish, etc. traditions, there is almost an apology for faith and an attempt to justify things based on reason alone. This leads to spiritual poverty in my opinion.
You will discover that Islam is a religion of both reason and faith. It is a very logical belief. One can and should find reason to believe the Qur'an is the unchanged word of Allaah(swt) and not the words of Muhammad(PBUH) or any other man. Once that is done there is no need to require proof for the contents, it can be on faith alone. although it is possible to find empiracal proof for virtually everything in the Qur'an if we search.
As we know, Christians are believers as well, so when they educate themselves about Islam then compare with Christian teachings, they will find out the perfectness of QURAN and ISLAM
When we are definite with the information we read/receive/ we act accordingly
my point as ex-Christian, the only religion that made me a follow it is my religion now (ISLAM) although i think all religion teaches us to be good but only Islam can reach your heart&mind at the same time.
Subhanallah, we may do things at the beginning but when we are certain about one thing, we strive to stand till the end
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